How do you defend a retreat....Good question?

[Beo]

Or I could be wrong.

[trax]

There's the material being blasted. Timber is more difficult to blow up than rock is, the timber is more porous and absorbs the blast. Concrete can be easier to blow up than clay because it's brittle and the concussion is a direct hit whereas the clay absorbs the concussion. Sand just collapses because that's sand for ya. The harder rock is the better it breaks when you blast. A packed charge will have better effect than a charge that's just tossed in, other variables being equalled (ie type and amount of explosive) but of course in the situations that Beo described, you probably don't have a lot of time to be setting really nice charges. It's like when you watch one of those building demolitions and they make the building implode, the charges are set so that the blast goes down, and with enough force that it creates a huge enough vacuum that the structural integrity of the building can't withstand the vacuum and the building is literally sucked down behind the blast. I've always wanted to try that, just, you know, to see if I could get it right. Funny, no one's asking me to go ahead

[Chris]

Bunkers completely useles, even as a bomb shelter cause ther goin to be droppin nuclear bombs on us. Also all laughfin and joking aside if you start stalkin to much the goverment does keep tabs on that sort of stuff.

If a nuke drops on your head you're dead. Only the gov has got bunkers that can take a nuke.

But a bunker can protect you from things like radioactive fallout.

[wareagle69]

here in the nickel mining capital of the world we have tons on old shafts 4000 to 6000 ft down we can withstand a nuke, as for repelling any attack i just tell nell they are going after trax and watch the desruction.

how did this get from a bait attack a faux sherriff or a couple of thugs to people droping semtex into my bunker seriuosly.

i have a bunker cuz for me it's fun bottom line it ain't about the end of the world or such things it's about being prepared. IF and i say if in a shtf scenario someone walks the hour and a half to my place they might be a little determined, so i fall back let them take the stuff i leave as a decoy and me and mine are safe, that is how i think if you don't like it then go pound salt, to call me crazy or wrong means you can't open your mind enough to see all the possibilities, i do not preach to people about anything here other than to be prepared, whatever that means to you... to me it means a bunker for safe storage, i hope i never have to use it but

this reminds me of when i joined the army oct 87 how long had it been since we had a conflict and don't count operation live fire in grenada where even the cooks got a cib because he heard gunfire, i took my training very seriously and was rideculed for that then how many conflicts since dec 89 have we been in? how many dead? every one said it wouldn't happen, but what if it does. whats it to you if i prepare have i wasted any thing other thsn my time? how does this affect you? so all i can say is bugger off.

well all i can say is bugger off and what?

sing along if ya know the words
always be prepared....

[trax]

Yep Yep, I was thinking your part of the PreCambrian shield. I could do ya some serious tunnels man, problem with old mine shafts is they flood.

[wareagle69]

ya thats whats great about being a plumber i can fix that

[nell67]

here in the nickel mining capital of the world we have tons on old shafts 4000 to 6000 ft down we can withstand a nuke, as for repelling any attack i just tell nell they are going after trax and watch the desruction.

how did this get from a bait attack a faux sherriff or a couple of thugs to people droping semtex into my bunker seriuosly.

i have a bunker cuz for me it's fun bottom line it ain't about the end of the world or such things it's about being prepared. IF and i say if in a shtf scenario someone walks the hour and a half to my place they might be a little determined, so i fall back let them take the stuff i leave as a decoy and me and mine are safe, that is how i think if you don't like it then go pound salt, to call me crazy or wrong means you can't open your mind enough to see all the possibilities, i do not preach to people about anything here other than to be prepared, whatever that means to you... to me it means a bunker for safe storage, i hope i never have to use it but

this reminds me of when i joined the army oct 87 how long had it been since we had a conflict and don't count operation live fire in grenada where even the cooks got a cib because he heard gunfire, i took my training very seriously and was rideculed for that then how many conflicts since dec 89 have we been in? how many dead? every one said it wouldn't happen, but what if it does. whats it to you if i prepare have i wasted any thing other thsn my time? how does this affect you? so all i can say is bugger off.

well all i can say is bugger off and what?

sing along if ya know the words
always be prepared....

Thanks WE,I must be one mean little badazz,eh? LMAO!!!!

