Printable View
See, Corndog, I tried.
I was hoping for what you would use during the high winds to start that fire, Wareagle. How to go about using flint and char cloth under those condition or whatever your first choice would be. But NNnnnnooooooo. You followed my lead and went for the easy joke.
Insurance is good enough that I sit with my back to the wall, thank you.
if out in a blizzard and i want to play then i will try a primitive way, if i think that it is a survival scenariio then i will not waste precious time i will light the flare and get warm..
always be prepared...
by the way. were you out hunting for the mushrooms that we discussed when this storm came up. what time of the year is it? what shrooms were ya looking for..
He's right Rick light the flare, but do you bring a flare with you every time you go out? Since I live in So Cal not goin to think about Blizzards so how do you lite one with flint n steel
Actually, I stopped the car to take a picture of this mother bear and her cubs. They were soooo darn cute. I wanted a really close shot but they walked the other way so I followed them then got lost. Why don't you Canadians put signs up out there in the wilderness? I mean, wouldn't that be so much easier to find your way around? And, Mr. Wildlife Rehabilitator, why wouldn't that momma bear pose for a family photo? Pretty rude to her southern neighbor if you ask me.
O BTW i ask with the memmory of the story "To Start a Fire" by Gary Paulson, so im serious(er)
WE he asked you to save his life and now he's complaing about how you go about it???He's the one sitting there freezing his a$$ off,no wait,you already gave him your jacket AND a blanket not to mention built a shelter around him,I think you were right with the flare,but if he keeps complaining, hand him the char cloth and the flint and tell him go for it......then you jump back in your truck crank the heater up,drive to the nearest town and leave directions to his location at the local law enforcement agency,then go home to the wife and a nice hot cup of coffee,geesh even men can only take so much complaining.:D
Proud - I was just joking for Wareagle. Lighting a fire and finding a shelter in a storm is a really serious thing. Corndog did a nice write up to start the thread and I offered another alternative to starting the fire. That is make certain you are properly dressed and know how to make a shelter under those conditions.
I don't carry a flare in the wild. I do carry Wet Fire Tinder and cotton balls soaked in vasoline. I also carry a BIC lighter, steel match, and water proof matches. (BIC lighter may not work in extreme cold!).
Most blizzards, at least the ones in lower elevations and/or in the Midwest where I am, don't rage on for days. They are almost always associate with a storm front moving through so the duration is more in terms of hours. (I know Alaska and Canada can be much different). Being able to hunker down with your survival blanket or a sleeping bag inside some other protection (beneath an evergreen, snow cave, etc.) or some other protection will get you through the worst of it.
Nothing can replace proper planning, being prepared and using good common sense.
By the way, you did exactly the right thing. If you don't understand something or we have confused you with our banter, then ask. It's important to get the right information.
Anyone else feel free to join in.....
Jeepers, Nell. (sniff) Now look what you did.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/parenting/image...ng_closeup.jpg
Rick, should I call 9-waaa-waa for ya?? No need to go cryin dude but I gotta tissue if ya need it!:DQuote:
Originally Posted by Rick
9-waaa-waa.....that's too funny.
Thanks Rick (sniff) such a true friend, to bad wareagle left you out there to freeze now whos goin to help the newguy?
yea,Rick, we use that one on the kids at the store all the time,shuts them up real quick LOL!
Dont worry Proud,I doubt WE would leave Rick out there to freeze,he is a better man than that LOL, now me on the other hand...if the guy can complain more than I do then ....maybe (j/k) I couldnt leave anyone out there like that either.Quote:
Originally Posted by Proud American
i like zippo lighters very good in a wind although the only time that i used them is when i go to the bush seems the fluid goes away to fast. cotton balls and vaseoline also asr in my kit. takes less than ten seconds for a cotton ball to burn up and over a minute with vaseoline.
contrary to what ppl think bears don't just hang around waiting for you then smile at the camera, they can't tell the difference between a camera lens and a scope, although i tried teaching that to norm..
I doubt there is anything more rugged than a zippo but than nice little burning sensation on your thigh after you fill one up made me get rid of mine. They do lite under just about every circumstance though, except being out of fuel.
