big brother is flying high in your sky

@mountain1 - I'm glad that you are happy living in Montana. It's a beautiful state - been there a time or two. Your independent living style is one that you choose, and I'm glad that you are happy with it. You say in your bio that you live off grid 5 to 6 months out of the year. I'd have to assume that the rest of the time you live?????? You can knock off your condesending remarks about others on this forum though. It has become boorish and tiresome. I don't think any of us need a lecture by you on freedom or liberty. I know darn well that I don't!

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Originally Posted by Rick

He does that from time to time. That's why 2D likes him so much.

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It kinda tickles, when I think! LOL

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Originally Posted by crashdive123

condensing remarks

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Those are kinda' like drips, right?

Mountain1

"MONTANA; WHERE THE MEN ARE MEN AND THE SHEEP ARE SCARED"

Do you realize what you are saying?

If that is what you like then well.......... it is best to keep that to yourself. No wonder he doesn't want arial surveillance over his property.

I'm sure thats illegal even in Montana.

By the way ever wear a Kilt?

Keep in mind that I'm just being an a$$ and have nothing better to do at the moment then polk fun at a Mountain.

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Originally Posted by mountain1

they have no right to do that either. if someone wants to grow weed it's none of their da&m buisness.

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With your permission Those are quotes that I will keep. (above) and :"MONTANA; WHERE THE MEN ARE MEN AND THE SHEEP ARE SCARED "

Might as well look up at a jet contrail and shake your fist, screaming that it is trespassing on your property.

I believe that we do have a right to privacy, but the airspace above your property does not belong to you. Making such a claim is the same as trying to claim that you own the moon.

A helicopter or drone flying around taking video of my property is going to have a very boring afternoon unless they really like cattle.

A reminder may be in order. This is not a stereotypical "Survival Forum". Most folks are here to learn and share. Not many get involved in unsubstantiated "Conspiracy" or unmarked black helicopter theories. Please provide as much background in the future with your posts, that is what gets you credibility.

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Originally Posted by r0ckhamm3r

Might as well look up at a jet contrail and shake your fist, screaming that it is trespassing on your property.

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Excellent idea! Score one for you!

Or invest in a lot of camo netting.

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Originally Posted by crashdive123

@mountain1 - I'm glad that you are happy living in Montana. It's a beautiful state - been there a time or two. Your independent living style is one that you choose, and I'm glad that you are happy with it. You say in your bio that you live off grid 5 to 6 months out of the year. I'd have to assume that the rest of the time you live?????? You can knock off your condesending remarks about others on this forum though. It has become boorish and tiresome. I don't think any of us need a lecture by you on freedom or liberty. I know darn well that I don't!

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+1 thanks crash wanted to say something but you said it much better.

The only Problem I would have with this is in regards to the Posse Commitatus act of 1878. I have a problem with using military Equipment or Personnel in Law enforcement roles. In regards to catching Illegal pot growers I have seen Military personnel using military equipment in finding and removing these plants and even one case watching the Prisoners while LEO's walked away. So in these type cases then I have a problem.... when LEO's Break the law to enforce the law(Oxymoron I know) No different than illegal wiretaps, or Coerced confessions.

BTW I have a source.......
http://www.dojgov.net/posse_comitatus_act.htm

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SEC. 15. From and after the passage of this act it shall not be lawful to employ any part of the Army of the United States, as a posse comitatus, or otherwise, for the purpose of executing the laws, except in such cases and under such circumstances as such employment of said force may be expressly authorized by the Constitution or by act of Congress; and no money appropriated by this act shall be used to pay any of the expenses incurred in the employment of any troops in violation of this section And any person willfully violating the provisions of this section shall be deemed guilty of a misdemeanor and on conviction thereof shall be punished by fine not exceeding ten thousand dollars or imprisonment not exceeding two years or by both such fine and imprisonment.

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Yet the money confiscated still goes to the LE agencies in these cases......


Sorry but for some reason the link provided in the OP keeps popping up, then disappearing and reappearing Like it doesn't want to load or something........Well 20 minutes later it finally loaded.

