Making water safe to drink?

[natertot]

Thanks Rick and Hunter. I always keep a couple qts in the car. I check them whenever I get gas to make sure they are okay and not leaking. I have those for roadside emergency and get home scenarios. Lately I've been wanting to add water to the home supply. I have lots of ponds and River near me, but it would be nice to have some on hand until other water is made potable. What is the benefit of rotating out water every 4-6 mos? Does it go bad or is it just a precautionary step to ensure health when used?

[hunter63]

Thanks Rick and Hunter. I always keep a couple qts in the car. I check them whenever I get gas to make sure they are okay and not leaking. I have those for roadside emergency and get home scenarios. Lately I've been wanting to add water to the home supply. I have lots of ponds and River near me, but it would be nice to have some on hand until other water is made potable. What is the benefit of rotating out water every 4-6 mos? Does it go bad or is it just a precautionary step to ensure health when used?

Time and paranoia.....one of those JIC deals.
Have used those water jugs for a long time, washed them, bleached them......and it seems like water kept in them has a "rubber taste" after a while, but that is just me.

[Rick]

Just my paranoia. I suppose the water would be good if I never changed it out but as long as I can I do. It just gives me some piece of mind to know the water is "fresh". I have access to a lot of water as well but if city water is off for some reason we don't have to worry about drinking, cooking or hygiene.

EDIT: We posted at the same time. I guess great minds think alike.

[kyratshooter]

When the stored water is used up the supply you are forced to use is STILL going to be polluted.

One had best plan for use of a filter system now and have the materials on hand.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FnaX1WvPSu0

[hunter63]

When the stored water is used up the supply you are forced to use is STILL going to be polluted.

One had best plan for use of a filter system now and have the materials on hand.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FnaX1WvPSu0

It too bad that where weren't any tests to confirm that it actually worked as far as bio, and other pollutants.....a clean catch buclet would have been nice?

I built a similar system a while back using clean 5 gal buckets.
Sand came in a bag, gravel was washed and was lime stone (figured cheap and acid rain?) and I used activated charcoal, from fish/ pool supplier.

Used it on rain water, but was really disappointed on effectiveness, and the sand turned green (good bacteria/good bacteria???? Don't know).
During a rain storm just the shed roof overflowed it real quick.

Still wouldn't drink it, as is....... No longer assembled or in use.

The collection system is still there, and has been posted before.
It is just 2- 50 gal plastic drums, not connected, one collection and one supply....water transferred from one to the other with small pump/ pool filter, as needed, then bleach added.

There is a first flush, and strangely enough, but watching it work, the debris in the gutter seems to pre-filter the grit, and worked much better when I left it alone, rather than cleaning it out.

Water used for a shower...mostly but is clean to the looking thru the glass test....I would boil it prior to drinking or cooking.

P.S. Not very portable

[Rick]

I keep a gallon of sodium hypochlorite in the garage at all times. I have an MSR Sweetwater kit and spare filter. I have boiling stations that can be used for water purification as well as food services clean up. If all that fails then I know a guy that knows a guy that's supposed to have access to a lot of water purification stuff.

[hunter63]

LOL.....It's called bleach folks.......and the dollar store has a set of measuring spoons for a buck....up to a cup.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodium_hypochlorite

[Rick]

But it doesn't have any additives of any kind in it. Go to the local pool supply shop and ask them for a gallon of sodium hypochlorite. I think I paid $8 for the last gallon I bought.

[RandyRhoads]

I'm not thinking of a situation like a natural disaster. I have water stocked for that. I also have a copper/steel distiller I made for distilling....uhhhhhhhh....water =D So I COULD do that and control the temps but that's not what i'm interested in. I like primitive ways of doing things and was curious of a primitive way to get water around here. Of course there is dew collecting solar stills and such but did early people rely on these? What did they do in these parts? I realize most of the mercury is from the gold rush mining. So even if it isn't specifically polluted mercury or petroleum, aren't there other bad things, such as naturally occuring chemicals like methylmercury ?

[Rick]

They dug a well. If they traveled I'd bet a pickle to a pepper they looked for running water when they could. That's certainly no guarantee but it was a common belief. Pollution and even bad bugs like giardia are, for the most part, introduced problems in the U.S. so they didn't have to contend with a lot of the problems. Those that are indigenous folks got sick and some died. It's a hard way to figure out what's good water and what isn't. Certainly not something I'd play around with. We developed modern methods of purifying water so we didn't die so often.

[Wildthang]

Have you ever heard of an air well? You bury about 12 foot of 6" PVC pipe 6 foot underground with a 90 degree elbow on each end. You slant the horizontal underground pipe about 1/2" per foot. You install a vertical pipe onto each 90 degree elbow. One should be around 6 foot above ground, and the other around 3 foot above ground. You install a self priming hand pump and the pickup tube goes in the lowest end of the horizontal piece underground. The difference in temperature between outside ambient temp and underground temp condenses pure fresh water which collects in the low end of the horizontal underground pipe. It will produce from 4 to 7 gallons of pure fresh water per day. I would put fine screens on the open end of the riser pipes to keep out insects.
This will allow mother nature produce pure water for you every day at no cost, no chemicals, no power, just a little pumping. You could install and electric pump I suppose if you want to get fancy! Oh, and clean all the inside of the pipe with bleach solution before assembly!

[RandyRhoads]

Wow very interesting, thanks!

[Wildthang]

Wow very interesting, thanks!

