Tents...

Don't think this is "survival" exactly...but I didn't know where else to put it.

So I came across this tent before and thought it was pretty good. I came across it again at Gander Mountain and the price was down to 150.00 (it's only 150.00 in the store) so I thought I would revisit it.
http://www.gandermountain.com/modper...D&merchID=4006

It's got quite a few people singing it's praises, but I was wondering if anyone here has ever used one of these for backpacking and what they think. I desperately need a lighter tent that's big enough for 2 adults, one child, and our gear...and this SEEMS to fit the bill.

I used the Eureka Timberline 30 years ago. It is a classic. It is a little heavy by todays standards for backpacking. I love the way it assembles and was very tough. Comfortable too. I still think they are one of better values I've seen.

I agree...even though it's a little less than 8lbs...it is still heavy compared to most. I'm having a hard time finding one lighter that will be that size though...

Eureka makes the "Bombshelter" Tents that are the standard in the Alaska Guiding Industry. Long ago I owned that "A"-Frame tent in two different sizes, I think they then offered it in three sizes. It is a good tent, easy to set-up by one person, but you need the FLY, and there was no mention of the rain fly in the ad that I saw, I may have missed it. The Fly is what gives it the strength. It is a three season tent, and I now only use four season tents. It is a good tent for the money.

Trabitha - they are good tents, but shop around. You can do better on the price. http://www.sportsauthority.com/produ...LAID=126060006

Thanks for the feedback and DOUBLE thanks for the link to the better price! I'm a gonna have to see if I can get it even cheaper. :)

Bummer...that's a 2 person tent, Crash. I'm looking for the Timberline 4 Backpacking Tent. I'm gonna shop around though. ;)

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Originally Posted by crashdive123

Trabitha - they are good tents, but shop around. You can do better on the price. http://www.sportsauthority.com/produ...LAID=126060006

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NOTE: That is a SMALLER Tent, the 2 person size. I think they made a 2 - 4 - 6 man versions of this tent. I ended up using my 6 man model the most, but then I was not Back Packing it, but hauling it in the Super Cub.

It is heavy. But, you won't find a lighter better tent in the same price range. To go lighter, you would have to spend more, get a smaller 3 person tent, or get a floorless tent or tarp. By the way, Campmor is selling it for the same price, $179.90.

To me, almost all tents are too heavy. 8 lbs is just rediculous. Thats like 30% or more of my average pack weight. Unless they come out with super lieghtwieght (like 2 pounds) tents, im sticking with a tarp.

In the PA mountains the temp, wind, and precipitation can change at a drop of a dime. If I'm going to go hiking all day, the last thing I want to do is sleep in bad weather and get eaten alive. Now if I NEED to in a survival situation, I can and have...but if I'm hiking for a weekend getaway with the family, NO WAY.

I'm not one who goes out of her way to have a pack that weighs no more than 10lbs. If I need it, it comes. I've hiked with much more than that on my back. I'm just not bothered by it. ;)

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Originally Posted by justin_baker

To me, almost all tents are too heavy. 8 lbs is just rediculous. Thats like 30% or more of my average pack weight. Unless they come out with super lieghtwieght (like 2 pounds) tents, im sticking with a tarp.

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They make tents that are under 2 lbs. They are 1 person tents. You can also buy 2 man tents that are under 3 lbs.

http://www.tarptent.com/products.html

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Originally Posted by Trabitha

In the PA mountains the temp, wind, and precipitation can change at a drop of a dime. If I'm going to go hiking all day, the last thing I want to do is sleep in bad weather and get eaten alive. Now if I NEED to in a survival situation, I can and have...but if I'm hiking for a weekend getaway with the family, NO WAY.