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For now, the use of drones for high-risk operations is exceedingly rare. The Federal Aviation Administration - which controls the national airspace - requires the few police departments with drones to seek emergency authorization if they want to deploy one in an actual operation. Because of concerns about safety, it only occasionally grants permission........I am curious if this was permission granted.
........Such technology could allow police to record the activities of the public below with high-resolution, infrared and thermal-imaging cameras.This would go past what is considered "In Plain View" And would be an illegal search, IMO

One manufacturer already advertises one of its small systems as ideal for "urban monitoring." The military, often a first user of technologies that migrate to civilian life, is about to deploy a system in Afghanistan that will be able to scan an area the size of a small town. And the most sophisticated robotics use artificial intelligence to seek out and record certain kinds of suspicious activity.This also concerns me as it might not be covered in a warrant, granted in a particular case. This would border on Illegal searches.

But when drones come to perch in numbers over American communities, they will drive fresh debates about the boundaries of privacy. The sheer power of some of the cameras that can be mounted on them is likely to bring fresh search-and-seizure cases before the courts, and concern about the technology's potential misuse could unsettle the public.

"Drones raise the prospect of much more pervasive surveillance," said Jay Stanley, a senior policy analyst with the American Civil Liberties Union's Speech, Privacy and Technology Project. "We are not against them, absolutely. They can be a valuable tool in certain kinds of operations. But what we don't want to see is their pervasive use to watch over the American people."Again concern is raised IF the technology mentioned above IS used From take-off to landing then Many homes would be searched illegally.

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Now I Just know someone is thinking "Well if you aren't breaking the law, Why worry?" To those that think /believe that.... How would you feel if the LEO's were allowed to pick your locks walk in, and search your house without a warrant ANYTIME they wanted? This technology borders on just that. I'm sure to a sharp enough analyst, your Gun safe would give off a different heat signature than say.... your refrigerator. However in this case they don't even have to come inside your house OR ask your permission to look. I also see sharp Lawyers getting off some really crooked crooks off on technicalities caused by this technology. Now to all the law abiding citizens THAT should give you concern.

DISCLAIMER: I am not a lawyer. Just an average citizen TRYING To understand these laws. What SEEMS to be a violation of laws Might not be a violation. However to an average citizen like myself they sure SEEM to be.

Ok, so I didn't read this whole thread, nor do I want to, but I would like to say that people, country people, who run homesteads and are self-sufficiant don't have TIME or the CARE to worry about "big brother" and all this government bull.

I never heard my husband, brothers or father(I grew up on a dairy farm also) talk about these things, or even politics. It was all chores, and repairs, and chores, and a lot of nodding and swearing. The conversation in families are always about how you can tell a man by how straigh he plows, how tall and neat his woodpile, how sharp he keeps his axe, how clean his barn, if his wheels squeek on the tractor...how his corn grows, how white the fences are... Worries about government? bah.

People who truly "live off the grid" and homestead are usually far to simple of people to be bothered. It seems a very trendy thing, to live off the grid, but it's hard, hard work. No time to think big thoughts.

Moondancer, I'm a city kid but grew up with the same values as you.
When you work hard for a living, you don't have time for counterproductive distractions.

The trick is to know when to pay attention.

[QUOTE=themoondancer811;275560]Ok, so I didn't read this whole thread, nor do I want to, but I would like to say that people, country people, who run homesteads and are self-sufficiant don't have TIME or the CARE to worry about "big brother" and all this government bull.

I never heard my husband, brothers or father(I grew up on a dairy farm also) talk about these things, or even politics. It was all chores, and repairs, and chores, and a lot of nodding and swearing. The conversation in families are always about how you can tell a man by how straigh he plows, how tall and neat his woodpile, how sharp he keeps his axe, how clean his barn, if his wheels squeek on the tractor...how his corn grows, how white the fences are... Worries about government? bah.

People who truly "live off the grid" and homestead are usually far to simple of people to be bothered. It seems a very trendy thing, to live off the grid, but it's hard, hard work. No time to think big thoughts.[/QUOTE]

Whoa! No time to think big thoughts? For the last seven years we've been off-grid and provide most of our food through gardening, foraging, hunting and fishing and we actually have lots of free time in the winter and even when working a person's mind can be delving with other matters. The founders of this nation worked very hard and proved themselves quite adept at "thinking big thoughts" and they surely were not "simple" people. The largest detriment to thinking today is the television and computer games. I'd be willing to bet that most of those living off-grid use their time for other things than rotting their brains in front of a boob tube.

