View Full Version : Your Most Critical Survival Resource
Every time I go into the bush I use a combination of both wilderness survival preparations and bushcraft techniques. My goal is to go into the bush in order to expand my knowledge and skill set and come out with more kit and resources than I took in. Every trip tends to take on the same schedule
Day One Get Stable, Work like a dog, get through the night, a good solution right now is better than the perfect solution too late.
Day Two Get Comfortable, Evaluate/Correct, fix whatevers broken, find all sorts of neat stuff in the area, turn shelter into the Hilton, sleep well.
Day Three Camping/Hunting/Trapping/Fishing, expand my borders, locate whats for dinner, start collecting enough to stay the week or walk out. Most often I just have to cut things short as theyre getting good because I have to get back to real life.
The most critical resource when using bushcraft techniques to solve these problems is TIME. The most advantageous aspect of using wilderness survival preparations to solve these problems is TIME. I would love to see a discussion of how much TIME it takes to do the various bushcraft techniques we practice. If the time factor is not clearly understood this lack of understanding could potentially create conditions in which the day one priorities of SHELTER-FIRE-WATER are not solved in time. A solid understanding of these techniques will allow a person to better evaluate how to spend their most critical survival resource, TIME.
I would like to see photos, if possible, of bushcraft techniques in action and hear how much time it took you to resolve the problem. To keep the focus let's stick to the three main categories of primitive fire lighting, natural shelter, and purifying water by boiling or creating a filter from natural means. Mac
I can tell you from experience it takes me about 2 hours to build a debris hut, about an hour to build a fire. That includes gathering my wood for the night.
If the weather's not too bad, half an hour for shelter, enough wood to get the meal started... and fire and get the meal started. Then I'll go gathering extra wood, usually. Everyone's answers are going to be based on the environment they're accustomed to again, Mac, but those are dang good questions.
crashdive123
06-26-2009, 04:58 PM
Assuming decent conditions:
Building a workable shelter - about an hour, but would probably tinker with it for three.
Starting a fire - With what I normally carry - gathering enoug tinder and fuel to sustain it for at least an hour - probably about fifteen minutes. Using friction????? maybe today, maybe tomorrow.
Collecting and boiling water - all depends on if I get the fire going. Once it is .... collect more fuel while water is heating.
doug1980
06-26-2009, 05:01 PM
Time.
Most of us understand time as a continuous flow...but it is not however how we experience it. I wouldn't want to bore anyone with quantum physics here...but a clue to your questions can also be found in the fact that time, is not continuous, even though it appears that way.
Time, and more precisely how we experience it, is most often like bumps. We bump from one realm to the next, from one consciousness to the next.
It is funny that you used bold letters to highlight the word TIME in your post...because it actually suggests this happening.
One can actually "compress" time, by eliminating the superfluous activities (in your post illustrated by the non-bold words linking one "bump" to the next) giving us the feeling that time is a continuous entity.
How much time it takes to do various tasks is greatly linked to our relation with the superfluous, and our lack of attention.
Sleep depravation can be used as a support to experience time in a different way for example.
Our brain is also capable to "slow down time" in the event of an emergency, by greatly augmenting the ratio of frame per seconds, or information we perceive at any given moment. This can also be controlled through many practices.
Time.
:tongue_smilie::clap::smash::smartass::airhorn::ga gged::thumbdown::tank:
jeff_c
06-26-2009, 05:28 PM
And you run and you run to catch up with the sun, but its sinking
And racing around to come up behind you again
The sun is the same in the relative way, but youre older
Shorter of breath and one day closer to death
Time.:alien:
Time.
Most of us understand time as a continuous flow...but it is not however how we experience it. I wouldn't want to bore anyone with quantum physics here...but a clue to your questions can also be found in the fact that time, is not continuous, even though it appears that way.
Time, and more precisely how we experience it, is most often like bumps. We bump from one realm to the next, from one consciousness to the next.
It is funny that you used bold letters to highlight the word TIME in your post...because it actually suggests this happening.
One can actually "compress" time, by eliminating the superfluous activities (in your post illustrated by the non-bold words linking one "bump" to the next) giving us the feeling that time is a continuous entity.
How much time it takes to do various tasks is greatly linked to our relation with the superfluous, and our lack of attention.
Sleep depravation can be used as a support to experience time in a different way for example.
Our brain is also capable to "slow down time" in the event of an emergency, by greatly augmenting the ratio of frame per seconds, or information we perceive at any given moment. This can also be controlled through many practices.
Time.
Time.
Most of us understand time as a continuous flow...but it is not however how we experience it. I wouldn't want to bore anyone with quantum physics here...but a clue to your questions can also be found in the fact that time, is not continuous, even though it appears that way.
Time, and more precisely how we experience it, is most often like bumps. We bump from one realm to the next, from one consciousness to the next.
It is funny that you used bold letters to highlight the word TIME in your post...because it actually suggests this happening.
One can actually "compress" time, by eliminating the superfluous activities (in your post illustrated by the non-bold words linking one "bump" to the next) giving us the feeling that time is a continuous entity.
How much time it takes to do various tasks is greatly linked to our relation with the superfluous, and our lack of attention.
Sleep depravation can be used as a support to experience time in a different way for example.
Our brain is also capable to "slow down time" in the event of an emergency, by greatly augmenting the ratio of frame per seconds, or information we perceive at any given moment. This can also be controlled through many practices.
Time.
So... everything not in bold is superfluous?
Mac
(If she...weighs... the same as a duck... she's made of wood?)
erunkiswldrnssurvival
06-26-2009, 06:03 PM
one person doing everything in a survival situation would have problems getting jobs done fast enough to get the maximum benefits. honing procedures to shorten the work time is a goal.
Schleprok
06-26-2009, 07:26 PM
That background is superfluous in the fact that it, by itself, does not give us information relative to what we seek by the sheer intention of coming here to read.
survival zen?:chinese:
oneraindog
06-26-2009, 07:55 PM
im dying to see pictures of shelters people here have built and how long it would take for said shelter.
or how long it took to make given meal and pictures of.
photo essays covering where you went, what you did and what the process was.
are there threads covering such things?
yes, forum search here i come.
hopefully im not hijacking picts thread here but....
another forum i frequent has a section specifically for trip documentation whether just in story telling or with accompanying photos.
this is where i went and this is what i did
this was the shelter i built
this was the new fire starting tech i tried and this is how it went
this was a new water gathering process i tried and how it went
etc
kind of like a communal journal. it seems to see a lot of input.
would there be a place for that here? or much interest from other members?
or i guess thats what the blogs are supposed to be? but it would be nice to see a common area where everyone can post in the same spot and everyone can see it in one spot rather than wading through blogs.
well, nice for me anyway :)
crashdive123
06-26-2009, 08:08 PM
Oneraindog - they're kind of scattered throughout the forum. The making stuff section has quite a bit.
wareagle69
06-26-2009, 08:27 PM
great thread pict
ok folks look at picts last paragraph fire shelter and water by NATURAL methods evryone so far has said a few minutes for fire and an hour for shelter using natural means? no saw or striker? i call BS or i am a terrible bushman(maybe i am) then u are also procuring water by filter or boiling by natural methods that quick also? let me see phots and pics cuz i gotta go back to the drawing board and figure out how you are doing it
pict, said not to say "gee i can do it in five minutes" but how are you doing it in five minutes
crashdive123
06-26-2009, 08:30 PM
Actually WE not everybody said a few minutes. I said without what I normally carry, under ideal conditions - maybe today, maybe tomorrow.