I'm not one who goes out of her way to have a pack that weighs no more than 10lbs. If I need it, it comes. I've hiked with much more than that on my back. I'm just not bothered by it. ;)

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I didn't know PA had mountains.....:innocent:....more like hills. :tongue_smilie:

Anyways, you can sleep warm and dry in a bug free space without a tent and using a tarp. Lots of people do it. It is just a matter of breaking with the norm. But, that doesn't mean carrying a tent is bad. Everyone has their own style and likes and dislikes.

When splitting the load between several people a larger tent can actually be lighter. You have to divide the weight between the number of people carrying the load.

Remember to always take the number of sleepers the tent is rated for and divide it in half for the number of sleepers it will sleep comfortably.

Yeah...that's what I wanted to do, but then I would have to get a 6 person tent...and that's just far too big to hike with, and outside my budget. It's only my husband, myself, and my 11 year old...so I think we will be fine with a 4 person. I know we sleep fine in our current 4 person with 2 air mattresses...we couldn't fit our packs...but we slept. This one is much larger and looks like it has a lot more usable space in it. Unlike domes. ;)
My hubby picked it up today! Can't wait to put it up this weekend and see what it looks like. We missed the sale...but it was only 30.00 more than we thought.

I have used both 4 and 6 person models for a youth group for several years and they were teenager proof. Great tents as they have Aluminum poles. They are a bit on the heavy side, but really durable and good in a downpour.

There you have it folks. No greater claim can be made of anything than it's "teenager proof".

You want to see what a tent will stand up to?

Put it up in the field behind the wood lot and tell your teenagers they can have a party!

You WILL have a gear test.

You need to look at all of the factors in your case:

1.) How many in the family & what are the specifics: Ht., wt, ages, etc..

2.) How much money you want to lay out.

3.) Will you use the tent for backpacking, or just general camping? Or both?

4.) Should you buy new or used?

5.) Remember, you get what you pay for so shop wisely & avoid unknown brands!

Campmor sells used tents in their section entitled "slightly soiled tents."(returns.)
http://www.campmor.com/outdoor/gear/...0226_200368494

Also keep checking with this company as they're always adding stuff to their inventory: http://www.sierratradingpost.com/?af...Processed=true

Hope this helps. :cool2:

I am going to see a man about a tent tonight after work. It's a Eureka Timberline 4 that he said was used twice. He doesn't use it b/c his wife decided she does not like to camp, so he went with a smaller tent. He's selling it for $100, but I think I can get it for less. I'll let you know...

I've always liked the "pup tent" style.

Do yourself a favor and inspect all of the tent including the poles. I once bought one only to find two of the poles had been bent and were cracked. My bad for not inspecting all the pieces before walking away.

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Originally Posted by Rick

Do yourself a favor and inspect all of the tent including the poles. I once bought one only to find two of the poles had been bent and were cracked. My bad for not inspecting all the pieces before walking away.

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No doubt. I will set up the tent, and check it for damage.

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Originally Posted by finallyME

I didn't know PA had mountains.....:innocent:....more like hills. :tongue_smilie:

Anyways, you can sleep warm and dry in a bug free space without a tent and using a tarp. Lots of people do it. It is just a matter of breaking with the norm. But, that doesn't mean carrying a tent is bad. Everyone has their own style and likes and dislikes.

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I camp a lot in primitive sites with no amenities. Some with fancy amenities like they mowed the grass. But, we always are close to a truck or quad. I have started trying out hammock camping and now have an ultra cheap parachute type hammock. I also bought a Hennese Hammock.

But, I would love some advice about tarp camping bug free down here.

By the weigh. :innocent: That tent may be heavy. But, you either have one person carry the main tent, the other the poles and another the rain fly. Or, you can just distribute other items in the other two people packs. So, its not nearly as heavy as it might seem.

Batch - let us know how you like the Hennese after you give it a test run.

Will do. I have set it up a in the yard probably like 8 to a dozen times. So far it is very cool.

I am going to take it hunting this weekend for the opening of archery on public land. But, where we are going is going to be a mad house of hunters.:sneaky2:

Did it come with netting and a rain fly? (or do they all have them?)

