Living in the woods/The Bare Wilderness Numptys!

Do any of you wolves think I was to hard on the guys from "Bare Wilderness"? Well, I might have been, but, in my opinion, a lot less harder than the cold Canadian winter is going to be on them, especially without all the gear they should be taking. I want to share a portion of text from the book: "Survival in the Outdoors" by Byron Dalrymple. The chapter is: "Pre-emergency Schooling", and the section is titled "Who is "accident prone?""

"I'm sure everyone has heard of what are known "accident prone" individuals. Are you one? Have you ever thought carefully about this?

I have a friend who is an avid and very experienced outdoorsman. Once when I was hunting deer with him he fell in rocks, smashed the stock of his rifle and cut his palm so badly that numerous stitches had to be taken. He was hurrying. On another occasion he shot a rifle that had a bullet from a handload stuck in the chamber-it had come loose-and he rammed another home atop it and blew up the gun. By a great miracle he was not killed, but he was seriously injured. He has fallen off a trail horse onto rocks, been hospitalized with pneumonia after being caught in a blizzard while trying to get out of the wilderness backcountry. These are just a few of his accidents.

So his family calls him accident prone. Even his doctor has sagely agreed that this man has "it" always hanging over him. But I'll tell you something. I have been with this man on a number of occasions under wilderness conditions. And I won't ever go again, regardless of our friendship. The term "accident prone" is simply an excuse.

There is no proof that any man is headed for continuous "accidents" because of his genes. The man I used in the illustration IS accident-prone, you bet. And I'll tell you why. He is incautious, reckless, inept in judgment, overconfident, has too quick a temper, and though he is a delightful companion most times, he totally lacks good sense and good judgment.(cont. next post.)

Astrologers believe that all this is in the stars, but as this is beyond proof, I will claim emphatically that for every "accident prone" person you show me, I will show you one-the same one-who has not learned about CAUTION, one in whose head nothing clicks that says, "Watch it, this can be trouble!" when trouble is standing smack in the path just begging to be dodged!"

A final note; go to the home page and read the introduction to this forum. If you think I'm hard you are right, lives might depend on it! tell me what you think, I promise you I'll listen!:cool:

i have gone thru your site. here are a few problems.

1-in your posting on receipes, beaver damns are not a sure sign of a beaver.
beavers may have used up the area of resources long ago and moved on yet a well built damn lasts a long time.staying with this topic most of your reciepes call for boiling a couple of times, best of luck with a birch bark container.

2- your reference to cattails being your main source of food. in october? have you eaten the roots yet this late in the season must boil many times over(pot issue again) and they are tough and woody bad idea, also using the down for insulation good idea but many ppl have had bad allergic reactions to the fluff and end up with severe rashes which in a survival situation only lend to your mental fatigue.

3- your info on black bears is okay until the part about bear attacks.on this topic i will speak with some authority seeing as how i have 15 bears cuurently at my wildlife centre that i am raising and rehabing. if a black bear attacks you fight back. if a grizzly attacks you play dead. get it good.

4- you have a section called the plan(more like obituary but okay)you admit that neither have any real survival training, no extra clothes, hypothermia is a ***** read cody lundins book or website, you also say if not successful you will either admit defeat or die. what a poor attitude, if you are trying to teach students you may not only get youreslf killed but others who seem to romanticize the idea of survival. all this to feed your egos. all i can say to that is via con dios(go with god).

THE END

probably for you.

always be prepared

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Originally Posted by volwest

Are you doubting yourself Sarge ?

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No, VW, doubt is a luxury I can ill-afford, but Maybe I was a bit harsh, or seemed to be. I'm still trying to figure out why these guys asked for advice on edible plants in a area they knew about, then ignored Owl Girl's response. If someone wants to go off in the woods alone with hardly any equipment that's one thing. When they try to get others involved in their dangerous action, that's another, and it tends to make me angry. I've seen too many people die, some horribly, and I haven't even been in the military like you and others here. Life is precious, and to risk it over a lame-brain idea, not listening to others, including experts, tends to irk me a bit.:mad:

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Originally Posted by wareagle69

i have gone thru your site. here are a few problems.

1-in your posting on receipes, beaver damns are not a sure sign of a beaver.
beavers may have used up the area of resources long ago and moved on yet a well built damn lasts a long time.staying with this topic most of your reciepes call for boiling a couple of times, best of luck with a birch bark container.

2- your reference to cattails being your main source of food. in october? have you eaten the roots yet this late in the season must boil many times over(pot issue again) and they are tough and woody bad idea, also using the down for insulation good idea but many ppl have had bad allergic reactions to the fluff and end up with severe rashes which in a survival situation only lend to your mental fatigue.