Okay, Mr. Picky. I said an hour for fire including gathering wood. Generally, I use a flint steel and tinder. Depending on conditions, it will be natural tinder or VS/Cotton balls if it is damp or wet. The rest of the time is gather the night's wood.
I use a water filter for my water. That takes about ten minutes to pump, which saves me time for gathering fire wood.
You know what a debris hut is and how to build one.
wareagle69
06-26-2009, 08:39 PM
rick you are missing the point pict asked for natural methods , no flint, no firesteel no vaseline, no cotton balls, no filter no cup no blade to cut the branches to make the hut, NATURAL or am i misssing something
oneraindog
06-26-2009, 08:41 PM
Oneraindog - they're kind of scattered throughout the forum. The making stuff section has quite a bit.
i hope this doesnt sound pompous but im thinking bigger than that
these are the words i have in mind when im thinking about this:
"I would like to see photos, if possible, of bushcraft techniques in action and hear how much time it took you to resolve the problem. To keep the focus let's stick to the three main categories of primitive fire lighting, natural shelter, and purifying water by boiling or creating a filter from natural means." - Mac
this is a great request. one that i think deserves its own section in the forum. a place where everyone can go to describe and discuss their experiments IN THE FEILD.
the making stuff section is great and serves its purpose but its focused on specific items, gadgets, gizmos and little projects done in the garage or at home. i dont want to take away from it, its an invaluable resource. but why wouldnt it be just as important to see documentation of real world application in a wilderness/camp setting with discussion and breakdown of what the process was? what did you do in your camp first? what were the priorities, conditions, challenges and lessons learned?
***what where some things that you used or tried from the making stuff section?***
it would be great to see a place where picts idea is communally discussed and continually evolving. not hiding in some thread we have to search for or direct a newbie to (i include myself in said newbie status)
That's as bushcraft as you're going to get from me. That's how I do it. (shrug)
Onerainddog, I hear what you're saying but you also have to understand there have been a good 25 or 30 suggestions over the last year or so on forum sections that need to be added. If all of them had been incorporated you'd be hard pressed to figure out where stuff was supposed to go.
You can set up a network section yourself.
EDIT: I meant social group. Sorry.
crashdive123
06-26-2009, 08:43 PM
i hope this doesnt sound pompous but im thinking bigger than that
these are the words i have in mind when im thinking about this:
"I would like to see photos, if possible, of bushcraft techniques in action and hear how much time it took you to resolve the problem. To keep the focus let's stick to the three main categories of primitive fire lighting, natural shelter, and purifying water by boiling or creating a filter from natural means." - Mac
this is a great request. one that i think deserves its own section in the forum. a place where everyone can go to describe and discuss their experiments IN THE FEILD.
the making stuff section is great and serves its purpose but its focused on specific items, gadgets, gizmos and little projects done in the garage or at home. i dont want to take away from it, its an invaluable resource. but why wouldnt it be just as important to see documentation of real world application in a wilderness/camp setting with discussion and breakdown of what the process was? what did you do in your camp first? what were the priorities, conditions, challenges and lessons learned?
***what where some things that you used or tried from the making stuff section?***
it would be great to see a place where picts idea is communally discussed and continually evolving. not hiding in some thread we have to search for or direct a newbie to (i include myself in said newbie status)
Gotcha. Have you checked out Pict's and Erunk's videos?
wareagle69
06-26-2009, 08:50 PM
i agree with oneraindog this is an awesome thread, i get so frusterted and yes i am going to pick on you crash and rick, sems people post"well i would just gather some wood start a fire boil my water build a shelter and have a nice day" it is not that simple, especially using natural and i stress natural methods.
for example lets go with water pruification, i have a couple of different methods one is using a large aster leaf that i fold into a cup the dip it into a hole near a body of water that i dug to naturally filter the water, this method sucks but will keep you hydrated
next is using birch bark that is still intacked, i pull out all the decayed wood and fill with lots of grasses then dip into water and either drink out of one end or filter into the aster leaf, i am still working on making a passable cup for longer storage or boiling water.both of these are very time consuming and not something i like to do after dark
ok kids see what i am doing i think this is what mac was looking for natural methods
oneraindog
06-26-2009, 08:54 PM
@crash: yes ive seen them. they are great. but its not really what im getting at though. youtube is youtube. and again thats something people have to go looking for. what im thinking is a place where things like that could be linked. and for people that dont have youtube capability/interest they can still contribute their experiences.
@rick: fair enough. im not saying implement every idea that comes your way. im not saying this idea is better than any other that has come your way.
just throwing it out there.
what is this network section you speak of ?
crashdive123
06-26-2009, 08:54 PM
WE you can pick all you want, but that was not what I said. Not sure if you read either of my posts.
wareagle69
06-26-2009, 08:55 PM
besides i don't utube, i have dial up, so how do i learn w/o the accss to videos
i agree with oneraindog this is an awesome thread, i get so frusterted and yes i am going to pick on you crash and rick, sems people post"well i would just gather some wood start a fire boil my water build a shelter and have a nice day" it is not that simple, especially using natural and i stress natural methods.
for example lets go with water pruification, i have a couple of different methods one is using a large aster leaf that i fold into a cup the dip it into a hole near a body of water that i dug to naturally filter the water, this method sucks but will keep you hydrated
next is using birch bark that is still intacked, i pull out all the decayed wood and fill with lots of grasses then dip into water and either drink out of one end or filter into the aster leaf, i am still working on making a passable cup for longer storage or boiling water.both of these are very time consuming and not something i like to do after dark
ok kids see what i am doing i think this is what mac was looking for natural methods
Wareagle,
Yes, this is exactly the point I was driving at. I had been writing something else, not a post, and got to thinking that it would make a great question to pose.
I'll put some of that material here, thought its unedited rough draft...
"The needs of a wilderness survivor can be placed into several broad categories. Medical and security problems aside, the first three, FIRE SHELTER WATER can all compete for the position of most critical. Once these problems are solved the adventure starts to look more like camping and less like surviving. Resolving these three immediate needs creates a short term stability that will enable you to resolve the rest of the problem. The next two priorities are SIGNALS and NAVIGATION. Signals will attract rescue and navigation will get you out of the bush and back to civilization, but both have the goal of ending the ordeal. I class FOOD as a very low priority and put it last because unless you are in an extremely cold environment hunger will not actually kill you in a 72 hour ordeal.
Wilderness survival equipment is carried with the end of creating stable conditions of SHELTER-FIRE-WATER in the short run and enabling SIGNALS- NAVIGATION as conditions allow. For each of these categories we plan to carry resources to enable these conditions in a reasonable amount of TIME before they begin to degrade our chances of survival.
For every piece of wilderness survival kit we carry we should also have a back-up system that relies on knowledge, intelligence, natural materials, basic tools, and personal skill. I place these back-up systems in the category of bushcraft. Ideally these techniques should be able to rest upon the ability to make the basic tools necessary from materials on hand."