Yeah, I had to get the big man expedition or what ever. They said otherwise you get claustrophobic if you over 6'.

But, I think there is a lot of room in there. You can use the rain fly and be sleeping minutes later.

The ground beneath you makes no difference.

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Originally Posted by Aurelius95

I am going to see a man about a tent tonight after work. It's a Eureka Timberline 4 that he said was used twice. He doesn't use it b/c his wife decided she does not like to camp, so he went with a smaller tent. He's selling it for $100, but I think I can get it for less. I'll let you know...

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That's the one we got. We spent almost 180.00 new on ours. We've used ours all summer and put it though a LOT but we LOVE it. It's a trooper! The replacement parts are inexpensive, the entire piece is quite light. It holds up great in bad weather, it's really easy to set up, and the accessories are amazing and affordable.

We sleep 2 adults and a child in ours, and still have plenty of room to keep our packs with us.

GREAT TENT!

Anyone got any opinions on the Ecotat Freedom Shelter?

http://www.imsplus.com/index.php?tar...oduct_id=30421

It's a 4lb bivy tent that can also be used as a poncho, sit in shelter, or sleeping bag liner. Two of them can be combined to create a 3-man tent. I have one of these, but have not tested it out yet.

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Originally Posted by Batch

I camp a lot in primitive sites with no amenities. Some with fancy amenities like they mowed the grass. But, we always are close to a truck or quad. I have started trying out hammock camping and now have an ultra cheap parachute type hammock. I also bought a Hennese Hammock.

But, I would love some advice about tarp camping bug free down here.

By the weigh. :innocent: That tent may be heavy. But, you either have one person carry the main tent, the other the poles and another the rain fly. Or, you can just distribute other items in the other two people packs. So, its not nearly as heavy as it might seem.

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You are right Batch, you have to consider the weight breakdown if others are spreading the weight. Anyways, tarp camping bug free is easy. You just need a bug net :D . A simple way is this guy.
http://www.campmor.com/wcsstore/Camp.../acc/86660.jpg
http://www.campmor.com/outdoor/gear/Product___86660
You just have to put a tie out point under the tarp to suspend the top of the bug net.
This guy is also sold in OD green for the military.
http://www.campmor.com/wcsstore/Camp.../acc/86662.jpg
The tarp I made has four tie outs on the underside to tie the corners of the military cot bug net one. I got those by accident when I put on the outside tie outs.
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2642/...1e4acf25_b.jpg
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2468/...8deaaf66_z.jpg

Another option is to sew bug netting on the edges of the tarp. This is basically a floorless tent. Here are instructions from Tarptent on how you can make your own tarp tent.
http//www.tarptent.com/projects/tarpdesign.html

Another option is a net tent under the tarp. Ray Jardine does it that way.
http://www.rayjardine.com/ray-way/Tarp-Kit/index.htm

A light bivy that has a lot of bug netting is also an option.
http://www.sixmoondesigns.com/suppor...teor-bivy.html

There are probably more ways to do it. Needless to say, it can be done.

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Originally Posted by sgtdraino

Anyone got any opinions on the Ecotat Freedom Shelter?

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Well, you asked.....:innocent:

I don't like it. $350 for a 4 lb one man tent :confused1: . If you want a one man tent that can be a poncho, I would recommend the meteor bivy with a poncho. You can even use a military poncho ($15-$30) for camo.
http://www.sixmoondesigns.com/images...meteorbivy.jpg
http://www.sixmoondesigns.com/suppor...teor-bivy.html

Anyways, just my opinion, but you did ask for it. :innocent:

By the way, have you seen this video?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BgoqA...layer_embedded

Thanks for the links finallyME!