I used to carry a zippo WE,carried in my jeans pocket for about a day but the fluid like you say,it leaks out and it burned the skin on my leg,so I carried it in my fanny pack but lost it the woods.Quote:
Originally Posted by wareagle69
i learned to carry my zippo and fluid in a plastic bag also same with my honing oil
Rick I appreciate your effort. All jokes aside... a blizzard, no matter the depth of the snow or the geographic area will kill. Wonder how many people will die this winter? Knowing how to start a fire in a blizzard is critical...just knowing how is not enough, a person needs to have the ability.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick
15 inches, 20 inches, 6 feet ...whatever. The North Pole is a desert, less than eight inches of precipitation a year...think there's blizzard's there? bet your *** there's a reasonable facsimile to theme.
Shelter first, fire second. See at the end of that last sentence? That's a period. What keeps a fire burning once it starts burning? Fuel and oxygen. Warm air moves up, cold air moves down (remember WE's chimney adventure?) If you build a fire outside in the cold and you are exposed at all (no wind protection) that fire will help you freeze to death. It's going to suck cold air in from all around itself, you'll get colder and add fuel to the fire..which will make it suck more cold air in. You're between the cold air and the fire and most of the heat generated is moving....straight up.
Also bear in mind what was said about the real weather conditions, it is f****ng difficult to get a fire going in blizzard conditions. You guys have been discussing one of the potentially most fatal survival situations. When you're eyes are starting to ice shut and your hand is trembling badly enough to put out the match or whatever you're lighting with. There's good advice here, and in reality, you do the best you can, but remember it looks way easy on the forum, not so much out in the bush.
Two most important things I can think of right now to watch for in the outdoors in sub-Arctic or Northern temperate conditions.
1. Sundogs...it looks like a little tiny slice of rainbow on each side of the sun or a little tiny copy of the sun on each side of the sun. Temperatures are going to go down. I remember once working in northern Saskatchewan and temps were in the minus 30's and 40's. I saw sundogs and thought "Oh he**, how much colder can it get?" Shouldn't have asked, -55 the next morning.
2. Heavy, slow moving gunmetal grey clouds, sudden change in wind (direction and or speed) and barometric pressure. Blizzard's coming, stay indoors.
People keep expecting me to actually do my job around here and it makes me miss things I meant to write! Idiots!
An important point...when you're eyelids are frosting shut and it hurts to breathe and your trembling trying to get that fire going...fear is going to set in. If it doesn't your a psychopath incapable of feeling fear and good for you, we're better off without you anyway. How much fear sets in, and how much control you give up to it is up to you. It's worse if there are other people counting on you. WE's advice...be prepared, proper clothing, some kind of shelter for windbreak, those things are essential, they are of paramount importance. If you have other people with you, make them help. Two people? One makes shelter one makes fire, three people? shelter, fire, gather more fuel, etc. Everyone stand around in a nice tight circle when the fire's being lit. Alone? Know exactly what you want to do next and move quickly, it'll offset the panic.
I was in AK once and it is was colder than billy hel*. I told the local I thought I was having a heart attack my chest hurt so bad. Frosted lung, he told me. We got inside and warmed up and I was fine. I guess it's similar to frost bite but on the inside. From breathing super cold air. Damn bad stuff, I know that.
If it's so cold that your nose hairs freeze...stay indoors
If you try to whistle and can't....stay indoors.
A scarf over the mouth and nose will prevent the lung thing that Rick described, for awhile anyway. When I was a kid I used to run cross country, summer and winter.
If you're a smoker, it's going to hurt your chest a lot more than a non-smoker (your lungs create liquid in their little sacs trying to defend themselves from the pollutants, liquid gets cold and starts to freeze, ouch!)
if you see polar bears moving south....speaks for itself.
Trax, If I'm close enough to see polar bears moving south...I'm gonna be movin' souther...fathster...I mean faster.....speaks for itself.
You're reminding me of that old story..."don't have to run faster than the bear, just have to run faster than you...." LOL.
Lint is readily available provided your clothes are dry. By simply scraping your pant legs or shirt with a knife will roll off a steady supply of lint.
