What can I make with deer?

I can't really see what you're showing in the pic, but I think it'll be ok, if I bust some grain it just wont come out as nice is all. I'll be careful not to though.

I removed and dried the foreleg tendons and needle bones, then heated the hooves and removed them, then boiled the bones to get most flesh off and am drying them. 1 strip of back sinew and the hockskins are drying, probably dried already, on a board in the shed.

Other than making the tallow candle and firestarters which are fungus and punkwood soaked in meted tallow that's pretty much it.

I'm getting ready to head out and harvest that fallen oaks bark in hopes that it's not too washed out. Other than that I'm probably going to try black tea, although I'm getting mixed stories on whether or not it will work to tan hides and I'm completely unsure of the concentrations to use.

I have an old cooler which I'm thinking of using for the bark tan as it is larger and will allow the hide to spread out more. I'm really hoping this oak bark will work. I'm either gonna de-hair it when I get back or do it tomorrow time depending, I'm back to school now and it's crunch time.

OK, got the hair off except the little stubbies that I showed in the pic above, some were just way too stubborn even using the backside of my machete. So, I got all I could off and made up a new lime solution and stuck er back in. I also started the flesh side removing the membrane to get a feel for it. It seems to come off easy, but it's hard to tell if it's coming off or I'm just squeeging the water and slime out??

But, I went and harvested some of the oak bark I was talking about and ran a quick test run to see how dark it would come out. As soon as I put the one pound of bark into the one gallon of water it started to change color. I boiled it for about 5 minutes and this is how it came out. I'm thinking if I gather 15 lbs. of this and mash and boil it down hard it should be plenty strong enough.

What do you think?

http://i101.photobucket.com/albums/m...LiquorTest.jpg

http://i101.photobucket.com/albums/m...orTestShot.jpg

For reference, this bark wasn't mashed or nothing, just cut off the tree with my machete and dumped in the pot. the bark on the younger sections of the tree was still green and the leaves were still attached and some were green which leads me to believe this tree fell when the leaves started changing about 1 month or so back. So, it hasn't been sitting long.

I am curious, if this bark is acceptable, which bark would be best to harvest, the young small branches, the main trunk, or somewhere in the middle? Or, does it even matter. This bark came from the midsection of the tree. I'd like to go back tomorrow and harvest as much as possible to store for the future. This is a variety of Red oak btw.

have another go at the stubbies tomorrow while doing the membrane. They'll eventually come out.

The liquor looks pretty fair. I think you should boil it longer. To my knowledge, it makes no difference if it comes off the little branches, or the base of the trunk. The Laurel oak that I used was off firewood sized pieces and it worked fine. Chipping it up will get the tannins out faster but I think boiling longer has the same effect.
Also, you can boil each set more than once, and if you want it more concentrated.. just boil the liquor down some more. You're definately on the right track!

If the tree still has green leaves on it, it's gonna be a good one to use.

I'd say get about 25lbs if you can.. it's better to have more than you need!

I am going to fill a 5 gallon pail as much as possible, but this bark is a bear getting off the tree.

So far the hardest part has been de-hairing the skin which has taken 3 hours so far. Getting the bark off the tree will likely take just as long.

Skinning was easy, Fleshing was easy, bucking/ liming the skin was easy, getting the membrane off seems easy, but I guess I'll know how well that went once I soak it in the bark liquor.

dehairing can be tedious because you're being so careful. Usually I take it off with the grain lol, two birds. The membraning is easy, and I'm sure you got it right. Really, you'd have to be trying a pretty wild experiment to mess up this process! If the flesh side doesn't look stringy and tatty, then you did an excellent job.

If you can get the outer and inner bark off at the same time, you can boil them together, but of course you'll need more weight. Often it takes longer to gather materials for a process than the actual process itself takes. If you think it's going to take a few days to gather enough bark, you can store the hide in the fridge, or freezer if longer than that.

Well I stuffed the 5 gallon pail chuck full of bark and it weighed 17 lbs. -2 for the pail is 15 on the nose, of course it has the outer bark on. This was about a 10-15 square foot section of tree that I removed the bark from. It took just over an hour using a hammer and utilty bar. Once started I could quickly hammer out nice long 2" wide strips right down to the wood.

