Navy Seal Snipers == Awesome

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Originally Posted by Chris

The pirates made 150 million last year in ransom.

I doubt you can blame socioeconomic reasons for their actions anymore, they're richer than all of us on this forum combined.

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So with even less justification for their actions, it all boils down to simple greed.

I know you can live like a king for a year (two *'s, a hotel room, and a case of beer a night) for about $800 or less.

I wonder what you can do with $150,000,000 in Somalia?

That's a lot of AK's and RPG's....
:m107::gun_bandana:
:gunsmilie::rambo:
:pirate:drool:

While some of the money is being kept by the "pirate community", the bulk of it is going to fund Islamic terrorists.

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Originally Posted by remy

Guys...
I own guns.
I am prepared to defend my family.
I was in the military.
My father in law is a Vietnam vet.
My father was in the military.
My grand father was in the resistance during WWII.
My great grand father was a horse man and fought at Verdain.

My point was, as i said in my second post...not about the action that took place...here...i'll quote myself.
"i am not criticizing, nor am i questioning the decision that was made to end this situation with deadly force..."

Coot is basically relating what i said to hippies from the 60s. I am no hippie believe me. As i said, what is done had to be done.

Maybe later, when i will no longer be told to back off, we can talk about it some more. Then again...maybe not.

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roflmao. So YOU were the one PGVOutdoors got his panties in a twist about?

got me... I was just guessing.

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Originally Posted by remy

Not using the word awesome within the context of killing another human being would be a good start.

........There is nothing awesome about killing. What had to be done is done...but this thread is morbid and juvenile.

.......... whatever they have done, finding their death to be awesome and of amazing sporting technic is disappointing...

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Remy, I DO understand what you have written. I'm sorry to "disappoint" you, but I do take great pleasure because of their death and the manner in which it came about.

They are not trying to survive. Instead, they are trying to THRIVE - at "our" expense. They are playing a dangerous game with the most serious of consequences. They laugh at us - the fools who pay tribute when brought to their knees. They place no value on our lives whatsoever - and I therefore view them in the same way. They are little more than animals, and certainly NOT human beings in my eyes - they ARE targets - only targets. Soooo, when these targets are eliminated with such skill, confidence, and efficiency - yep, I'll cheer for the winning team!

What is awesome is the ability of our navy snipers to do three simultaneous headshots when shooting from one ship to another in the open ocean.

"Awesome" was not meant to relish in the deaths of those pirates, though like Ken, I feel no sympathy for them. The captain was not going to be rescued any other way. A boarding party would have been at risk and put the captain at risk, and having them get to Somali shores would have been a firefight, more lives lost again. It had to be snipers, it had to be simultaneous, and it had to be while they were still in the open ocean. I thought such a thing was going to be impossible.

Great job Navy!
:rambo: :death::death::death:










:gunsmilie:

Remy, I think it's just a matter of semantics.
Perhaps if the title said, "awe inspiring" rather than "awesome"?
You don't seem to be arguing that the outcome was destined, only in the use of the word "awesome" associated with the deaths. The skill of the Seals is awe inspiring. I could never hope to make such a shot. That three of them did it simultaneously is worth noting.

all I can say is; three seals, three pirates, three shots...nuttin but net baby! Nuttin but net!

Welcome hobowonkanobe. Why not net your way over to our Introduction section and tell us a bit about yourself?

http://www.wilderness-survival.net/f...splay.php?f=14

i am curious
how many herwe quiping about how awesome these kils were have ever had to take a life whether it be in the line of duty or in self defense.
to take a human life is not awesome or even great even if these are the bad guys. these three snipers will have to live with that the rest of their lives, its easy to say how great it is when you have never been in that situation or had to live with the outcome of said events
wake up at night seeing faces or have your spouce deal with the nightmares and mood swings, then come on here and tout your greatness.

I think there is a huge difference between the admiration of the snipers' skill, wanting the pirates dealt with, and thinking that killing is a good thing.