3- your info on black bears is okay until the part about bear attacks.on this topic i will speak with some authority seeing as how i have 15 bears cuurently at my wildlife centre that i am raising and rehabing. if a black bear attacks you fight back. if a grizzly attacks you play dead. get it good.

4- you have a section called the plan(more like obituary but okay)you admit that neither have any real survival training, no extra clothes, hypothermia is a ***** read cody lundins book or website, you also say if not successful you will either admit defeat or die. what a poor attitude, if you are trying to teach students you may not only get youreslf killed but others who seem to romanticize the idea of survival. all this to feed your egos. all i can say to that is via con dios(go with god).

THE END

probably for you.

always be prepared

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Very sound advice, WE, but it will probably never be read by these guys unless they're still lurking around to read any of them. We didn't feed their egos. My question to you is are these guys "Wanna-be's", or "posers"? Probably both!
I especially agree with what you wrote about people attempting to duplicate their actions. Too bad that oft-times the wisest words we hear in attempting any endeavor is "no".:eek:

Sorry to stir up so much ****! That was not my intention. I was hoping i could get some good ideas from some fellow outdoorsman, Its always interesting hearing others experences and ideas. Obviously thats not what this site is for. Some people just talk about there dreams and others live them out.

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Originally Posted by Adrian

Sorry to stir up so much ****! That was not my intention. I was hoping i could get some good ideas from some fellow outdoorsman, Its always interesting hearing others experences and ideas. Obviously thats not what this site is for. Some people just talk about there dreams and others live them out.

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You just proved my point dawg! You HAVE been given advice from people who have gone out into the woods, faced danger, and came back alive. You even received the input from a professional "Search & Rescue" guy, (Rick SAR) and you've chosen to believe that you guys know more than the experts and refuse to listen! You've refused to answer questions or respond to many of the posts here regarding what you're doing! People like you usually get themselves or others seriously hurt or killed! That's the input you're getting from the experiences and ideas of the others on this site. The problem is that it isn't what you want to hear! In my opinion you guys are the "posers" here trying to copy the stars of the survival shows on TV. You will notice that even they are smart enough to get the advice of the "pros" before they go out into the woods. I really feel sorry for you're family, dude.:cool:

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Sorry to stir up so much ****! That was not my intention. I was hoping i could get some good ideas from some fellow outdoorsman, Its always interesting hearing others experences and ideas. Obviously thats not what this site is for. Some people just talk about there dreams and others live them out.

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Sean,

Some of us have been in situations like where you are heading, maybe diff environments, with alot more only to find that it was damn hard.

Instead of insulting some about dreams, check your ego and pay attention. Most dreams are not of survival but that of adventure. Adventure sometime leads to survival.

We are a group from around the world, with so much info that would be benefitial to you. All you need to do is have a dialog. Many have posted questions, yes we would like to know what you are going to do. If your skin is not tough enough to hang here, you may not want to try your trip.

We have hunters on this site that seem damn competant. There are also phsyco........ guys here that will be able to give you insight to what you and your partner may run into, pers. conflicts. There are EMT's, ahhh, duh, God's of injury and survival. We have people like Owl girl, who if I was heading to the North woods, def. would be picking hers and Wareagle's brain.

You can never have enough information.

One last question. Will you at least be carrying a gps unit?

It's easy to say we are going to survive or die. To die, like that, to brag about it, is a bit egocentric.

Sarge,

You're just a hard charger. NO, don't think you were hard on them. You are the voice of experiance. You realize the value of life, and death can come fast in many forms.

I use to have a bandaide sticker across my motorcross bike, just sold it last week.

STUPID HURTS

44 year old man taking 20 foot jumps on a motorcycle. Yeh, I was stupid.LOL!

We are not bringing a GPS. We have both hunted in the area and know it fairly well, Sean has hunted the are for 10 years. I am not trying to ignore your questions, i am not in front of the computer all day.

I also dream of adventure. I am the type of person who likes to push themselves to there limits and this trip will do that. I have spent a fair amount of time in the bush. I have slept in a leantoo with a small fire on 2 feet of snow and i have slept in a tent in 25 deg bleow freezing to see how much colder a tent would be. It was alot colder. I try to push myself to my limites every year or two. Its what i enjoy. I also like to build everything myself i need, I find alot of purchased products are inferior to things you can make yourself (leantoo warmer than tent etc.), not only that but it gives you more satisfaction if you build it yourself. I would rather build my own bow than buy one or my own boat etc. When ever i go out i try to make as much of what i need myself. If things get bad i can always go home. I never plan for falure, I plan to succeed, but i try to learn enough to deal with my failures.

