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Thread: I found this on another forum and thought you should see it.

  1. #1
    Over Taxed Under Paid Swamprat1958's Avatar
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    Default I found this on another forum and thought you should see it.

    The message it delivers is too important not to pass on.

    You're sound asleep when you hear a thump outside your bedroom door. Half-awake, and nearly paralyzed with fear, you hear muffled whispers. At least two people have broken into your house and are moving your way. With your heart pumping, you reach down beside your bed and pick up your shotgun.. You rack a shell into the chamber, then inch toward the door and open it. In the darkness, you make out two shadows.

    One holds something that looks like a crowbar. When the intruder brandishes it as if to strike, you raise the shotgun and fire. The blast knocks both thugs to the floor. One writhes and screams while the second man crawls to the front door and lurches outside. As you pick up the telephone to call police, you know you're in trouble..

    In your country, most guns were outlawed years before, and the few That are privately owned are so stringently regulated as to make them useless. Yours was never registered. Police arrive and inform you that the second burglar has died. They arrest you for First Degree Murder and Illegal Possession of a Firearm. When you talk to your attorney, he tells you not to worry: authorities will probably plea the case down to manslaughter.

    "What kind of sentence will I get?" you ask.

    "Only ten-to-twelve years," he replies, as if that's nothing. "Behave yourself, and you'll be out in seven."

    The next day, the shooting is the lead story in the local newspaper... Somehow, you're portrayed as an eccentric vigilante while the two men you shot are represented as choirboys. Their friends and relatives can't find an unkind word to say about them. Buried deep down in the article, authorities acknowledge that both "victims" have been arrested numerous times. But the next day's headline says it all: "Lovable Rogue Son Didn't Deserve to Die." The thieves have been transformed from career criminals into Robin Hood-type pranksters. As the days wear on, the story takes wings. The national media picks it up, then the international media. The surviving burglar has become a folk hero.

    Your attorney says the thief is preparing to sue you, and he'll probably win. The media publishes reports that your home has been burglarized several times in the past and that you've been critical of local police for their lack of effort in apprehending the suspects. After the last break-in, you told your neighbor that you would be prepared next time. The District Attorney uses this to allege that you were lying in wait for the burglars.

    A few months later, you go to trial. The charges haven't been reduced, as your lawyer had so confidently predicted. When you take the stand, your anger at the injustice of it all works against you. Prosecutors paint a picture of you as a mean, vengeful man. It doesn't take long for the jury to convict you of all charges.

    The judge sentences you to life in prison.

    This case really happened.

    On August 22, 1999, Tony Martin of Emneth, Norfolk , England , killed one burglar and wounded a second. In April, 2000, he was convicted and is now serving a life term.

    How did it become a crime to defend one's own life in the once great British Empire ?

    It started with the Pistols Act of 1903. This seemingly reasonable law forbade selling pistols to minors or felons and established that handgun sales were to be made only to those who had a license. The Firearms Act of 1920 expanded licensing to include not only handguns but all firearms except shotguns.

    Later laws passed in 1953 and 1967 outlawed the carrying of any weapon by private citizens and mandated the registration of all shotguns.

    Momentum for total handgun confiscation began in earnest after the Hungerford mass shooting in 1987.. Michael Ryan, a mentally disturbed Man with a Kalashnikov rifle, walked down the streets shooting everyone he saw. When the smoke cleared, 17 people were dead.

    The British public, already de-sensitized by eighty years of "gun control", demanded even tougher restrictions. (The seizure of all privately owned handguns was the objective even though Ryan used a rifle.)

    Nine years later, at Dunblane , Scotland , Thomas Hamilton used a semi-automatic weapon to murder 16 children and a teacher at a public school.

    For many years, the media had portrayed all gun owners as mentally unstable or worse, criminals. Now the press had a real kook with which to beat up law-abiding gun owners. Day after day, week after week, the media gave up all pretense of objectivity and demanded a total ban on all handguns. The Dunblane Inquiry, a few months later, Sealed the fate of the few sidearm still owned by private citizens.

    During the years in which the British government incrementally took away most gun rights, the notion that a citizen had the right to armed self-defense came to be seen as vigilantism. Authorities refused to grant gun licenses to people who were threatened, claiming that self-defense was no longer considered a reason to own a gun. Citizens who shot burglars or robbers or rapists were charged while the real criminals were released.