I also get very frustrated by people tossing off head knowledge as equated with actual experience. Friction fire is an awesome skill to have in the head, it is exactly the kind of bushcraft technique we should become skilled in. Going from a knife to a fire is a whole different animal under field conditions and I would be hard pressed to create fire with only a knife especially if I also had to resolve my shelter and water problems without wilderness survival resources. Mac
I deliberately left some wiggle room in this to get as much information as possible. When this is all done I'd like to have it be a record of how long tasks take to get done. There is a huge time difference between surviving in the wilderness with survival equipment and trying to bushcraft it all.
http://img103.imageshack.us/img103/439/img3112kb7.jpg
This rock shelter involved finding the location, clearing the ground, finding and cutting a pole, rigging the poncho, removing some rocks, and collecting bedding. It took about 1.5 hours to get it to the point he could spend two nights here.
http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/3773/rcoabrigofp6.jpg
This double bunk shelter built under a rock overhang took my daughter and I four hours to build. That also included the time it took to prepare bark lashings and collect bedding.
http://img110.imageshack.us/img110/716/img1788xo8.jpg
This is the typical open ground shelter over a grass bed. It involved finding a flat spot, not easy, clearing enough flat ground to stretch out, cutting a few poles, rigging the poncho, and ripping up enough grass to insulate the ground. The whole process took about 1.5 hours, with some of that spent in searching a location and traveling back and forth to where we had decent grass.
Each of these shelters make use of a poncho for overhead cover but still involved a substantial amount of work. How much more time would have been needed to build overhead cover with natural materials? How much time could have been saved by using a man-made ground pad?
The times I'm using here start with deciding to resolve the problem to finished and ready to use. I think that's important because while rigging up a poncho as overhead cover may only take 15 minutes or so, finding the location to do it needs to be factored in as part of solving the problem. On that last photo we had hiked over a ridge and spotted a good looking little valley/plateau that covered a few acres. I could see from the ridge that we had everything we needed down there, decision made, camp here, start the clock.
Once the shelters were up we also had to make a water run. We wern't using primitive means for this but as I recall it was about an hour before we had five liters of water in camp.
Mac
Nice thread, Mac!
Shelter: One to two hours depending on climate/conditions.
Fire: Fifteen minutes to one hour to gather initial wood and light fire, depending on conditions, and another half hour to two hours gathering additional wood.
Water: About 15 minutes with a Katadyn pocket filter.
wareagle69
06-26-2009, 09:31 PM
Nice thread, Mac!
Shelter: One to two hours depending on climate/conditions.
Fire: Fifteen minutes to one hour to gather initial wood and light fire, depending on conditions, and another half hour to two hours gathering additional wood.
Water: About 15 minutes with a Katadyn pocket filter.
ken ken ken ken ken ken, (shaking my head) deatils son details and did you miss the word NATURAL here no katadyn natural
fire 15 minutes to an hour dud i need to come hang out with you and learn what i am doing wrong, can you tell me how you do that so fast
ken ken ken ken ken ken, (shaking my head) deatils son details and did you miss the word NATURAL here no katadyn natural
fire 15 minutes to an hour dud i need to come hang out with you and learn what i am doing wrong, can you tell me how you do that so fast
Natural? What's natural to me is......
Using my Katadyn is about as natural as I get. Before that, it was AquaPure. Yeah, I've used coffee filters and boiled my water, but it sometimes tasted like crap depending on the source......
Flicking my Bic. But don't worry, I stopped using charcoal lighter fluid when I turned 12. :blushing: I've used a Fire Steel, but I've been known to be a bit impatient when I'm cold and hungry. :innocent:
BUT FEAR NOT! The shelter is with materials nature provides - debris, snow......... At least I understood that we weren't talking about my one man tent or my bivy. :)
wareagle69
06-26-2009, 09:47 PM
well all i see from this in the last hour is that folks need to get out into the field a bit more and get "boots in the feild time" "dirt time" what have you and practice and learn more, book knowledge is great but what are any of your (any refering to all of you here)
actual feild skills, tell me show me explain to me how to do it not just "blah blah blah" but details people details,
or bypass this thread and leave it to the folks with the expeinece
The times Ken posted there and the methods he used to solve the problem are valid times for what he describes. Those are wilderness survival equipment and techniques being employed and like I said in the original post I use a mix of WS and BC methods every time I go out.
We have all heard "The more you know the less you carry". That is true to an extent. My personal Central Brazil pack is down to about 15 lbs (give or take, much more if loaded out with water). I could get by without many of those items and I'd be stripped down to a total kit load of about 10 lbs. If any of those remaining items are removed from the pack my TIME factor will go up dramatically to bushcraft my way out of problems that could actually kill me. Mac
Edited to add...
http://img140.imageshack.us/img140/7185/macsfotos0507985340.jpg
This is that basic 10 lbs or so of kit I'm not willing to leave without. I might substitute a machete and scandi for the BK-7 but this is the kind of kit that will give me the time to resolve my problems on day one and make day two a pleasure.
Ole WV Coot
06-26-2009, 11:25 PM
Where I am makes a huge difference. Shelter under an overhang can be found almost anywhere. I cover a few hundred acres I know pretty well after walking them for 55+yrs. I now use a Jeep hardtop with enough to live in or an ATV with plenty of supplies. I know my area, know where to find shelter, am well supplied and armed. Unless I had an accident and was injured, broke my cell & gps to call for help giving my location I would not have any problems. I learned and used the basics when I was young so "head" knowledge is there. I know "how" but now I say "Why". I always go with wife & friends. Except for a few years I have spent my life in E. KY & S. WV and have a better than average knowledge of the area. This is now the way I go and I posted a couple of pics of hundreds of acres I know very well. Everything of which you speak is situational depending on your area. I would hope everyone is in an area that they are comfortable in. As for the Ohio you abandon barges upriver you won't have any bridges to worry about and in the '50s we practically lived off the land anyway. The pic of a cabin I posted has 2br, eat in kitchen, full bath, living room, porch all around, good garden, generator, well, outhouse(with door) and plenty of friends all 99 miles from nowhere. I think we could manage, even have a doc in the group. I sleep well at night.
crashdive123
06-26-2009, 11:30 PM
well all i see from this in the last hour is that folks need to get out into the field a bit more and get "boots in the feild time" "dirt time" what have you and practice and learn more, book knowledge is great but what are any of your (any refering to all of you here)
actual feild skills, tell me show me explain to me how to do it not just "blah blah blah" but details people details,
or bypass this thread and leave it to the folks with the expeinece
Wow. I guess we all just don't measure up to your standards. Kind of pompass don't you think?
jeff_c
06-26-2009, 11:43 PM
Wow. I guess we all just don't measure up to your standards. Kind of pompass don't you think?
I agree... my field craft is just that... MY field craft. I am where I am with it. Sorry, I don't filter my water with leaves... But I also don't drive to starbucks then back to the trail for it.
Everyone's goals are different. Although I would like to get there, I don't want to go into the field with a knife and a pair of boots for 3 months. Thats VERY VERY cool that you do, but we are all at different places.
To me, I would like to be able to get around with a kit like Pict showed. Apparently to wareagle that would be like a weekend at the Ritz LOL.
Id love to get a field kit for 3-4 days down to about 15-20 lbs. That would be a big step for ME and would make ME prouder than a peacock.
