an absolute must read

[FVR]

I use to think I was the master of my destiny. Handed that off to my wife as the way I was going, destiny wasn't going to be long.

Life has way too many variables, destiny is questionable.

[wareagle69]

to quote a great aussie "numpty"

[ryaninmichigan]

You mean, you really make your own money ? As in print it and **** ? Isn't that illegal Ryan...so you are the master of your destiny...are you the master of your emotions ?
Are you the master of your cells ? Are you the master of your dreams ?

Hey..."you read too much", that's with 2 o's yah freak.

I mean I rely on no one else to suport me and mine. your just an antagaonist. SP? Oh course I can not control my destiny completely I have control of what is possible. The rest I let God handle. I do need a leader that is full of ****. thats all I am saying. and Snakes like you discribe are usualy full of it..

[FVR]

I do need a leader that is full of ****.

I think you mean "you do not."

[ryaninmichigan]

You rely on no one else ?

-electricity
-water
-gas
-money
-oil
-cotton
-plastic
-dentists
-doctors
-microbes
This little list is just the tip of the iceberg, when it comes to people, plants, animals, elements, working to support your existence. Life is a chain...can you sincerely sit here and tell me that you control your destiny, that you rely on no one, when this destiny is linked to the smallest organisms on this planet ? When Man will be done thinking he himself his half of a God, maybe he will be a little more humble...and use his eyes to see, and his ears to hear.

To support you and your family, it takes an entire world.
Call it antagonistic if you want, i am simply telling you what i see. You go from being the master of your destiny, to not even control it completely...to it being in the hands of God in the span of 3 posts.

Snakes like i describe ?
You are looking at it from a sheep's point of view.

A leader does not supply any of the above. you are an antagonist. I am done with this thread.

[wareagle69]

i still think this is an absolute must read go down to donny h and then click his link. this is extremley inportant to consider i know i changed my game plan..

[HOP]

some body has to be in charge to make the dessions big and small hard and easy. In survival type groups usually they are elected and everyone pulls thier weight and suplies there own equipment and food usualy a group gets together and practice things to see if they are compatable anyone who goes rogue and threatens the team will have to be dealt with. These groups are not spur of the moment things but well planed out preperations.
There is a good book written like a novel by James Wesley called Patriots that is a pretty good manual Wesley has a survival blog out there that has a lot of links and info.
I think we have to rember that aman or leader is only good as his tools or the people he has to work with if the group is crappy then the leader will only not be able to do a great job. I worked for some real jerks some times in the army but if they were good leaders they got my undying support.

[nell67]

WB volwest!

[HOP]

VW actions speak louder than words , there is no answer sound very much like giving up. Bugging out ,in or up has worked all over the globe. There is strength in unity., sound judgement in planning you can't feed all of humanity people who have their prioritys straight see this and group up to protect self, group and family. Paranoia is descrided as ilrational fear , if your fears are rational then it is good fear any type of break down of society will put the masses in to the streets and country side, will it happen yes sooner or later by a time table not controled by us. Now do I go get in the stupid line with my neighbor or do I prepare in the most common scence way I know how , this is a no brainer for me in days of old a fort worked much better than sticking your head in the sand every time.

[HOP]

I get my knowledge on the ground and by the time I was your age I was almost ready to retire from the US ARMY and then survived in corections for 17 years when I say many rodent types try to survive with their head in a hole I have also learned that a foul mouth isn't a sin but it sure means you are crude and have limited ability to use the languge you speak. Most of the best soliders in the world are these tough mousie looking guys that will clean your clock in a heart beat Again the cursing usually reflects on your upbringing or lack there of. I can see why you are afraid of a group and that is your fear of not measuring up except in your mind.

[wareagle69]

i knew it.

welcome back bud sure missed your input. and it looks like we have found a contestant already, gosh i missed this..

[FVR]

Well I'll be damned. I was wondering if you were ever going to "pop" back in.

Pull up a stump, here is a cup of hot tea or coffee and a piece of jerky.

Welcome back.

[FVR]

The comparing of "Fight or Flight" to "Bug In / Bug Out" is a close call. Also, it falls right in line with two men discussing stressful situations.

From what I've read, men and woman react to the stress' of FF completely different and would also probably do the fall on diff. sides of the fence on the BI/BO scenario.

Wher men would be more willing to deal with the stress' by social withdraw, aggression, and substance abuse, woman typically handle the stress by seaking social support.

