Hey put that on necklace :D jk I know bad joke.
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Hey put that on necklace :D jk I know bad joke.
FVR probably carries his "Wilderness 1st aid" kit in a bottle...of Wild Turkey! :D I think that everybody will be a bit different; a Dr., for example might carry syringes and different injectable medicines. I have a nice-sized Atwater-Carey 1st aid kit, a few small store-bought ones, a nice, larger, store-bought one, and a big home-made job for those Auto-camping trips. Everything is relative, (Groucho vioice) "and if you got a relative who's a Doctor along with you that's even better!":rolleyes:
Rick,for you ,he'll use the forceps:eek:Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick
See? There are other people in this world that think like me. Scary!
Do you get a real live donkey to carry it or do the 4 of you just drag it along?
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You don't use a donkey. Get yourself a pack dog.
and no nurse get a female doctor.
In addition to what's already listed, I add:
1 - 15 gr. CELOX Hemostatic Agent
1 Emergency Bandage - Military 6" Version (can be used 1 handed)
after Celox and a gauze pad is applied.
Or as a tourniquet (be careful)
Snake Bite Kit
Iodine Sticks
pack of 2 Aspirins (asprin, because it can be used as a blood thinner for CA)
Has anyone ever used a snake bite kit? I've researched these things quite a bit and the best I can find is a lot of conflicting information about how beneficial they are. I would really like to hear from anyone that had to use one and/or any herpetologists that might be on here.
About the only consensus I can find is a snake bite should never be cut to try and remove the venom. That only adds a bleeding wound to a snake bite.
Here are my thoughts as naive and uneducated as they might be.
1. To me, trying to pull the venom out using a negative pressure device is like trying to pull out the medicine from a shot you just received. That doesn't seem to make sense although I'll be the first to admit I may be completely wrong.
2. Most North American snakes are not poisonous so you might do more harm than good.
3. If you know the snake is poisonous then you're going to have to seek medical assistance so why waste time fooling around with trying to suck out the venom when you could be moving toward a hospital by whatever means.
My snake bite kit is over 25 years old, and is the best made one I've ever seen. It's a thumb size very thick piece of rubber that opens in half. There is a small surgical scalpel inside, which you should never use! You should only use one of the rubber half's to make a strong suction. this one is lite and strong enough that it will stay in place, even when walking. You can also use your belt or paracord to make a type of bandage (a few inches above the bite). It should not cut off blood flow from a vein or artery. Make the bandage tight yet loose enough that your finger can get under it. This will only (hopefully) slow down the toxin until you get help.
According to the American Red Cross, these steps should be taken:
* Wash the bite with soap and water.
* Immobilize the bitten area and keep it lower than the heart.
* Get medical help.
"The main thing is to get to a hospital and don't delay," says Hardy. "Most bites don't occur in real isolated situations, so it is feasible to get prompt [medical care]." He describes cases in Arizona where people have caught rattlesnakes for sport and gotten bitten. "They waited until they couldn't stand the pain anymore and finally went to the hospital after the venom had been in there a few hours. But by then, they'd lost an opportunity for [effective treatment]," which increased the odds of long-term complications. Some medical professionals, along with the American Red Cross, cautiously recommend two other measures:
* If a victim is unable to reach medical care within 30 minutes, a bandage, wrapped two to four inches above the bite, may help slow venom. The bandage should not cut off blood flow from a vein or artery. A good rule of thumb is to make the band loose enough that a finger can slip under it.
* A suction device may be placed over the bite to help draw venom out of the wound without making cuts. Suction instruments often are included in commercial snakebite kits.
How NOT to Treat a Snakebite
Though US medical professionals may not agree on every aspect of what to do for snakebite first aid, they are nearly unanimous in their views of what not to do. Among their recommendations:
* No ice or any other type of cooling on the bite. Research has shown this to be potentially harmful.
* No tourniquets. This cuts blood flow completely and may result in loss of the affected limb.
* No incisions in the wound. Such measures have not been proven useful and may cause further injury.
