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well we all know the health benefits of growing your own food or harvesting a deer or fish but what is the econmic benifit? by the time you have spent all that time and sometimes money in tha garden or money for ammo, clothing, hunter saftey course, permit, time off work and butchering, is it more viable to be self sufficent or buy from the store in bulk when on sale?
More viable,some of those expenses you listed are once in a lifetime expenses,or only happen once a year or more,plus you benefit from not only knowing what is in the food you raise/kill,but you also get the added benefit of the excersise involed in obtaining that food.
Palerider, I turkey hunt and fish.I will teach my kids what I know when the time comes that they want to learn.As far as being cheaper,dont really know.With what I spent on gear last year compaired to a Butterball turkey I would say NO.I still have my gear and can use it again on turkeys and other game animals.So in a way it evens out.But here is my thinking, I dont need the supermarkets for a turkey or seafood.That makes me feel better than the guy standing next to me knowing that if the grocery stores closed their door's they would not know how to get food for themselves.Knowing you can do something is a lot different than thinking you can.
i agree to a point, knowing how to do something does not mean it is the most economical way to do it.yes if in time of shortage or need i will be able to still provide for me and mine, but when i look at what some of my co workers spend trying to harvest from the land i shake my head. two thousand dollars for ice fishing gear(probably not including the beer) for a fish i can buy for what 2.39 a pound? i don't know seems like to me i use what i can where it will benefit me.
Good point, I buy a lot of gear for hunting each year, and most of it is not needed (Handheld GPS, ground blind, scents, etc...) In a true survival situation I could get by with a gun and ammo. I know a lot of folks who also lease hunting land, and take big trips, their cost per pound of taken game is huge.
On the vegetables/grow your own, not so much goes into them. We have a big garden that has very little into it and we try to grow enough for ourselves for a year and have extra to sell and give away. We also raise chickens, hogs and a couple of cows. We have our own pork and beef with plenty to share and little cost put into it. We also use the manure in our garden.
as a quick illustration of the economic benefit: annual fishing licenses in california cost $41 this year. fish in the local supermarkets averages $10/lb if you consider only common species.
given that i ride my bicycle to the river most of the time, and don't tend to loose a lot of lures [but i usually climb a tree or two after one somebody was too lazy to get out of an overhanging branch], i have only the occasional outages of bait when i need anchovy or some similar [and i can always dig/collect/trap bait], and the odd replacement lure/line, etc.
i payed off my fishing related expenses so far this year after 3 trips.
you do of course get to add to that the recreational and sanity preservation value.
i've paid for the garden this year, and last winter entirely on the money brought in by the recycling i collected while cleaning up the roads near my home. i have an investment in time, which is also good for the body and soul, but that is easily paid off both by the volume of produce, and the variety. i have an added benefit of being able to have many herbs, vegies, etc. fresh when they are not generally available or fresh in the stores.
even if i only broke even, i would like to point out that this is a persuit which cares nothing for economic trends. when there is little work near me, i can always produce some food. if i where to work harder at it, this could even be all my food. as in 'no employment; no problem'.
hunting is the same way. i could go spend thousands [or even, as i've seen some do; tens of thousands] of dollars each year applying for hunts of sheep in the high rockies, grizzlies in alaska, hiring guides, leasing land, etc] but why?
that kind of hunting is not about food, the simple realism of getting meat, it's about extragavant recreation.
since i am in love with archery, and make almost 100% of my equiptment, and because there is ample deer population around here, i could go take deer without spending a dime beyond licensing/tags and do so within a few mioles of my home. if i had to travel further, all that would be added is gass and a meal or more.
I've started planting heirloom plants and harvesting my own seeds. I plant them in pots I've had for several years and in dirt from the garden. I do have some seeds that I've bought but, considering the harvest, I've more than paid for them.
So far this year I've got nothing but time and $3.58 invested in my garden. Should finish planting tomorrow without spending any more $$$.
Self sufficiency is a two-sided coin. Right now yes, it may cost more in the end to grow/harvest your own food than it would to go down to the bulk store and buy it, but knowing you could subsist on what you can harvest yourself is a far better feeling. I get more enjoyment out of growing a garden than I do going to the bulk store for a big bag of rice. I'd rather be outdoors than down at the slaughterhouse buying a beef quarter. I'm hoping to be able to get a hunters license this year or next to cure that.
People tend to spend a lot on their hobbies, it doesn't mean they need to.
You don't need a big fancy gun to hunt deer, but many people want one. You don't need big and fancy garden equipment to garden, but people buy it.
One of my businesses is selling compost tumblers. They're pretty expensive.
