Fire by Friction....One More Time

[crashdive123]

Snakeman - I'm not sure about Eastern Red Cedar, but maybe somebody else might know - the resin content of the wood might be too high to give you success.

[snakeman]

It didn't seem resonous and was really light and dry. It starts to smoke in about 2-3 seconds for me.

[Pict]

Crash,

Great tutorial on the fire saw. I have used this in Brazil many times to make fire. My technique is exactly the same.

Rick makes a good point in that you have to learn this skill to the point that you can do it in the bush from materials on hand. That can be difficult with bamboo because you have to use bamboo that is dead and dry. It also has to have thick enough wood so it doesn't fall apart. Bamboo is a very good friction fire material when you have the right stuff.

I think it is good to bear in mind that most people who use primitive skills for real have several advantages. They collect materials over the course of the entire growing season and they have a wealth of local knowledge to add to their lifelong skill set. People who depended upon friction fire often did make their friction fire set in camp and carry it with them until parts wore out. It was common that such fire sets were carried in waterproof containers, especially in South America and other jungle environments.

In places where matches and lighters have become available friction fire skills die very quickly. In my area of Brazil friction fire isn't even a dim memory because it was replaced with the flint and steel starting about five hundred years ago. You can still find old timers lighting their corn husk cigars this way. Mac

[Pict]

Endurance,

Have you tried Aspen roots? I have heard that they are very good material for friction fire. If you find an Aspen that tipped over or has had its roots washed out in a creekbed you might give them a try.

It is very hard to find soft woods in Central Brazil most of them are rock hard or filled with resin. I seriously doubt I could collect the materials and make friction fire in any reasonable amount of time in my home state apart from using bamboo. That's why I have a mag-block laced to my machete sheaths. Mac

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Mag block on machete, BSA Hotspark on Mora.

[dolfan87]

Rick- I have successfully built a friction fire from materials I found while camping...but it was here in the desert where everything is dry almost all the time. I can show you pictures, but would it be of any value considering our vastly differing locations?

[Mischief]

Thanks Crash

Have you found the thickness to be significant in the bamboo method? All the bamboo around here ,Panama City area ,is thin 1/16 +-

[crashdive123]

Thanks Crash

Have you found the thickness to be significant in the bamboo method? All the bamboo around here ,Panama City area ,is thin 1/16 +-

If by thickness you mean the wall thickness, then IMO it is important to use materials with a thick enough wall to hold up under the pressure of the sawing motion. The thinner walled pieces will break under the pressure.

If you are talking about the over all thickness of the bamboo (diameter) then no, I haven't noticed a big difference. I will point out however that the bamboo that I have access to is much smaller than the stuff that was available to me in places like the jungles of Guam. Some of that stuff was huge! We'd make canteens and rice steamers out of them.

[Mischief]

Yes wall thickness. Looking at your pic's again looks like around 3/16"

Will start the thick bamboo search,or do you have any for sale?
Thanks again

[crashdive123]

Nah, I don't sell it. It's just stuff I find. Stop by your local IFAS Office and ask where you can find some. Here's a link to one that may be near you. http://escambia.ifas.ufl.edu/

[Rick]

Dolfan - I can certainly see the ability to do that in a desert environment. I would never question someone's ability to accomplish that there.

I think Mac is spot on about indigenous folks building their fire sets in camp. That's exactly what my thoughts have always been. I sure can't see them waiting until they needed it to build it. That would be like waiting until you saw a deer to build a bow and arrow. Everything was done in camp ahead of time (IMHO).

I'm going to work on the electric drill thingy for a bit and see what I can do with that. I like that idea quite a lot.

[crashdive123]

Nicely said.

[Rick]

Well put, Remy. I think you captured it well.

[endurance]

Endurance,

Have you tried Aspen roots? I have heard that they are very good material for friction fire. If you find an Aspen that tipped over or has had its roots washed out in a creekbed you might give them a try.