And this from a practicing herpetologist:
http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaver...2437/bite.html
excerpt from the site:
"What should you do if you are bitten? Forget everything you've ever heard about cutting and sucking out the venom. Forget about using electric shocks from a stun gun, or packing the bitten limb in ice. Forget about tourniquets or constriction bands. None of these "treatments" work, and they all do more harm than good. The only first aid measure that can be effective is the use of a "Sawyer extractor", a device that sucks envenomed fluids out through the fang punctures themselves. The Sawyer extractor, however, is only effective if used within seconds of the bite. After that, the venoms have already traveled too far into the body's tissues to be removed.
There is a well-respected saying among venomous snake keepers----"The best equipment for treating a venomous snake bite is a set of car keys"."
Rick, what I quoted was from the FDA and the American Red Cross:
http://www.fda.gov/fdac/features/995_snakes.html
I'm not doubting you at all. I've seen a lot of the information that is posted. As I said, I've researched this a lot. I just posted this piece from a practicing herpetologist as an example of how confusing it can be. I don't know what the right thing to do is and this could be a serious issue if someone were actually bitten. I happened to run across the web site of the American Society of Ichthyologists and Herpetologists so I emailed them the question of what they do when one of them gets bitten. We'll see if they bother to respond and what they recommend if they do.
It's good that you carry the kit. Better to use it and not need it than the other way around. It looks like the Sawyer Extractor is on the top of folks lists of the best devices and then only if used quickly.
EDIT: And just when you thought it couldn't get any foggier,
http://lomalindahealth.org/services/...es-strike.html
This guy is the leading snake bite ER doc in the nation. He's on call for Pres. Bush should he get bitten on his ranch in Texas according to this article:
http://www.ncbuy.com/news/2004-03-23/1009204.html
You'll recognize him as the doctor in "Venom ER".
Ok this is all intrestin but im goin to take a step backward here. Medicine Wolf talked about his kit that the Rangers are issued in the Park, but that sounds like alot how much is being prepared and how much until you breaking your back. Certain thngs sould be solved by a expert like a scalpel? What surgery needs to be preformed that you can do that you dont need to activley seek proffessional help? Just askin cause as with what imm gettin from Rick about snake bites is that you should seek medical help not deal with it yourself.
Well, that was the whole point of my post, Proud. The old wisdom said to cut an X on the bite and suck out the poison. Then we were told that making any sort of cut just adds a bleeding injury to a snake bite and does no good. So how good is using a negative atmosphere device? Given the fact that most snakes are non-poisonous and even poisonous snakes dry bite about 50% +/- of the time and you should seek medical attention anyway...my question is do you just remove rings and watches because of swelling and head for the nearest ER or is there some value in trying to suck out the venom. By the way - The American Society of Ichthyologists and Herpetologists haven't responded to my email yet.
is this one sosciety? cause otherwise, i can understand why the fish people haven't responded to the snake question ;)
Thought this deserved a mention again!:cool:Quote:
Originally Posted by mbarnatl
what about snare wire do you bring the whole snare wire or cut it up before setting out ?
I always carry a roll of 24 ga. brass wire but I also have the snares I've used in the past. I also have a couple of Thompson snares I carry. I hope I understood your question.
Not entirely when you bring the roll of wire you wouldn't use the whole thing for one snare. So do you cut it into sections for more than one snare before leaving or carry more than on roll.I only ask about cutting it up because it seems like you could use it for more than one snare because they are about 100 feet in lengh.
You are correct. I don't use the whole roll only enough to build the specific type of snare I want to create. The rolls I carry are 55' so if I'm trying to catch a rabbit in a run or squirrel using a snare pole I just cut off the length of wire I need to build that specific snare. When I'm done I save the snare for reuse (you can use it for many other things as well like lashing). I like soft wire for a snare because it has a tendency to kink closed once the animal puts pressure against it.
Good that is what I was wondering because I need to know what you use to cut the wire seems like a simple knife might not cut the wire.