You can go to Home Depot and buy a 40 pound bag of composter manure for 2 or 3 cents per pound. Granted, straight manure isn't as diversified in nutrients as kitchen scraps, but still, its cheap. And if you have livestock you can get that for free. Of course you can compost your kitchen scraps for free too, just toss them in a pile in the yard (assuming you live in the country, many cities have ordinances against such things because of rodents). But, still, people buy them. And if compost is worth 3 cents a pound it'll take 10 years or longer to pay off. I of course am happy when people buy them, but at that point the spending is not out of frugality.
How exactly do you fish for turkeys?:boat:Quote:
Originally Posted by Stargazer
I'd agree if I didn't enjoy doing it so much. Sure, commercial food is cheap, but how are you spending your downtime? If I'm not working, I want to be outdoors. I'm not an x-box kind of guy. While I post a fair amount during the week, most of the time you won't see me posting on the weekends because I'm outside playing. I enjoy hiking, which often turns into scouting areas for deer and elk season. Sometimes I need some quiet alone time and that's why god invented fishing. How many hobbies that people enjoy actually put food on the table? No matter how good you get at stamp collecting, they all still taste awful.
Are you fishing for answers?Quote:
Originally Posted by AKS
It really depends on YOUR situation.
For instace the expenses involved in hunting differ from person to person. Some people will only have to make the one time expense of equipment, others just have to have the latest thing every season. Some people don't spend a lot on licensing and can hunt locally on gameland or of someone they know for no extra fees and some people will spend hundreds or thousands on leases, guides, etc.
I'm just getting into these things but I can already say that even though I may be spending a little bit more (for now anyway) the money spent doesn't bug me a bit. I may spend a little more in the proccess, but the fun and experience I get when fishing is worth a whole lot more. That is time and money I don't have to spend at a grocery store on some bland, crappy fish that has who the heck knows what in it.
Same on the garden, I've spent a bit this time since it's my first one but now that I have it set up I won't have to spend near as much next year, and I have a few plants this time that I won't need to buy new seeds for, and I'm planning to eventually be getting all my own seeds.
There's also something to be said about being self sufficient, and not having to rely on a failing economy. There can come a time when the grocery stores are no longer a viable option. That is not the time to decide you need to learn to fish and hunt, or plant a garden.
And that time will vary from individual to individual. I'm sure for many driving long distances and shopping in a store depletes already stretched incomes. They may not be able to afford the fuel even if they have food stamps or use food pantries.Quote:
Originally Posted by Catfish
eating the food I provide for myself is very fulfilling.
Palerider,
As is the case with most of the population, there is an over-abundance of wasteful spending on hunting and fishing.
I know guys that buy new camo or a bow every year. And some even add a new gun to their collection every year. Is it necessary? No, but "keeping up with the Jones'" is an every day way of life for many.
If people (hunters) learned to "really" hunt, not sit in a treestand or ground blind, they wouldn't need any fancy camo or an expensive compound bow (look at hunters like Fred Bear, Howard Hill, Ben Pearson, Dick Mauch, etc. The Fathers of modern American bow hunting. They wore no fancy camo and their bows were nothing special either), it costs these people as much as it does because they are part of the "over-indulgence crowd".
A simple stick & string is easy to operate, lightweight, relatively inexpensive (compared to a compound bow) and fun to shoot. I've had my bow (handmade long bow) for 9 years, and guess what? It still shoots just fine. My arrowshafts, they cost me about a weeks worth of my time to fashion. I also make my own broadheads and fletching from crow or wild turkey feathers. My only cost for hunting is the license.
Today's society is a "I want it all and I want it NOW!" Nobody has the patience to wait and work for what they want. They want to buy it now and worry about how to pay for it later.
So, hunting (for the majority) has become an expensive hobby or past-time for the "over-indulgence crowd". . . .But that is their choice. After all this is the land of the free. . .at least for a few more years. . . .I think?! :confused:
As for the meat aspect of hunting. If you compare how much meat you get off of an animal to what it would cost to buy the same quantity in the grocery store or at the butcher, I think you'll find it comes cheaper hunting it yourself.
And lastly, the health benefits of hunting -v- buying commercially raised, processed and over-the-counter meat.
Game meat is 100% better for you than what you get in the stores. . . .Hands down!!
As far as my fishing pole, I made it 33 years ago from a piece of hickory and the reel/spool is wooden that I made myself. The only "store bought" part of it is the line and my 4 - 25 year old Daredevil lures.
JM2C! :)
I don't do much hunting or fishing for food or sport so I can't really say if it saves ME money or not. But I do know that gardening/growing my own food when possible has saved ME money.
Too many people take gardening over the top and spend way more time and money on it than needed. Once our raised (not till) beds on the farm are planted and mulched we rarely need to maintain them other than the tiny amount of weeding done while we are harvesting the vegetables, as well as some watering when needed (if we had a drip irrigation system set up on a timer we wouldn't even need to do that).
