Help me stock up

[cowgirlup]

True, but the nutritional value difference between the two is completely off-set by the fact that canned goods are not dry. If your in a crappy situation, you will have to use more water to get your dried goods back to being digestible and then drink more water to prevent intestinal/digestive issues. Not saying one shouldn't have dried foods, but the increase of water needed is something to take into consideration. Pros and cons to everything.

True. I guess it all depends on where you live so you should plan accordingly. We don't want to get on Murphy's bad side but water isn't an issue here. Storage space is at a premium though.

[Sunset Sam]

Luckily for me if i'm home with my supplies I have an unlimited supply of safe water.

Does this mean you are on your own well? If so, is the well pump run off electricity from a ulility? That is the situation for me and I am getting worried that some catastophic failure in the power lines (e.g., ice storm) is going to leave us without electricity for a week or more, because we are out at the end of a small branch line and would be one of the very last places to get power restored.

[RandyRhoads]

No. I live on a large body of water and spent hundreds of dollars on water distillation equipment.

[hunter63]

Does this mean you are on your own well? If so, is the well pump run off electricity from a ulility? That is the situation for me and I am getting worried that some catastophic failure in the power lines (e.g., ice storm) is going to leave us without electricity for a week or more, because we are out at the end of a small branch line and would be one of the very last places to get power restored.

Is it possible to add a gen set or even a hand pump?
I have several options at "The Place's" well, gen set(s), water collection system, river......But city water is the only option here.....
I do store some BTW....about 100 gals.....but could use more storage.

[Rick]

I was just thinking that large body of water could become polluted rendering your equipment useless. You can dream up your own scenario but if Murphy has his way a plane loaded with mercury will crash in the middle of it.

[RandyRhoads]

Polluted how? Distillation removes the water from the pollutants?

[Sunset Sam]

Is it possible to add a gen set or even a hand pump?
I

It's a deep well, so hand pump, probably no. Generator, yes, but I am concerned that it will take a pretty big one to put out enough juice to pull the water up several hundred feet to the surface and then 150 yards up hill to the house. Then there is enough fuel to run the beast for a week or more. I remember the pool pump at my folks house in Arizona pulled a heck of a lot of power and it only had to raise the water about 12 feet. Then I have to splice the generator to the well pump separately from the house power because the pump is on a dedicated line. But I think you are right, a big generator is the way to go. At least I don't have water pollution to worry about. (Goddamit Murphy, stand down!)

[hunter63]

My well is 185 ft, has 20 amp breaker 220/240 VAC.......not sure if 1/2 or 3/4 hp....I would have to go look.
Mine runs with a 6500 watt Colman Gen set.....wired direct when needed.....

Looks like about 12 amps draw.
http://www.grainger.com/product/DAYT...ZU4?s_pp=false

[hunter63]

