BP Oil

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Originally Posted by HeritageFarm

I don't see why we should stop getting imported oil. We don't actually get a very large percentage of oil from terrorist countries, around a couple percent I believe.

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IMO it's a matter of national security and sovereignty. Here are the top 10 of countries that we import oil from. Looks to me that more than one of those are run by regimes that would not hesitate cutting their exports to us if they thought it was prudent.

1. Canada
2. Mexico
3. Saudi Arabia
4. Venezuela
5. Nigeria
6. Angola
7. Iraq
8. Algeria
9. United Kingdom
10. Brazil

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Originally Posted by HeritageFarm

I don't see why we should stop getting imported oil. We don't actually get a very large percentage of oil from terrorist countries, around a couple percent I believe.

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The operative phrase is Addiction to Foreign Oil.
Where it comes from is secondary.

This from the Pickens Plan:

It's an addiction that threatens our economy, our environment and our national security. It touches every part of our daily lives and ties our hands as a nation and as a people.

The addiction has worsened for decades and now it's reached a point of crisis.
In 1970, we imported 24% of our oil.
Today, it's more than 65% and growing.

Please do read the rest of the story if you really care:
http://www.pickensplan.com/theplan/

I've been paying attention to T. Boone and his plan for quite some time. There are a lot of things I like about it.

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Originally Posted by HeritageFarm

I don't see why we should stop getting imported oil. We don't actually get a very large percentage of oil from terrorist countries, around a couple percent I believe.

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First, I have to say that I think your info is incorrect, but aside from that, it's still about $500 billion a year leaving the country. That amount of money would sure help out our economy, if it stayed in this country.

Producing our own oil/natural gas, would create a ton of new domestic jobs, boosting the economy, which will allow us to spend more money on research and development of other energy sources. Currently, the cost of wind and solar are too expensive. Another problem is that battery technology isn't up to the task, yet. People don't seem to think about the fact that wind/solar have to have back-ups. (Sometimes, the sun doesn't shine, and other times, the wind doesn't blow.)

At this time, I have to think nuclear energy is the direction, for the replacement of fossil fuels.

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Originally Posted by 2dumb2kwit

(Sometimes, the sun doesn't shine, and other times, the wind doesn't blow.)

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If you want to see the sunshine, check here :): http://www.wilderness-survival.net/f...mber.php?u=200

If you want to feel and hear the wind blow, check here :sneaky2:: http://www.wilderness-survival.net/f...ber.php?u=3276

Clean Energy would create lots of jobs too,

2d, You are just Mad cause you dont want to drive a solar powered Race car ! :innocent:

We need everything--nuclear, solar, wind, gas (Rick?)--they shouldn't be mutually exclusive.
Whatever happened to backups? I thought we were all down with that here.

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Originally Posted by BENESSE

We need everything--nuclear, solar, wind, gas (Rick?)--they shouldn't be mutually exclusive.
Whatever happened to backups? I thought we were all down with that here.

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I absolutely agree. No options should be off the table - period.

I'm not down with nuclear generation. Spent fuel and the possibility of an accident are serious considerations that don't have well defined solutions.

And 2D I disagree that solar and wind generated power are too expensive. Indiana added 905 megawatts of wind generated power in 2009. Second only to Texas in construction and 13th in the nation in terms of megawatts generated. We currently have 616 utility sized wind turbines. All in production and feeding the grid.

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Originally Posted by Justin Case

Clean Energy would create lots of jobs too,

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So would washing everyones car, twice a week, but who's going to pay for it?

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Originally Posted by Rick

I'm not down with nuclear generation. Spent fuel and the possibility of an accident are serious considerations that don't have well defined solutions.

And 2D I disagree that solar and wind generated power are too expensive. Indiana added 905 megawatts of wind generated power in 2009. Second only to Texas in construction and 13th in the nation in terms of megawatts generated. We currently have 616 utility sized wind turbines. All in production and feeding the grid.

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I understand that, but you didn't address the cost. The info that I have read, shows that with current technology, on-shore wind farm produced energy cost about twice what coal powered energy cost.....and that doesn't even take into account that you have to have a back-up system for the wind farm. That's even more additional cost.