For soil amendments we use compost made from the dead garden plants, kitchen waste (might be setting up a worm farm this year so that will no longer be going into the pile), as well as dead leaves and some yard waste. The beds are mulched as needed will grass clippings from the lawn.
Once your garden is set up it is really up to you as to how much time, energy, and money you want to put into it. Some of out biggest squash and zucchini crops ever were from neglected plants that were accidentally started.
Over all I get better quality, and better tasting food, for less money by growing my own when possible. Take a look at the price of asparagus. It grows like a weed (something like an inch an hour in 80 degree weather) yet it is very expensive to buy in the store. Yet at the farm we GIVE IT AWAY because we can't eat it fast enough. Same with out rhubarb and chives. All three are also grown with minimal care at our place.
I'm not saying for everyone that gardening will save money, but for me it does.
Quote:
Originally Posted by RaymondPeter
Hehehe, boy howdy.Quote:
Once your garden is set up it is really up to you as to how much time, energy, and money you want to put into it. Some of out biggest squash and zucchini crops ever were from neglected plants that were accidentally started.
http://www.gardeningblog.net/2008/10...ash-squirrels/
I agree on asparagus, it is such a cost effective and easy plant to grow. I don't get why more people don't grow it. I think its because they don't think they'd like to eat it or something.Quote:
Over all I get better quality, and better tasting food, for less money by growing my own when possible. Take a look at the price of asparagus. It grows like a weed (something like an inch an hour in 80 degree weather) yet it is very expensive to buy in the store. Yet at the farm we GIVE IT AWAY because we can't eat it fast enough. Same with out rhubarb and chives. All three are also grown with minimal care at our place.
Personally, growing up I hated the stuff. Now I've expanded my tastes and don't mind it. It's all how you prepare it really. Just like everything else. One other reason people don't grow it is because they are told that it is hard to grow (it isn't).
Back on topic. I do understand for some people that buying all their food is cheaper than hunting, fishing, trapping, gardening, and foraging. It's really how much you want to put into it all up front. Fishing doesn't need that $500 pole, lure, fish finder, etc. But if you are the type of person that has to have that stuff, fine, have fun! If you don't need it, great, all the more power to you!
One reason I don't hunt... I KNOW that I have a mind set against inexpensive rifles. Why? No clue, because as long as they are safe and hit what I aim at then they work. But I still do. So I am one of those people that until the SHTF I "need" the high end rifles to hunt with. Which is why I don't hunt. I'll stick to my .22's and my Grandfather's old .30-30 for now (and will continue to until I die or my future kids take my toys away from me...lol)
:offtopic: (can I get this more as a warning, than an admonishment?)Quote:
Originally Posted by RaymondPeter
Roll it in some olive oil, a little salt and pepper, and bake it the oven until crispy @~350. awesome.
Nothing new for lots of folks. We always had gardens, canned, pickled holed up potatoes & apples. Dried beans all the food we needed and more. Cost practically nothing and veggie wise well worth what little we spent on seed. I and everyone else hunted and fished, not exactly legally but we ate what we caught, shot or trapped. Country folks have always done well around this part of the country. We would help butcher and always get prime portions of the meat and we did the same. We nor anyone we knew ever wanted for food back in the '50s and I guess we can do it again.
you know what coot, thats why i like living in between to small towns one pop of 500 the other pop of 1200. you get to know folks and learn lots of cool stuff. things that are second nature to you, but all new to me, but things i could not learn in the big city, i feel like such a rube here, a grown man and feel like , despite my skills that i have nothing useful to bring to the table, but i am a fierce and fast learner.
Wareagle,Quote:
Wareagle69 wrote: ". . .i feel like such a rube here, a grown man and feel like , despite my skills that i have nothing useful to bring to the table, but i am a fierce and fast learner."
Don't sell yourself short. You have a lot to offer and bring a proverbial bounty to the table.
We all have things to learn. That's why we're here right? At least that's why I'm here! :)
i know i have my wilderness skills and wild edibles, but i am also spending time with folks that have spent their whole life in this area, in the bush and working the land, i do bring unique experience to the table, it just seems that some things should be obvious and they are not, its like learning to crawl then walk the run, i'm still crawling
Don't sell yourself short. You're willing to learn and work at it. The old folks appreciate that in a man. You'll learn more than you think without trying and the folks will be glad to help you if you help them. They will learn from you also. You bring a strong work ethic and open mind, willing to learn. That's more than most men can bring to the table today. I grew up in that environment, closest town now has 4,000 pop. smaller when I was a kid and we lived at the end of a hollow 5 miles from town. We were a small community where we helped each other. A decent man can fit in anywhere, you won't have any trouble.Quote:
Originally Posted by wareagle69
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