found this chart of appliance needs.
Quote>
From
http://www.northerntool.com/shop/too...drxAAgwWattage
ChartCategory Appliance
Running Wattage Required Surge Wattage Required at Startup
Household/RV Coffee Maker 1750 0
Dishwasher: Cool/Dry 700 1400
Electric Fry Pan 1300 0
Electric Range: 8in. Eleme 2100 0
625W Microwave 625 800
Refrigerator or Freezer 700 2200
Automatic Washer 1150 2300
Electric Clothes Dryer 1800 5750
Furnace Fan (Gas or fuel oil): 1/8 HP 300 500
Furnace Fan (Gas or fuel oil): 1/6 HP 500 750
Furnace Fan (Gas or fuel oil): 1/4 HP 600 1000
Furnace Fan (Gas or fuel oil): 1/3 HP 700 1400
Furnace Fan (Gas or fuel oil): 1/2 HP 875 2350
Lights As indicated on bulb 0
Radio 50-200 0
Sump Pump: 1/3 HP 800 1300
Sump Pump: 1/2 HP 1050 2150
Color Television 300 0
RV Air Conditioner: 13,500 BTU 1500 2200
Room Air Conditioner: 10,000 BTU 1500 2200
Central Air Conditioner (for 2200 sq. ft. home*) 10,000 11,250
Small Appliance 200 1700
Contractor 8in. Bench Grinder 1400 2500
Pressure Washer: 1 HP 1200 3600
7-1/4in. Circular Saw 1400 2300
Electric Chain Saw: 14in. Bar, 2 HP 1100 0
10in. Table Saw 1800 4500
Drill: 3/8in., 4 Amps 440 600
Drill: 1/2in., 5.4 Amps 600 900
Industrial Motors Split Phase: 1/4 HP 600 1000
Split Phase: 1/2 HP 875 2300
Capacitor Start Induction Run: 1/3 HP 720 1300
Capacitor Start Induction Run: 1 HP 1600 4500
Capacitor Start Capacitor Run: 1 1/2 HP 2000 6100
Fan Duty: 1/6 HP 550 850
Farm Equipment Electric Fence: 25 Miles 2500 0
Milk Cooler 1100 1800
Milker (Vacuum Pump): 2 HP 1000 2300
Portable Heater (Kerosene, Diesel Fuel): 50,000 BTU 400 600
Portable Heater (Kerosene, Diesel Fuel): 90,000 BTU 500 725
Portable Heater (Kerosene, Diesel Fuel): 150,000 BTU 625 1000
Battery Charger: 15 Amp 380 0
Battery Charger: 60 Amp with 250 Amp Boost 1500/5750 0
Battery Charger: 100 Amp with 300 Amp Boost 2400/7800 0
Electric Welder: 200 Amp AC 9000 0
Electric Welder: 230 Amp AC at 100 Amp 7800 0
Computers Desktop 600-800 0
Laptop 200-250 0
Monitor 200-250 0
Fax 600-800 0
Printer 400-600 0

[Old Professor]

I have a water purifier that can handle all my needs and a stream that flows through my property that has never dried up. I had about seventeen gallons of water stored that I used this winter when my water froze. I used it to flush the toilet until the village maintainence workers came up with a bypass (after 4 days). I had lots of bottled water for cooking and drinking.
I have about a 30 day supply of food stored in my heated garage. I intend to shelter in place if something bad happens, so canned goods work for me inspite of the weight. Since I live alone, I only store the kinds of food that I like to eat or cook.

[Rick]

My only point, Randy, is never think never. One = None, remember. When you rely on a single item or single source that's when disaster strikes.

[RandyRhoads]

Good advice Rick. Ill keep that in mind. Got me thinking of more possibilities that could go wrong.

[LowKey]

Food storage shouldn't be a pack it and forget it thing. Self-rotating can racks are easy to build. Grocery stores can have major sales of canned and dry goods and I stock up whenever they do. I really wish that the big box stores like Sams and BJs would go back to carrying cases of stuff instead of specially packed overized containers of stuff. I'd much rather have a case of spaghetti sauce in small jars rather than two big 2gallon jars tied together with a plastic carry handle. You often don't save any money in those stores any more because of all the expensive off market packaging they now use.

Be sure you have a scenario or two to store toward. Mine started with being able to last a week with no power in December. Then when it actually happened, it turned into two weeks, one of them being sub-zero. Wasn't quite prepared for that. Far more prepared now.
So after two weeks no power in the middle of winter, my storage goals changed to having one month's supply of food laid in. Slowly working that up to 6 months.

I have a propane powered genny that will run 3 weeks on its current tanks to keep the fridge, freezer, heat and sump pumps running. And gives me time to think about what to do with the freezer and cellar contents. I have a backup portable genny that will run the furnace and sumps. Trying to figure out how to capitalize on the water feature in the basement. Quite a supply of fresh water, protected and conveniently located...but a whole cellarfull isn't gonna work so well. Should have it tested. Wells here have an arsenic problem.

I put in fireplace inserts to heat if the genny gives out. I keep plenty of cordwood on hand. Buying early this year because last winter there was a shortage of wood and pellets here. The hardware stores were rationing pellets to 10 bags - when they had em, not by-the-ton palettes. Forget finding any firewood in January. Didn't buy a pellet stove. Most want electricity to feed though there are a few gravity feeds out there.

I digress though. It's all about working up to goals. Once you can do This Thing, start thinking toward The Next Thing.

[1stimestar]

You could look into an oil drip stove. Economical and requires no electricity.

[Winnie]

Big thing in my house, make sure you have a good supply of herbs, spices and stock(bouillon?) cubes to make all that boring stuff taste good.