[Tony uk]

You pay the Twinkienator 100 twinkies per hour to watch over it, No one would dare try and go near it

[trax]

You pay the Twinkienator 100 twinkies per hour to watch over it, No one would dare try and go near it

Tony, I think we just have to tell him that his Twinkie stash is being threatened and then unleash him

[Rick]

Cheap jokes. Real cheap. No Super Moderator respect shown around here, that's for sure.

[trax]

Cheap jokes. Real cheap. No Super Moderator respect shown around here, that's for sure.

Well that's just silly, everyone respects Sarge

[nell67]

Rick,you knew the job was dangerous when you took, it,or you could have asked Sarge,he would have 'splained it to you

[Sam]

What about a prefab tunnel system. Could you use concrete pipe for the path ways and conex containers for rooms? I mean some of you own back hoes so it seems possible. You could just sod over the cuts to hide them until the grass and brush grew back.
I don't claim any training in building tunnels. So I am genuinely curious.

[Rick]

Sam - That's an interesting thought. Our county courthouse is well over 100 years old so the county decided to build a new one across the street. They also spent several million to redo the old courthouse and did exactly what you suggested. They installed a prefab concrete tunnel to connect the two underground. It's been a couple of years but it seems like the tunnel sections were around 12' wide by 10' high. Each section was about 20' or 25' in length. I didn't watch the construction so I don't know what they did to keep moisture from infiltrating the seams or if any additional supports were added for roof load, which would be a concern on square or rectangular concrete but it could certainly be done.

You could use 8' road culverts and weld the ends together which would support well because of the round shape and be a whole lot cheaper.

[crashdive123]

One of the facilities at the last military base I was stationed on had to be built under ground. It was done with the pre-fab sections. The facility is fairly deep and this was in SE Georgia. Ground water was a real problem - hit water after a few feet. Solution - liquid nitrogen. Lots and lots of liquid nitrogen (22 tankers if I remember right).

[Rick]

If you fill the facility with liquid nitrogen then......

[Beo]

What about a prefab tunnel system. Could you use concrete pipe for the path ways and conex containers for rooms? I mean some of you own back hoes so it seems possible. You could just sod over the cuts to hide them until the grass and brush grew back.
I don't claim any training in building tunnels. So I am genuinely curious.

I have a friend in Kentucky who did that, he dug out his land (about 150 ft. from the house) and sunk the conex/sea land containers in it at certain areas and then placed those big heavy round concrete sewer tunnels in a sort of highway/hallway connecting them all there about 8 feet high and 10 feet wide or close to that, and once done he covered the whole thing over with the dirt he had removed, their about 6 feet below the surface from the conex top and he even ran an air vent at each conex, he has food storage in one, goods and supplies in another, ammo and weapons in another, and living quarters in the last one, a generator to power the drop lights he has running through the whole thing. Not the deepest thing in the world but no one knows its there (except for you guys now) and it'll supply him for a good long time. He has railroad ties as steps leading down to it, don't ask me where he got the materials I have no clue. Once done he planted Ky. Bluegrass over the whole thing along with crab grass and ivy to climb out to the trees. There's a creek about a quarter mile away so he's thinking he's good if he needs to go undergound in an emergency. Once inside he sealed it W.E.T.'s
1050 Conseal Primer and then 1000 CONSEAL a concrete sealer to keep moisture out.
Maybe Sam ain't to far off.
Beo,

[Rick]

Sam - If you used metal corrugated steel pipe and finish the outside with shotcrete I think it would be both watertight and pretty darn tough. You can get the pipe in round and oblong design. I think they call the oblong pipe-arch or something like that. I would think you could have a removable walkway down the center of either one and place any electrical or other service piping below the walkway. It would be out of the way and yet serviceable.

[Sam]

Sam - If you used metal corrugated steel pipe and finish the outside with shotcrete I think it would be both watertight and pretty darn tough. You can get the pipe in round and oblong design. I think they call the oblong pipe-arch or something like that. I would think you could have a removable walkway down the center of either one and place any electrical or other service piping below the walkway. It would be out of the way and yet serviceable.

Here is a link to some shelters including the containers Beo referenced.

http://www.earth-house.com/Disaster_...tructures.html

I've seen these systems before, I just did not know how feasible they would be for joe public. The ones I have seen were government spots, and they can afford the cost/labor.

[trax]

It depends on the ground underneath you, most places you can dig the soil that deep, but if you hit the rock I was talking about, you're going to be blasting anyway. But I think it's a great idea Sam, if a person has decided to go that way.