Hello, every now and then I wonder because I've heard of them and even looked up a few but information from someone who's actually visited would be interesting! Let me know how the experience was.
*off
Hello, every now and then I wonder because I've heard of them and even looked up a few but information from someone who's actually visited would be interesting! Let me know how the experience was.
*off
There is a homeless community in a wooded area near Athens, GA. No water, no toilets, no electricity. A lot of tents and some "shacks" thrown together with whatever materials that could be scrounged.
The differing stages of cleanliness is what surprised me the most. Some had very clean camps while others had stuff strewn about.
A couple years ago, the authorities decided that it was time to roust these folks from their "homes". That decision created a storm of protests from several groups.
The end result was cleaner camps and folks would stop by to drop off food, water and health/sanitary items.
Wow, that sounded bad at first but the end result seems nice. thanks :)
I've heard there's actually two. The one off of the 10 loop I think you're refering to? Another is supposedly across the railroad tracks behind Athens Tech. My old boss told me of them coming on to campus to steal supplies like toilet paper.Quote:
Originally Posted by MrFixIt
Quote:
Originally Posted by 7whitewolf7
I seeing a possible apples and oranges scenario here....But then again maybe not.Quote:
Originally Posted by MrFixIt
Homeless camps and in a much bigger case, refugee camps are a example of what has be done with what ever you can find, and are most likely not a "on purpose" situation, mostly pretty bad.
Where as a "Off Grid Community" brings to mind an organized and controlled version of some ones vision.
So I guess it would be better to narrow down your question?
I'm not big on any kind of organized "Community" where the building are controlled but rules.
You are correct Ranger. The one I was referring to was off the 10 loop. Didn't know about the one behind Athens Tech...Quote:
Originally Posted by RangerXanatos
@ hunter, I see your point. Some of these folks have jobs, just choose to live that way. The others are just surviving.
Camp in Turkey......
Not sure about "grid ties"
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y13...psytifpqtp.jpg
Not sure what the allure is for being, what my folks used to call, a "BUMB".
Now we mask it with some call for ecological purity or carbon footprint reduction, when the real reason for most of these situations is some form of personality disorder that prevents these folks from coping with human relationships to the point that it prevents them getting and holding a job/family/marriage/home.
I have lived "off grid" for decades at a time, but I owned my land, had a job, earned a living for my family, educated my kids and never had to worry about the police driving a bulldozer through my living room.
It all depends on if you consider "off grid" to mean off the utility network, or if you consider "off grid" being a social and economic outcast.
One is not necessarily connected to the other.
mabey we don,t see it so much cause of the size of our nation. but when the housing crises took place
07 to 09 millions were left homeless across the nation i,ve seen in the last number of years plenty of people
living out of their vehicles. many choose to close their eyes to such sadness any never see the reality of where our nation
is today. many would like to believe that because they have a job and place to live that all is good. i tell you it is not.
just Google tent cities in Hawaii it,s really sad.
Most, not all, but most of those that lost their homes did so because they had secured high risk financing like a balloon note. They purchased more home than they could otherwise afford and the banking industry was incredibly lax about risk standards. Once they found themselves upside down on their mortgage or without a job and without a financial cushion, which everyone should have, they either lost their home or walked away from it. 2009 was six years ago. If they are still homeless after six years then they choose to be for whatever reason.
If you want to talk about the reality of where our nation is then consider this....
U.S. Houshold wealth hit its highest level ever in March of this year.
http://www.wsj.com/articles/u-s-hous...mbs-1426176246
Jobless rate is at a 15 year low.
http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/...0NL1JT20150430
If you want a job it's out there. The unemployment rate has steadily dropped since 2010 and is currently at 5.5%. That's low in anyone's book.
http://data.bls.gov/timeseries/LNS14000000
Actually the definition should be "A Camp"....although doesn't seem to fit to well today with Cell phones and WifiQuote:
Originally Posted by 7whitewolf7
To narrow it down people who choose to cut themselves off, with any kind of rule set I guess.
Thanks for the links Rick. 2008 was right aroung when the Bush cuts came into being, correct? That graph took an upscale around there!
(does this count as 'remotely political? XD )
2007 started the Great Recession. Unemployment began rising in 2007.
Rick, I beg to differ. Those unemployment rates are based on those actually collecting unemployment benefits. Many people have exceeded the benefits time period or were not eligible for benefits in the first place and such persons are not counted in the ranks of the "unemployment rate". The actual unemployment rate is more than likely twice what is reported, close to around 10-11 percent. Also,many of those that did gain employment took a major pay loss. All in all, not a pretty picture.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick
There's an Amish community about 5 miles from my grandma's house in upstate New York (near Fulton County.) We used to drive up there in the fall to buy bread and pies from them. Nice folks, not at all shy about letting strangers into their kitchen and offering them coffee or tea. What struck me most about the homes there was how neat and clean they were. The floors were bare wood and were sanded, the way wooden floors are supposed to be. Everything was neatly arranged. And very plain. The two women's houses we visited had wood-fired cookstoves, those big massive black and chrome things. I can't really describe all the various things in that kitchen but you could tell it was canning season. I'm betting they put things aside for visitors. They only sold pies and bread on Saturday.