The reason i came here was because i realize there are always people that know more than you and you can never know enough. I dont know alot about plants to eat, i have read a few books etc but people who have experenced similar things always have interesting things to teach others. Thats why i am here!

Adrian...
Lets say you guys are one the move so you don’t have a shelter built, and a storm moves in faster then you have time to prepare for it, it starts raining and its raining hard and its frizzing and you can’t get a fire going because everything is drenched with what feels like ice water. What do you do?

Back in the early days even Native Americans were afraid of this scenario because they know how deadly it could be. Fur hides wont help you when its wet the way a wool blanket will and even then you’re going to want something waterproof to put over you. Id go with an alpaca wool blanket they are stronger, warmer, softer, and it weighs less then sheep’s wool.

Last week there was a storm here at my house and it started raining really hard. Me and my friend decided to run out in it for fun. We were out there no more then 30 seconds and we ran back in the house freezing. Even after I was in the house and wrapped up in a wool blanket I was still shivering.

About plants, well the people on this forum are all over the world, if you want info on plants specifically in your area it would be best to ask a native of your area.

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Originally Posted by Adrian

We are not bringing a GPS. We have both hunted in the area and know it fairly well, Sean has hunted the are for 10 years. I am not trying to ignore your questions, i am not in front of the computer all day.

I also dream of adventure. I am the type of person who likes to push themselves to there limits and this trip will do that. I have spent a fair amount of time in the bush. I have slept in a leantoo with a small fire on 2 feet of snow and i have slept in a tent in 25 deg bleow freezing to see how much colder a tent would be. It was alot colder. I try to push myself to my limites every year or two. Its what i enjoy. I also like to build everything myself i need, I find alot of purchased products are inferior to things you can make yourself (leantoo warmer than tent etc.), not only that but it gives you more satisfaction if you build it yourself. I would rather build my own bow than buy one or my own boat etc. When ever i go out i try to make as much of what i need myself. If things get bad i can always go home. I never plan for falure, I plan to succeed, but i try to learn enough to deal with my failures.

The reason i came here was because i realize there are always people that know more than you and you can never know enough. I dont know alot about plants to eat, i have read a few books etc but people who have experenced similar things always have interesting things to teach others. Thats why i am here!

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Adrian, or Brad, I totally understand dreams, believe me, I do. i just lost one of my best friends to bone cancer, he died at 60 years of age never realizing a life-long dream he had, and that haunts me now as I was part of it. Here's his story for the benefit of everyone, please take the time to read it if your serious about continuing your adventure.

My friend had a nickname: "Butch". In 1965 he'd just married my cousin and decided that he wanted to go looking for gold. He set his sights on the Superstition Mountains, and Alaska, which at that time was a lot more open than it is today. He was the complete opposite of the "Bare Wilderness Team" in the area of equipment. His list was hilariously long. We had enough firearms, axes, knives, and ammo on that list alone to supply Osama Bin Laden.:D He planned on driving in as far as he could and start hiking from there. Remember, this was before all the knowledge and technological breakthroughs that we have with Back-Packing today. Another thing he had that doomed his dream was a very real fear of snakes. He was terrified of the thought of a rattler or some other pit-viper biting him. So he put his dream on hold while he tried to design some stupid "snake-proof" suit that would be two-inches thick, cover him from head to toe, and let him remain cool or warm as the outside conditions dictated. This probably saved our lives, because, like you guys, he refused to listen to others. He thought that 1.) He knew it all, And 2.) It couldn't happen to him. A few years before his death he thought about it more realistically and bought some land down in Colorado that he figured would be more of a realistic approach to his dream, he could pan for gold. He kept putting it off and didn't figure on getting bone cancer, which cut his dream short.

So you see, I don't begrudge you guys your dream, that's never been an issue here. We've all been trying to do is help you survive it so you can remember it untill your old and gray. The focus of this survival site, is listed on the home page. It also tells you that it uses the information right out of the US ARMY SURVIVAL MANUAL. So please, please, please answer these two questions for me; 1.) Why aren't you listening to the experts, like Rick SAR who deals with this sort of thing on a daily basis? & 2.) Why don't you at least have some sort of a back-up plan to secure help if you need it?

