living in az i tuned into him quick, i lived in flaggstaff and got a good laugh when he talks about taking the cop car i lived right on that corner, to read him now makes me homesick..
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living in az i tuned into him quick, i lived in flaggstaff and got a good laugh when he talks about taking the cop car i lived right on that corner, to read him now makes me homesick..
some of Abbey's books turned to be downright prophetic huh? wrote about people refusing to report for conscription back in the '50's. How much of that was going on back then?
Stuff he wrote about industrial damage to the environment he wrote in the '70's and look at our world today...:mad:
George, I was just wondering about your plans. You have figured out your budget that you seem comfortable with. What are your plans for your water system? If your going to have a well dug, you need to talk to the local well diggers to see how far down they'll need to dig 300', 600'? Most well diggers I've met throughout the Northeast and Midwest charge about $10 - $12 a foot plus all the fees, another $500 - $600. A water/pumping system will run about $3k, Talking to them about different areas your interested in, might save you a few thousand dollars to have the well dug and a water system put in. Remember we all keep getting older, and the farming, wood cutting, animal care, and the repairs that always come along, how will you deal with your water needs as time goes on? If your not doing a well, a good idea would be, being downhill from a fast running mountain stream, making use of gravity even for irrigating your crops.
i think i know where gw line of thinking lies he and i share the same hero in a man called richard proeneke www.aloneinthewilderness.com the man was 52 when he went to the bush and came out 30 some yrs later at the age of 86 cuz the winters was just to cold a man among boys he was..
A good site for rural and wilderness properties is, Landandfarm.com. They have land for sale from all over the world. Brazil looks interesting at $20. an acre. Always wondered what legalities and rights one would have owing property in a country they are not a citizen of.
No Rick it wouldn't. When you live alone, alone to the point where you don't see other humans for months on end, you have to take more precautions and be diligent about being careful when using an ax, or saw, or hammer, or any other tool. When I was building my cabin, I had to be careful not to pull a muscle, or over exert myself in the process. Once you get accustomed to being ever diligent and careful, it become an everyday part of life. You can never take anything for granted. If you do, you most certainly will die out there! :eek:Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick
Dick Proenneke too, took many years prior to his final decision to live out there (in Alaska) scouting around the area to find the right spot to live. He had been going there on leisure trips since the forties. He finally decided to build his cabin in in the spring of '67. He cut the timber in the summer of '67 and returned to build his cabin and live there full time in '68 (51 years old), and continued to live there until the late summer of '98. During his thirty years at Twin Lakes he did travel down to the lower 48 from time-to-time to visit family and help his ailing dad in Iowa.Quote:
Originally Posted by wareagle69
When I met him in '94 he stated that he was contemplating moving down with his brother in CA because the winters were getting tough then. He was 76 at that time. But he stuck it out until he was 81. He was a tough old bird, and didn't pull any punches! He said that he admired my tenacity and vigor of wanting to live even further back in the remoteness than he did. He told me that "you probably won't ever see anyboy traveling that far off the path?!" He would see people in the summer traveling down the river in front of his cabin and hunters would pass by his cabin on caribou and bear hunts, and he even had people like John Denver fly in to talk to him, on occasion, just to find out what it was like to live in such a remote area and to live such a remote lifestyle. ;)
Watch the series on Richard Proenneke called "Alone in the Wilderness" it describes the perfect way to do live off the grid.
Go to this link: http://www.dickproenneke.com/
No, no, no, no, no. You guys live way too far off the grid for me. Unless, of course, there's a Starbucks, Home Depot, Sears, Cabella's, Big Truck Stuff, ER with a frequent visitor's plan, Cable TV, Throw it in the microwave, cabin nearby.....with Jacuzzi and an oversize Lazy Boy, of course.
What no stereo, surround sound, wine cellar ????Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick
Can't hear sh*t. Did way too much of that in the '60s. What? You heard me. So no need for that. Don't drink wine, nitrates give me a headache. Wa, wa, wa, I know. Cryin' a river.
Calling 9-waaa-waaa again for Rick!:rolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick
yo native dude
how come dick walked hunched over?