    Indeed, after the Martin shooting, a police spokesman was quoted as saying, "We cannot have people take the law into their own hands."

    All of Martin's neighbors had been robbed numerous times, and several elderly people were severely injured in beatings by young thugs who had no fear of the consequences. Martin himself, a collector of antiques, had seen most of his collection trashed or stolen by burglars.

    When the Dunblane Inquiry ended, citizens who owned handguns were given three months to turn them over to local authorities. Being good British subjects, most people obeyed the law. The few who didn't were visited by police and threatened with ten-year prison sentences if they didn't comply. Police later bragged that they'd taken nearly 200,000 handguns from private citizens.

    How did the authorities know who had handguns? The guns had been registered and licensed. Kinda like cars.

    Sound familiar?

    WAKE UP AMERICA ; THIS IS WHY OUR FOUNDING FATHERS PUT THE SECOND AMENDMENT IN OUR CONSTITUTION.

    "..It does not require a majority to prevail, but rather an irate, tireless minority keen to set brush fires in people's minds.."

    -Samuel Adams

    If you think this is important, please forward to everyone you know.

    You better wake up cause your new president is going to do this very same thing over here if he can get it done. And there are stupid people in congress and on the street that will go right along with him.


  2. #2
    (FMR) Wilderness Guide pgvoutdoors's Avatar
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    I remember reading an article about the British government asking for assistance during the beginning of World War Two - they needed firearms. As I remember it was early on when the Germans had started the major offensive on the British. The British government was concerned about a possible invasion and wanted to arm it's citizens. The United States wasn't ready for a major war and our industry hadn't kicked into high gear to produce military weapons. So, American citizens gave to a collection of firearms that would be sent over to Britain. But, by the time the collection was sent over, the British didn't feel they needed them and opted not to issue them to their citizens. Instead the firearms were dumped in the ocean.
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    Quality Control Director Ken's Avatar
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    His lawyer sucked. That case could have been won and should have been won. Media or no media. It should have been "not guilty."
    “Learning is not compulsory. Neither is survival.”
    W. Edwards Deming

    "Live free or die: Death is not the worst of evils."
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    Administrator Rick's Avatar
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    All I want to know is what's this stuff about other forums?
    Tracks Across the High Plains...Death on the Bombay Line...A Touch of Death and Mayhem...Dead Rock...The Griswald Mine Boys...All On Amazon Books.

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    Quality Control Director Ken's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rick View Post
    All I want to know is what's this stuff about other forums?
    I musta' skipped over that part.........
    “Learning is not compulsory. Neither is survival.”
    W. Edwards Deming

    "Live free or die: Death is not the worst of evils."
    General John Stark

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    Super Moderator crashdive123's Avatar
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    I was on another forum just this morning. It was a forum that dispelled the rumors that there are other forums.
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    Administrator Rick's Avatar
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    Actually, SR, I understand the point you're trying to make but the article really compares apples to oranges. You could remove the UK from that post and plug in Saudi Arabia, China, North Korea or even Canada. You can't compare the laws between countries then say we're next. It doesn't work that way.

    Here's a RHETORICAL question for the members.

    1. Are you a life member of the NRA (or even a member)?
    2. Do you vote in EVERY election?

    If you answer no, particularly to number 2, then for pity sake please don't come crying to me about how bad the world is. If you don't bother to exercise your vote then you are part of the problem.

    End Rant.
    Tracks Across the High Plains...Death on the Bombay Line...A Touch of Death and Mayhem...Dead Rock...The Griswald Mine Boys...All On Amazon Books.

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    Quality Control Director Ken's Avatar
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    1. Are you a life member of the NRA (or even a member)?

    YES, I AM!

    2. Do you vote in EVERY election?

    YES, I DO!
    “Learning is not compulsory. Neither is survival.”
    W. Edwards Deming

    "Live free or die: Death is not the worst of evils."
    General John Stark

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  10. #10
    Administrator Rick's Avatar
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    Thank you, Mr. Crash.
    Tracks Across the High Plains...Death on the Bombay Line...A Touch of Death and Mayhem...Dead Rock...The Griswald Mine Boys...All On Amazon Books.

