What do you know about flint and primitive tools?

[Zack]

I've been interested lately in the idea of making primitive tools. I think that they're pretty tools, especially knives, and I've head (maybe incorrectly) that they can do better than their modern counterparts. What do you know about primitive tools? Flint? Where is it found (besides Ebay)? What do you recommend to a beginner in terms of projects and a "tool box"? Thanks, please reply!

[RangerXanatos]

I did a large arrow head in glass. Working from a round rock woulf take lots of skill amd patience for me to attempt.

[natertot]

I've been interested lately in the idea of making primitive tools. I think that they're pretty tools, especially knives, and I've head (maybe incorrectly) that they can do better than their modern counterparts. What do you know about primitive tools? Flint? Where is it found (besides Ebay)? What do you recommend to a beginner in terms of projects and a "tool box"? Thanks, please reply!

"primitive" is a word used loosely to describe many things from the beginning of mankind up to about 50 years ago so I don't know exactly what you have in mind. I do think that you heard incorrectly they can do better than their modern counterparts. This is a general statement and I am sure there is an occasional exception to the rule. If the newer variations weren't better, then they wouldn't have replaced their predecessors in the first place. As far as anything primitive goes, it may not be as good as newer things but I find it interesting to learn about and fun to play with. You won't see me doing an entire project with a hand drill though, the Bosch will come out after 2-3 holes!

Just my opinion. If you want to play and learn, have at it. I think that is worthwhile in itself.

[hunter63]

Look in your area to outdoor shows, rendezvous, pow-wows, and craft fairs.....see if some one is doing a demonstration and go watch.

Knapping is an art form, take years of practice, and required special materials, available in limited places.....so that why you see it on Ebay.
Native Americans and the all other cultures traded for materials just like we do today.

[Zack]

Look in your area to outdoor shows, rendezvous, pow-wows, and craft fairs.....see if some one is doing a demonstration and go watch.

Knapping is an art form, take years of practice, and required special materials, available in limited places.....so that why you see it on Ebay.
Native Americans and the all other cultures traded for materials just like we do today.

I'll try that.

[Zack]

"primitive" is a word used loosely to describe many things from the beginning of mankind up to about 50 years ago so I don't know exactly what you have in mind. I do think that you heard incorrectly they can do better than their modern counterparts. This is a general statement and I am sure there is an occasional exception to the rule. If the newer variations weren't better, then they wouldn't have replaced their predecessors in the first place. As far as anything primitive goes, it may not be as good as newer things but I find it interesting to learn about and fun to play with. You won't see me doing an entire project with a hand drill though, the Bosch will come out after 2-3 holes!

Just my opinion. If you want to play and learn, have at it. I think that is worthwhile in itself.

When using the term, I meant Indian type knives and tools. If I had to give a time period and region, I guess I would say Northeast America (Delaware, Pequots, etc.) and parts of the East Coast (Powhatans), up until the late 1500's.

[natertot]

When using the term, I meant Indian type knives and tools. If I had to give a time period and region, I guess I would say Northeast America (Delaware, Pequots, etc.) and parts of the East Coast (Powhatans), up until the late 1500's.

Gotcha. Yeah, what Hunter said.

[natertot]

Knapping is an art form, take years of practice, and required special materials, available in limited places.....so that why you see it on Ebay.
Native Americans and the all other cultures traded for materials just like we do today.

Native Americans and all the other cultures used Ebay too?!!!!!!

Just funnin' ya!

[crashdive123]

I disagree with the statement that primitive stone tools can perform better than their modern counterparts. While it is true that as stone edged tool can be made sharper than a steel edged tool it is also true that you need the correct stone and skill to make that happen. The stone (obsidian) is actually volcanic glass. The skill (as H63 pointed out) will take time to master.

Other things to consider are durability. A stone (glass) knife will be brittle and easily damaged. While obsidian is used in some applications, it is hardly manufactured in a primitive way. Additionally, if a stone knife were superior to a steel blade, we'd probably all be carrying them.

I don't want to put a damper on your enthusiasm to buy/make a knapped tool - just want you to be realistic about it.

From a coolness factor they are hard to beat.