No nightmares, Wareagle, no nightmares at all. No remorse. Instead, an occasional pleasant dream of Capt. Phillips surrounded by his family - knowing he was still alive.

and people that say that have never been there

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Originally Posted by wareagle69

and people that say that have never been there

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Wareagle, once upon a time, I was the first responder at a horrible car accident. Two young moms and two infants - 2 months old and 4 months old. I pulled both of those infants' mangled bodies out of the wreck. I spent 15 minutes trying to bring one of them back to life until we reached the hospital. I had nightmares about that for a very long time......

Some lives are precious and some have no redeeming value whatsoever.

They say that the eyes are a window to the soul. If you could ever look in my eyes, Wareagle, you would know, to the very core of your existence, you would know that I would never feel a split second of remorse if I had taken the life of one of those pirates. Of that, I am certain.

like i said you never been there

i agree with some of what remy had said about other parts of the world seeing us as the terrorists and evil doers. we were fortunate to be born in this country and have the beleifs that you do, if you was born there you may have been brought up to see the americas as evil and vow to fight occupation and evil from your side, from your comfy desk it is very easy to be one sided and hypocritical.
as i have shared here before i was in somalia in 93 lost some good friends there, if any one has the right to be bitter i think i qualify, it is a lawless land course the same can be said for here with all the mass killings and gang violence, its just here we accept it better because we are civilized.
i am not saying that these actions were preventable but it amazes me how many of you who have never pulled a trigger can sit here and talk about it like it was a 4th and long call at the superbowl, until you have pulled a trigger, rode a bull, fought in a cage, climbed a mountain and been in the depth of it all you cannot say how you will deal with the aftermath. i guarantee that these well trained warriiors do not take delight in taking a life, it probably was a neccesary evil but one they must live with

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Originally Posted by Ken

Wareagle, once upon a time, I was the first responder at a horrible car accident. Two young moms and two infants - 2 months old and 4 months old. I pulled both of those infants' mangled bodies out of the wreck. I spent 15 minutes trying to bring one of them back to life until we reached the hospital. I had nightmares about that for a very long time......

Some lives are precious and some have no redeeming value whatsoever.

They say that the eyes are a window to the soul. If you could ever look in my eyes, Wareagle, you would know, to the very core of your existence, you would know that I would never feel a split second of remorse if I had taken the life of one of those pirates. Of that, I am certain.

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coming across death and desrtuction that you have had no hand in is hard but not the same, i also have trained and volunteered on a bls squad, but when you are directly responsible for causing that death it is a whole different scenario that you cannot comprehend, its like watching all these folks train for a situation until they live it and feel it they cannot possibly say how they would react as a lawer you should be aware of that

You know what else is awesome?

Shortly after 9/11 when our operations started in Afganistan we had operatives helping Afgan rebel groups fight the Taliban. In one instance it was a very dark and cloudy day and the Taliban armored line was advancing. The tribal people told our operatives that it wouldn't be possible to call for air support because of the clouds. Our guys said "just wait" and pointed a laser at the Taliban forces. A few minutes later they were nailed by a barrage of smart bombs from above.

The capabilities of our armed forces are awesome, amazing, and impressive. And would hope that the brave men and women who carry out their duties sleep well at night because all they're doing is protecting us and helping people. Sometimes that means bad people have to die. The Pirates are not good people, the Taliban are not good people.

If you could go back in time and kill Adolf Hitler when he was 12 years old would you? This is a typical moral question often tossed out. I tell you what, I would. I imagine Ken would as well. I understand some people would not, some people are more sensitive than others. I'm kind of a hardass. I would strangle 100 adolf hitlers with my bare hands if it would prevent WW2.

These pirates are attacking innocent civilian ships that are often carrying food aid to gain hundreds of millions of dollars in ransom which they then spend to both live like kings among their starving countrymen and fund terrorism elsewhere. To allow them to continue, to allow them to get more hostages and kill more people, would in the end result in far more bloodshed than what three sniper bullets can cause. It is a good thing what was done, and those snipers should sleep well, and should be lauded for their skill and expertise.

you say they are not good people because you have the luxory of sitting over here on this side, they beleive in what they are fighting for as they ahve fought their whole lives to defend, if you have been born there how would you feel? as for the pirates desperate times call for desperate measures, heck look at our onw country when times get tough.