I could go back and harvest more I suppose, but was thinking this would be enough?? This is a small deer. BTW, my hands are now brown. Actually, I expected the bark to weigh more, I think I will go back for another bucket tomorrow.

If your hands are stained brown you got PRIME bark, my friend. Excellent.

It's hard to guess how much it'll take, I would probably go for one more bucket since the bark will otherwise be wasted once the tree is dead. You might want to do another deer once you've done this one ;)

Sounds like all that's left is to make the bath, and wait!

Oh, I want to do more, actually thinking along the lines of a bark tan fur on squirrel by applying the tan to only the flesh side. Or maybe a brain tan squirrel, not sure. I saw a rabbit on the side of the road today dead, but it was too magled or I'd have stopped. I've got my eyes peeled for roadkill, but haven't seen any recently.

Getting that hair off was a pain, but it is rewarding to see a nice clean hide. It seems so small now and thin. I still have to remove the stubbies though and finish the membrane, but it's looking like something different than what it was if that makes any sense at all. LOL!

The only thing that really concerns me is the amount of blood that was on the hide to start. I squeegied as much off while fleshing as possible, but it was stained pretty badly.

I'm not sure if the lime will remove the blood or will I need to wash it at some point?

You can wash it after the rinse. Blood stains will add character to the finished hide, so don't sweat it too much. those spots will be darker.

Thanks YCC, it appears a lot of the blood has washed out with the lime, but there are a few dark spots left.

Woe is me, the little hairs still won't slip, I'm leaving them in. I even had a hard time removing some of the pigment areas underneath the hair. I'm thinking the lime I bought is not good for the job. That's the only variable that is out of wack.

The skin has soaked in temps from 40-70 degrees for 10 or 11 days now, and 3 days ago I made a fresh batch of lime solution. Like I said it's the leg hair and white belly hair that's killing me. Unfortunately those are the thinner areas of skin, but even with great force and a somewhat dull blade they won't budge at all whatsoever. Except for the very nap of the neck all the rest of the hair slipped with just the lightest stroke of my smoothed over stick. This seems the exact opposite of everything I've read, confusing.

I think I have over 7 hours into de-hairing this skin and I'm calling it good.

Time to flip it, get the membrane off the flesh side and rinse this puppy out.

The weather has went from high 50's yesterday and rain to 20's and snow. I took the hide outside to de-hair it and withing 15 minutes it was starting to freeze. Winds are between 10 and 30 miles per hour. I brought it in and am finishing it in the bathtub, much more comfy, lol, and it's not freezing solid.

Next time I do this I will either use wood ash, lye, or specifically hydrated or pickling lime. Actually, I think I will avoid the lime altogether and go with the wood ash or straight up lye.

I did go back and get another pail of bark, the tree looks like an angry beaver had it's way with it now, it's pretty naked. I now have 28 lbs. of bark with outer bark on.

Quote:

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looks like an angry beaver had it's way with it now

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Now that right there is funny. I don't care who you are.

I'd love to see the look on your wife's face when she walks in and sees you in the bathtub with that hide.

"Don't tell, I don't want to know."
"But honey, it's not what it looks like, honest."

Maybe you need to give that thing a shave.

It does sound right opposite of what normally happens, perhaps it was a thicker winter coat on the belly and delicate areas? Usually the neck is the toughest spot and the white falls out. wierd. Since it bucked the rest of the hide, I think your lime was fine, and blood stains are pretty common.
28 lbs will be plenty to do this hide, and probably enough to do another.
The stubbies will be fine too. they'll probably disappear in tanning, or you can shave them off with a sharp knife once the hide is "tight". It won't affect the tanning.

Sounds like you are getting part of the storm that passed through here yesterday. Today winds 30+ mph, temps crazy low considering it was 80 degrees yesterday. Work was hell today!

I don't know about the weather, but winter came today and it's here to stay according to the weatherman. I wouldn't have wanted to be on a roof with that wind you had.

I finally got the membrane off for the most part too. The membrane had reset up or something and was a bear removing. Basically a 1/4" at a time almost as if it were a dry scrape from what I've read. Some spots would slide off and most others were a nightmare, no other way to say it. But, it's done for now and rinsed. I have it soaking in 5 gallons of cold water and will move it to the creek in the morning. Hopefully a muskrat or scuba diving cat doesn't run off with it. If so I'm setting traps and they will be my next project. I'm not kidding!