I did a thread on Richard Proenneke, he was truely amazing. Left the site link there too. He came down in 1999 at the age of 82, and your saying you were one of the handful of people he actually talked too. That is pretty impressive.
I live on 40acres and to me it is the bare minimum of land to live on, and I'm not even trying to live off the land. I hope to own a square mile someday.
40acres is about 1/4mile x 1/4mile
hey thanks for the advice guys. sorry i haven't been able to respond to your questions i've been real busy lately.
graywolf- the thought of digging a well hadn't really crossed my mind but i wish i would of thought about this earlier. how does a well in Alaska work wouldn't it just freeze up? i dunno' what i can do about this since digging a well is going to be pricey it sounds like. are there any reliable ways to catch water?
i know what you mean about being diligent about being careful with tools or anything else you do. i used to work a bunch of ****ty construction jobs without any insurance and i learned how to work as safely and diligently as possible. if i ever got hurt or injured i would have been in a heap of trouble. tons of medical bills on top of being out of work is a horrible combination and i've seen it happen to a lot of guys in the business.Quote:
When you live alone, alone to the point where you don't see other humans for months on end, you have to take more precautions and be diligent about being careful when using an ax, or saw, or hammer, or any other tool. When I was building my cabin, I had to be careful not to pull a muscle, or over exert myself in the process. Once you get accustomed to being ever diligent and careful, it become an everyday part of life. You can never take anything for granted. If you do, you most certainly will die out there!
you've got to be patient and aware of what you're doing at all times while making sure no freak accidents happen.
Yes Beo, I did meet and talk with Dick Proenneke.Quote:
Originally Posted by Beowulf65
There are a lot of items posted that claim that Dick lived in AK for "over 30 years". He, in fact, lived in his cabin from 1968 until 1998. That equals 30 years. He was 51 years old the spring he went back to AK, built his cabin and lived in it full time, and he was 81 when he left there (end of summer '98), contrary to what is posted on Wikipedia. That posting is wrong! And Dick's leaving is recorded by the National Park Service at Twin Lakes, when Dick officially turned over the care of his homestead to the park service.
Dick did fly back to twin lakes in the summer of '99 to attend a ceremony that honored him for his care and commitment to the land and wildlife at Twin Lakes. He was presented with a "life time achievement" award by the Governor of AK and National Park Service, but Dick did not live there that summer, he flew out the same day.
I have seen many writings that depict different dates that he moved back to the lower 48, but Glen Alsworth, Babe Alsworth's grandson, (Babe piloted for Dick), was there when Dick flew all of the belongings he was taking with him out of twin lakes. It happened in early Sept. of 1998.
I ran across this site with several books on wilderness log cabins. Thought it might of interest to some of you:
http://www.wildernessdrum.com/html/shelter_books.html
hey there George, we moved out into the bush 3 years ago. I just posted a message about ways of getting land under "Hi from the North" in Introductions. We're in Canada, so I don't know about the rules in Alaska. In Canada, they throw wilderness areas at mining, oil and gas companies to destroy, but don't sell land to "normal" people for just living there. I'd suggest to you to find out under what circumstances they do sell land in Alaska. You may be more successful finding something that way - getting a trapline, staking a mining claim, staking land for a business venture...just make yourself fit to the rules and away you go. With the metal prices boom right now, you may end up with mineral exploration in your backyard. They're drilling 4km south of our place. Not much safety from industry anywhere these days...but what goes boom inevitably goes bust again and a lot of the mineral exploration is just a show for making money, actual mines happen a lot less often and then you can always fight it.
The other thing is, when you're looking for land, figure in the transportation costs of getting supplies in. It's hard to make money in the bush, you'll still need $3000 or more/year, and transportation by plane can eat up your budget really fast.
