My one and only 9MM, Ruger P85 with Hogue grips in a thigh holster and three 15 round mags.
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My one and only 9MM, Ruger P85 with Hogue grips in a thigh holster and three 15 round mags.
Doesn't all that weight sort of pull your drawers down on one side?
Technically speaking, it's a magazine... Not a clip. A clip is something that you use to load the fixed internal magazine of a firearm such as an M1 Garand or SKS (non-"modernized").... A magazine is what actually holds the ammunition in the gun, ready to be fed into the chamber...
Hey, Sourdough. You and the jg are going to get along just fine.
I stayed out of this but I just gotta say the 9 isn't a favorite of mine for much. I had a couple, maybe still do and kept them only for their high capacity during the days when 10 was the limit. My use in this part of the country is 22, 38 & 45. I might have a 357 or two and maybe a 40 & 380. I guess I'm the only person who would rather carry a J frame Smith than a high cap 9.
Nothing wrong with that. The Ruger LCR is a nice little weapon like the J frame. .38 can back you up and make you reconsider some of your life's choices if you've been a bad boy.
Don't feel alone Coot. There's a bunch of us out here.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ole WV Coot
Just a little, I just cinch up the pants belt another hole.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick
The only reason to settle for a 9 s that it's the most power that can be pocketed, and still be controled in such a gun. Put a .45 in a 16 oz gun, and the rate of hitting is much too slow for realistic self defence. I don't kid myself about being a "one shot wonder", and I know very well that multiple attackers are a commonplace occurance. So I don't settle for gun and ammo combos with which I can't get .25 sec repeat hits, on a 10" vitals circle at 10 ft. I greatly prefer to have those times under .20 sec, too. So airwt .38 snubs, are out, as are 357 and .44 Special snubs, .40 Keltecs, and the like.
I have an older Taurus 92C made before the decocker. Heavy as a brick, but a real sweet shooter. I am looking to add to this list. I think I have narrowed it down to a 709 slim for the pocket, and a SR9 for play.
Paul
A .45 ACP :eyepoke::yes:
No body with a 9mm is "settling". The 9mm is a proven combat round and has been doing as good of a job as anything else out there for about a centry. Everyone is so high on the .45 ACP horse when the truth is a little sobering. Fact is neither the 45 or 9mm in ball configuration is worth a damn for stopping really intent individuals even though they carry the same energy. In ball, the 9mm out penetrates the .45 in hard and soft barriers. In hollow point configuration the 9mm still out penetrates the vaunted .45. Long story short, the .45 is held in high regard as a "man stopper" while the 9mm is looked down upon even though the 9mm hits just as hard (or harder in many cases)and penetrates deeper than a .45 ACP. That's a hard fact for alot of .45 devotees to admit. Sounds to me like we Americans are just tooting the horn for "our" big .45 even though the evidence tells a very similar tale for the 9mm and .45. I'd be just as happy with either in a Sig or Glock.
Dang! I forgot all about one 9mm. It's an old school "convertible".
A CZ-52.
9mm, or swap out the barrel and go back to 7.62 x 25. (Now we're talking about some penetration! LOL)
Yah Buddy. That little sucker will pass through a kevlar helmet at 50 yards. Talk about no place to hide :).Quote:
Originally Posted by 2dumb2kwit
Ft lbs of energy top out around 450 on the hottest +P 9mm loads and over 600 for 45 ACP. As far as penetration goes the 147 grain 9mm is more impressive than 45 ACP but I think when talking in terms of what hits harder one should acknowledge the higher energy level of the 45 ACP.Quote:
Originally Posted by glockcop
There is a chart on one-shot-stops that puts the 9mm 115 grain +P around 87-88% and most 45 ACP rounds at > 92%.
PS: I personally favor the 9mm for its higher capacity, lower recoil, easier concealability and cheaper ammo, acknowledging it has much less energy than the 45 ACP. Insert plug for Doubletap 147 grain +P here.
I was not talking about the hottest loads available. I was talking standard pressure which most people carry. Both 45 and 9 are about 330 to 350 ft lbs regardless of manufacturer with the 9mm on top alot of the time. Not many folks are running around with 600 ft lb energy levels in their 45 ACP. One shot stop charts represent exactly nothing IMO. Too many variables to be taken for face value. No two shootings are exactly the same. 4 percent difference between the best 9 and the best 45 ACP is not enough to declare one "better". My point is that the 9 and 45 are alot more alike than different yet people love the 45 and shun the 9 as a step child unjustly.Quote:
Originally Posted by greenbeetle
It is all psychology. The ball ammo in the early 1900 gave the 9mm/38 a bad name. It just never recovered from that. Then you have statement like "because they do not make a .46".Quote:
Originally Posted by glockcop
I shoot a stock CZ75 in bowling pin competition and kick the crap out of the guys using the Wilson competition .45's because the recoil is way harder to recover from. I'll take 16 rounds of 9mm over 8 rounds of .45 any day of the week.
I whole heartedly agree. Not that there is anything wrong with a .45. Matter of fact I love the .45 ACP but nobody can argue that 16 to 21 shots of 9mm is better than 8-14 shots of .45 anyday of the week. Knowing that mostly all combat handgun calibers (9,.40, and .45) performs very similarly in the real world, why would anyone choose less ammo? Just doesn't make sense to me. The more ammo you bring to a fight, the better. That's common sense. Problem is, sense is not so common. The 9mm is proven and does a way better job than alot of gun nuts want to admit because their $1850.00 Wilson Combat or Les Bauer 45 has "Just got to be better" than that $479.00 9mm Springfield XD.Quote:
Originally Posted by klickitat
I am not a fan of 9mm but the of the 9mm calibre pistols I have shot the Browning HiPower Belgium made is my favorite to shoot.
So by using that chart.....I have 7+1 rounds in the .45 and 15+1 in the 9mm...... that means I have 176% stopping power with the 9mm as opposed to 92%.Quote:
Originally Posted by greenbeetle