I got all the lime cleaned off my boots and everything else, it's messy stuff. Just need to wash out the buckets and get the bark chopped up and going.

The de-hairing and de-mambraning process actually took upwards of 7 hours total. 2 -1 hour sessions and 1 -5 hour session today. I may have took an hour break in there somewhere and 1 hour was cleanup. I really did not expect it to be so difficult and take so long, but it's done now and I feel good.

It took me 3 hours to gather the bark. So, I think I'm around 12 hours in now starting from skin on deer. 1/2 hour to skin, 1 hour to flesh, 1/2 hour messing around with the egg, lol, and 7 hours de-hairing/ membraning. But, in reality 3 hours was spent waiting, cleaning up, and taking smoke breaks.

I'll try and get together some pics and such of the things that stood out to me, but haven't really had time to mess with the editing and such, been too busy just trying to get this far and now I need to catch up on schoolwork. Finals are in two weeks and I have three lengthy projects coming due.

Hehe. If you were making buckskin, you'd still have about 13 more hours of work to go! 7 hours is actually pretty good time considering this is your first one. After doing quite a few buckskins, I average around 20 hours per hide. I don't count cleanup time or "wait" time either...

If you want to speed up the rinse, you can squeegie it, rinse, repeat.

And remember, Schoolwork FIRST. This is just a side project!

Alright, I guess this will be the thread where I post all the pics of the tanning process. It wouldn't make sense for me to do another write up on the entire process as YCC's Bark tan utility leather thread does that better than I could with my limited knowledge. But, I do want to point out a few things that didn't seem quite clear to me and a few things that may still not be clear to me.

First off I put the hide in the creek to rinse 2 days ago, nothing has ran off with it yet, but a deer crossed 2' from it overnight. there's not much to show there.

Next, before I rinsed it I had to get the pigment layer off the hair side and the membrane layer off the flesh side.

This pic shows the skin half way through removing the membrane, at least I think the darker area to the right has had the membrane removed, at least for the most part. The stuff on the left is just a gooey, fatty layer and once you get under it the skin has a much less gooey feeling.

http://i101.photobucket.com/albums/m...mbrane5050.jpg

This next pic shows the hide after membraning, the lighter area on the left is the flesh side and the dark area to the right is the hair side. You can see in the center the hairs that just would not slip.

http://i101.photobucket.com/albums/m...inPreRinse.jpg

After I got the hide soaking I wanted to start the bark liqour. Here is the tree I removed the bark from, I believe it has been sitting for less than 2 months after falling. I stripped from the foreground of the pic all the way to the rearmost bare spot along with about 6 squre feet from other locations. The area you're seeing is the mid section of the tree from halway to about 3/4 of the way up the tree. This section of tree had the best inner bark per chunk ratio. The outer bark was not too thick and the inner was about 1/4" thick. The outer limbs had thin inner bark, and the main trunk had really thick outer bark, but the inner bark layer was much darker meaning more tannins, I think. LOL! Buty, it was just too tough to get off and it would have taken much more by volume to get the same amount of tannins, which is the end goal.

http://i101.photobucket.com/albums/m.../FallenOak.jpg

This pic shows the golden inner bark sandwiched between the white interior wood and the dark outer bark. I think this is helpful to someone who may not understand the make up of a tree.

http://i101.photobucket.com/albums/m...BarkLayers.jpg

These are the tools I used to remove the bark, a ball peen hammer and a Roughneck utility bar. I was able to fill this 5 gallon bucket in about an hour or just over. This bucket isn't quite full and held 13 pounds of bark. I filled it full the first time and it held 15 pounds and took 1-1/2 hours to fill. I wore safety glasses and earplugs and would recommend using a wooden mallet rather than a ball peen for safety reasons.

http://i101.photobucket.com/albums/m.../BarkTools.jpg

Once I got the bark home I shredded it up by hand, it was easy and took just over an hour to shred 10 pounds of bark. I did not separate the outer bark or bits of wood that were incidental. It all went in the pot. I found trying to remove the outer bark to be very unproductive, it was hard and did not separate easily.