Marion made THE best shoofly pies.
I haven't been up there in years.
Some argue the Amish don't live entirely off grid, some houses have propane for cooking and heat, but they are pretty much as close as you get and they do it 24/7/365.
I also know a guy down in Florida who sort of lives "off grid." He does have electricity for a chest freezer, and he has a cell phone, so I guess you can't really say he's off-grid, but on the two acres he has he grows most of his own food, raises bunnies and chickens and keeps a beef critter on grass for slaughter in the fall. Does his own slaughtering. His wife does the canning on a gas fired stove. Self-reliant may be a better term for him. But through necessity. No work to be had so he's doing odd jobs and small engine repair to pay the taxes, with little left for anything else.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Natertot
Sorry, but it doesn't work that way. Those numbers come from random phone calls to people. Not those that are collecting benefits. The numbers are actual and accurate. And you have no way of knowing what the pay was before or after so you can only have that opinion. It can't be accurate when overall wealth is increasing. However, it would be true for some I'm sure.
"Because unemployment insurance records relate only to people who have applied for such benefits, and since it is impractical to count every unemployed person each month, the government conducts a monthly survey called the Current Population Survey (CPS) to measure the extent of unemployment in the country."
http://www.bls.gov/cps/cps_htgm.htm
Read "Where Do The Statistics Come From".
We have a crap unemployment system here. We can't 'pay into' any personal benefits, so if you own your own home, car and live decently, have a bit of money in the bank etc, they make you sell stuff first, and also spend all your savings, before you can claim. They actually knock back most of the middle class, and only hand it out to 3rd generation, 'dole bludgers', or un-married mothers, with 7 kids from 5 different fathers. (they promote a dole-culture down here, for single women to churn out babies, they reward them with cash incentives, per child, I believe it's $5000 per kid, they knock out).
Selective Socialism sucks.
Ok so you are not really talking about off grid communities. You are talking about homeless camps? There is a difference. While a homeless camp is most likely off grid, not all off grid communities are homeless camps. There are lots of purposful off grid communities here. One right near me actually. A little cabin patch (several cabins built in a community) with one shared well/bath house.
@ Enigma - Depending on the state that's pretty much how it works here. It falls under state rules but the feds can overlay monies as they did during the recession in order to extend benefits. Where I live you have to spend down in order to qualify. Last pay checks, severance, vacation pay, etc. all have to be spent before you qualify. Your home and auto are protected however. Unemployment insurance is generally paid for by the employer and they can challenge your right to draw it under certain circumstances.
Off grid communties, but homeless camps are welcome too.Quote:
Originally Posted by 1stimestar
I have been to one in Southeastern Oklahoma a couple of times. I have a friend who lives in the "community" It is pretty much off grid. No external power feed. No external water. If I were guessing I would say around 8 or 9 homes on about 300 acres. Water is from a spring and wells. Some people use solar and at least one home has a modern wind mill powered electric system. From my observations and discussions with my friend I think most folks raise chickens or guineas. You see some goats, both milkers and meat stock. I have seen one lady using a team to plow with. 4 wheelers and Gators/Kabotas seem to be very popular. I think most of the folks work somewhere away from the community but I know of at least three families that don't. They do what they call "Subsistence living" but to me it looks like they work their rears off. Lots of timber in the area and you can get a permit to cut standing dead or marked "diseased" trees from the Forestry department. I think the community is about 50 or so years old or least some folks have been living there that long. I think there is a large extended family that was the genesis of it. Brothers bought 360 acres at a Sheriffs Sale and built three homes out on "The Place" in 1961 or so.
That makes me curious, do they research and build things like windmills or maybe irrigation ditches? Did they seem to participate in any community enrichening (I don't really know how to say it) do they grow veggies and, if someone is not busy do they start taking up beekeeping, as an example....Quote:
Originally Posted by DSJohnson
Do they improve what they have or do they continue to stay as they are, how they live?
Well I screwed that up. Okay there is a paved county road that runs through this little neighborhood. The school bus picks the kids up every day. Most of these folks, I think, are in town regularly. Even the ones who do not seem to have a job away from here go to Walmart every once in a while. The post office delivers mail to their mail boxes and the UPS driver knows all their names. They are not living in isolation. They are just living
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Might want to Look up "The Hog Farm"....long running hippie commune started in the 1960's.....