Yikes...mountain man, put on the breaks. For starters, I meant no insult when calling my OWN family "simple people." They are brilliant in every regard, but no interest in the big modern day politics/ government etc.

You are right, our forefathers did indeed create our country by thinking, "big thoughts." I agree, but from the people I know in my family (my father is now 87) were old yankees, farmers and simple folk. So from my specific life, this is how I have experienced it. Of course, other people may have different experiences. I have speant 52 years farming, I guess we just choose to live in our own lives.

As for TV and video games, I couldn't name one.

Edit- What exactly do you feel is WRONG with being a "simple" person? I am taken quite a back that you are so insulted by the phrase?

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Originally Posted by crashdive123

@mountain1 - I'm glad that you are happy living in Montana. It's a beautiful state - been there a time or two. Your independent living style is one that you choose, and I'm glad that you are happy with it. You say in your bio that you live off grid 5 to 6 months out of the year. I'd have to assume that the rest of the time you live?????? You can knock off your condesending remarks about others on this forum though. It has become boorish and tiresome. I don't think any of us need a lecture by you on freedom or liberty. I know darn well that I don't!

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no. i say in my bio that i snowmobile to my house 5-6 months a year. 4wd the rest.
and you actually can't see my cabin from space on google maps. the roof and siding on all structures on the property are forest green and blend in with the surrounding forest canopy. i'm fully aware that that is old tech.

Pocomoonskyeyes: Excellent points you made there. I couldn't have stated it better myself.

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Originally Posted by gryffynklm

Mountain1

"MONTANA; WHERE THE MEN ARE MEN AND THE SHEEP ARE SCARED"

Do you realize what you are saying?

If that is what you like then well.......... it is best to keep that to yourself. No wonder he doesn't want arial surveillance over his property.

I'm sure thats illegal even in Montana.

By the way ever wear a Kilt?

Keep in mind that I'm just being an a$$ and have nothing better to do at the moment then polk fun at a Mountain.

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now that is funny.
it's a 'famous' saying from a 'famous' strip club here in MT.
i could send you a tee shirt. just picture a guy/sheep/stump. it is hilarious. and in some cases supposedly true. guys get lonely on the range. so the sayin' goes...

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Originally Posted by mountain1

no. i say in my bio that i snowmobile to my house 5-6 months a year. 4wd the rest.
and you actually can't see my cabin from space on google maps. the roof and siding on all structures on the property are forest green and blend in with the surrounding forest canopy. i'm fully aware that that is old tech.

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Great. I'm happy for you. High tech, low tech - it's your choice. That wasn't the real point of my comment though.....the next three sentences of it were.

Not Necessarily so..... One Very famous politician was met by a farmer who changed his mind and methods in Washington....Even helped him get re-elected.....

http://hushmoney.org/Davy_Crockett_Farmer_Bunce.htm

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Originally Posted by Pal334

With your permission Those are quotes that I will keep. (above) and :"MONTANA; WHERE THE MEN ARE MEN AND THE SHEEP ARE SCARED "

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it's not my quote. it's just an old montana saying.

It's a Montana saying, a Wyoming saying, a Texas saying, a Scottish saying (my guess the origins), an Australian saying, a New Zealand saying, an Army saying, an Air Force saying, a Marine Corps saying.....and on and on (Notice that it is not a Navy saying):innocent:

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Originally Posted by crashdive123

It's a Montana saying, a Wyoming saying, a Texas saying, a Scottish saying (my guess the origins), an Australian saying, a New Zealand saying, an Army saying, an Air Force saying, a Marine Corps saying.....and on and on (Notice that it is not a Navy saying):innocent:

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Navy saying is something about separating the men from the boys with a crowbar....I dont really remember.