http://i101.photobucket.com/albums/m...rkShredded.jpg

Here the bark is boiling, I thought this pic looked neat. But, I wanted to show what I used, a 6 gallon SS pot filled to within 4" of top with 10 pounds of bark. I then added 3 gallons of tap water and once boiling let it roll for just over an hour. The tap water can supposedly leave spots on the leather, but from what I understand it's purely visual, does not affect functionality. I need confirmation on that though.

http://i101.photobucket.com/albums/m...arkBoiling.jpg

I repeated the boiling and pouring three times per YCC's tut and here's what I ended up with. Going from right to left; first pour, second pour, third pour, and finally 4th pour. The fourth pour was not boiled, I simply added hot tap water to the boiling hot bark and let it steep in a 5 gallon bucket just to see what the results would be. You can see how each pouring gets progressively lighter. In a white 5 gallon bucket the 1st pour is like black coffee, here it looks much lighter.

http://i101.photobucket.com/albums/m...orPourings.jpg

That's it for now.

BTW, schoolwork is over halfway done. I've spent over 20 hours on it in the past two or three days and have about 8 hours to go.

Thanks for the pics. Looks like your learning curve is steep. Well done.

Another great tut, RWC. Do you think a draw knife would make bark removal easier?

The first picture is an excellent membraning job. That is better than I get most of mine. Great work!
Don't sweat those couple little hairs. They can be trimmed off later. Looks to me like you did a really good job with that too.
Most folks, like me have hard well water. The calcium can cause little spots, but it hasn't been a problem. With city water, the chlorine or salt (depending on how they purify) Also has some chemical properties that are able to react with the stuff in the bucket, but I don't have city water, so I can't say either way on that one. I have read about it, but not used city water.

You've done an excellent job so far. With a little research, and just "getting your hands dirty" I felt like it was a really intuitive process. Would you agree? I know it seemed a little daunting at first, but now that you're at the end of the process, what do you think? Easy for anybody to do?

Just remember to use the LAST pouring first and the first pouring last. You are well on your way to completing this project

@Rick, I tried using my drawknife back when I first tried this and the hammer + axe combo (or chisel or wrecking bar) worked better for me.

If you chip fresh bark and it changes colors quickly, i.e. turns brown or red, that is how you know you have good bark. The tannins, when exposed to open air, oxidize. If it stains your hands you know you have REALLY good bark.

Wish I could give you some more rep rwc, Thanks for posting these pics. Hopefully you'll inspire someone else to give this a try! You've done really great so far. Just make sure you get the schoolwork first!! Two thumbs up!!

I would agree that it is an intuitive process and skinning this recent deer was easier knowing how the skin and such is made up. I suppose I paid a little more attention to the details this time around because of this process.

Also, I think it is easy enough for anyone to do as long as they have a little patience, a place to work, and don't mind getting a little drty and putting out some physical effort. I really didn't get too dirty though and so far none of the smells have been terribly offensive as i had imagined.

and, eventhough I am trying to break it down to a science and cover all the bases it's not rocket science. The tut you provided should allow anyone wanting to do this to do it.

Interesting point on the bark oxidizing. I didn't notice that, but probably wasn't paying attention.

How do you feel about using that 4th pouring that wasn't boiled as a 1st bath? It has darkened up somewhat since I posted the pics of each pouring.

Also, where's that brain tan tut? I have brains and another skin now. I think I will freeze this skin and raw brains until spring though and go from there. Is that doable? This skin doesn't appear to need fleshing as all the visible meat and fat is still on the deer. It looked just like the one you posted in your skinning tut, that thin layer of meat was left on the deer and I even kept it from peeling around the neck region where I had trouble the last time.

Again man, thanks for all the help and tuts, you really do know your stuff. You'd be surprised what crazy stuff I read while searching for bark tan topics on the net, some good, some bad, and some was just out there. You could tell by reading some of the articles that the folks had likely never skinned a deer let alone done this, but were talking as if they were experts. It's refreshing to get first hand knowledge passed on in the way that you do it. It takes time to put it all together and I appreciate that very much.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Rick

Another great tut, RWC. Do you think a draw knife would make bark removal easier?

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I don't recall ever using a draw knife, except maybe back in wood shop, but the outer bark is quite tough and takes a little work to get through and to me it would take great effort to simply draw the knife under the bark, it is held to the tree securely, at least on this oak, whick I believe is Red oak proper, not sure though, but it is in the Red oak family.

