Bee Keeping

**your_comforting_company** · 11-16-2009, 06:17 AM

That raises more questions, Crash.
Was this hive not used for honey or was this a colony hive and the fella has more with excluders for honey and wax extraction. I have also read that bee larva are quite nutritious...
It also doesn't look like he was using preformed wax comb base, but rather the bees were building however they wanted. I'm curious about the different options for comb bases. are they really necessary?

you got me started, now I want to learn more!

**crashdive123** · 11-16-2009, 08:16 AM

Winnie - the style hive that we most often see was developed in the mid 1800's by Langstroth. Some tinkering has been done since then, but the basic design is the same. Probably more than you want to know, but here's a bit of info on the history. http://outdoorplace.org/beekeeping/history1.htm

**crashdive123** · 11-16-2009, 08:26 AM

Originally Posted by your_comforting_company

That raises more questions, Crash.
Was this hive not used for honey or was this a colony hive and the fella has more with excluders for honey and wax extraction. I have also read that bee larva are quite nutritious...
It also doesn't look like he was using preformed wax comb base, but rather the bees were building however they wanted. I'm curious about the different options for comb bases. are they really necessary?

you got me started, now I want to learn more!

These hives (there were 2) are being managed more for a teaching tool than honey collection. They are located on the property of one of our extension offices. All of the frames have "foundation" inserts in them. The foundations come in a variety of forms. These are a semi-rigid plastic with a very slightly raised honeycomb pattern on them. The inserts are then coated with bees wax. The bees, being attracted to the wax will then build their comb on top of it. Here's a pic of a foundation. The comb pattern is only for promoting them to "build here".

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**crashdive123** · 11-16-2009, 08:39 AM

I should add - the hive that we were looking at was not that healthy (according to all of the beekeepers present). I asked about some of the comb being darker and was told that it is just older comb. The advantages to not removing comb is that it takes so much energy and pollen for the bees to create it that by leaving it, their efforts are more focused on honey production and tending to the hive maintenance. The disadvantages are the increased possibility of disease or pests. The beekeeper that manages these two hives is a volunteer, so I'm not sure how actively they are managed. He is going to combine the two hives to improve the health of the hive (after making sure it is free of critters that cause problems for it).

**Winnie** · 11-16-2009, 09:25 AM

Thanks very much for the link Crash, very interesting. I just wondered why Skeps were no longer used, I suppose these days, it's more difficult to get your hands on a swarm and bee husbandry has moved on.

**your_comforting_company** · 11-17-2009, 01:25 AM

i read something like 8 pounds of honey per pound of wax. it takes a lot of resources to build comb. I could see how it would be beneficial to leave it and let them recycle.

supposing I were going to build my own boxes and frames, could I substitute hardware cloth or some other material as a building surface?

I found a decent outline here for anyone else slightly interested.

did he suggest anything in the way of why the colony was unhealthy? they look like bees to me lol.

**crashdive123** · 11-17-2009, 07:24 AM

Not sure if hardware cloth would work or not. The foundations (plastic inserts)in addition to having the comb (hexagonal) forms, are solid, not with screens, and are coated with bees wax. Research has shown that the size and shape of the frames will allow 3/8" between comb built on the frames, which is ideal, and most closely mimics how they are built in the wild. The whole idea with the frames, sizing, spacing, and materials used is to get the bees to build where you want them to in order to facilitate harvesting honey and hive maintenance. They will build in an empty space (like in the skeps pictured in your link) but in those cases hives and colonies were most often destroyed to harvest the honey and wax.

They did not suggest why the hive did not look healthy. I believe the comments were based on the number of bees present and the amount of comb they had produced.

**erunkiswldrnssurvival** · 11-17-2009, 10:11 AM

Originally Posted by crashdive123

We may in the future, but not for now. I kind of wanted to focus on my line of work. Because of the problems with Africanized Honey Bees in the state, I am required to destroy feral colonies. I figured if I could learn more and possibly save some, it would be better for all. Many beekeepers in the state won't touch feral colonies for the fear of contaminating their hives. What I learned that I thought was pretty cool was that if you kill the queen of an Africanized hive and properly introduce a new queen (non Africanized) you can turn the entire colony into a tame (relative in bee terms) hive. Something I want to explore.

so let me get this straight..... Mrs Crash did what with your bug sprayer??remember that bee hives are mounted on ships and they shoot one million rounds per minute! if you dont think so just kick the hive and watch what happens!!!

**old soldier** · 11-17-2009, 05:11 PM

nice pictures and everyone should try to keep a few hives around for the good the bees do and for the honey.
here's a hive after a bear stopped by one night. nothing can stir up a hive of 60-80 thousand bees faster than getting woke up by having their hive tipped over by a bear. since then i've put an ele fence around all the hives.
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**crashdive123** · 11-17-2009, 05:24 PM

Are those claw marks in the comb in that last picture?

**old soldier** · 11-17-2009, 05:41 PM

Originally Posted by crashdive123

Are those claw marks in the comb in that last picture?

yes and he wasn't very big, I stood about 50 foot from him and he just gave me a hurt look like i could do something for all those stings he got. I was angry for a while but he was just being a bear looking for food, I should have had the ele fence around them yrs ago, it was just a matter of time til a bear found them. I put out a game camera and he never did come back.
PS the real shame was that i went out with the camera and it wouldn't work, for some reason everytime i have it hooked to the computer and them switch it to the camera, i need a ball point pen to hit the reset button

**Rick** · 11-17-2009, 06:15 PM

Oh man! I would really have been upset to walk out there and find that. But, like you said, the bear was just being a bear. It's sort of like waving a bacon sandwich in front of one of us.

Were you able to save any of the hives? I didn't know if the queens stayed in the frames or if they skeedattled.

**old soldier** · 11-18-2009, 05:59 AM

Originally Posted by Rick

Oh man! I would really have been upset to walk out there and find that. But, like you said, the bear was just being a bear. It's sort of like waving a bacon sandwich in front of one of us.

Were you able to save any of the hives? I didn't know if the queens stayed in the frames or if they skeedattled.

I save one out of three, i even replaced the queens and fed them but they just couldn't get started again, it rained everyday also. I'll order a couple more packages in Dec. for next yr. around here bears have made a come back and we just have to live with it.