No problem Randy! It is one of the best ways to get pure water I have ever seen. But just rember, when it's around 50 degrees outside, it doesn't make much water because the outside air temp is so close to ungerground temperature. But nothing is perfect you know! The temperature differential is what produces the condensation. And if you put a very small electric fan to blow air into the lower pipe, it will produce more water!

[Thaddius Bickerton]

Boiling can actually concentrate some chemical contamination by reducing the amount of water that it is dissolved / suspended in. This is similar to heating a weak acid which evaporates the solution that is diluting the acid thus concentrating it into a stronger acid.

For many heavy metals etc, filtering through activated charcoal will get them out. Mercury is one I'm not sure how to get out short of distilling / solar still / etc via evaporation / re condensation of the water vapor (steam).

Around my area, I purify water as follows:

1. I use a home made version of the "Millbank bag". This removes turbidity from the water (cloudy / muddy / leaves / bugs / etc floaty bits). The water can still contain microbes however. (I Have been told of filter bags that can be ordered that filter down to 1 micron which supposedly will get most microbes that cause sickness which typically are of 1 - 4 microns in size. I haven't tried them however.)

Assuming that I have confidence that no microbes are present the water can be used after the Millbank bag filter.

2. After filtering the water with a Millbank bag, I then either chemically treat it, or just boil it to rolling boil for a minute or so in a billy can.

Usually I will treat only if on the move, as I prefer to boil it.

***

When I'm on the move I have just put a piece of tee shirt over the mouth of a bottle and let the water filter into it, then throw in a purification tablet or drop in some bleach etc. Not the best tasting, but drinkable and allows continuing movement. (This is a military option that I don't find necessary if just woods loafing, and long time since military so just for information purposes at this point.)

***

I actually have a copper tea kettle and some tubing that I can literally set up a "still" and boil / condense my water if I need to know 100% it is as pure as I can get it.

***

The most basic is boil after a prefilter through some kind of cloth.

Link for Millbank bag info.

[Rick]

Let's talk about that. Most mechanical filters will filter down to 0.2 microns. That does not block viruses. You still have to treat water with a chlorine product if you want to kill viruses as well as cysts, protozoa, bacteria and nematodes.

How do you have confidence that no bugs are present?

I used a handkerchief this past week-end to cover the mouth of a canteen bottle and it took water long enough to clog the thread openings in the handkerchief. Covering the top of a bottle with a cloth is no guarantee you'll get water if the water is silty.

For boiling, there is no need to boil for one minute. Once you bring water to a boil you have killed all pathogens in the water. As long as the water temperature exceeds 70C or 158F water pathogens are killed. Boiling it is just an easy way to know how hot the water is without using a thermometer. Boiling longer simply wastes fuel.

As for taste, each to their own, but I don't have a problem with the taste of Potable Aqua pills. I'm not crazy about iodine however.

[kyratshooter]

I believe that if you check you will find that we are expecting water for our survival needs in a more pure form than we get from our utilities. Most utilities simply push the water through a sand filter and dribble clorine into it at a steady rate. They test daily for clorine content but only on occassion for contaminants, the reasoning being that if the chemicals are present at a specific level the contamination is dead.

I see the same question asked and addressed over and over again in this single thread as if the answer can not really be the answer, something else is really the answer. I also see misuse/misapplication of the processes presented and wonderment that they do not work.

It is simple; Strain the water, filter the water, put a chemical in the water, if really scared boil the water.

Your city water utility strains, filters and adds chlorine, if something goes wrong what do they do? They issue a boil alert.

There is only so much we can accomplish past filtering, boiling and a few drops of clorine. That is the standard for clean water world wide. Why should we expect something we can buy for a few cents and carry in a belt pouch to operate more efficiently?

The only real way I know of to eleminate the entire process is to switch to beer! The absolute proof that God loves us.

[jcullen24]

Here's something I read recently for purifying water.

You will need the following:

3 sticks about 3' long and 1" in diameter
3 pieces of cloth, cotton, denim burlap, anything that is strong and will allow water to drain through it
Grass, Sand and (Charcoal taken from your fire)
1 collection can (Coffee Can)
Create a tripod with your three sticks an equal distance apart.
Secure the 3 cloths to your tripod.

Fill the first cloth with Grass.
Fill the second cloth with Sand
Fill the third cloth with Charcoal

Pour your water into the first cloth at the top, it will drain through all three cloths, first grass, then sand then charcoal and into your collection can.
Boil the water that collected into your collection can.

You now have water that's better than city water!


waterfilter.jpg
Taken from The book: Wilderness Survival 2nd edition
Gregory L. Davenport

[Rick]

You can find it in the Army Survival Manual located on our page:

http://www.wilderness-survival.net/water-4.php

[jcullen24]

Wow, great reference!
Book Marked to read, there's so much online and I have barely scratched the surface!
Amazing that it's right here.

Thanks again!
Jim

[Rick]

You'll notice there is another option there made from a pant leg. That's just an example of field improvised tools. Any type of cloth will work as long as it's porous (not nylon, etc.) and you can construct it to hold water.

I think an awful lot of attention is put toward filtering out leaves and twigs when the reality is those are pretty easy to keep out of your water. I recently pulled raw water from a shoreline where the wind was in my face churning up the water pretty good. I pulled a lot of water that was silt laden but nothing else in it. Then just let the silt settle out and pull the water off the top. Just be observant as to what's in the water and you can keep the big stuff out.