Fire arms drills

**Pal334** · 01-27-2010, 12:23 PM

I used that title for lack of anything better. I was just reading an article about how some Marines are training for duty in Afghanistan.

http://www.defense.gov/news/newsarticle.aspx?id=57735

"There's going to be a lot of pivoting and shooting, facing away from the target and turning around very quickly; usually engaging the target with two shots at a time," said Marine Corps Cpl. Sandro Ola, a field radio operator. "It's very quick and to the point."

I am not a big proponent of the world government, collapse of society, anarchy theories etc. I , as well as many of the vets / LEO on this forum have probably had some variation this type of training.

My question: Do you think an "average" shooter (whatever your definition of "average" is) would be prudent to include in their firearms training the type of drill described above?

**glockcop** · 01-27-2010, 12:46 PM

Pal, in a word, Yes. Everyone that carries a weapon should train for it's instantaneous deployment and use. Crisis rarely accompanies convienience. You and I both know the bad guy is counting on you not being ready for the surprise attack. One should be proficient with their weapon in as many situations as possible. The "average shooter" will never become an "exceptional shooter" if first the basic training fundamentals are not learned and then secondly the more refined skills attained. IMO, you are not "armed" if you are not trained no matter what you are carrying. Always practice to be better than you are today and constantly hone the skills you have acquired. There is no such thing as "good enough" or being "too good". Take care, Brother.

**BENESSE** · 01-27-2010, 01:26 PM

Glockop is spot on!
I certainly intend to be the best I can be under the circumstances. (wish they were more convenient)
Can't imagine survival preparedness that doesn't include comprehensive firearms training.

**Pal334** · 01-27-2010, 01:38 PM

Originally Posted by BENESSE

Glockop is spot on!
I certainly intend to be the best I can be under the circumstances. (wish they were more convenient)
Can't imagine survival preparedness that doesn't include comprehensive firearms training.

Being in NYC, how do you get firearms training? I know now that I am out of the Federal and military loop it can be difficult here in NJ to get proper ranges and range time. Looking forward to heading to upstate NY for more space

**Old GI** · 01-27-2010, 01:39 PM

GC: As usual, UH DAH MANNNN!!!!. Another result of that training/practice is knowing what your physical limitations are and how to work aorund them.

**BENESSE** · 01-27-2010, 01:49 PM

Originally Posted by Pal334

Being in NYC, how do you get firearms training? I know now that I am out of the Federal and military loop it can be difficult here in NJ to get proper ranges and range time. Looking forward to heading to upstate NY for more space

There's a firing range (open 7 days a week) with NRA instructors on staff and one-on-one training. (for a fee)
It's the best I can do.

**glockcop** · 01-27-2010, 02:12 PM

Old GI and Benesse, Thanks for the compliment. It is a welcome departure from what criminals usually tell me on a daily basis. Yall take care.

**BENESSE** · 01-27-2010, 02:24 PM

I've always been a huge proponent of a peace time draft across the board. Men & women, college students, anyone who's not in a coma.
From there, people can choose to enlist and continue with their career just as they do now but at the very least everyone would know the basics. We can't afford not to any more.

**Byte Me** · 01-27-2010, 02:28 PM

try to turn away from downrange with a loaded weapon at our range an the range master will bark at you like you had lost your mind. The best way to practice turn & fire method would be to find a remote area. At our range you arent even allowed to rapid fire it must be a 3 second pause between rounds or they will give you an ear full. Needless to say I dont go there unless I am to lazy to get out west of town.

**hunter63** · 01-27-2010, 02:33 PM

GC, great post, training is a big piece of the pie, IMHO.

Last winter while we were in La, a mile or so from DD and SIL house, was a range and club, offering CC training.
La. course is supposed to recognized in most other states that require it.

As I could hear the shooting, most every day, I stopped over and inquired, if an out of state person could take the course.

Guy says, yeah, no problem, but we are "full up" for the next couple of sessions, (very popular in that area.
Well, as the time frame didn't fit our stay I didn't include it in my plans.

When we return, I'm seriously considering buying in for a membership.

They also specialize in long range 1000M and such.

**Ole WV Coot** · 01-27-2010, 03:18 PM

Yes, I agree. I drill with a handgun more now and can do any shooting I wish at home. I don't practice one hand reload with either hand much anymore but handgun and rifle drills if you have either learn, same with any weapon including my favorite a walking stick.