There you go, no smart A*s comments, just straight talk. Can you answer those two questions or not, they're not hard ones.:confused:

We will be letting people know where we will be going. We are planning to post video so in order to do that we will have a computer and satelite at our main shelter. We can at any time leave or ask for help using our internet. We will not be using the computer to aid us in survival, only to send info. but if nessary we can use it to ask for help. We know that anyone can get hurt at any time, i have thought about that alot. People will know where we are, at least our base shelter and we can always leave if we can't do it. but i dont plan on failing. if we do then we will learn from our mistakes and try again.

two books i rely on heavily are

1-edible wild plants a north american feild guide (elias and dykman)
2-identifying and harvesting edible and medicinal plants in wild and not so wild places ("wildman" steve brill with evylyn dean.

these are two of about 16 books i own just on wild edibles also have found several experts in my area by expert i mean ppl who have been doing this for over 30 yrs, like i stated before i am simply an amatuer, but here my opioion.

edible plants in the autumn

amaranth,burdock roots and seeds, brassica flowers and seeds, carrot roots, seeds and flowers, catnip, chickweed, chicory root, clover flowers, coltsfoot leaves, common evening primrose roots, curly dock roots, dandelion flowers and roots, day flowers, daylily tubers, epazote, wild onion leaves and bulbs, foxtail grass seeds, goatsbeard, ground ivy, horesradish roots, jerusalum artichoke roots,ladys thumb, lamb quarters leaves and seeds, mugwort, mullien leaves, nettles, orpine leaves and roots, passion flower fruits, peppergrasses, pineapple weed(personal favorite) plaintain leaves and seeds, poverty weed, purslane stems, leaves, and seeds, rasberry leaves, rose hips, sheep sorrel, spearmint, storksbill, stawberry blite leaves and seeds sumac berries, thyme, wild potato vine root, wood sorrel.

now go do your homework, positvely id 10 of these take pics post on your website and i'll know you won't starve to death. then when your out there keep me posted on how you cooked them and how they tasted.

the wolf pack listens to your advice old timer

i just googled manitoba wildflowers in 5 minutes found enough wildflowers that i personally could live on for 30 days. find lone pine publishing manitobas wayside and wildflowers i own several lone pine books i recommend any of them.

if you can identify amaranth or it's cousin lambs quarters you will have enough protien to make it thru your trip.

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Originally Posted by wareagle69

edible plants in the autumn

amaranth,burdock roots and seeds, brassica flowers and seeds, carrot roots, seeds and flowers, catnip, chickweed, chicory root, clover flowers, coltsfoot leaves, common evening primrose roots, curly dock roots, dandelion flowers and roots, day flowers, daylily tubers, epazote, wild onion leaves and bulbs, foxtail grass seeds, goatsbeard, ground ivy, horesradish roots, jerusalum artichoke roots,ladys thumb, lamb quarters leaves and seeds, mugwort, mullien leaves, nettles, orpine leaves and roots, passion flower fruits, peppergrasses, pineapple weed(personal favorite) plaintain leaves and seeds, poverty weed, purslane stems, leaves, and seeds, rasberry leaves, rose hips, sheep sorrel, spearmint, storksbill, stawberry blite leaves and seeds sumac berries, thyme, wild potato vine root, wood sorrel.

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Passionflower fruits? If your thinking of the same plant I’m thinking of I don’t thing it grows in Manitoba. Im pretty sure its not nativ to canada though you might find a cold hardy vriety growing in gardens on the west coast. unless your talking about some other Passionflower I don’t know about.

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Originally Posted by Adrian

We will be letting people know where we will be going. We are planning to post video so in order to do that we will have a computer and satelite at our main shelter. We can at any time leave or ask for help using our internet. We will not be using the computer to aid us in survival, only to send info. but if nessary we can use it to ask for help. We know that anyone can get hurt at any time, i have thought about that alot. People will know where we are, at least our base shelter and we can always leave if we can't do it. but i dont plan on failing. if we do then we will learn from our mistakes and try again.

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I couldn't help but notice you did not directly answer question #1. I do like your idea about your base camp; but remember this: "People don't plan to fail, they fail to plan." Of course you don't plan on failing, and that's your problem. Look at it objectively, as though you're an outsider viewing yourself. Lose the personal bais and look at it realistically. Your last statement was a foolish one. Nobody "PLANS" on failing, that"s Murphy's department, he's got a law named after him, remember? "SH*T HAPPENS!". How would you feel if your best friend lay dying in front of you because of lack of preparation on your part? Now you've failed, and you're telling me you're simply going to go home, chalk it up to experience, and try it again? Do you realize how foolish that sounds? Go back and read wareagle69's post on the problems that he discovered on your plan listed on your website. Write them down and make preperations covering those things in case things go south. If you think it can't happen to you, you're sadly mistaken. I used to think that no one in my family could die in a gruesome homicide but it's happened...twice! You're experience is limited and doesn't impress me. The experience of people like wareagle, vol west, Owl girl, Trax, Marscroft, TonyUK, and RickSAR, just to name a few off of the top of my head impress the hell out of me! And you can see what they wrote! If we didn't care we'd turn our backs on you and let you go on your dangerous way, yet nobody here has done that! It's because we care, dude! :cool:

aw gosh sarge your gonna make me blush