I don't know... I'll just say it again... we are all at different places and I think that's totally ok and doesn't need any judgment from others. I think the most important thing is to sharpen your skills where you are and not to kid yourself into thinking you are Jeremiah Johnson if your not. Knowing "where you are" is probably the most important tool in the survival kit. Knowing what you can and cannot do. Im just having a ball trying to get my kit together and learning all the little things along the way. For the life of me I cannot find any "Tinder Fungus" lol.
wareagle69
06-26-2009, 11:57 PM
Wow. I guess we all just don't measure up to your standards. Kind of pompass don't you think?
no not really
i am just starting to realise that many here do not actually have the feild time sure a couple times camping out and read some threads and books, but the question was very specific about natural methods and no one could answer the question of what they have done sans modern equipment, sure haveing the modern equipment is great but not fail safe.if your happy and comfortable with that then good for you, but was just wondering what most will do if/when equipment fails. was looking for details not just the blah blah answer that anyone can type from behind the keyboard but show the actual true experince not book or computer learning, just shows who here has the time in the feild and who doesn't. i think hopeak had it right
wareagle69
06-27-2009, 12:01 AM
[quote]Apparently to wareagle that would be like a weekend at the Ritz LOL. [quote]
not apparently but obviously, but it is what i like to do knowing i can survive w/o modern gear, that comes from spending more than 3 days in the bush, do 14 or 30 days and come back and teach me about what you learned then you will understand where i am coming from
Mac when I was young I loved doing the things your doing but I didnt even think about how long it took me, it was just do it and get it done. nowadays with my bad back and the wife's bad knee it takes me longer to find a remote location away from others that I can park my trailer.
I still setup camps like you do now and then to keep some skills but I dont stay there ( I think I miss it more than keeping skills)
Ole WV Coot
06-27-2009, 12:20 AM
no not really
i am just starting to realise that many here do not actually have the feild time sure a couple times camping out and read some threads and books, but the question was very specific about natural methods and no one could answer the question of what they have done sans modern equipment, sure haveing the modern equipment is great but not fail safe.if your happy and comfortable with that then good for you, but was just wondering what most will do if/when equipment fails. was looking for details not just the blah blah answer that anyone can type from behind the keyboard but show the actual true experince not book or computer learning, just shows who here has the time in the feild and who doesn't. i think hopeak had it right
I was running the woods probably before you were born or in 3 corner pants. I think over the years I have paid my dues and I don't have to prove myself anymore. I go the way I do because I enjoy it, don't impress easily and don't need to do more damage to my body. I could if I really needed to, but why? My boots were in the field for 35yrs, that's long enough.
wareagle69
06-27-2009, 12:25 AM
well if ya'll can read the op wanted to know what natural methods you would use, if you are too old or have no bush time then read another thread same as always if ya don't like whats being posted here then read something else. simple details of natural methods is what the question was asked and apparently very few here can answer that, which is why i suggest either post about what you know or get out in the feild and learn
simple no?
kx250kev
06-27-2009, 01:10 AM
Edited to add...
http://img140.imageshack.us/img140/7185/macsfotos0507985340.jpg
This is that basic 10 lbs or so of kit I'm not willing to leave without. I might substitute a machete and scandi for the BK-7 but this is the kind of kit that will give me the time to resolve my problems on day one and make day two a pleasure.
Pict, Love my BK-7, but I really love my Becker Combat Bowie for the extra choppin' power. It really helps when building a fire. Your minimalist kit is truely minimalist. A++ Great posts...:munchies:
Her ya go. As some overcome the puberty stages they realize how childish proving them selves was, prove what to whom and why? Put your self high on a pedestal that doesn't exist? LMFAO
WE - You are equating boot time with the ability to use natural items to accomplish what Mac has outlined. For some that may be true. For a bunch of us it is not. I choose NOT to do it that way. It has nothing to do with how much time I spend in the woods. I just don't want to filter my water with a leaf. I'll do it using my MSR, boil it or drop in some pills. Why? Because I want to, it's easier, it's quicker and it leaves me time to do other things like enjoy where I am. If those are skills you choose to work on and enjoy doing then more power to you.
The other piece of the pie is I can't rub two sticks together and make fire. I've tried...a lot...and I just don't seem to be able to do it. I've never understood how you can go to the field and make a fire kit and make it work. I can't do it so I quit trying. Some folks bring their friction kit with them and I don't understand that either. If you're bring a kit with you why not just bring a lighter, a fire steel and matches? Fire is too important to monkey around with it.
Guys,
There's no need to make this into a competition. I am attempting to make a clear distinction between wilderness survival and bushcraft.
Everyone who enters a wilderness area is practicing wilderness survival and bushcraft
On one end you have the guy in the Winnebago searching for a flat spot and the other end the guy in a loin cloth searching for flint. I'm not setting up a scale by which we judge people I'm trying to shed light on what it takes to apply bushcraft methods to wilderness survival situations.
Wilderness survival is something you DON'T EVER INTEND TO ACTUALLY DO and can prepare well in advance to deal with.
Bushcraft is something you FULLY INTEND TO ACTUALLY DO and head off to the bush all the time to do it. Lots of folks, self included, practice bushcraft at or near home which is a great way to learn but could possibly result in a catastrophic FAIL in an actual wilderness survival situation, not for lack of skill but a lack of time. Mac
Ole WV Coot
06-27-2009, 09:33 AM
well if ya'll can read the op wanted to know what natural methods you would use, if you are too old or have no bush time then read another thread same as always if ya don't like whats being posted here then read something else. simple details of natural methods is what the question was asked and apparently very few here can answer that, which is why i suggest either post about what you know or get out in the feild and learn
simple no?
Not that simple. You're already in the bush and I kinda live in the boonies. A lot of folks don't care to leap from a cliff to see if they will bounce or go splat. I have enough time and believe it or not I can read. I am sorry I don't wish to swing from a vine in a loincloth anymore, my choice. Most folks here really don't have anything to prove and like me aren't easily impressed. I learned one can either work smart or work hard and it's our choice. I will avoid answering any post you make because I simply don't wish to regress. I know my abilities or lack thereof and by experience I know I can survive. I am sorry if us Hillbillies aren't primitive enough. My last on this subject.
I would like to apologize to you Mac.
With the snow just receded and still rain and snow mixed saturated the tinder it took about 2.5 to 3 hours to build a fire.
with dry conditions about 1hr
The currant conditions and the standards a person has may take more or less time to complete
My standard for a fire may differ from others, my standard is a fire is not a fire until there are enough hot coals there so that if you walk away for a minute and the flame goes out it can restart itself by putting more tinder on it.
Never timed myself and maybe I will someday.
No apology needed.
I often get to where I'm going to be practicing wilderness survival later than I intended and while I'm not lost and not injured I am often struck by the pace I have to work at to get into a stable situation before the lights go out. That is using basic minimum kit like in the photo I posted. Using pure bushcraft techniques, as in knife only, that time factor goes way up.
Lost in the woods I think I could manage to bushcraft my way out of any one of the big three (shelter-fire-water) on day one. Attempting to conjure up all three and get into a shelter, in front of a fire, and have clean water with pure bushcraft techniques would be beyond me unless I was in a very favorable place and conditions were right.
I don't see any of this stuff as proving I'm a man or anything. Most of us have been through much harder tests in life than anything we choose to do in the wilderness. Mac
erunkiswldrnssurvival
06-27-2009, 12:49 PM
some times that pace is almost too much. i can remember being so exausted from the efforts that i almost couldnt move. determination kicks in though and a person manages to get through it.
traveling in steep or rough rocky terrain can take your strength leaving you tired and needing to get more done
Remy,
I think we're talking past each other here. That photo I posted of the kit is exactly what it takes in Central Brazil to have your most basic wilderness problems solved with a minimum of time and maximum savings of energy. If those items are not carried then I would have to resort to bushcraft methods to perform those functions. My point being that there is not enough time to do that between realizing you have to spend an unplanned night in the bush and making it happen. I practice primitive skills because I find them interesting. I practice wilderness survival because it could save my life, and I find it interesting. I think it is important to know the difference between the two disciplines and keep survival preparations in focus when going into a wilderness area.