I initially tried using my machete as a makeshift drawknife and it seemed it took a pounding force to get the blade under and along the bark, it doesn't simply slice off.

That utility bar worked excellent really, I just don't like pounding steel on steel is all, especially in below freezing temps. I have a few vids I'm slowly getting together as this progresses and one shows the bark coming off in fast motion. It's pretty neat! Once you make your first cut in the bark it peels off pretty quick and the ut. bar has a tendency to stay under the bark and lift it away from the tree which helps greatly.

Honestly, it was much easier removing the layers from the tree than it was removing them from the deer and the two are very similar in construction on a basic level. I find this entire process fascinating. Eventhough there's a fair amount of physical work involved I find it very rewarding.

Ok.. I won't make you twist my arm. I'll work on a braintanning tute in my spare time. You can store a fleshed skin (if it doesn't need it, it's good to go) and brain in the freezer almost indefinately. I double bag 'em in grocery bags. I would apply the same rules to the skin as any meat.. 6 months to a year.. after that it'll probably get freezerburn, etc. Freezing till spring is totally doable, but try to time it so the temps are not higher than 70-75 degrees.
A word of warning... braintanning is a monster as far as labor is concerned, and it's HIGHLY ADDICTIVE.

The 4th pouring, I'd probably start off with, undiluted, then add the third pouring a week or so later and dilute it depending on how "thick" the liquor looks. Like I say, it's not a really specific method. I would think the 4th pouring would be thin enough to start without dilution. If there isn't enough liquor to cover the hide, add some of the third pouring. I don't think it'll be too strong. About like a cup of tea, and gradually increase to almost "soup", hard to see through.
(I think I answered all the questions lol)

There are a lot of different opinions on how and what, but really it all boils down to chemistry and a little common sense. It has been said, "There are as many recipes and methods for brain (or bark) tanning as there are tanners" and I find this to hold true. There are lots of folks out there who have tanned thousands of hides and do it for a living. Whether they understand the chemistry is debatable, but they always reach the same end.
If we end with the same product, using different methods, then it must not be the method, but the underlying sciences that take place behind the methods.

i have 3 deer carcasses from shotgun laying out in the back field.... better go see if those bones are clean yet! buzzards work good to clean em off the lazy way :sleep:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by your_comforting_company

Ok.. I won't make you twist my arm. I'll work on a braintanning tute in my spare time. You can store a fleshed skin (if it doesn't need it, it's good to go) and brain in the freezer almost indefinately. I double bag 'em in grocery bags. I would apply the same rules to the skin as any meat.. 6 months to a year.. after that it'll probably get freezerburn, etc. Done!

Freezing till spring is totally doable, but try to time it so the temps are not higher than 70-75 degrees. A word of warning... braintanning is a monster as far as labor is concerned, and it's HIGHLY ADDICTIVE. That's why I want to get all the info and equpment I need ready now so when the temps start getting above freezing I can get on it and have time set aside for the labor.

The 4th pouring, I'd probably start off with, undiluted, then add the third pouring a week or so later and dilute it depending on how "thick" the liquor looks. Like I say, it's not a really specific method. I would think the 4th pouring would be thin enough to start without dilution. If there isn't enough liquor to cover the hide, add some of the third pouring. I don't think it'll be too strong. About like a cup of tea, and gradually increase to almost "soup", hard to see through.
(I think I answered all the questions lol) Hey, I'm just gettin' started. I have an entire list, just trying to spring 'em on you slowly, LOL. JK!

There are a lot of different opinions on how and what, but really it all boils down to chemistry and a little common sense. It has been said, "There are as many recipes and methods for brain (or bark) tanning as there are tanners" and I find this to hold true. There are lots of folks out there who have tanned thousands of hides and do it for a living. Whether they understand the chemistry is debatable, but they always reach the same end.
If we end with the same product, using different methods, then it must not be the method, but the underlying sciences that take place behind the methods.

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That's what I've noticed too while perusing this subject. Some swear by a certain method and condemn the next, but most seem to end with good results, so I suppose it's a preference or "what I'm used to" kinda thing. Wet scrape vs. dry scrape for instance, It seems most prefer one over the other and have strong reasons why they don't like the other method.