They're excellent tents, it's a classic design that's held up well against the competition because of the simple but genius design. A lot of Boy Scout troops use Timberlines and they hold up to years (even decades) of teenage abuse. They are a bit on the heavy side but about the same/better than most 3-4 man tents. Back when I was doing 50 mile hikes (it's been a over 2 decades now), we'd split them up with 1 person carrying poles and the other carrying the tent and rain fly. If 3 to a tent, the 3rd would carry the fly. We used them year round in upstate NY.

For the past 2 years, my son's been using the very roomy but lightweight Eureka Spitfire2 (2 man @ 4.5#) for monthly campouts. I only got to use it once before he commandeered it from me.

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Originally Posted by finallyME

I don't like it. $350 for a 4 lb one man tent :confused1: .

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Well, the link was mainly to give you an idea of what I'm talking about, not a price. Sometimes you can find these things for around $150.

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Originally Posted by finallyME

If you want a one man tent that can be a poncho, I would recommend the meteor bivy with a poncho.

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Just to clarify, you're recommending a tent plus a poncho, not a tent that can be used as a poncho, yes?

What do you think the combined weight of the meteor bivy plus a poncho would be?

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Originally Posted by finallyME

Anyways, just my opinion, but you did ask for it. :innocent:

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You may well be right, like I said, I haven't really field tested the Ecotat yet. One thing I do like about the concept, is how two of them can fit together to make a 3-man shelter, as well as potentially eliminating the need for rain gear. Then again, the Ecotat seems kinda complicated.

sgtdraino hopefully I didn't come off as too rude. I apologize for any offense. My opinion was based off a picture and some words written about the ecotat. I could be wrong. Personally, I would have to physically see it.

You are right that I was recommending a net tent plus a poncho. The net tent is only used for bug protection, not waterproofness. Just goes to show how heavy 4 lbs is. The meteor bivy weighs 7 oz, or a little less than half a pound. I think a military poncho weighs about 1.5 lbs (I am guessing here). The coghlans mosquito netting weighs 5 oz. You would still need a ground cloth for this. So the total weight of a net tent plus poncho is probably around 2 lbs.

Of course, my solution isn't perfect. A normal poncho makes a small tarp. The meteor bivy compensates a little by covering the foot end of the sleeping bag. A full bivy with a poncho tarp would be better protection, but then your weight is getting real close to 4 lbs, plus you still need poles.

Don't get me wrong. The ecotat isn't a bad shelter, nor is it really heavy. If weight is your concern (only you can answer that one personally), then you can get the same function (a water and bug proof shelter that also serves as rain gear) for half the weight and price. But, if you need a bomb proof shelter that can handle high winds and heavy snow loads, and serve as rain gear, then 4 lbs is probably light, and the ecotat seems to fit the purpose perfectly.

Me personally, I don't like using my shelter as rain gear. I like having those two separate (which goes against being light weight). But that is personal preference. In the end, we all have to make our own decisions, and just because you decide something that I wouldn't, doesn't mean you are wrong.

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Originally Posted by finallyME

sgtdraino hopefully I didn't come off as too rude. I apologize for any offense.

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Not at all!

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Originally Posted by finallyME

You are right that I was recommending a net tent plus a poncho. The net tent is only used for bug protection, not waterproofness. Just goes to show how heavy 4 lbs is. The meteor bivy weighs 7 oz, or a little less than half a pound. I think a military poncho weighs about 1.5 lbs (I am guessing here). The coghlans mosquito netting weighs 5 oz. You would still need a ground cloth for this. So the total weight of a net tent plus poncho is probably around 2 lbs.

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Wow, that is really light!

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Originally Posted by finallyME

Of course, my solution isn't perfect. A normal poncho makes a small tarp. The meteor bivy compensates a little by covering the foot end of the sleeping bag. A full bivy with a poncho tarp would be better protection, but then your weight is getting real close to 4 lbs, plus you still need poles.