Bushcraft and primitive skills are great things to know and learn but they do not take the place of wilderness survival preparations. Relying solely on primitive skills for wilderness survival is very unwise. It presupposes that you are in good enough health to perform the steps required and all of them are highly dependent upon the resources in the area.
Why would you rely on primitive bushcraft skills? You might wind up in a situation that you have no choice. I don't carry my minimum kit everywhere I go. I think it is valuable for people to have a solid understanding of how much time and energy gets expended in performing those tasks. It factors into deciding what is necessary and what can safely be left out of a pack. It also factors into what you should do next in bad circumstances. Mac
mountain mama
06-27-2009, 06:24 PM
Isn't this why many of us carry a small survival kit for everyday, have a BOB ready if we have time to grab it, and then a BOV beyond that? If I had to just take one item, it would be the one I have with me at all times - my suvival tin.
I can make a shelter with what I have in my tin in about an hour, give or take.
I can make a fire with what I have in my tin in usually less than 10 minutes, depending on conditions.
I can gather water with what I have in my tin in the amount of time it takes me to find the water and then purify it (30 minutes).
As long as my survival tin stays with me, my chances of survival are increased.
The other piece of the pie is I can't rub two sticks together and make fire. I've tried...a lot...and I just don't seem to be able to do it.
Don't be sad, Rick! :crying: You can always play with your BAN BUTTON, right? :innocent:
I've never understood how you can go to the field and make a fire kit and make it work.
But you're STILL Minister of Science! :clap:
Tundrascout
06-27-2009, 07:16 PM
Interesting thread, first I'll qualify that I am a newbie here with no credibility, so yeah, I'm more blah blah, but I think what I'm taking away from this thread is that there is a time for bushcraft and a time for wilderness survival skills and a time for both. In a time of actual emergency, you will probably need both, it all depends on what resources you have (time, material, skill and knowledge). All factor into your "Survivability" level.
If I'm in a plane that crashes in Alaska, I can not control the material I'll have unless I pack something in the suitcase, (Provided it makes the plane, etc). I cant control the time of day the plane goes down, so it would be good to know how long it would take to make a shelter or a fire to give me a better idea which one I would be most likely able to complete should there not be enough daylight for both. The skill and knowledge part is why I joined this site. Information here is all going into my head, but I still need to practice the knowledge to have the skill.
Thanks for the thread and posts folks!
Alaskan Survival Equipment Requirementshttp://www.preparedpilot.com/images/pixel_trans.gif
We called and talked to the FAA in Alaska and to the Alaska DOT's Aviation Staff about the following statute. We had a few questions such as how much food do they think a person needs to survive for a week in light of the numerous medical studies that have shown we can go for much longer than a week with out eating. No one had an answer. That being said, any prudent pilot carries a substantial survival kit when flying in the remote parts of Alaska. In addition to a Prepared Pilot Survival Kit (http://www.preparedpilot.com/product_info.php?cPath=23&products_id=28&osCsid=59e355140578ab14a9e84d71c8e789a9), we recommend bringing a hatchet which is also useful for pounding in tie down stakes, a sleeping bag, extra food and water when ever you fly to remote airstrips. In our opinion the signaling equipment in the Wilderness Aviator Survival Kit (http://www.preparedpilot.com/product_info.php?cPath=23&products_id=28&osCsid=59e355140578ab14a9e84d71c8e789a9) is better than the example items listed in the statute because they have a much longer duration.
Firearms have not been required since Sept. 27, 2001.
ALASKA STATUTES Sec. 02.35.110. Emergency rations and equipment.
An airman may not make a flight inside the state with an aircraft unless emergency equipment is carried as follows:
(1) the following minimum equipment must be carried during the summer months:
(A) rations for each occupant sufficient to sustain life for one week;
(B) one axe or hatchet;
(C) one first aid kit;
(D) an assortment of tackle such as hooks, flies, lines, and sinkers;
(E) one knife;
(F) fire starter;
(G) one mosquito headnet for each occupant;
(H) two small signaling devices such as colored smoke bombs, railroad fuses, or Very pistol shells, in sealed metal containers;
(2) in addition to the equipment required under (1) of this subsection, the following must be carried as minimum equipment from October 15 to April 1 of each year:
(A) one pair of snowshoes;
(B) one sleeping bag;
(C) one wool blanket or equivalent for each occupant over four.
(b) However, operators of multi-engine aircraft licensed to carry more than 15 passengers need carry only the food, mosquito nets, and signalling equipment at all times other than the period from October 15 to April 1 of each year, when two sleeping bags, and one blanket for every two passengers shall also be carried.
All of the above requirements as to emergency rations and equipment are considered to be minimum requirements which are to remain in full force and effect, except as further safety measures may be from time to time imposed by the department.
SOURCE: http://www.preparedpilot.com/info_pages.php?pages_id=7 (http://www.preparedpilot.com/info_pages.php?pages_id=7)
wareagle69
06-28-2009, 09:07 AM
well volwest i started to disagree with you last post but then continued reading it, which i rarely do with your musings, but in the end i liked what you have to say this time.
my problem with this thread is still with some of the folks here posting only generic answers, start fire, build shelter ,drink water, i have spent vast amounts of time latley looking at 3 day survival treks both volunatary and involuntary, most here would think that 3 days in the bush is easy, and if you do i challenge any of you to come up here to our neck of the woods and let me or my mentors put you thru the ropes, yes you may be old or smart or what have you but from what i have seen from this site i can think of only 5 folks here that would survive 3 days the rest would fail badly, now that will spark a storm of self rightousness but i defy any of you to go 3 days in the bush. in the scenarios that i will put you thru. any of you can pm if you like and we can go thru a 3 day routine, but i still see no real experience here only the generic answers that most would give but no true details
actually volwest on this thread other than mac you are really the only one who gave any credible info, still don't care much for you or your musings but there are times when i do find you credible, as for the rest of you who do not beleive all i can say is, look long and hard at yourselves, quit lying to your selves get out of your comfort zones and some real skills
The other piece of the pie is I can't rub two sticks together and make fire. I've tried
At least you tried Rick, I never had because I agree with you on packing it around when a lighter, fire steal, magnifying glass, and water proof matches takes up less space and takes alot less energy.
I'll have to give it a try someday and use the natural wood in the mountains and time myself.
Oscar
06-28-2009, 10:02 PM
Man am I a dork, I can and have used magnesium stick and natural tinder to start fires but today I began buliding a bow and parts for friction. It took me forever to do this and I stopped to do other family stuff. I can see time is really the killer, literally. I have never made a fire this way but will teach myself and appreciate the magnesium stick/ Vaseline on a cotton ball stuff too. WE are so weak. It's high time we reteach ourselves and get strong.
Oscar
06-28-2009, 10:08 PM
I just began lurking here this month. Just posted my first two or three questions and resectful comments. I can tell you I definately would not make it three days. I am weak but want to learn and survive. We live near a launch site for nuclear war heads. Will all my prep be in vane? I would like to know what my chances are 60 miles from a ground Zero?
crashdive123
06-28-2009, 10:14 PM
Oscar - the launch sites are not ground zero. The population centers are.
