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Magpie
08-04-2009, 11:13 PM
Which is more important? Are they equal? Does it depend on what exactly the task may be? These are questions for any seasoned veterans here to answer. I'm currently working on brushing up on my knowledge and getting fit, but have limited real survival situation experience. The hypothetical question is could a person with absolutely no real wilderness experience (which isn't exactly me) survive on his/her own simply by knowing all there is to know?
crashdive123
08-04-2009, 11:20 PM
Which is more important? Are they equal? Does it depend on what exactly the task may be? These are questions for any seasoned veterans here to answer. I'm currently working on brushing up on my knowledge and getting fit, but have limited real survival situation experience. The hypothetical question is could a person with absolutely no real wilderness experience (which isn't exactly me) survive on his/her own simply by knowing all there is to know?

I believe (as I think many others do as well) that knowledge is good. Couple that knowledge with practical experience and that is much better (or gooder if you like). IMO knowledge without experience is just theory. So, IMO practical experience - boots in the field - will give you a more valuable learning experience. Knowing how to start a fire with a bow drill (I do) is much different than trying to make one on a cold and rainy day. Book knowledge is an introduction, but experience is an education. As to your last statement - I cannot accept that anybody knows all there is to know.
Magpie
08-04-2009, 11:22 PM
Well yeah but I just sort of used that last question as more of a generalization. Okay let's change it to someone who has extensive knowledge/zero experience.
crashdive123
08-04-2009, 11:24 PM
That's where everything else I said in my reply would be applicable. This is just my opinion. I'm sure that others will weigh in on your question.
rebel_chick
08-04-2009, 11:54 PM
I have a little of each, gaining more of both everyday. But if I may use my horses as a subject here, I have a colt needing to be trained. I KNOW how to do it, but without the experience, its almost useless information. It is going to take a lot of trial and error to get to where these pro trainers are. As for survival, I think that experience is crucial. How much trial and error can you afford in the field? Experience can come from camping, hiking, trying out different things in your back yard.
pocomoonskyeyes
08-04-2009, 11:56 PM
Since Crash has already used the Bowdrill analogy, I'll stick with that. I had read about it and was pretty sure I could do it pronto. Then I saw someone do it and rethought it (this could be harder than I thought). Then I tried it and found out it was harder than I thought(it's one thing to read or hear about the pressurre, and another to ACTUALLY experience it,) it was harder than I thought but with a little practice it got easier.
Then I was put into a survival experience(not by choice) and found out a lot of nuances I hadn't thought about at all.So having said that ,I think that anything you THINK you know but haven't practiced, go practice it. That way you won't have as hard a time as if you had never tried it.
Sourdough
08-05-2009, 12:07 AM
I have no Knowledge (Dumber than a STICK). But Have lots of experience, I am happy with that, Boots in the FIELD. The problem with knowledge is you don't really know if it will work. Not really, not 100%. But experience you know what works and what don't. I have been studying about how to install a 1" copper waterline, using a pitless system. Today I did it, now I know it works, I have a well and a waterline. And I can do it again, anytime now that I have taken it from theory to creation.
SARKY
08-05-2009, 12:10 AM
"Information without experience is simply knowledge"
Mark Twain
OICU812
08-05-2009, 12:19 AM
There is no substitute for experience at anything you do in life, ie; if you start a new job is your pay scale due to your knowledge or experience?
There is alot of things that I can do due to experience at my job but if I were to read how someone else does it then I would be second guessing myself all day long.
DOGMAN
08-05-2009, 01:07 AM
So much of wilderness survival has to do with mindset and attitude that knowledge and experience are trumped by "mental fortitude". A creative mind and strong will are better assets than anything else
Magpie
08-05-2009, 01:08 AM
Also if I could be allowed to broaden the subject a bit, how important do you feel morale and determination to be? Can a person with neither knowledge OR experience survive with simply a strong will to live?
DOGMAN
08-05-2009, 01:09 AM
Also if I could be allowed to broaden the subject a bit, how important do you feel morale and determination to be? Can a person with neither knowledge OR experience survive with a strong will to live alone?

read my previous post...
Magpie
08-05-2009, 01:12 AM
Ah I must have been writing that addition before you posted yours, didn't see that. But it's good that you brought it up as well.
Rick
08-05-2009, 05:38 AM
I don't think you can separate the two. You can certainly have knowledge without experience but you can not have experience without knowledge. Once you gain the experience you gain the knowledge.

Hope, you are wrong about not having knowledge. Through your experience, you probably have more knowledge than most of the members on here when it comes to wilderness living, hunting, etc. Just because you didn't read it in a book doesn't make the knowledge any less real.