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I would really like a setup where my wife and I can carry pretty much the same thing, which could be used to make an indidual shelter for each of us, or combine to make a larger shelter for the two of us together. I watched that video you linked, pretty neat! Tempted me to run out and buy a couple of ponchos! Might still do it, would probably be handy rain gear to have.

I guess the two main concerns I have, are (1) bugs, and (2) proper ventilation. Those ponchos don't look like they "breath" all that well. Would it be safe to completely close myself up inside of one?

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Originally Posted by finallyME

Don't get me wrong. The ecotat isn't a bad shelter, nor is it really heavy.

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Well, it might be a bit on the heavy side considering it's only for one-person. I have a 2-man bivy tent that's only about 3.6 pounds. I'd need two Ecotats for 2 people, and that would be 9 pounds of weight!

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Originally Posted by finallyME

Me personally, I don't like using my shelter as rain gear. I like having those two separate (which goes against being light weight).

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Not necessarily! A 3.6lb tent plus two 1.5lb ponchos is 6.6lbs, still significantly lighter than two Ecotats.

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Originally Posted by sgtdraino

I would really like a setup where my wife and I can carry pretty much the same thing, which could be used to make an indidual shelter for each of us, or combine to make a larger shelter for the two of us together. I watched that video you linked, pretty neat! Tempted me to run out and buy a couple of ponchos! Might still do it, would probably be handy rain gear to have.

I guess the two main concerns I have, are (1) bugs, and (2) proper ventilation. Those ponchos don't look like they "breath" all that well. Would it be safe to completely close myself up inside of one?

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Any tarp shelter will breath better than a tent. That is the main benefit of a tarp. I guess lighter weight is another. Tarps are open and allow cross ventilation. It is also easier to find a site. You only need to find a spot that is big enough to lay down on. A lot of people like to lay next to logs. A poncho doesn't breath when you wear it, unless you get one that is waterproof/breathable. But, you generally get wind blowing under it that helps mitigate this. A rain jacket has to be breathable or you will get soaked. Personally I like to wear a rain jacket that is very breathable, but not super-duper waterproof, and then don a poncho when the rain gets out of control torrential. If it is raining, I will generally cover my pack with the poncho and then roll it back behind my head when it isn't raining very hard. If it starts dumping, then I pull it over my head. A good cheap breathable and light rain jacket is the dri-ducks by frogg-toggs.

As for two shelters that can be combined, I have been thinking about the same thing for me and my wife as well for the BOB. I think it is smart that she has a completely self sustaining BOB apart from mine, in case of accidental separation. A tarp is easy to set up individually, or together. Plus it is cheaper than a tent, and smaller/lighter. A slighter larger bug net can squeeze two inside as well. I said earlier that I like to carry a tarp and a poncho and not rely on my poncho for shelter. An 8X10 silnylon tarp is around 16 oz. So a tarp+bug net+ground sheet (6 mil painters drop cloth) is probably around 25 oz (2 lbs = 32 oz). Oh and by the way, you can buy a lighter than military poncho tarp that is 58"X104" and weighs 9.5 oz. http://www.campmor.com/outdoor/gear/Product___20275 But I don't like sleeping under tarps that are less than 8X10.

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Originally Posted by sgtdraino

Not necessarily! A 3.6lb tent plus two 1.5lb ponchos is 6.6lbs, still significantly lighter than two Ecotats.

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Yes, but if I am carrying a tarp plus a poncho, plus a bug net, then the tarp is redundant. I could just carry a poncho and a bug net. But, I personally don't like being stuck in my shelter with no rain gear to wander around in. So, I carry a dri-ducks rain suit, a poncho, and a tarp. Excessive, I know.

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Originally Posted by Sgt. Draino

Would it be safe to completely close myself up inside of one?

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I don't think you have any safety issues to worry about unless you're trying to have a fire inside of it. I know you know better than that. Condensation from your own breath would be another thing. You could wind up with a wet bed if it doesn't have any ventilation or very little.