[QUOTE=mosquitomountainman;275571]

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Originally Posted by themoondancer811

Ok, so I didn't read this whole thread, nor do I want to, but I would like to say that people, country people, who run homesteads and are self-sufficiant don't have TIME or the CARE to worry about "big brother" and all this government bull.

I never heard my husband, brothers or father(I grew up on a dairy farm also) talk about these things, or even politics. It was all chores, and repairs, and chores, and a lot of nodding and swearing. The conversation in families are always about how you can tell a man by how straigh he plows, how tall and neat his woodpile, how sharp he keeps his axe, how clean his barn, if his wheels squeek on the tractor...how his corn grows, how white the fences are... Worries about government? bah.

People who truly "live off the grid" and homestead are usually far to simple of people to be bothered. It seems a very trendy thing, to live off the grid, but it's hard, hard work. No time to think big thoughts.[/QUOTE]

Whoa! No time to think big thoughts? For the last seven years we've been off-grid and provide most of our food through gardening, foraging, hunting and fishing and we actually have lots of free time in the winter and even when working a person's mind can be delving with other matters. The founders of this nation worked very hard and proved themselves quite adept at "thinking big thoughts" and they surely were not "simple" people. The largest detriment to thinking today is the television and computer games. I'd be willing to bet that most of those living off-grid use their time for other things than rotting their brains in front of a boob tube.

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as usual mmm thanks. their is alot of "down time in winter". i do care about many things and pay attention. it's my nature.

and to moondancer. we live the livestyle, not because it's trendy. because it's who we are.
i know very few people who want go to the outhouse when it's -30. we don't mind:)
nor do i know many people who butcher their own chicken for dinner at 8 deg. we don't mind...
we choose to be primitive because society sucks and we want no part of it...

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Originally Posted by Camp10

Navy saying is something about separating the men from the boys with a crowbar....I dont really remember.

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ROFLMAO!!!!!!! (Sorry Crash)

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Originally Posted by Camp10

Navy saying is something about separating the men from the boys with a crowbar....I dont really remember.

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Navy mascot is a goat. Of course that's an Officer thing. Us enlisted folks were much more refined.

You'll get a kick out of this question and answer....
http://answers.yahoo.com/question/in...8060634AAly6I3

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Originally Posted by Pocomoonskyeyes3

Not Necessarily so..... One Very famous politician was met by a farmer who changed his mind and methods in Washington....Even helped him get re-elected.....

http://hushmoney.org/Davy_Crockett_Farmer_Bunce.htm

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Ok, ok guys, I retrack my statement in that not ALL farmers/homesteaders are like this (I don't think I ever said that anyway) but honestly, if you met the people in my community, and my family in the 60's and 70's, you would find the same as I have said. They just were not interested in those things. They worked hard, they loved their families and went to church. But again, I do not understand why it is insulting to have people in the world who have a simple life, simple people...I mean, that was a great pride in my family and still is today. We can't all be Davy Crockett nor do I wish to be.

Sorry for hyjacking the thread. ;)

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Originally Posted by crashdive123

It's a Montana saying, a Wyoming saying, a Texas saying, a Scottish saying (my guess the origins), an Australian saying, a New Zealand saying, an Army saying, an Air Force saying, a Marine Corps saying.....and on and on (Notice that it is not a Navy saying):innocent:

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yep. fully aware. but apparently some folks aren't.

[QUOTE=mountain1;275595]

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Originally Posted by mosquitomountainman

we don't mind...
we choose to be primitive because society sucks and we want no part of it...

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THAT's my point, not everyone DOES it because "society sucks" They do it because they CAN, because we live in America.

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Originally Posted by themoondancer811

Yikes...mountain man, put on the breaks. For starters, I meant no insult when calling my OWN family "simple people." They are brilliant in every regard, but no interest in the big modern day politics/ government etc.

You are right, our forefathers did indeed create our country by thinking, "big thoughts." I agree, but from the people I know in my family (my father is now 87) were old yankees, farmers and simple folk. So from my specific life, this is how I have experienced it. Of course, other people may have different experiences. I have speant 52 years farming, I guess we just choose to live in our own lives.

As for TV and video games, I couldn't name one.

Edit- What exactly do you feel is WRONG with being a "simple" person? I am taken quite a back that you are so insulted by the phrase?