Good luck and I'd be really interested in hearing how things are going. If there's any questions I can answer, I'd be happy to!
my biggest advice is to research as manystyles of cabin building as you can in advance if you are going to do the building, or at least the design and planning yourself, as the property you find and the situation will dictate how you can build and what resources are at hand, transportation, etc. do you realy want to have to learn to do it the only way available and at the last min?
will you be doing all the work yourself?
when i lived in ak we had a rainwater cistern. this lasted untill one of the locals contaminated it with turtle wax, whereafter we where thankful for the road access and the 500gal tank we had. we would otherwise have been in a bad situation.
wells are more reliable but as entioned before are expensive and must be properly surveyed for and positioned. the best location [or any suitable one for that matter] will need to be found before you purchase and a testing of the ground water is advisable if there is any industry in the area. this includes mining, particularly older mines, as they can contaminate groudwater with heavy metals for years. is there a resivoir up watershed, breeding cholera or giardia right uphill from you? in most remote areas the latter is not usualy a probleml, but you might want to have the water tested anyway, and in many places is required by law.
if you 'step out' to a lifestyle like this, i wish you all the luck and happiness it can bring to those with true grit and such a desire, i can't even talk my lady into moving back to juneau with me because it snows and there isn't a stable enough job base :(
just take the advice in this thread about learning what to expect and being ready. i've read it quoted that 90% [ or some similar] of people who move to the state of alaska don't stay a year and 98% don't stay two. that includes those who move to settled areas with roads and jobs. i suspect most of this is probably poor preperation, in one way or another.
good advice wildwoman and canid
i agree with what you said about ppl leaving alaska i think they get in over their heads and it is not the romantic notion that the had planned it turns out to be work. i don't know how many woman i dated that wanted the bush, log cabin lifestyle but i could tell by their actions that they would not be happy, until i met mrs wareagle, she lives more hardcore than i do..
You are right on the money WE!!Quote:
Originally Posted by wareagle69
There are a lot of areas with "abandoned" cabins (homesteads) in AK. Abandoned mostly by people of the 60's and 70's whom wanted to "commune" with Mother Nature (so they thought), but found that Mother Nature is an unforgiving task master and living the "natural" lifestyle was harder than they thought.
It does take work to live an OTG/bush lifestyle, but IMHO, it is easier to live the "bush" lifestyle than the "city" lifestyle. In the cities/suburbs there are too many rules about what you can and can't do with, in and around your own house. IT IS YOUR HOUSE, yet you can only do what the city, county, or state tells you you can do with YOUR HOUSE!
In a lot of cities you can't dig a well for water, ON YOUR PROPERTY, if you want -- you must use the city supplied water (UGH!), nor can you let your grass grow as tall a you want! If you try to, the city will come and cut it and bill you for it! YOU must maintain the cities sidewalks that are adjacent to YOUR property. And you can't build or put up anything on your property without a permission and a permit. . .again, from the city! . . .These are just a few examples of the constraints of urban/suburban dwellers.
Where I live, I built my cabin & food cache how I wanted, the size I wanted, facing the way I wanted. I have a garden and plant it as big or small, as I want. I can do anything I want to my cabin, inside and out, and I have no nosy neighbors poking there snooty, snooping noses into my business.
Also, I don't have any crime in my neighborhood! :D
So, which lifestyle is harder? For the lazy person, the city is easier. For the person that doesn't mind putting in a little "elbow grease" to live the way "they choose" free from all the constraints of others, an OTG/bush lifestyle is the preferred choice!
Yeah, I agree with you guys, WE and ND...I think one big mistake people sometimes do is moving from a "normal" city lifestyle (muli room house, power, telephone, running water, fire and ambulance service etc etc) to something as extreme as wintering in a teepee in the far North, or moving to a fly-in location and then having to adjust not only to living without "civilized" services but also to a lifestyle that involves incredibly more physical work, prudence and loneliness. Maybe that's why so many peole in the 60s and 70s didn't last...
I think a good way of easing into it and, especially, learning lots of the skills is moving first to the outskirts of a village in the general area where one would eventually like to have a remote home. Often there are simple cabins without power, phone and water for rent, so that's a good way of finding out what it's like in the winter, living like that. Bit easier to rectify mistakes when you can drive into town for help.
I knew Dick when I homesteaded over on Lake Clark, What a wonderful human. Jay Hammond, the Governor ("Bushrat") was a fair piece down the lake. Good time, good place, good people.Quote:
Originally Posted by wareagle69
George, I hope I don't end up regretting I did this, but contact: hopeak.com and ask about Safari Lake.Quote:
Originally Posted by george hayduke
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