New to guns

**Rick** · 06-26-2009, 06:21 PM

As compared to a 20 gauge, I agree. Still, I wouldn't want to get shot with one.

Actually, I was concerned more with recoil for her.

**rebel** · 06-27-2009, 11:17 PM

Remy,

If you want to believe 30,000 rounds per man a month then that works for me.

However, lets do the math correctly. 30,000 divided by 20 days ( Uncle Sam gives off Saturday and Sunday during training if possible) = 1500 rounds per day. In your 4 hours of range time you have to reload, change targets, change distances, allow for an hourly potty break , the instruction, malfunctions and at the end police the brass. At most you would have 3 hours of range time. So, 1500 divided by 3 = 500 rounds per hour. Why 3 hours and not the eight hours you suggested. Well, it's not done that way. So, you can see how it would not happen. Right? Your day consists of: 4 hours range , 2 hours simulation, 2 hours hand -to-hand training , 2 hours class and 1 hour lunch. They're long days and that's the way it's done. No U.S. government agency will train 30,000 rounds per man / per month. I guess if you can't hit your target after 4,000 rounds of training per month, the other 26,000 will not help.

**Mountain Man** · 06-28-2009, 11:06 AM

For home defense I would go 12ga 870 or 20ga youth 870 if the 12ga is too much. Keep in mind it might not even be the recoil it could be the reach for her. However, in a home defense situation I highly doubt she'd be shouldering and aiming down the barrel too, so keep that in mind.

My wife can handle the 870 12ga with 3" 00 and she's 5' and 100lbs dripping wet so it can be done. For clay shooting were gonna eventually get her the 20ga youth, much easier to shoulder and reach for her that way.

**Mountain Man** · 06-28-2009, 11:08 AM

Originally Posted by rebel

Remy,

If you want to believe 30,000 rounds per man a month then that works for me.

However, lets do the math correctly. 30,000 divided by 20 days ( Uncle Sam gives off Saturday and Sunday during training if possible) = 1500 rounds per day. In your 4 hours of range time you have to reload, change targets, change distances, allow for an hourly potty break , the instruction, malfunctions and at the end police the brass. At most you would have 3 hours of range time. So, 1500 divided by 3 = 500 rounds per hour. Why 3 hours and not the eight hours you suggested. Well, it's not done that way. So, you can see how it would not happen. Right? Your day consists of: 4 hours range , 2 hours simulation, 2 hours hand -to-hand training , 2 hours class and 1 hour lunch. They're long days and that's the way it's done. No U.S. government agency will train 30,000 rounds per man / per month. I guess if you can't hit your target after 4,000 rounds of training per month, the other 26,000 will not help.

30,000rnds a month training would be reason enough to join said agency

Every 2 or 3 months they assign you a new pistol or new components or what? Sounds interesting

**chiye tanka** · 06-29-2009, 12:36 AM

Max, do not get a shotgun with a pistol grip only.
With a full stock on the weapon, it is less likely to be taken from you, and in turn, used on you.

**Aurelius95** · 06-29-2009, 08:55 PM

Great info, guys. I don't usually pay much attention to this category, as I don't know much about firearms. However, I decided to look for information on what type of hand gun I'd like to buy one day. Definitely a good starting place for me.

**Old GI** · 09-24-2009, 05:40 PM

[QUOTE=Sourdough;128825]

Originally Posted by Max

Isn't a magazine something used for fully automatic weapons, a la Rambo-style, while a clip is what's used in a semi-automatic handgun? Or am I totally wrong about the terminology? I guess I can just take the girly route and call it "those bullet thingies." That'll make everyone happy they let the girl come out and play.

Unlikely you will ever encounter clips, so just learn to call them all magazines, or thingies.

Magazines: a four sided box, with a bottom, a spring, and a cartridge follower, used to hold cartridges.

Clip: a three sided metal spring enclosure, enclosing the back and both sides of the cartridge, it it used for rapid loading of "Blind" Box magazines, generally older military type rifles.

Hey, watch that older military rifle stuff. First time I qualified was with an M-1 and that used a clip.