This is an interesting article dealing with an archeological dig at the former site in California.
http://www.kcet.org/arts/artbound/co...m-commune.html
Kinda funny to me seeing a site I considered current in my past being considered "archeological".....LOL
A photo overview of Amish today.
Electric free sawmill. Gas powered horse drawn hay bailers.
How far off grid do you want to go?
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/americanexpe...y/amish-today/
Each and every Navy Ship I was on was an off grid community.
Duh. I completely missed that Crash. LOL Boomers were/are pretty "off the grid"..!
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To a degree. Lots of communications to other ships and land based commands, though and at least every week we hit port to get supplies/fuel or we would do a RAS. We never grew any food on the flight deck, but if we caught fish the cooks would oblige us as long as we shared. We did have our own police/security force, fire department, flooding department, mail department, repair department, etc. As far as civilian basic government services, yeah, self sufficient and off grid.Quote:
Originally Posted by crashdive123
Ain't hunting camps of the grid? They have generators in some camps. Your cell phone isn't gonna work in our camps. No anything provided. But, most folks only go out on the weekend.
Not on the Boats I was on.Quote:
Originally Posted by natertot
oh, yeah, I forgot you were on those little underwater thingys! Yep, whole other lifestyle compared to the rest of the sea dwellers!Quote:
Originally Posted by crashdive123
That sounds like an Ideal community. Not isolated, but they are mostly self sufficient. What do you guys think of this community DSJohnson spoke about? I guess.... What would you consider to be an ideal community?Quote:
Originally Posted by DSJohnson
The ideal community is have them "over there" and me "over here".....LOL
Yep, what Hunter said...
DSJohnson, is that the community where no one has a driver's license? I remember one of those when I lived down there.
1stimestar,
My friend, Jasper, has a drivers license and an Oklahoma Life time Hunting and fishing license. I have no clue about the other people. I do know that they have "community" work days once each quarter. They ask everyone who lives there to help clean up and do some "house keeping" type things for 4 hours and then have a big pot luck. Jasper bought an existing home there several years ago. He chose to do that because they have some kind of (screwy, in my opinion) deal where you can buy the home/house/lot/acreage on some kind of a "quit claim" deed deal. No down payments you just start making payments. They get first shot at buying the place if you decide to sell. You sign some kind of a contract. What it did for Jasper was allow him to move to a livable home with 5 acres for $750 a month I think. He can NOT pay it off early and I have no details on interest or any specifics. I only know what Jasper has mentioned in casual conversations. I have never really quizzed him much about the details of the deal. Not really any of my business. I let him use my trailer to help move down there. I have only been down there a couple of times since he moved. The last time I was there he told me about one of his neighbors building a very nice little shooting range. He cleared out a place to shoot out to about 250 yards with a good back stop/berm and a pistol distance range as well. He told Jasper, who had helped him work on it, that Jasper and any friend of Jasper's could use it whenever they wanted as long as we police our trash and do not start shooting before 0800 hours. Jasper showed it to me but we did not do any shooting that day.
When it's some one else's community...usually come with their rules and such.
Sounds to me like that is pretty controlled.
When I hear, "Like minded people Community"....means do what the organizers/original owners say to do.
Bring your back and cash.......
Hunter,
Kind of my thinking also. According to Jasper, except for the quarterly work day deal he really does not "interact" with many of his neighbors. He gets a check from the VA and does some "Handy Man" work in two or three of the local towns. He is really good at laying brick and cinder blocks and actually stays pretty busy during the summer with that. I have never understood choosing to live in a gated community/neighborhood or a "Covenant Neighborhood" I am really happy with the choice that my redhead and I made when we decided to move out on this 50 acres and "live out in the country" On the other hand I also have no desire to live in commune/"Utopia" type experiment or an "Off the grid" community either. I really really like EMS, Fire and the rule of law!
I guess no matter how nice it sounds, small 'communities' are very much like small towns...
I have found that on close examination most of those Quick Claim communities are a scam.
No one ever remains long enough to pay off the debt due to changing restrictions and harassment and the contract always says if you leave you forfeit everything.
In a couple of instances in TN there were people that paid out their mortgage and found there was no clear title on their land.
That is why they specify no early payoffs.
I bought land directly from the bank, at auction, from the bankruptcy sale of one of those outfits after the developers were sued, then prosecuted, then jailed. It was a good deal for me, not so much for some of the folks that had built nice houses on land they did not have title on and lost everything, or had to buy it twice.
I also learned that gates and a fence are only good if everyone in the community refuses to give out the gate code to every delivery driver and all the boyfriends of every female inside the fence.
Was there not an incident where the Soviets docked a boomer near a small port city and powered the entire community off their reactor?Quote:
Originally Posted by crashdive123
http://ocw.mit.edu/courses/electrica...p_to_shore.pdf
It appears that we can do the same thing.