Night Forum, Wednesday (2/20/08), 10:00pm EST

[pgvoutdoors]

I can not change the thread name so this is a reminder that the forum will be held on Friday at 8:00 pm. I would like to give a few topics for thought; check the terrain, general weather conditions for that time of the year, and estimated time of travel. The more information you can provide the better, show off your skills and your decision making progress. Remember that other people will learn from your postings. I hope many of you can attend.

See you Friday,
PGV

[Rick]

I just thought I'd post a reminder for PGV that the forum will be held this evening. This is a bump.

[Beo]

Koooooool I'm there

[pgvoutdoors]

Thanks Rick for keeping the forum updated. Tonight should be a good time plus a testing ground for possible future scheduled forums. I'm sure they're a few people out there that have some ideas for hosting a forum.

Everyone be sure to read the first posting as it describes the survival situation we will be discussing. A complete answer to the scenario is preferred but not required. Please describe in detail your ideas for any part of the scenario.

See you tonight at 8:00pm U.S. EST!

[Rick]

bump to top

[pgvoutdoors]

Good evening everyone. In a few moments we will start tonight's forum. It will run from 8:00pm to 8:30 pm EST. I've been looking forward to what all of you have come up with. Talk to you in a few minutes.
PGV

[Beo]

Items on Hand: A two blade pocket knife, (2) Quarters and (3) Pennies in change, A glass Coke bottle, and A pack of gum.
Goal:To move two hundred miles in a southerly direction. Once you cross that imaginary line, you will have safely returned to civilization. The route is up to you but you can only travel by foot or watercraft that you have built.
Objectives:1. Provide yourself protection from the weather. 2. provide yourself food and water. 3. Plan a route to civilization.

Travel on foot towards river, at river edge build a raft of logs using vine to tie together, float down stream for 200 miles all the while chewing my gum , stopping along the way to hit squirrels with a rock and cook them, using my knife to gut them and filling glass coke bottle with water from river to drink. During the day make a fire on raft using a large hunk of thick bark that is soaked in river water and wet so as not to burn, using glass bottle and sun start fire using cattail fluff or dried moss, if that don't work use fire bow, after some time I come to safe ground. If that don't work I go by foot and force march outta there and suck up the cold cause I'm a former RANGER and never give up!!! Hooooya!!!
Beo,

[Rick]

How do you want to do this, PGV?

[Beo]

Ohc crap, sorry if I did that wrong, my bad. Back now had to get some salsa and chips

[pgvoutdoors]

Well, I would like to get the first few ideas posted, then I can lead everyone in a direction of discussion. At any point, all of you can chime in if you feel the urge to ask for details.

[Rick]

Do you want us to post our plan first?

[Sam]

I'm gonna build a chariot and have a huge pack of squirrels pull it. (joking)

[pgvoutdoors]

Yes, please

[Rick]

Some considerations. The most direct route means crossing water. Lot’s of it. The most narrow crossing would be at Machinaw Bridge (but we know the bridge isn’t there for this game). That’s still over 4 miles of open water at around 55F in early June. Plus there are strong currents so my odds of making it straight across, alive, even on a warm June day are about zilch no matter what I use to cross. The cotton blue jeans and flannel shirt will only add to the hypothermia problem.

Day time temperatures could be just about anything in early June so I’ll have to be prepared for cold weather during the day, just in case, and maybe even frigid at night.

So my only viable option would be to head West Southwest 50 miles around Lake Michigan and then turn south 100 miles to safety. That will keep me on dry land but take a lot longer. If I can average 15 miles a day then I should make it in 10 days. I’ll give myself a total of 15 days just so I’m mentally prepared. There is not a lot of elevation change in my route of choice. In fact, it’s fairly flat. The whole route averages around 700 feet above see level.

I’ll need to take a heading of 245 or 250 degrees to keep me from running into the shoreline and having to walk around all the coves and inlets but I’ll also want to stay close enough for water if I can’t find any on my route.

To figure out my heading, I’ll use a compass stick. I’ll poke a three foot stick in the ground and place a smaller stick at the tip of the shadow the larger stick makes. In about an hour, the shadow will have moved and I’ll place another smaller stick at the tip of the new shadow. The line formed by the two smaller sticks will give me an east west grid. 90 degrees from that will be north south. Since I know south is 180 degrees and west is 270 degrees I’ll have to eyeball between the two and pick some point on the horizon that sits near my 245 degree heading. I’ll be walking toward that object.

http://www.learn-orienteering.org/old/nocompass1.html

From a survival perspective 15 days is doable. I might even be able to do it without food if I had to but I sure don’t want to. I’ll stay near the shoreline, at least close enough for water, so my only real considerations will be fire, shelter and food.