**glockcop** · 09-24-2009, 07:42 PM

Since you are fresh to guns you should start off with some professional training and use a full framed, 4 inch barreled revolver in .357. You should practice alot with .38 special loads and then move up to .357 mag. for defense. Stainless steel is also the way to go until you get very farmiliar with the care of a handgun. If I were limited to just one handgun it would be a 4 inch stainless steel .357 mag revolver. It does everything any newer designed wiz bang auto pistol does except that it doesn't carry concealed quit as easily. Even that may be overcome with good holsters and belts. Believe it or not you will be just as well armed with this set up any anybody else out there. This is the most versitile combination you can get in a handgun. You can take anything from mice to moose with a properly loaded .357 mag. You may not want to even look for another handgun once you realize the great companion you have found in a .357 mag revolver. Besides they are a little cheaper than the vast majority of auto's out there so the initial cost for the weapon and rounds will be cheaper. My handle may say GLOCKCOP but my heart and mind know that there is nothing better than a good old reliable .357 mag. revolver for life's little problems. It can do it all and then some! Hope this helps. Best.

**Rick** · 09-24-2009, 07:46 PM

You're kidding, right? You're going to sick a 4 inch .357 on a lady? I don't even like shooting a .357. The recoil is awful on the darn things. Yeah, they stop stuff. They stop me from going to the range and shooting them. That's what they stop.

**glockcop** · 09-24-2009, 08:10 PM

Originally Posted by Rick

You're kidding, right? You're going to sick a 4 inch .357 on a lady? I don't even like shooting a .357. The recoil is awful on the darn things. Yeah, they stop stuff. They stop me from going to the range and shooting them. That's what they stop.

NO I am not kidding. That is sound advise that is irrelavent to gender. You have heard of the .38 special haven't you? It's recoil is negligable and very accurate. The hand grip on a revolver can be fit to any hand with aftermarket grips. I have instructed more Police recruits than I can count over the years and that is the best advise to be had. Ask any other instructor about my advise and I promise you , you're gonna have 9 out of 10 agree. The 10th will be too stuck up on auto's. If a 4'' .357 mag is too much for YOU that is not to say that it is too much for this lady. I am sure she can handle the .38's better than mostly anything else out there that is a "real" defensive round (.380's and 32's don't count IMO). There is also a spectrum of weights and velocities that can be used to tune in to your recoil threshold. I am sorry the .357 is too much for YOUR hands but that will come in time with practice. That is the only way to cure the flich. Truth be told the .357 is very loud and that is what causes most of the flinch. The recoil is managable for nearly anyone with practice. Cowboy up man, it ain't that bad. You probably need better hand grips if your magnum hurts you. Remember you can always stick with the .38 specials in it. Name a more versatile handgun and I'll wistle Dixie

.Best.

**Rick** · 09-24-2009, 10:16 PM

I'm in your corner on the .380 and 32s and I don't mind the .38 through the .357 at all. I have a Ruger SP101 SS in .357 and it's just a lot of bark. It doesn't take much to be too much.

I used to cowboy up all the time but got tired of the saddle sores. I just side saddle it anymore and look for a step ladder to get up and down.

**glockcop** · 09-24-2009, 11:21 PM

Originally Posted by Rick

I'm in your corner on the .380 and 32s and I don't mind the .38 through the .357 at all. I have a Ruger SP101 SS in .357 and it's just a lot of bark. It doesn't take much to be too much.

I used to cowboy up all the time but got tired of the saddle sores. I just side saddle it anymore and look for a step ladder to get up and down.

Hey, I hear ya. I was just ridding your a$$ a little bit. You really should try some rubber Hogue or Pachmayer grips on the old wheelie. They are worth their weight in gold. They will make that .357 feel much closer to a hot .38. What model full framed .357 do you have? I may have a pair laying around here that I could spare. It's worth a try to take a great hogleg out of semi-retirement. It really is true though that a .357's bark is what causes most of it's bite especially in a full framed gun. That sp101 is gonna bark a bit more than a larger framed weapon. That's physics for Ya. Can't get around it. Try the Remington "Medium Velocity" .357 mag with a 125 grain Golden Sabre bullet. They are actually pleasant to shoot. Try not to concentrate on the noise as much and you'll notice that full house .357 mag ammo miraculously recoils alot less

. Humans were not designed to have a small explosion go off two feet from our face and not react. You have to reprogram your brain for it. Besides a .38 can get the job done any day, all day long if you do your part. It is a classic cartriage in it's own right that works just about as well as anything else. Nothing wrong with sticking with it instead for sure. Stay safe, Brother.