Tundrascout
06-29-2009, 04:25 AM
I would like to know what my chances are...
If your talking full Russian return, zilch, even in the Dakotas where people drive 50 miles to thier neighbor's house. I read somewhere that a Hiroshima sized bomb will kill everything flat out within 10 miles, but some H bombs were 100 times stronger. Needless to say, I'm not at ALL concerned with a full strike as I probably wouldnt want to survive. I'd be more concerned about a smaller terrorist type action, but I doubt Minot is even on that radar.
Oasis de Tucanes
08-23-2009, 06:48 PM
Down here the law requires that you carry darn near a BOB in your car. Jack. Flares or lights, first aid kit, water. Once you have that in the car just a few more items and you got it. Fire, water purification tabs, salsa can stove, cup, 8 oz bottle of alcohol, 5/7 tarp, bug spray, rain gear. Done.
In Latin America you don't leave anything in the car so I am never without my bag, which contains a whole lot more than I listed. 20 or 22 lbs worth of crap...LOL
In this climate I could handle 3 or 4 days minimum on a 3 second notice just with the crap I carry. Plenty of food and good water in the woods. No problem there.
Do you carry this kind of crap?
http://tbn1.google.com/images?q=tbn:CClJZpt-_LUnhM:http://www.outhousegraffiti.com/Crap1.jpg (http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.outhousegraffiti.com/Crap1.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.sodahead.com/blog/51136/loyal-voters/&usg=___RstMXOcgB0Mi3vGpdbTud2s4FI=&h=366&w=451&sz=27&hl=en&start=3&um=1&tbnid=CClJZpt-_LUnhM:&tbnh=103&tbnw=127&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dcrap%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DG%26um%3D1)
Or this kind?
http://tbn2.google.com/images?q=tbn:Vg5OFSoEgg6xEM:http://www.sillyjokes.co.uk/images/p-jokes/toilet/cat-crap-big.jpg (http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.sillyjokes.co.uk/images/p-jokes/toilet/cat-crap-big.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.myspace.com/hydrogen21&usg=__MSJI3472KQIgJA2ZUCgu6Sit8rg=&h=450&w=637&sz=38&hl=en&start=2&um=1&tbnid=Vg5OFSoEgg6xEM:&tbnh=97&tbnw=137&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dcrap%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DG%26um%3D1)
You need some serious professional help. You should have been an outhouse cleaner. You'd have been in heaven.
You need some serious professional help. You should have been an outhouse cleaner. You'd have been in heaven.
Look. :sneaky2: I'm getting sick of talking about urine. Isn't it time we changed the subject?
yellowcab
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yellowcab
01-27-2026, 06:46 AM
audiobookkeeper.ru (http://audiobookkeeper.ru)cottagenet.ru (http://cottagenet.ru)eyesvision.ru (http://eyesvision.ru)eyesvisions.com (http://eyesvisions.com)factoringfee.ru (http://factoringfee.ru)filmzones.ru (http://filmzones.ru)gadwall.ru (http://gadwall.ru)gaffertape.ru (http://gaffertape.ru)gageboard.ru (http://gageboard.ru)gagrule.ru (http://gagrule.ru)gallduct.ru (http://gallduct.ru)galvanometric.ru (http://galvanometric.ru)gangforeman.ru (http://gangforeman.ru)gangwayplatform.ru (http://gangwayplatform.ru)garbagechute.ru (http://garbagechute.ru)
gardeningleave.ru (http://gardeningleave.ru)gascautery.ru (http://gascautery.ru)gashbucket.ru (http://gashbucket.ru)gasreturn.ru (http://gasreturn.ru)gatedsweep.ru (http://gatedsweep.ru)gaugemodel.ru (http://gaugemodel.ru)gaussianfilter.ru (http://gaussianfilter.ru)gearpitchdiameter.ru (http://gearpitchdiameter.ru)geartreating.ru (http://geartreating.ru)generalizedanalysis.ru (http://generalizedanalysis.ru)generalprovisions.ru (http://generalprovisions.ru)geophysicalprobe.ru (http://geophysicalprobe.ru)geriatricnurse.ru (http://geriatricnurse.ru)getintoaflap.ru (http://getintoaflap.ru)getthebounce.ru (http://getthebounce.ru)
habeascorpus.ru (http://habeascorpus.ru)habituate.ru (http://habituate.ru)hackedbolt.ru (http://hackedbolt.ru)hackworker.ru (http://hackworker.ru)hadronicannihilation.ru (http://hadronicannihilation.ru)haemagglutinin.ru (http://haemagglutinin.ru)hailsquall.ru (http://hailsquall.ru)hairysphere.ru (http://hairysphere.ru)halforderfringe.ru (http://halforderfringe.ru)halfsiblings.ru (http://halfsiblings.ru)hallofresidence.ru (http://hallofresidence.ru)haltstate.ru (http://haltstate.ru)handcoding.ru (http://handcoding.ru)handportedhead.ru (http://handportedhead.ru)handradar.ru (http://handradar.ru)
handsfreetelephone.ru (http://handsfreetelephone.ru)hangonpart.ru (http://hangonpart.ru)haphazardwinding.ru (http://haphazardwinding.ru)hardalloyteeth.ru (http://hardalloyteeth.ru)hardasiron.ru (http://hardasiron.ru)hardenedconcrete.ru (http://hardenedconcrete.ru)harmonicinteraction.ru (http://harmonicinteraction.ru)hartlaubgoose.ru (http://hartlaubgoose.ru)hatchholddown.ru (http://hatchholddown.ru)haveafinetime.ru (http://haveafinetime.ru)hazardousatmosphere.ru (http://hazardousatmosphere.ru)headregulator.ru (http://headregulator.ru)heartofgold.ru (http://heartofgold.ru)heatageingresistance.ru (http://heatageingresistance.ru)heatinggas.ru (http://heatinggas.ru)
heavydutymetalcutting.ru (http://heavydutymetalcutting.ru)jacketedwall.ru (http://jacketedwall.ru)japanesecedar.ru (http://japanesecedar.ru)jibtypecrane.ru (http://jibtypecrane.ru)jobabandonment.ru (http://jobabandonment.ru)jobstress.ru (http://jobstress.ru)jogformation.ru (http://jogformation.ru)jointcapsule.ru (http://jointcapsule.ru)jointsealingmaterial.ru (http://jointsealingmaterial.ru)journallubricator.ru (http://journallubricator.ru)juicecatcher.ru (http://juicecatcher.ru)junctionofchannels.ru (http://junctionofchannels.ru)justiciablehomicide.ru (http://justiciablehomicide.ru)juxtapositiontwin.ru (http://juxtapositiontwin.ru)kaposidisease.ru (http://kaposidisease.ru)