  11. #11
    Quality Control Director Ken's Avatar
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    “Learning is not compulsory. Neither is survival.”
    W. Edwards Deming

    "Live free or die: Death is not the worst of evils."
    General John Stark

  12. #12
    Super Moderator crashdive123's Avatar
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    Ken - don't burn the popcorn.
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    Quality Control Director Ken's Avatar
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    All questions should be answered. All of them!!!!!!!!!!!

    Will Your Honor please instruct the witness to ANSWER MY QUESTION?
    “Learning is not compulsory. Neither is survival.”
    W. Edwards Deming

    "Live free or die: Death is not the worst of evils."
    General John Stark

  14. #14

    Default

    This kind of thing really annoys me. By taking the weapons from innocents we are only achieving leaving our society defenseless from those who will arm themselves against the law.

    When seconds count the police take minutes this is unfortunately often the case. This story makes me feel kind of sad especially when hearing about the elderly people who got harmed. This is why we all need to be good neighbours and help each others. There is a reason Wolves travel in packs.

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    Senior Member Ole WV Coot's Avatar
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    Wish I had saved the pictures in American Rifleman back when Australia destroyed works of art that would never been fired and everything else. English law concerning knives I think are stupid and as to firearms....well I don't plan on visiting anyway. Looks like it's keep the guns for awhile and make ammo hard to get in this country. If anyone asks my CCW is for a slingshot.
    Don't pick a fight with an old man. If he's too old
    to fight... he'll just kill you.

  16. #16
    Gadget Master oldsoldier's Avatar
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    [QUOTE=

    Here's a RHETORICAL question for the members.

    1. Are you a life member of the NRA (or even a member)?
    2. Do you vote in EVERY election?

    1. YES since 1980 ( I think)
    2. EVERY one local,state.national

  17. #17
    Senior Member Winnie's Avatar
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    Tony Martin is out of prison now, but is persona non grata in the village he lived in his whole life. His farm was sold to pay compensation to the surviving toerag who committed the crime.
    UK gun laws were tightened up as a knee jerk reaction to a mass shooting in Hungerford in the late 70's/early 80's when a man went on the rampage through the town shooting indescriminately as he went.
    I'm not completely up on gun laws over here, but I think it is illegal to have a handgun in the house, you can only possess one if member of a gun club and the pistol has to be kept on their premisis under lock and key. The law relating to shotguns is also very strict, you now have to have a dr's cert to say you're not a rampaging lunatic and the Police are within their rights to to a background check and if you have any sort of criminal record you are refused. If you do manage to get one, the law states it has to be under lock and key in a proper gun cabinet at ALL times, including your vehicle.
    The law relating to this particular incident(and many others) is you can only use "reasonable force" to subdue an intruder. So in a few words an Englishmans home is no longer his castle and if someone breaks into it, you may just as well help them load up their vehicle with your possesions.
    BTW when my shotgun licence was due for renewal it was revoked because I have epilepsy, even though it was never a problem before. I had to sell my guns and show proof that I had done so within 14days of the refusal of renewal and provide details of the person I had sold them to, including their licence number.
    Last edited by Winnie; 06-15-2009 at 05:44 AM. Reason: add comment

  18. #18
    Senior Member Winnie's Avatar
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    Just to add re knife laws, if I step out of my property with ANY knife, I am comitting a crime!

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    Super Moderator crashdive123's Avatar
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    I'm sure it is a beautiful place with wonderful people, but I can see that I will not be moving to Middle England any time soon.
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    Administrator Rick's Avatar
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    I've done quite a bit of reading on GB's knife laws. This is just my opinion and I'm sure many will (can) challenge it but here goes...

    Crimes and personal injury attacks with knives have been on the rise in GB. I'll offer up this article to support that claim but you can google it and find tons of information.

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...s-falling.html

    I think GB is an excellent case study and it's no surprise why knife attacks are up. If you disarm a population folks are going to replace a gun with something else. In this case, it happens to be knives. Now they want to ban knives because they are being used. If that proves successful then the headlines in five years might be "Personal Attacks with Rocks up 70% in GB". People are going to use something if they are intent on doing harm. It has never been the tool. It's the person behind the tool.

    Again, that's just my opinion and worth every cent you paid.
    Tracks Across the High Plains...Death on the Bombay Line...A Touch of Death and Mayhem...Dead Rock...The Griswald Mine Boys...All On Amazon Books.

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