Magpie, it's pretty simple. Would you want a surgeon to operate on you that had studied it, actually done it or both? I'd choose the last option and I think everyone else would too. In my example with Hope, he's studied wilderness living for years and has the practical experience to back it up. If I want to know how to live off grid, he's the type of person I would want to talk to. There are many others on here as well, not to slight any of them.

Gain as much information as you can from any source that you can then transform that knowledge into actual experience and find out what works the best for you under specific conditions.
wareagle69
08-05-2009, 07:43 AM
yo pops pitless with copper? why? why not PE?

let me add to this, most folks think they know how to solder copper, simple they say until they have to do it with old copper and with wwater still in it w/o setting their house on fire and to do it proper and make it look good, tskes years of experience.
same with sheleters or fires, i tried to start a fire with a stricker for months until one episode with ray mears showed me one thing i was doing wrong, all these shows always show the guy doing a quick strick and its done, watching the episode over again and in slow motion was almost like him being there to show me. can't get that from a book. then just practised on eveything i could until i was confident enough with any material any season any condition
Ole WV Coot
08-05-2009, 10:55 AM
I agree with Rick. Knowledge & experience go hand in hand. I like to think I have knowledge, but I can still learn and I definitely have more experience in staying in one piece. Knowledge without plenty of experience ain't squat. Know anyone that can tell you exactly how to dress a deer but can't take the blood & guts?
Ken
08-05-2009, 12:04 PM
Knowledge and Experience are often the best combination, but not always. For example, you may have a thorough knowledge of Newton's Law of Gravity........

"Every particle of matter in the universe attracts every other particle with a force that is directly proportional to the product of the masses of the particles and inversely proportional to the square of the distance between them." .........

but you probably don't want to fall out of a tree to gain experience with it.
pocomoonskyeyes
08-05-2009, 12:30 PM
You know this makes me think about the "romanticism" of certain things... Hollywood has done a LOT of that,everything from Mountain Men to Homelessness(as it applies to this thread) It's one thing to go to the movie theater and watch "the Edge" and another matter altogether to actually be put in that situation. Even if you have a photographic Memory, it ain't as glamorous as Hollywood would have us believe. Yeah when I was a kid I wanted to run away and be like the movie "My Side Of The Mountain" Or live like one of Jack Londons novels read. But I didn't. I eventually experienced many things in my life to help with some things I needed to Survive in certain situations, I.E. Boy Scouts, Military,Etc. I can promise you it's one thing to watch someone pretending to be hungry and another to ACTUALLY be hungry. I could go on all day with other examples of this "romanticism".but I think everyone "gets my drift". For those who have watched movies or read books about survival (mostly fictional and those that aren't Hollywood has taken "Poetic License" with) Life and the movies or books are NOT the same thing. So be careful with what you have read and seen, Even in movies like Jeremiah Johnson they had technical ADVISORS but not all the advice was taken by the producers. It just didn't "fit in" with the story line, it wasn't heroic enough, etc. Anyone who thinks that eating raw minnows is romantic has been to one too many Sushi restaraunts. Believe me it ain't romantic at all. I've done it,and that's one reason I won't eat Sushi today, I want my fish cooked or at least smoked.
This is just a cautionary reminder to all who think ....How romantic ....
Mischief
08-05-2009, 12:33 PM
Boots in the field and hi tech. skivvies
Ken
08-05-2009, 12:39 PM
How about this? "Knowledge is the ability to distinguish the things that you want to experience from the those that you don't."
Pal334
08-05-2009, 01:00 PM
I am a simple person (no wise remarks :) ) If you do it, you know it (to a larger or smaller degree). But if you learn it and do not use it do you know it? No I am going to take a nap.
SARKY
08-05-2009, 02:17 PM
Also if I could be allowed to broaden the subject a bit, how important do you feel morale and determination to be? Can a person with neither knowledge OR experience survive with simply a strong will to live?

Magpie,

The system I teach is A.S.K., Attitude, Skills, Kit. That is the order of importance. People have survived by shear force of will but survival is a 2 edged sword. With honed skills survivors don't need to lose fingers or toes to frostbite, nor do they need to come out of the survival situation on the deadly edge of dehydration.
So yes determination is very important. Skills make life easier in those situations and your kit is the gravy on your bisquits.
finallyME
08-05-2009, 03:22 PM
"So yes determination is very important. Skills make life easier in those situations and your kit is the gravy on your bisquits. "

I think Sarky hit the nail on the head. :smash:
Rick
08-05-2009, 09:31 PM
That is a good rule to live by...
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yellowcab
05-02-2026, 09:43 PM
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