Have a mix of things. Dried and canned, ready to eat and needs cooking. Nothing worse than having all that food and for lack of a way of cooking it you go hungry

[canid]

Food storage shouldn't be a pack it and forget it thing.

For sure. The goal isn't to 'collect' food here. It will eventually spoil and you could have a very large collection of spoiled canned goods.

I saw a lot of dried beans but decided to post here first before buying 50 pounds of them. Ratios are also troubling me. I guess it's really not that important, the more the better. But is 3 gallons of salt and 3 gallons of pepper overkill? Guess it couldn't hurt to have buckets of seasoning too right?

It comes back again to what you regularly like to eat. 3 gallons of black pepper might be a heck of a lot while it's fresh. if you don't open it for 10 years, it could possibly be stale and bland enough to eat it on it's own. In my household we go through about 1lb of it per year, which is as long as it keeps much kick. On the other hand, I personally eat far greater amounts of dried hot chilies, and so those are what I would store.

Salt is important. You can live without pepper, chilies, basil, cilantro, cinnamon and such, but you will die if you do not regularly eat salt. It's pretty cool that it happens to be dirt cheap (though probably not getting any cheaper, it having doubled in price here in 5 years) and it will keep for centuries longer than the buckets you have.

Another thing I like to store, and which must be rotated is dried greens. they don't hold a candle to fresh, but they go well in a lot of things and I invariably end up growing and often end up collecting more than I will use right off. I'm sure you've noticed you live in an area with enough field mustard to make it the bulk of one's diet. Lots of wild fennel too. You get them bone dry and then pack in cans or buckets with dried grains and legumes and they'll keep easily. When you're ready to eat them that way they are already the backbone of a soup.

[Rick]

If you have a water softener then you probably have about 160 pounds of salt already stored.

[LowKey]

Salt is funny stuff. Sure get all the iodized or non-iodized table salt you want.
But you have to understand too, that table salt is not canning salt, and iodized table salt even less so. While you can use it, it turns home canned goods cloudy or off color. I keep 5 boxes of canning salt in rotation. I only use about a box a year but if I ever needed to can the freezer...it's there. It cakes though so keep it dry. You can preserve food with Kosher salt too but Kosher salt is fluffier because it is usually flaked instead of crystalized. Be careful of your measuring.

The solar salt in water softening systems isn't "sea salt" in the edible sense. It may be mixed with other things and is not considered food grade. Same with Rock Salt. Other ion exchanging chemicals may be mixed in too. Be sure you know what's in the water softener before consuming it.

[RandyRhoads]

For sure. The goal isn't to 'collect' food here. It will eventually spoil and you could have a very large collection of spoiled canned goods.



It comes back again to what you regularly like to eat. 3 gallons of black pepper might be a heck of a lot while it's fresh. if you don't open it for 10 years, it could possibly be stale and bland enough to eat it on it's own. In my household we go through about 1lb of it per year, which is as long as it keeps much kick. On the other hand, I personally eat far greater amounts of dried hot chilies, and so those are what I would store.

Salt is important. You can live without pepper, chilies, basil, cilantro, cinnamon and such, but you will die if you do not regularly eat salt. It's pretty cool that it happens to be dirt cheap (though probably not getting any cheaper, it having doubled in price here in 5 years) and it will keep for centuries longer than the buckets you have.

Another thing I like to store, and which must be rotated is dried greens. they don't hold a candle to fresh, but they go well in a lot of things and I invariably end up growing and often end up collecting more than I will use right off. I'm sure you've noticed you live in an area with enough field mustard to make it the bulk of one's diet. Lots of wild fennel too. You get them bone dry and then pack in cans or buckets with dried grains and legumes and they'll keep easily. When you're ready to eat them that way they are already the backbone of a soup.

Sadly I think i'm slightly allergic to the mustard greens. Probably this oral allergy syndrome crap. But if that's the case I should be ok to eat it after it's been dried/cooked. I use a TON of fennel seeds when I make stew/soup.

Are you saying you go pick a ton of mustard/fennel and store it? Wouldn't you want to store stuff you can't get any time?

[canid]

I don't store a ton of the wild stuff - though the fennel and mustard can often only be found most of the year - but you might as well ask why store canned or bulk goods. They can - after all - be had any time.

I'm sorry to hear you have trouble with the mustard. It's one of my favorite greens, just behind kale.