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Originally Posted by wareagle69

like i said you never been there

i agree with some of what remy had said about other parts of the world seeing us as the terrorists and evil doers. we were fortunate to be born in this country and have the beleifs that you do, if you was born there you may have been brought up to see the americas as evil and vow to fight occupation and evil from your side, from your comfy desk it is very easy to be one sided and hypocritical.
as i have shared here before i was in somalia in 93 lost some good friends there, if any one has the right to be bitter i think i qualify, it is a lawless land course the same can be said for here with all the mass killings and gang violence, its just here we accept it better because we are civilized.
i am not saying that these actions were preventable but it amazes me how many of you who have never pulled a trigger can sit here and talk about it like it was a 4th and long call at the superbowl, until you have pulled a trigger, rode a bull, fought in a cage, climbed a mountain and been in the depth of it all you cannot say how you will deal with the aftermath. i guarantee that these well trained warriiors do not take delight in taking a life, it probably was a neccesary evil but one they must live with

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And this is a typical logical fallacy. We're not allowed to have an opinion on a topic unless we've personally experienced it?

I'm sorry I've never shot a Somali. I'm not going to fly over there and shoot one just so I can post my opinion on the Internet.

I also never liberated a concentration camp in WW2, I wasn't even born yet. But I can still have an opinion on the treatment of the Jews in Nazi Germany can't I?

Ya sure, if one of those snipers does have nightmares, I'm probably not the guy for them to confide in because I'd have absolutely 0 insight into their issue. But, I'm sure you don't actually have to have shot someone in the line of duty to have an opinion on a military operation, no?

one more thought and i'm done with this
when the taliban was fighting the russians we thought they were great and was willing to overlok their religous beleifs, we even backed osama and trained and supplied him, have they changed or have we?

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Originally Posted by Chris

And this is a typical logical fallacy. We're not allowed to have an opinion on a topic unless we've personally experienced it?

I'm sorry I've never shot a Somali. I'm not going to fly over there and shoot one just so I can post my opinion on the Internet.

I also never liberated a concentration camp in WW2, I wasn't even born yet. But I can still have an opinion on the treatment of the Jews in Nazi Germany can't I?

Ya sure, if one of those snipers does have nightmares, I'm probably not the guy for them to confide in because I'd have absolutely 0 insight into their issue. But, I'm sure you don't actually have to have shot someone in the line of duty to have an opinion on a military operation, no?

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i emphaticly whole heartedly 100 percent disagree

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Originally Posted by wareagle69

you say they are not good people because you have the luxory of sitting over here on this side, they beleive in what they are fighting for as they ahve fought their whole lives to defend, if you have been born there how would you feel? as for the pirates desperate times call for desperate measures, heck look at our onw country when times get tough.

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So Wareagle, how do you feel about women's rights, torture, are you for torture? Do you think women should be beaten and not allowed to be educated, and raped by their husbands? You're saying that the Taliban are bad people is just a matter of where I'm standing. So okay, from where you stand, why don't you think women have the right to not be raped?

That is a rhetorical question, you don't have to answer it.

And the pirates, are a hell of a lot richer than me. You can't say I have access to a better life because I was born in the US. They could come here and buy every foreclosed house in Detroit and never work again. Of course, they'd be in Detroit, but still. Is it the pain of having all that money and guns and living like kings in their country that makes them do this? Its gotta be rough, being multimillionaire pirates, probably with a harem too. Rough life that.

They don't even have an ideal they're fighting for. Its money, all about money.

They are bad people.

nevermind too they are interfering with food aid shipments that could feed starving somalis who aren't multimillionaire pirates with harems.