keepagoodoffing.ru (http://keepagoodoffing.ru)keepsmthinhand.ru (http://keepsmthinhand.ru)kentishglory.ru (http://kentishglory.ru)kerbweight.ru (http://kerbweight.ru)kerrrotation.ru (http://kerrrotation.ru)keymanassurance.ru (http://keymanassurance.ru)keyserum.ru (http://keyserum.ru)kickplate.ru (http://kickplate.ru)killthefattedcalf.ru (http://killthefattedcalf.ru)kilowattsecond.ru (http://kilowattsecond.ru)kingweakfish.ru (http://kingweakfish.ru)kinozones.ru (http://kinozones.ru)kleinbottle.ru (http://kleinbottle.ru)kneejoint.ru (http://kneejoint.ru)knifesethouse.ru (http://knifesethouse.ru)
knockonatom.ru (http://knockonatom.ru)knowledgestate.ru (http://knowledgestate.ru)kondoferromagnet.ru (http://kondoferromagnet.ru)labeledgraph.ru (http://labeledgraph.ru)laborracket.ru (http://laborracket.ru)labourearnings.ru (http://labourearnings.ru)labourleasing.ru (http://labourleasing.ru)laburnumtree.ru (http://laburnumtree.ru)lacingcourse.ru (http://lacingcourse.ru)lacrimalpoint.ru (http://lacrimalpoint.ru)lactogenicfactor.ru (http://lactogenicfactor.ru)lacunarycoefficient.ru (http://lacunarycoefficient.ru)ladletreatediron.ru (http://ladletreatediron.ru)laggingload.ru (http://laggingload.ru)laissezaller.ru (http://laissezaller.ru)
lambdatransition.ru (http://lambdatransition.ru)laminatedmaterial.ru (http://laminatedmaterial.ru)lammasshoot.ru (http://lammasshoot.ru)lamphouse.ru (http://lamphouse.ru)lancecorporal.ru (http://lancecorporal.ru)lancingdie.ru (http://lancingdie.ru)landingdoor.ru (http://landingdoor.ru)landmarksensor.ru (http://landmarksensor.ru)landreform.ru (http://landreform.ru)landuseratio.ru (http://landuseratio.ru)languagelaboratory.ru (http://languagelaboratory.ru)largeheart.ru (http://largeheart.ru)lasercalibration.ru (http://lasercalibration.ru)laserlens.ru (http://laserlens.ru)laserpulse.ru (http://laserpulse.ru)
yellowcab
01-27-2026, 06:47 AM
laterevent.ru (http://laterevent.ru)latrinesergeant.ru (http://latrinesergeant.ru)layabout.ru (http://layabout.ru)leadcoating.ru (http://leadcoating.ru)leadingfirm.ru (http://leadingfirm.ru)learningcurve.ru (http://learningcurve.ru)leaveword.ru (http://leaveword.ru)machinesensible.ru (http://machinesensible.ru)magneticequator.ru (http://magneticequator.ru)magnetotelluricfield.ru (http://magnetotelluricfield.ru)mailinghouse.ru (http://mailinghouse.ru)majorconcern.ru (http://majorconcern.ru)mammasdarling.ru (http://mammasdarling.ru)managerialstaff.ru (http://managerialstaff.ru)manipulatinghand.ru (http://manipulatinghand.ru)
manualchoke.ru (http://manualchoke.ru)medinfobooks.ru (http://medinfobooks.ru)mp3lists.ru (http://mp3lists.ru)nameresolution.ru (http://nameresolution.ru)naphtheneseries.ru (http://naphtheneseries.ru)narrowmouthed.ru (http://narrowmouthed.ru)nationalcensus.ru (http://nationalcensus.ru)naturalfunctor.ru (http://naturalfunctor.ru)navelseed.ru (http://navelseed.ru)neatplaster.ru (http://neatplaster.ru)necroticcaries.ru (http://necroticcaries.ru)negativefibration.ru (http://negativefibration.ru)neighbouringrights.ru (http://neighbouringrights.ru)objectmodule.ru (http://objectmodule.ru)observationballoon.ru (http://observationballoon.ru)
obstructivepatent.ru (http://obstructivepatent.ru)oceanmining.ru (http://oceanmining.ru)octupolephonon.ru (http://octupolephonon.ru)offlinesystem.ru (http://offlinesystem.ru)offsetholder.ru (http://offsetholder.ru)olibanumresinoid.ru (http://olibanumresinoid.ru)onesticket.ru (http://onesticket.ru)packedspheres.ru (http://packedspheres.ru)pagingterminal.ru (http://pagingterminal.ru)palatinebones.ru (http://palatinebones.ru)palmberry.ru (http://palmberry.ru)papercoating.ru (http://papercoating.ru)paraconvexgroup.ru (http://paraconvexgroup.ru)parasolmonoplane.ru (http://parasolmonoplane.ru)parkingbrake.ru (http://parkingbrake.ru)
partfamily.ru (http://partfamily.ru)partialmajorant.ru (http://partialmajorant.ru)quadrupleworm.ru (http://quadrupleworm.ru)qualitybooster.ru (http://qualitybooster.ru)quasimoney.ru (http://quasimoney.ru)quenchedspark.ru (http://quenchedspark.ru)quodrecuperet.ru (http://quodrecuperet.ru)rabbetledge.ru (http://rabbetledge.ru)radialchaser.ru (http://radialchaser.ru)radiationestimator.ru (http://radiationestimator.ru)railwaybridge.ru (http://railwaybridge.ru)randomcoloration.ru (http://randomcoloration.ru)rapidgrowth.ru (http://rapidgrowth.ru)rattlesnakemaster.ru (http://rattlesnakemaster.ru)reachthroughregion.ru (http://reachthroughregion.ru)
readingmagnifier.ru (http://readingmagnifier.ru)rearchain.ru (http://rearchain.ru)recessioncone.ru (http://recessioncone.ru)recordedassignment.ru (http://recordedassignment.ru)rectifiersubstation.ru (http://rectifiersubstation.ru)redemptionvalue.ru (http://redemptionvalue.ru)reducingflange.ru (http://reducingflange.ru)referenceantigen.ru (http://referenceantigen.ru)regeneratedprotein.ru (http://regeneratedprotein.ru)reinvestmentplan.ru (http://reinvestmentplan.ru)safedrilling.ru (http://safedrilling.ru)sagprofile.ru (http://sagprofile.ru)salestypelease.ru (http://salestypelease.ru)samplinginterval.ru (http://samplinginterval.ru)satellitehydrology.ru (http://satellitehydrology.ru)
scarcecommodity.ru (http://scarcecommodity.ru)scrapermat.ru (http://scrapermat.ru)screwingunit.ru (http://screwingunit.ru)seawaterpump.ru (http://seawaterpump.ru)secondaryblock.ru (http://secondaryblock.ru)secularclergy.ru (http://secularclergy.ru)seismicefficiency.ru (http://seismicefficiency.ru)selectivediffuser.ru (http://selectivediffuser.ru)semiasphalticflux.ru (http://semiasphalticflux.ru)semifinishmachining.ru (http://semifinishmachining.ru)spicetrade.ru (http://spicetrade.ru)spysale.ru (http://spysale.ru)stungun.ru (http://stungun.ru)tacticaldiameter.ru (http://tacticaldiameter.ru)tailstockcenter.ru (http://tailstockcenter.ru)