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Originally Posted by 2dumb2kwit

So would washing everyones car, twice a week, but who's going to pay for it?

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I nominate Rick! :)

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Originally Posted by Justin Case

Clean Energy would create lots of jobs too,

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How many jobs would it kill, when the economy goes all to pieces, when energy prices triple?

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Originally Posted by 2dumb2kwit

How many jobs would it kill, when the economy goes all to pieces, when energy prices triple?

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You are either part of the problem, or part of the solution, 2D. :sneaky2:
((I just had to say it once in my life...feels good.)

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Originally Posted by 2dumb2kwit

First, I have to say that I think your info is incorrect, but aside from that, it's still about $500 billion a year leaving the country. That amount of money would sure help out our economy, if it stayed in this country.

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Ouch. I would like that money to stay here. (Oh, and Walmart imports most everything from China - That there is an enormous amount leaving).
One reason we import our oil could be because we have all these environmental people who don't want oil rigs in national forests.
I present a solution: Stop driving all over the place! Let's buy local produce and meats, that weren't shipped thousands of miles before making it to you.

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Originally Posted by HeritageFarm

Ouch. I would like that money to stay here. (Oh, and Walmart imports most everything from China - That there is an enormous amount leaving).
One reason we import our oil could be because we have all these environmental people who don't want oil rigs in national forests.
I present a solution: Stop driving all over the place! Let's buy local produce and meats, that weren't shipped thousands of miles before making it to you.

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I DO!!!
Don't have a car, walk everywhere, take public transportation or rent a car if I have to.
I buy produce at the farmer's market where farmers from NJ, upstate NY & CT sell their produce. I pay a bit more and eat a bit less.
And yeah, I'm one of those people who don't want anyone f-ing around with our national forests. Because if we ALL did our part, we wouldn't need to.

It is interesting that no one ever says the problem is 6.85 Billion HUMANS, and doubling every 37 to 42 years. We loath War, Pandemic, Famine; We make every effort to keep medically compromised babies and geriatrics alive. Feeding tubes in humans that have been in a coma for years. We play GOD with the Earth, and all forms of live, we cull any animal population deemed to be in a state of overpopulation. We make NEW engineered food in test tubes.

Odd that humans don't pray for a pandemic. Odd that we can't see that "WE" are the cancer that is killing our earth, the very Earth that nurtures us, feeds and clothes us, provides materials for our shelter.

I am NOT advocating any action, only pointing out that we (All) Humans never see that we are the problem.

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Originally Posted by Sourdough

It is interesting that no one ever says the problem is 6.85 Billion HUMANS, and doubling every 37 to 42 years. We loath War, Pandemic, Famine; We make every effort to keep medically compromised babies and geriatrics alive. Feeding tubes in humans that have been in a coma for years. We play GOD with the Earth, and all forms of live, we cull any animal population deemed to be in a state of overpopulation. We make NEW engineered food in test tubes.

Odd that humans don't pray for a pandemic. Odd that we can't see that "WE" are the cancer that is killing our earth, the very Earth that nurtures us, feeds and clothes us, provides materials for our shelter.

I am NOT advocating any action, only pointing out that we (All) Humans never see that we are the problem.

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We ARE the problem, no doubt about it and short of doing something very drastic, we can scale back where it reasonably makes sense. It doesn't have to be an all or nothing proposition.
If we want to be intellectually honest, we know best where we can personally cut back. Don't concern yourself with what everyone else is doing (the kiss of doom) think about what YOU can do and just do it.

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Originally Posted by BENESSE

You are either part of the problem, or part of the solution, 2D. :sneaky2:
((I just had to say it once in my life...feels good.)

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You're absolutly correct. My point, is that jumping to conclusions/actions that cause more problems than they solve, is a problem....not a solution.

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Originally Posted by 2dumb2kwit

You're absolutly correct. My point, is that jumping to conclusions/actions that cause more problems than they solve, is a problem....not a solution.

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Maybe.
But at some point we've got to get off our a$$es and do something. Sometimes doing ANYthing is better than doing nothing. Have to stop fiddling while Rome's burning, don't you think?