**glockcop** · 01-27-2010, 03:30 PM

Originally Posted by Byte Me

try to turn away from downrange with a loaded weapon at our range an the range master will bark at you like you had lost your mind. The best way to practice turn & fire method would be to find a remote area. At our range you arent even allowed to rapid fire it must be a 3 second pause between rounds or they will give you an ear full. Needless to say I dont go there unless I am to lazy to get out west of town.

Here is how you can practice "turn and fire" drills safely. Never turn "uprange" with a weapon in hand. You must practice "ONE" man at a time and walk a course parallel to the burm for "turn and fire drills" on a typical range. You look straight ahead (really at the side of the range) as you walk parallel to the burm. You will only be turning 90 degrees instead of 180 degrees to fire toward the burm. You turn and fire at the order of the Range Master once he sees that you have arrived at a target as you walk. It is still good training for ultra fast target aquisition practice. That is the only safe way to do it on a typical range. Good luck training and stay safe.

**2dumb2kwit** · 01-27-2010, 04:14 PM

Originally Posted by glockcop

Pal, in a word, Yes. Everyone that carries a weapon should train for it's instantaneous deployment and use. Crisis rarely accompanies convienience. You and I both know the bad guy is counting on you not being ready for the surprise attack. One should be proficient with their weapon in as many situations as possible. The "average shooter" will never become an "exceptional shooter" if first the basic training fundamentals are not learned and then secondly the more refined skills attained. IMO, you are not "armed" if you are not trained no matter what you are carrying. Always practice to be better than you are today and constantly hone the skills you have acquired. There is no such thing as "good enough" or being "too good". Take care, Brother.

Well said, GC. People seem to forget, that a gun is just a tool....and like most tools, they don't do things on their own. Their successful use is largely dependant on the operator.

**doug1980** · 01-27-2010, 04:21 PM

Rapid fire and quick target aquisition is always a great thing to practice. Like anything in life practice makes "perfect" but then again nothing is truley perfect. The important thing for most people is to get the basics down. Trigger pull, breathing, mechanics and know your weapon of choice in and out. Anyone can shoot a gun, and anyone can hit a target from time to time but not everyone can be proficient. I think doing any type of shooting practice is good.

**Ole WV Coot** · 01-27-2010, 07:16 PM

I really don't encourage "bullseye" shooting. Practical is all I bothered with after my teens with a handgun. Now if you can get the bad guys to pin a bullseye on their chest maybe but stance and sight alignment sometimes aren't fast enough in combat. Basics practiced and well learned will develop speed & accuracy. Can't beat experience but I can't recommend it.

**SARKY** · 01-27-2010, 10:15 PM

Another bit of training we would do is tape a target inside of a tire, and roll it down hill then try and hit the target as it goes by. Yes we had a remote release for the tire. The interesting part was when the tire would hit bumps and ruts a nd really bounce around. The further away from the target you were the harder it was to hit.

**BENESSE** · 01-28-2010, 12:26 AM

Originally Posted by SARKY

Another bit of training we would do is tape a target inside of a tire, and roll it down hill then try and hit the target as it goes by. Yes we had a remote release for the tire. The interesting part was when the tire would hit bumps and ruts a nd really bounce around. The further away from the target you were the harder it was to hit.

That's a great exercise!!!
Love the unpredictability of it.

**hunter63** · 01-28-2010, 12:52 PM

Originally Posted by SARKY

Another bit of training we would do is tape a target inside of a tire, and roll it down hill then try and hit the target as it goes by. Yes we had a remote release for the tire. The interesting part was when the tire would hit bumps and ruts a nd really bounce around. The further away from the target you were the harder it was to hit.

This also works well for bow practice, roll it down a ramp, with the off center "Heart", but shoot from a tree stand, and have the target roll behind trees and brush. (takes two guys)
Oh, yeah, put your hands in the freezer for about 5 min first, then you get the true "moving target" experience.

Had a step ladder set up next to my big tree in the back yard, apple tree was about 20 ft away, so would shoot at the fallen apples for practice.

Neighbor, could see me over the fense, so would come out and bring in her cat.......I don't know why?

**trax** · 01-28-2010, 01:13 PM

I believe that turn and fire practice is absolutely essential for anyone. As previously stated, the firearm is only as useful as the user. Even in a hunting situation there've been plenty of times when I was caught off guard and had to make a quick turn shot for smallish critters.

I recommend practicing in remote areas and alone. Alone a) for basic safety purposes, and b) so you don't absolutely embarrass yourself on your first few attempts.