It is very hard to find soft woods in Central Brazil most of them are rock hard or filled with resin. I seriously doubt I could collect the materials and make friction fire in any reasonable amount of time in my home state apart from using bamboo. That's why I have a mag-block laced to my machete sheaths. Mac

I haven't tried aspen roots yet. I'll keep an eye out for some while I'm out for my ride today and bring some home to work on. I guess it's one of the few areas of bushcraft that I probably haven't put much effort into since I've never had the need. I absolutely, positively always have my magnesium with me, sometimes two or three (i.e. in my pocket, in my car kit, and in my day hike bag). I have vasoline'd cotton balls in every kit and most of my jacket pockets and while they're not essential, they sure as heck make it a lot easier if dealing with damp material. This summer has been the wettest I've seen in years and I can certainly say that I've fallen back on the cotton balls more this year than ever before. If I had to, I could live without, but when they're there, it's hard not to take advantage of them. I guess the same might be true for my bow drill experiences. If left no other choice, I just might keep at it longer if I didn't have a choice.

On a completely different tangent; does anyone else just want to reach through the TV screen and slap the living crap out of the Survivor contestants when they bash the hell out of the striker side without ever scraping a single flake of magnesium? They may as well be trashing my personal gear.

[Rick]

I've heard, I'm not certain if it's true or not, that a .22 LR will actually fit inside a fiber optic cable and, if fired correctly, will actually hit a contestant in front of the camera.

[endurance]

Hmmm, might have to give that a try sometime.

[your_comforting_company]

Yuccas are plentiful here. If you find one you've got your spindle. thats what I use most all the time. Without a Bow, I use my leather necklace/thong as thumbstraps for a hand drill and I prefer to use mullein stalks for that, but yucca will work. Mullein isn't too hard to find around old fields.
For my hearthboard I use Black Willow as it has an aggressive grain but still powders well. Black willows grow everywhere down here and you can find a dead limb in a tree within 100ft of wherever you are in most cases.
When gathering it all afoot, these are my materials of choice and I've demonstrated it twice at camping trips this summer. I usually gather these materials when gathering the wood to burn and the tinder.

[COWBOYSURVIVAL]

Yuccas are plentiful here. If you find one you've got your spindle. thats what I use most all the time. Without a Bow, I use my leather necklace/thong as thumbstraps for a hand drill and I prefer to use mullein stalks for that, but yucca will work. Mullein isn't too hard to find around old fields.
For my hearthboard I use Black Willow as it has an aggressive grain but still powders well. Black willows grow everywhere down here and you can find a dead limb in a tree within 100ft of wherever you are in most cases.
When gathering it all afoot, these are my materials of choice and I've demonstrated it twice at camping trips this summer. I usually gather these materials when gathering the wood to burn and the tinder.

You have an awesome quote on your signature and I like the truths you speak! Thanks!

[your_comforting_company]

Thanks cowboy.
I could talk for hours about the quote alone.
As I said before, I dont want to put up a lot of heresay, though some of my experiences are vicarious ( I was with someone who did something I witnessed, so I know it can be done). Everything I post will either be something I've done, or witnessed firsthand. I honestly didnt believe fire could be made with sticks either, till I saw a guy do it at a demonstration (Mr Russel Cutts). If his wife wasn't a braintanner I might not have ever seen it done. The most interesting thing was the items in his fire kit were things that were growing in the woods around the park where the demo was and he showed me exactly where they were and what they look like growing.
One thing I would like to add here is that it is pretty much impossible to make fire by banging 2 rocks together. Many folks have told me "I have made fire with 2 flint rocks before" yet every one of them fails when I hand them 2 rocks, but I can take my sticks and have flames in my hand in 3 minutes.
Conditions need to be favorable, i.e. gentle breeze, not raining, dry materials, but not necessarily "ideal".
As with braintanning, you have to let your kit teach you how to make fire. It's all about getting a feel and this takes me over to a post by Wareagle where I talked about the neurons in your brain being 'rewired' as you learn. Wetscrape braintan is tough to explain to someone, but they soon realize it is a self regulating process. So it is true with firemaking. Most times I dont even think about making fire, I just do the work and let the lords creation do the rest because, well... thats the way he designed the world. You dont have to fully understand HOW it works, just that it does if you put in the effort.

I'm rambling again lol.
thanks again for the compliments
If anyone has any questions, feel free to contact me. I love helping others get rewired!
ycc

[finallyME]

endurance, have you tried juniper or cedar? I saw Cody Lundin use if for his fire drill once. Haven't tried it myself, but there is a lot of cedar here in Utah, so it might be plentiful in Colorado. There is even a lot at 10,000 ft.

[Old GI]

Collect clothes dryer lint for tinder.