And you wonder why men die alot faster than woman.

Comparing this to the bug in bug out, I wonder, men would usually want to pack it in and head to the hills where woman might want to stay, find out what is happening and take action a little later.

That being said, the fight or flight scenario has all but died in our society when it comes to the tiger stalking, chasing and killing us. Yes it might come in handy if we are preyed apon by the voltures of society, if and when.

Most of us deal with the fight or flight everyday in our normal lives. The preceaved dangers are not that of the animals that want to prey on us but rather the butthead who cut us off in traffic. We get ourselves all hyped up with the adrenalins flowing through our bodies, then what. We yell, cuss, give the finger, maybe get in a fist fight, or even worse pull a gun and shoot someone, for what, cutting us off.

So, is the fight or flight slowly being bred out of us? Is this bug in bug out our last ditch effort to capture the last bastion of the pioneer spirit?

Bugging out as I have mentioned before is for those that don't have families. It would be just too easy to run away from the fight. Hide in the hills and let others deal with the ramifications of what tragic happenings accured.

Personally, you won't find me heading to the hills. I have a family, if needed the neighbors that I really don't like, we would all get together and try to create a safe haven for ours. Even if after alot of thought, if I had to back off from being a dom. male, to survive for awhile, it could be done. IT WOULD BE HARD! My survival means nothing, my families survival is paramount.

Alot of rambling.

Damnit VW.

[HOP]

Sarge how about the word TROLL don't know if I am supose to have a fishing or hunting liscence

[HOP]

And the mind is a terriable thing and must be stopped in our life time. Be a milita of one , now there is a concept. Now conflict with the group except for muli personalities and no one to blame except your self If you don't like it complan to the boss if you do like it pat yourself on the back or high 5 your self.We have met the enemy and he is us.

[owl_girl]

Hey volwest, how’s it going? It’s gotten a bit quiet around here while you were gone.

[owl_girl]

Hey girl...
I am doing fine...you ?
A bit quiet ? You mean geriatric quiet like oh my god what am i doing here ?
Or good quiet, as in, sigh, volwest is finally out of here...lol

Quiet as in boring lol.
This last week for me has been awesome.

[FVR]

I don't think VW is trying to show us that he is smarter than us, but rather he is coming to the table with psychological mindset. This mindset if looked at in the wrong light may come off as arogant even though it is not meant that way.

VW is looking at discussions in a complete different way, if you remember his hobby or maybe it was his education is psychology. His take on the fight or flight is right on and when it is carried over to other situations, can be justifieably done so.

I understand his ideology as my better half was working on a doctorate in pyshcology until she decided that it was not for her. I understand and support her reasons 100%, but damn a 4.0 gpa is hard to leave behind.

I am not grading VW as that is not my lot in life, but rather his posts bring an angle that many overlook. There is always the "do this, do that" follow instructions and you will live. But in reality, will you live if you do do it? Anyone can go through the motions and to do them without thinking, hmmmmmm.

I'm just rambling now.

[FVR]

I don't think VW is trying to show us that he is smarter than us, but rather he is coming to the table with psychological mindset. This mindset if looked at in the wrong light may come off as arrogant even though it is not meant that way. Or, maybe I'm wrong.

VW is looking at discussions in a complete different way, if you remember his hobby or maybe it was his education is psychology. His take on the fight or flight is right on and when it is carried over to other situations, can be justifieably done so.

I understand his ideology as my better half was working on a doctorate in pyshcology until she decided that it was not for her. I understand and support her reasons 100%, but damn a 4.0 gpa is hard to leave behind.

I am not grading VW as that is not my lot in life, but rather his posts bring an angle that many overlook. There is always the "do this, do that" follow instructions and you will live. But in reality, will you live if you do do it? Anyone can go through the motions and to do them without thinking, hmmmmmm.

I'm just rambling now.

[HOP]

Back to the subject of this thread, which I think is a good one.
Bug out or bug in either way should involve much prior research and planning. The group dynamic allows the infusion of additional equipment and skills and actually shares the expence of equipment and supplies. careful screening would be wise and many prior training scenarios would help weed out the fringe types and let you pick your group wisely. There is a lot of info out there some good and some bad. The botom line should be pull your weight or you will be a solo act.

GOOD JUDGEMENT COMES FROM EXPERENCE AND A LOT OF THAT COMES FROM BAD JUDGEMENT.