Just want to add, make sure you don't smother the fire, fire needs oxygen.Quote:
Originally Posted by Borelli
Rotwood For Sale :D
Here is a link to a nice article about 7 primitive ways to make fire. I have to admit, I had never seen a pump fire drill before:
http://www.fieldandstream.com/fields...546757,00.html
The pump drill is new to me too. It certainly looks like it would work. Keeping the spindle steady might be a problem. Must try it out. Its great how you can learn something new every day!
Rick thanks for the link. I liked the pics. I've seen the pump drill around, never tried it though. A problem with these types of articles that I see is that they make it out that all one has to do is get you a slab of wood and a stick and follow their pics and have-ho at it and presto you got an ember. They don't say anything about how dry the wood has to be in order to get an ember.
This is what the article said about rock striker:
"Rock Striker
An ideal tool for starting a spark-based fire, the striker should be made of flint for best results. If you can’t find flint, look for quartzite, which is much more common and is hard enough to strike sparks from steel."
Wonder how many people would recognize quartzite if they saw it?
Just my 2-cents on this subject.
I read an article once in which the author said when he was child his father showed him
how to make a bow drill but was unsuccessful in creating an ember. He finally did it twenty five year later. Few people can say it took them that long to actually make an ember. I thought he was pretty funny. I've tried and tried and I'm still only successful about 1/100. My dad always said the most important thing in fishing was how you held your mouth. I'm beginning to think the same thing about make fire with sticks.
Yes, I think the pacific islanders used them for centuries
I've tried the pump fire drill method, and it didn't impress me! :(Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick
While the pump fire drill does work, it is a very slooooow way to make fire. When the drill reverses its spin it stops the friction of the direction it was going and has to start making friction in the opposite direction. As soon as friction starts in that direction the drill stops and has to start spinning back in the opposite direction. Long story short; it is better to just use the drill with your hands than the pump drill method. Plus it expends a lot of energy and is a lot of work (for little results) making the disc that fits around the drill. JMHO. :cool:
Native Dude. Your humble opinion ranks high. IMHO.
You would think if the Iroquois invented the Pump Fire Drill, with all that extra work and materials, that they would have figured out that the Two-Man Friction Drill (almost the exact same principle) was so much easier, faster, and needs less time and materials. I decided to try (always like trying new ways) the Two-Man Friction Drill with a neighbor, it worked fast, and I mean fast, to get a good ember. But I like making a fire by myself. Maybe the Iroquois did too... Still the Pump Fire Drill, was an over kill... IMHO
It looks to me like it's a one handed operation. Maybe it was invented by a one handed guy.:rolleyes:
If that is for one handed Native Americans, they may be the first to abide by the ADA. Then again why so much work, someone else would have to build it for them, and you could put a flint stone on the ground, braced by another stone, branch, or between the knees, and strike it. Nice thought though.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick
GW - Never place ANYTHING between your knees and try to strike it, The thought alone conjurs up more agony that I care to dwell on. The loss of a knee cap would be bad enough but there are other things that could be in the way, if you know what I mean.:rolleyes:
Thanks Rick, You Own :D *Gives A Thumbs Up*
I lived in MN from 1961 - 2005 ,, Hunted , fished , hiked , camped , backpacked all the way up into canada through the BWCA I've seen some blizzards,, as for lighting a fire lol well I'm still here shootin off me mouth ,,, lol
[QUOTE=Rick;15283]Here is a link to a nice article about 7 primitive ways to make fire. I have to admit, I had never seen a pump fire drill before:
Rick, I tried it out. Used an old arrow shaft 20"long with a small metal flywheel.
Spins well once you get the hang of it. only problem is it doesnt create an ember. could not even char the baseboard. the problem is that you cant bring any weight to bare on it. also the spindle has to have a very sharp tip to strart with. otherwise it jumps all over the place. once the tip had worn down it starts to bind. Tried the same spindle in a bow. Got a nice ember in under 2 minutes. so its not the baseboard or spindle wood. Looks like I'm doing something wrong. may be I'll try a heavier flywheel. Any ideas or suggestions???
ps:
Our traditional gold and silversmiths use a similar thing as a drill. They hammer a nail into the tip of the spindle, cut the head off and sharpen it. they use it to create designs in jewelery.(Drilling out parts of the design)