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"Simple" as in needs and desires is fine. "Simple" as in mental capacity I would have a problem with. I think most of my reaction had to do with the impression I got from your post that a "true homesteader" wouldn't have time to get involved in "outside issues" or have an informed opinion of those things. I believe that's a false assumption.


Congratulations and thanks regarding your livelihood. I had/have relatives in Kansas who farm. I spent most of my summers working at one place or another when growing up. They were some of the best years of my life.

FWIW I took the comments to refer to a simple lifestyle. Not necessarily easy, but simple as in not complicated.

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Originally Posted by crashdive123

Navy mascot is a goat. Of course that's an Officer thing. Us enlisted folks were much more refined.

You'll get a kick out of this question and answer....
http://answers.yahoo.com/question/in...8060634AAly6I3

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"All the good mascots have been taken." That's pretty good.

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Originally Posted by mosquitomountainman

"Simple" as in needs and desires is fine. "Simple" as in mental capacity I would have a problem with. I think most of my reaction had to do with the impression I got from your post that a "true homesteader" wouldn't have time to get involved in "outside issues" or have an informed opinion of those things. I believe that's a false assumption.


Congratulations and thanks regarding your livelihood. I had/have relatives in Kansas who farm. I spent most of my summers working at one place or another when growing up. They were some of the best years of my life.

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I agree, I am sorry if it did come out sounding like that, as it certainly was not meant to. Sometimes things from the brain do not quite type out the same. :) "Simple minded" and "simple folk" are two very different things. My father for one, left school at 16, fought in the navy in WW2, can't read much of anything but everyone here would very much love his company! :) He's a wonderful man. So I guess there is a strange line in determining exactly what "simple" should be regarded as.

[QUOTE=themoondancer811;275601]

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Originally Posted by mountain1

THAT's my point, not everyone DOES it because "society sucks" They do it because they CAN, because we live in America.

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JFYI - the quote "we don't mind ... we choose to be primitive because society sucks and we want no part of it..." is not mine.

I have different reasons for living the way we live.

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Originally Posted by crashdive123

FWIW I took the comments to refer to a simple lifestyle. Not necessarily easy, but simple as in not complicated.

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live your live free, without worry. you've only got one and i'll be dam8ed if i live it for the 'man' or anyone else.
that is the point of it all.
most as a society in general have become a slave to the daily grind. so they will let the "ruling" class control them without question. it's all by design. and it seems to be working just as planned.

pocos post is right own.

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Originally Posted by mountain1

live your live free, without worry. you've only got one and i'll be dam8ed if i live it for the 'man' or anyone else.
that is the point of it all.
most as a society in general have become a slave to the daily grind. so they will let the "ruling" class control them without question. it's all by design. and it seems to be working just as planned.

pocos post is right own.

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1. My post was not to you, it was to Mosquittomountainman, so no need to take offense.
2. I don't know why you have some sort of chip on your shoulder, but "the man" or "the ruling" class ain't hanging around this forum so you can knock of the histrionics.
3. While I'm sure that there are a few that might agree with you, as Pal334 indicated, this is not one of those conspiracy based survivalist forums. Lord knows there are enough of them out there already.

[QUOTE=mosquitomountainman;275614]

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Originally Posted by themoondancer811

JFYI - the quote "we don't mind ... we choose to be primitive because society sucks and we want no part of it..." is not mine.

I have different reasons for living the way we live.

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yeah i saw that.
that is bye no means the only reason we live as we do. there are many;
no one around for miles, we are basically camping everyday(except we have a cabin), SILENCE, just the general freedom do do what ever the he11 we want when we want. we have no bills except the mortgage. to all the uninitiated; just imagine a life without a power,water,sewage,trash bill, etc., the list goes on and on with the bills we do not have that most folks choose to have. we are independent and free of that. that within it's self helps give us the freedom we enjoy.
we are free from those bonds of society that most people have made themselves slaves to.
it is a choice we have made many years ago and will keep it at al cost...

Keep up with your snide remarks and you'll be free to go elsewhere.

You're sipping the cookin' sherry again aren't you?