[Rick]

Look for the book Ancient Carpenters Tools by Henry Mercer 0-486-40958-9. It's loaded with every type of tool imaginable.

http://www.amazon.com/Ancient-Carpen.../dp/0486409589

[Zack]

I disagree with the statement that primitive stone tools can perform better than their modern counterparts. While it is true that as stone edged tool can be made sharper than a steel edged tool it is also true that you need the correct stone and skill to make that happen. The stone (obsidian) is actually volcanic glass. The skill (as H63 pointed out) will take time to master.

Other things to consider are durability. A stone (glass) knife will be brittle and easily damaged. While obsidian is used in some applications, it is hardly manufactured in a primitive way. Additionally, if a stone knife were superior to a steel blade, we'd probably all be carrying them.

I don't want to put a damper on your enthusiasm to buy/make a knapped tool - just want you to be realistic about it.

From a coolness factor they are hard to beat.

Like I said, maybe I heard that incorrectly. For instance, I think I heard somewhere that a good obsidian knife can dress game faster and cleaner than a lot of steel knives. Maybe they're wrong? But from a common sense stand-point, I'd disagree as well. But I would still like to pursue a stone knife.

[Rick]

I've posted this before. It's been a while so I hope my numbers are correct. There was a PBS documentary about stone tools. They were able to make a stone blade that was .03 microns across. A scalpel is .05 microns. Crash's comment is spot on. Even though the stone tool is sharper which would you rather have the surgeon use?

[Roel]

Hand axe, they say it was the "Swiss army knive" from the Stone Age. The Neanderthal people used it for more than 250.000 years.
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This kind of blades are like razor blades, even sharper.
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Making arrowheads in Danmark 2013.
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[hunter63]

Like I said, maybe I heard that incorrectly. For instance, I think I heard somewhere that a good obsidian knife can dress game faster and cleaner than a lot of steel knives. Maybe they're wrong? But from a common sense stand-point, I'd disagree as well. But I would still like to pursue a stone knife.

I don't think you "heard incorrectly", I think some one was bragging as in "I can do this better with my stone knife"......... the age of "experts" has exploded with the interweb and Youtube.

I can see a group of hunters sitting around a fire 35000 years ago......Gorg says, "What is the best stone knife?"

[crashdive123]

I don't think you "heard incorrectly", I think some one was bragging as in "I can do this better with my stone knife"......... the age of "experts" has exploded with the interweb and Youtube.

I can see a group of hunters sitting around a fire 35000 years ago......Gorg says, "What is the best stone knife?"

Now that right there is funny.....probably true, but funny.....I don't care who you are.

[kyratshooter]

Can you imagine killing a wooly mammoth with a sharp rock on a short stick, then turning it into jerky strips with a stone knife??

[natertot]

Can you imagine killing a wooly mammoth with a sharp rock on a short stick, then turning it into jerky strips with a stone knife??

that sounds like a good time machine road trip right there!

[hunter63]

Wisconsin Outdoor Journal (defunct) had a kinda a funny article about cloning woolly mammoths (Kenosha County has had two dug up with butcher marks on it). ....rasing and possible hunting seasons.

I tried to find it, on the web....I do still have it in the original form.

I wrote the writer a letter (remember those?)...about hunt regulations, hunting on private property, approved weapons, titanium shaft spears, shining and group hunting....ever tried to drag a mammoth?

Write did respond in kind....funny...but it wasn't published.....
Maybe some day I'll go through my stuff.....find it and a type out the whole thing....not sure about plagiarism.

[natertot]

I could be wrong hunter, but I think that it is only plagiarism if you take the credit for it. If you state clearly who it was written by there shouldn't be a problem. The only other issue to worry about is if the writer is still getting any kind of kick back from it (I doubt it though) and you post it for free. I am not a lawyer though.

[hunter63]

I'll have to see if I can still find it....the writer has passed away some time ago......

They got several letters kinda like mine but were more serious about habitat, cloning in general, and other issues.....couple were printed in their "letter to the editor section"
I guess my tongue in cheek response, basically making fun of our states anal retentive hunting rules, was a little much for the general public.....the writer liked it though.