Anyway, I checked the skin again today and it had been moved once more. This time it was up over a log and the part exposed was frozen, hope that didn't effect it. I'm not sure what's getting a hold of it, but I moved it a little further down in an area that will hopefully get less traffic.

I'm not noticing a change in the texture of the skin as you described, but it ddidn't really have a distinct rubbery or swollen feel or look to start with. I'm considering just pulling it on Wednesday, squeegy it and start the tan.??

And for any who are interested I posted some vids of this process so far and some of the things I ran into along the way.

The process has pretty much been explained in YCCs tut and expanded by him even more in this thread so I won't describe each vid, it pretty self explanatory at this point.

Fleshing

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RflPvyT-olM

Liming/ Bucking

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gTTumhFU2D0

De-hairing/ removing the membrane, etc.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QfY_PW51MNo

Harvesting and prepping the bark/ liquor

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h9-gKENRJ1k

At this point I'm just waiting for the hide to rinse and will then start the actual tanning process.

First of all, thank you for documenting these steps with video. It's something I've been wanting to do. A BIG two-thumbs up from me!
Also I'd like to say you've done fantastic with the hide so far. I really hope a critter doesn't get it.

You might not have noticed the change so much at the bucking phase because at first the skin was filled with gooey goodness, which has now been washed out. If the skin feels lighter and more stretchy it's ready to tan. I'd give it at least one more day, maybe two just depending on how it feels, and start the tan.
This being your first one the changes aren't so noticable, after this one though, you'll kinda know what to look for.

I got started on the BT tute last night, but I still gotta get pics of my setup and tools and get it organized. I'll try to get the tools soon so you can get your stuff together.

Excellent videos.

Thanks Crash, and that 'd be cool ycc. I appreciate it.

I have my new skin folded and wrapped in on itself, flesh side in, double wrapped in a plastic garbage bag inside a paper grocery bag and into my new ice box along with a ziploc container full of brains, lol, the meat from both deer, and my shrooms.

I still have room in there for about 3 more deer and another hide or two. Convenient!

Way cool job, RWC. How can you and YCC walk around with 5 green thingies? That just looks heavy.

yeah.. it makes you walk funny too.

I love watching this stuff! It's something I won't have the chance to do myself, but it's great to see the job done. Thankyou.

You're welcome Winnie and Rick. I noticed i've been walkin' a lil funny lately, thought it was the sore butt from sittin' on a bucket de-hairing. :)

What can you make with deer?.........Me dinner!

That's #1 on the list Sarky. I have the liver and kidneys soaking in salt water right now and will probably be cooking them up later today. The inner loins are history.

You know, the dehairing video is really a cut above and is a great display of adaptability. The truth is that you just have to do it and figure it out just like you said. I think it's better than what's on the DVD's that are out there because it is REAL, and it's how anybody who goes at it for the first time is going to see it.
It should definately go in the utility leather thread. A really excellent video. Thanks for taking the time to put it together.

By all means feel free to put it in there YCC, thanks.

After 6 days I decided to pull the skin from the creek.

http://i101.photobucket.com/albums/m...tAndStains.jpg

As you can see it's not white or anywhere close. It is now all stained up from the debris and such in the creek and is quite dirty too. There is a large orange stain along the bottom edge in the pic which came from something in the creek. Thinking back I think the creek was a bad idea. The creek level had went down greatly in the past two weeks and there wasn't much flow. Also, this creek, as most every creek and river in Southern Michigan is full of sediment, leaves and such and has no real rocks or gravel in it. I think if you're going to soak it in a creek it needs to be a swift flow of water over gravel and rocks in a stream that is not filled with sediment. That is very hard to find in Southern Michigan as all our creeks and rivers have been choked out long ago due to farming, household cleaning chemicals, industry, logging activity, etc. etc.

Nevertheless, the deed is done so I put it in a pot below with some dishsoap and a little vinegar to hopefully rinse out the grey color, stains, dirt, blood and such and bring it back toward a more acid ph, neutralize the lime. The vinegar is a tip I got at Braintan.com as well as several other sources for bark tan. It makes perfect sense to me as the vinegar will neutralize the lime. From what I understand trhis step isn't needed for bucking with lye or wood ash, but is suggested for limed hides, which is what I have.

http://i101.photobucket.com/albums/m...tCreekSoak.jpg

As you can see the water was quite cloudy still which leads me to believe the 6 days in the creek didn't do much to remove the lime, maybe it did, I don't know. I rinsed it 4 times until the water was fairly clear and scrubbed it with my hands in the soap to try and remove some of the stains and discoloration. My efforts did very little, but at least I got the dirt and leaves from the creek washed off it. LOL! I then let it soak in the pot of cold water for about 6 hours with about a 1/4 cup of vinegar to hopefully neutralize some of the lime which I was most certain it was still loaded with.

