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Whoah...twice the size of the United States and it can't be picked up by satellites? I'm not buying it. I don't doubt there is plastic floating and fouling the seas but a mass 30 feet thick and twice the size of the U.S.!? Come on. Where do they come up with this stuff?
http://www.naturalnews.com:80/022885.html
Send out a barge to collect that crap and recycle it, yo!Quote:
Originally Posted by BraggSurvivor
Seriously, I've heard since I was just a wee lad that the US Gubberment can read the label off of a pack of cigarettes if you're sitting outside at a table. How can they honestly expect anyone to believe that todays tech can't pick up a 30 foot thick platform of trash twice the size of the US?
I do believe the bit about the concentration of chemicals, though. I saw a documentary on Polar Bears on NatGeo that said the same thing...plastic collects chemicals, fish eat plastic, seals eat fish, bear eats seals...voila...Chemical imbalance in Polar bears causing violent behavior.
My dad, who sails, heard of oceanic sailboats getting "beached" in this plastic continent but for the life of me I can't find a decent picture of this mass. Sure you get a few over-the-gunwale shots and a couple dead birds with plastic stomach contents but nothing to play out the magnitude. Google earth doesn't do oceans yet and no satellite images exist to my knowledge. Coupled with this continent acting like an iceberg, with most of its mass under the surface, I doubt many people will truly see how bad it is.
Stories like that are intended to "scare" the world into action. When activists can't convince people with facts, they rely on feelings. We can map the contours of the ocean bottom with satellites. We can (as Alpine Sapper stated) read the label on a pack of cigarettes. There are sonar's that can detect the plankton and small animal life.We could darn sure see something like this. I have sailed hundreds of thousands of miles of the Pacific Ocean. Is trash in our oceans a problem - yep. Is it a problem to the extent that the fear mongers would have us believe - nope. If this plastic continent truely existed, there would be pictures everywhere. There would be marine biologist living onboard ships as far as the eye could see to study the affects on marine life (afterall, what better way to get grant money). I just a'int buying it.
I agree.. this is sensationalism pure and simple... All news media use it to incite .. I just re-read it.. and noticed that it says that the heap? is twice the size of the U.S. Then later it says that it is in two places on the east and west of hawaii and that one is twice the size of Texas.. the other one is smaller.. Well, Texas is smaller than the entire U.S. so this contradicts itself big time.. As I said sensationalism.. and the guy didn't edit his article for those contradictory statements..Quote:
Originally Posted by crashdive123
I read anything like that with a grain of salt. Yes I think it's a problem, no I don't think the problem is the size of Texas.
A big problem by my house is those darn plastic shopping bags. Animals get into garbage bags the night before garbage day, and the bags are so light they blow all around.
Reduce, recycle, *REUSE*Quote:
Originally Posted by bulrush
:D
I use those things for everything from taking my lunch to work to temporarily waterproofing things that get transported, etc. etc.
Actually, there are two The East and the West collectively known as Great Pacific Garbage Patch.
Mitch - Ask your dad if he is familiar with the the North Pacific Gyre (a.k.a. the horse latitudes). It's an area of strong circular rotation and junk of any kind tends to get drawn into it. Most of you probably remember the great Ni*e (the software asterisked that for some reason) tennis shoe fiasco when a ship lost thousands of them in the Pacific (there were even clubs formed to match up found shoes) or the bathtub toys that dumped tens of thousands of rubber duckies and turtles into the Pacific. That stuff all collects at the center of the Gyre. I don't know how large it is but it's pretty big. The two together would comprise several hundred (thousand?) square kilometers.
The big thing we throw away are the plastic cola and beer holders. They are just the right size for animals to get their head trapped inside one of the holders. I always cut all the rings before throwing it away so that won't happen.
bulrush,I have been buying those reusable shopping bags from the stores when I go to the store,as I hate the plastic bags. The reusable ones usually cost about a buck and I have 6 of them now,so I dont have to worry about the plastic things anymore,dont want to buy them?? they are fairly simple to make,or use any old bookbag or craft bag,look for those at yardsales for about a dime apeice.
Only problem I have with the purchased ones are, if I shop at a different store,I turn them inside out,since stores dont like seeing competitors names being flashed around in their store.
Rick, yea the Gyre is what he was talking about. Old netting, plastic jugs, even a refrigerator! Do fridges float? Anyways, yea, it would suck to get a sailboat stuck in that mess... maybe even worse for a prop-driven boat
Here's a nice animation that shows how it works and the location of the two patches. Scroll down to Eastern Garbage Patch and click on the link below the picture.
http://www.greenpeace.org/internatio.../trash-vortex#
Here's a fairly recent article on attempts to remove it.
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/articl.../MNT5T1NER.DTL
and floating...why not move there? Lash all this crap together, maybe add a few more tons (not like there's a shortage of plastic garbage obviously) Cover the surface with a few layers of dirt, introduce some plants, then some animals, small, lightweight shelters and voila, maybe put a motor on one end so you've got yourself a mobile mini-continent!
Yeah, I think it's probably not that big too, but that was fun!
Link below the pic doesn't work..Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick
Ridge - The link spawns a new window. Do you have new windows turned off?
Sam - I guess if I had the answer, I'd make millions. But the way I understand it, it isn't like picking up garbage bags but more like trying to pick up dust. As the sun breaks down the plastic it turns into dust like particles.
Sam, I didn't think you were riding me. Like you, I'd like to see a cleaner planet for my kids and grandkids. I get disgusted driving down the road and seeing the trash people have thrown out of their vehicles. How stupid do you have to be not to see what it's doing? (rhetorical question by the way)
Might be a good idea, a little futuristic, but a good idea. The main issue with this plastic garbage is that while plastic does not decompose in a stomach or in water, it does UV-degrade. Meaning the big chunks are slowly breaking into grain-sized pieces which fish and other animals eat thinking they are plankton or small fish. Then, like that picture of the dead seagull with all the plastic stomach contents, the animals starve to death. So leaving it is not an option.Quote:
Originally Posted by trax
Imagine how much sunlight is being blocked. How much cooler the water is. How fewer plankton are growing How........
Ah... nope.. it just takes me to the top of the page when I click on it. Not important..Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick
Great idea! Floating garbage can fix the global warming problem!Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick
Floating gargage to fix......what......a myth?Quote:
Originally Posted by bulrush
You can't be serious....:confused:Quote:
Originally Posted by crashdive123
Yeah, actually I am. There is too much data out there that calls into question all of the hysteria around global warming. This forum probably isn't the place to get into all of that, but yeah, I'm serious.
We can agree to disagree, but, I'd just like to know if you're referring to "man-made" global warming, or the natural cycle of the earth? It's definitely getting hotter, and the polar ice is definitely melting, at least from the data that I've seen. And this is general chat, so I don't see any reason why we couldn't discuss it here?Quote:
Originally Posted by crashdive123
My main disagreement is with man made. It is true that some areas are warmer, but then again other areas of the planet are cooler. My reluctance to discuss is the "why" there is so much hysteria because IMHO it is political in nature. As far as discussing is there warming, is there cooling, is it man made or is it natural and cyclical - sure - no problem talking about it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alpine_Sapper
You guys might want to read through this post.
http://www.wilderness-survival.net/f...global+warming
Thanks for the link Rick. Interesting read.
Forget about global warming, when is that 10.0 going to hit California?
http://www.cnn.com/2008/TECH/science...ice/index.html
I saw on the news tonight it finally let go. That's a hunk of water.
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