Wareagle, in order to feel that way, one would first have to view the deceased as human beings. I don't. I look at them as animals wh have taken a human form. By their actions, they not only place their captors at risk of death, they also place the innocent starving children of their own country at risk of death as well.

Call me jaded. In the course of my life, I have encountered far too many people who have no redeeming social value whatsoever - people who exist for the sole purpose of victimizing others. They act like animals - they ARE animals - sociopaths - but they are not human by my definition. They are like a cancer on society and should be removed with no more remorse than a surgeon should have when removing a tumor.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by wareagle69

you say they are not good people because you have the luxory of sitting over here on this side, they beleive in what they are fighting for as they ahve fought their whole lives to defend, if you have been born there how would you feel? as for the pirates desperate times call for desperate measures, heck look at our onw country when times get tough.

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You were in Somalia and you are still defending this bs? WTF is wrong with you?
I think you have survivor's guilt.

I'm glad they were killed.

You can cast accusations at me such as "You've never been there", but you don't know that do you? Every single person that has ever taken a life deals with it differently. The fact remains that due to a trio of our elite soldiers one of our citizens has been returned safely to his family, and three criminal militants who enacted an assault on our nation and our people have been dealt with according to their own standards. I'm proud of our boys. And like myself, I don't think they'll lose a bit of sleep over it.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Chris

If you could go back in time and kill Adolf Hitler when he was 12 years old would you? This is a typical moral question often tossed out. I tell you what, I would. I imagine Ken would as well.

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Without a doubt. And, with full knowledge of what I had just done, I'd sit down to a fine meal, joke with my family and friends, and go to bed and sleep soundly for the entire night.

And just in case you're wondering, I do value life and do sympathize with the less fortunate. Like many of you, I've nursed injured birds and animals back to health, handed a bag of groceries to some of the guys holding the "Hungry, will work for food" signs, and volunteered in a number of charitable efforts with my friends.

Pirates? I wouldn't **** on them if they were on fire.

When I grow up I want to be a millionaire pirate with a harem. I'd be a nice pirate, though. I'd play Pirates of the Caribbean all day long on the TV and walk around saying, "Arrrrr!" a lot. Oh, and a parrot. I'd have to have a parrot. Parrots are cool.

Yeah, me and Rick are gonna be bulletproof (as in why bother shooting those two #$###!!'s?) but seriously, I can see WE's and Remy's point and agree with it. I doubt that the professionals who did the job take any particular pleasure in, and I'd also add that I'm sure they take the pirates and their capabilities a lot more seriously than anyone posting here does.

Well, I do have a bit of perspective on this, A tour in Vietnam ,Mayaguez Rescue team member, Grenada, Somalia, First Gulf War, and two tours in the current sandbox tussle. Never enjoyed any of it. Several good friends did not come back. I do have some bad dreams, but have absolutely no regrets. These "pirates" took a course of action that included visiting violence and mayhem on unarmed mariners, and got their just deserts. Will this stop the problem? Probably not, but there are now 3 fewer players on the field. Any difficulties "dealing" with this are best born by professional military folks, and not non combatant civilians.

Yes, I think those Seals were Awesome, & what WE has posted makes it seem even more so for me. Look what they're going to have to live with just to save the life of one American!

I also think France is awesome, they're also not taking any doo-doo from these guys.

And furthermore; YES, the pirates are the bad guys, who cares how many of them are millionaires? Who cares if the pirate trying to take you hostage, or beating the crap out of you, or killing your co-workers & friends is well-heeled or not?

We're the GOOD GUYS! Why? Because I say so! Good & bad are relative terms fixed in the "eye of the beholder". I don't think that if it was my family in danger & I'm the guy with my finger on the trigger I'm going to even think about how much sleep I might lose over it; that's what sedatives & counseling are for! Go after me & mine...You're the BAD GUYS &, if I got anything to say about it, you're dead! End of story!:smash:

Great shooting Seals! Viva La France! Yo Pirates....K.M.A.!:sneaky2:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090418/...acy_captain_42

The captain calls them superheroes. Not quite awesome, but close enough for me to claim agreement ;)

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