My ability to make fire with sticks is really bad so I’m going to be without fire unless I can find some flint or chirt both of which can be found in Michigan. And there are a lot of rock outcroppings around Lake Michigan that could serve up some flint. I’ll use my pocket knife as a striker if I get lucky. I will not even attempt to make fire with sticks because I know I’m bad at it and don’t want to waist valuable time and energy when I know the end result. So I’ll be on the lookout for flint and some tinder fungus. That will also help keep my mind occupied and focused on something other than my problem.

I might try to focus the sunlight through the coke bottle during a rest break and see if I can just get lucky and catch a spark but I won’t waist a lot of time with that either. It will be more of a “pass the time” endeavor.

The coke bottle will be my water bottle. But since I don’t have anyway to sterilize it I’m stuck drinking raw lake or stream water unless I find some flint very soon. If I do then I can use the bottle to boil the water and sterilize it.

My shelter will be a debris hut since I won’t have fire. I can stuff my Carhart jacket with leaves, pine needles or grass if I need additional insulation for the night. I can use my socks for gloves stuffed with grass if it gets cold enough. Stuff my tennis shoes with grass to keep my feet warm and fashion a grass “balaclava” to stuff under my ball cap.

I will take time to whittle a spear, probably the first night. It won’t be fire hardened but at least it will be sharp. I’ll be checking small pools and tributaries for any small fish, snakes or grayfish I can spear or catch and like it or not, eat them raw.

The chewing gum is going to be saved. I can use the sugar for additional energy but I’ll only do that when I think I really have to have it. If worse comes to worse and I contract dysentery from the raw water then my body will really need the sugar.

The foil wrapper could be used for signaling and the paper outer wrapper for fire tinder if I can find that elusive flint. I’ll scrape some cotton fiber from my blue jeans or, if I’m lucky, I’ll find some lint in the pockets. I could even pluck some cotton fibers from my socks. I can use that to catch a spark and along with the paper wrapper and some dry grass get a fire going.

Rain is a real concern. If I get wet, I’m going to be cold and with no fire making ability and my cotton clothes that could spell disaster. If it looks like a squall is coming in off the lake or it looks like rain is likely I’ll either stay put in my debris hut and wait it out or if it’s in the middle of the day I’ll look for a nice thick evergreen tree to take shelter under. I don’t like a tree in a thunderstorm but I wouldn’t like dying of hypothermia either. I’ll have to stay dry to stay alive if the temperatures aren’t very warm.

I don’t think this is a particularly bad or difficult scenario unless I’m stuck the entire trip without the ability to make fire. Fire would make this trip a whole lot more comfortable, sanitary and safer from a food, water and warmth perspective. The rest will just be mental knowing I have at least 10 days or more of travel. I’m not worried about food in June because there will be plenty of insects, worms and ant larvae about even if I don’t get lucky hunting the shallow pools.

[Sam]

PGV, what are we wearing for clothes? Sorry I missed that part.

[pgvoutdoors]

Items on Hand: A two blade pocket knife, (2) Quarters and (3) Pennies in change, A glass Coke bottle, and A pack of gum.
Goal:To move two hundred miles in a southerly direction. Once you cross that imaginary line, you will have safely returned to civilization. The route is up to you but you can only travel by foot or watercraft that you have built.
Objectives:1. Provide yourself protection from the weather. 2. provide yourself food and water. 3. Plan a route to civilization.

Travel on foot towards river, at river edge build a raft of logs using vine to tie together, float down stream for 200 miles all the while chewing my gum , stopping along the way to hit squirrels with a rock and cook them, using my knife to gut them and filling glass coke bottle with water from river to drink. During the day make a fire on raft using a large hunk of thick bark that is soaked in river water and wet so as not to burn, using glass bottle and sun start fire using cattail fluff or dried moss, if that don't work use fire bow, after some time I come to safe ground. If that don't work I go by foot and force march outta there and suck up the cold cause I'm a former RANGER and never give up!!! Hooooya!!!
Beo,

What river are you using?

[pgvoutdoors]

PGV, what are we wearing for clothes?

It's in the first posting

[pgvoutdoors]

Has anyone figured out the terrain and weather at the starting location?

[Rick]

Early June temperatures can be anything from chilly to warm. Terrain is sandy and mostly flat. At least that's what I came up with.

[pgvoutdoors]

Early June temperatures can be anything from chilly to warm. Terrain is sandy and mostly flat. At least that's what I came up with.

Average temperatures: 51/75 record low 24 Junes precipitation: 3.10 in.