Side note:

I'm thinking at this point the lime I used was a bad idea and next time I'll use wood ash or straight up lye instead. I'm pretty sure the majority of the discoloration is from the lime, or inert ingredients within the lime, maybe not??? It took on a grey outside color and tan inside color after placing it in the lime. It seems that most of the blood has been washed out of the hide at this point except for the area immediately surrounding the bullet hole.

So, after soaking and rinsing I placed it in the 4th pouring which I diluted about 50/50 with cold tap water. As you can see below the 4th pour, even after diluting, has darkened up considerably since I showed it in the previous posts above. It has been leaching out tannins from the bark for 5-6 days.

http://i101.photobucket.com/albums/m...PourLiquor.jpg

You can see 1 to 2" down into the diluted liquor. I put it in yesterday and stirred it frequently for the first couple hours and three or four times today as well. The skin is taking on the brown coloration of the tannins and the liqour has lightened up noticably since I took the pic above. You can now see easily 2" down into it.

Unless you see something that throws a red flag YCC, I'm adding the third pouring full strength tomorrow as it's starting to look weak already, much lighter than pictured above.

My big question now is if the lime wasn't rinsed out thouroughly what will happen? and how do I tell if it needs more membraning?

Since the hide wasn't anywhere near white I feel it's going to be hard to tell if the tannins are soaking in evenly across the entire skin.

BTW, the orange streak I mentioned above turned pitch black when it hit the tannins. It must have been rust from something in the creek that wasn't visible to me?? Personally, I'm not worried about the staining, but want to be sure the skin is taking in the tannins properly.

I don't see any red flags and if you've noticed a change in the color of the liquor I'd say go ahead and step it up. It must be opened up really well and taking the tan.

Add about a half a gallon of your third pouring and see how that looks. Any time you think you might need it a little stronger than that, you can further condense any of your pourings. Like I said, none of this stuff is an exact science and it really just requires monitoring and going on what feels right.

That I know of, there is not much danger in leaving a small amount of lime in for bark tanning. I'm of the opinion that for braintanning the vinegar step can be used to neutralize the lime, but not so much to "acidify" the hide. Brains are slightly acidic, being amino acids, and acids are much less attracted to other acids than they are alkalis. That's my logic anyway..

I hate the hide got all stained and dirty like that. I don't normally have that problem since I use tapwater. I do wash mine with dawn or dove when they have stubborn spots, so don't worry about the soap.

The picture of the fourth pouring above looks good. If it's much weaker than that add some, and try to keep it about the same consistency throughout, getting a little bit stronger (darker) each time.

now it's just a waiting game. I've had one take 45 days, and I've had one take 60 days. There's no way to know how long it will take. Once a week I'd check the neck. make a small cut into the hide at the neck and look for color to go all the way to the center. You're at least a few weeks from needing that tho. I'll do my first neck check on monday which will be day 14 on the black walnut cow. That'll give you a good idea what to look for.

Man, you've really taken this thing and run with it! I'm super excited for you brother. I know that as well as you've done so far with it, that this is going to turn out great. It's amazing how with just a little background info, you just kinda "know" what to do.

I'd bet that that slow creek would have tanned it, especially if the creek has lots of leaves and "brackish" water. Leaves from many trees have lots of tannins in them too. Particularly sumac trees.

Time to hit the woods, so I'll check back later tonight. Keep up the good work!

LOL! the creek was tanning it. Wherever a leaf bit settled on it there would be a tannin stain. And when it got drug up on the log by whatever critter there was a stain as well.

This got me thinking. Many of the swamps around here are in amongst hardwood forests and the water is usally red with tannins. Hmm? Premade bark liquor or would it just rot?

Also got me wondering if fresh fallen dried oak leaves from the forest floor could be used the same way sumac leaves are??

Just a couple things I've been pondering.