tamecurve.ru (http://tamecurve.ru)tapecorrection.ru (http://tapecorrection.ru)tappingchuck.ru (http://tappingchuck.ru)taskreasoning.ru (http://taskreasoning.ru)technicalgrade.ru (http://technicalgrade.ru)telangiectaticlipoma.ru (http://telangiectaticlipoma.ru)telescopicdamper.ru (http://telescopicdamper.ru)temperateclimate.ru (http://temperateclimate.ru)temperedmeasure.ru (http://temperedmeasure.ru)tenementbuilding.ru (http://tenementbuilding.ru)tuchkas (http://tuchkas.ru/)ultramaficrock.ru (http://ultramaficrock.ru)ultraviolettesting.ru (http://ultraviolettesting.ru)
yellowcab
05-01-2026, 08:27 PM
(Мел (http://audiobookkeeper.ru/book/2823)1196 (http://cottagenet.ru/plan/655)напр (http://eyesvision.ru/lectures/121)PERF (http://eyesvisions.com/eyesight/23)Сико (http://factoringfee.ru/t/1195013)Клок (http://filmzones.ru/t/1025105)*ейн (http://gadwall.ru/t/906258)Заха (http://gaffertape.ru/t/1102131)Моск (http://gageboard.ru/t/1095523)Луко (http://gagrule.ru/t/945432)ажур (http://gallduct.ru/t/1162901)Щедр (http://galvanometric.ru/t/1048468)Side (http://gangforeman.ru/t/1099336)*осс (http://gangwayplatform.ru/t/1531417)Bell (http://garbagechute.ru/t/1144331)
Trac (http://gardeningleave.ru/t/1028870)2125 (http://gascautery.ru/t/1144204)удае (http://gashbucket.ru/t/854764)Tesc (http://gasreturn.ru/t/1144361)сырь (http://gatedsweep.ru/t/859707)Чудо (http://gaugemodel.ru/t/1161865)Арсе (http://gaussianfilter.ru/t/1232615)Cand (http://gearpitchdiameter.ru/t/972536)XVII (http://geartreating.ru/t/1045400)Труш (http://generalizedanalysis.ru/t/1002409)Деле (http://generalprovisions.ru/t/1041244)aspe (http://geophysicalprobe.ru/t/947109)Ment (http://geriatricnurse.ru/t/946605)прак (http://getintoaflap.ru/t/946073)Черк (http://getthebounce.ru/t/815462)
Rhyt (http://habeascorpus.ru/t/1088373)Slim (http://habituate.ru/t/1091950)Губи (http://hackedbolt.ru/t/944674)Tico (http://hackworker.ru/t/1135477)Ever (http://hadronicannihilation.ru/t/1102690)деви (http://haemagglutinin.ru/t/1095939)лати (http://hailsquall.ru/t/849519)Arth (http://hairysphere.ru/t/943366)Rudy (http://halforderfringe.ru/t/849222)одно (http://halfsiblings.ru/t/938389)Serg (http://hallofresidence.ru/t/846047)Lola (http://haltstate.ru/t/899885)Alex (http://handcoding.ru/t/1027538)Vite (http://handportedhead.ru/t/1143312)стро (http://handradar.ru/t/830618)
Mari (http://handsfreetelephone.ru/t/860732)*аев (http://hangonpart.ru/t/972353)Jiri (http://haphazardwinding.ru/t/780746)дене (http://hardalloyteeth.ru/t/568239)Prel (http://hardasiron.ru/t/632080)допо (http://hardenedconcrete.ru/t/857057)Coto (http://harmonicinteraction.ru/t/865822)отли (http://hartlaubgoose.ru/t/762382)Jose (http://hatchholddown.ru/t/835637)Хоте (http://haveafinetime.ru/t/1239680)Geor (http://hazardousatmosphere.ru/t/845602)Туты (http://headregulator.ru/t/1375021)Most (http://heartofgold.ru/t/1547456)Rajn (http://heatageingresistance.ru/t/832758)Worl (http://heatinggas.ru/t/1189384)
Nanc (http://heavydutymetalcutting.ru/t/1182507)Alek (http://jacketedwall.ru/t/748361)Женс (http://japanesecedar.ru/t/664230)*евя (http://jibtypecrane.ru/t/843205)Andr (http://jobabandonment.ru/t/645041)*ойт (http://jobstress.ru/t/674724)чудо (http://jogformation.ru/t/833765)Funk (http://jointcapsule.ru/t/1147583)Tras (http://jointsealingmaterial.ru/t/1147940)Цыбу (http://journallubricator.ru/t/1142101)Soph (http://juicecatcher.ru/t/1147578)Silv (http://junctionofchannels.ru/t/1180398)Sela (http://justiciablehomicide.ru/t/1181902)Бело (http://juxtapositiontwin.ru/t/1183249)Калм (http://kaposidisease.ru/t/1180037)
ELEG (http://keepagoodoffing.ru/t/1181119)Boys (http://keepsmthinhand.ru/t/649696)Spli (http://kentishglory.ru/t/1183122)Coll (http://kerbweight.ru/t/1179884)Афан (http://kerrrotation.ru/t/674072)Нахм (http://keymanassurance.ru/t/653859)Roxy (http://keyserum.ru/t/1180925)Jose (http://kickplate.ru/t/1210620)худо (http://killthefattedcalf.ru/t/1239588)Anne (http://kilowattsecond.ru/t/846153)пред (http://kingweakfish.ru/t/1003223)друг (http://kinozones.ru/film/7719)Jack (http://kleinbottle.ru/t/782072)Заль (http://kneejoint.ru/t/1062091)Бору (http://knifesethouse.ru/t/1342849)
язык (http://knockonatom.ru/t/833452)куби (http://knowledgestate.ru/t/1004351)Will (http://kondoferromagnet.ru/t/1245118)Спир (http://labeledgraph.ru/t/1226558)Арис (http://laborracket.ru/t/1200177)Zone (http://labourearnings.ru/t/1548516)Pian (http://labourleasing.ru/t/1311701)Zone (http://laburnumtree.ru/t/1190616)Chet (http://lacingcourse.ru/t/1188887)зака (http://lacrimalpoint.ru/t/1188557)Zone (http://lactogenicfactor.ru/t/1186893)Zone (http://lacunarycoefficient.ru/t/1193529)Zone (http://ladletreatediron.ru/t/1191971)Zone (http://laggingload.ru/t/1190280)Zone (http://laissezaller.ru/t/1191907)
Zone (http://lambdatransition.ru/t/1191955)Zone (http://laminatedmaterial.ru/t/1193521)Chet (http://lammasshoot.ru/t/1184210)Zone (http://lamphouse.ru/t/1185104)Zone (http://lancecorporal.ru/t/1185043)Zone (http://lancingdie.ru/t/1186483)MORG (http://landingdoor.ru/t/1188662)Баев (http://landmarksensor.ru/t/1241788)Zone (http://landreform.ru/t/1186948)Zone (http://landuseratio.ru/t/1185267)Zone (http://languagelaboratory.ru/t/1191060)хоро (http://largeheart.ru/shop/1160089)Coll (http://lasercalibration.ru/shop/152301)PCIe (http://laserlens.ru/lase_zakaz/1776)Каси (http://laserpulse.ru/shop/589317)
yellowcab
05-01-2026, 08:28 PM
Micr (http://laterevent.ru/shop/1178549)Прои (http://latrinesergeant.ru/shop/452196)Ardo (http://layabout.ru/shop/99604)кале (http://leadcoating.ru/shop/100374)Fict (http://leadingfirm.ru/shop/102934)Book (http://learningcurve.ru/shop/279243)Свят (http://leaveword.ru/shop/145669)4805 (http://machinesensible.ru/shop/107528)WWHo (http://magneticequator.ru/shop/268965)Wind (http://magnetotelluricfield.ru/shop/145995)Mist (http://mailinghouse.ru/shop/95714)word (http://majorconcern.ru/shop/268358)Urti (http://mammasdarling.ru/shop/159073)ARAG (http://managerialstaff.ru/shop/159341)(Дюн (http://manipulatinghand.ru/shop/613224)
Мавр (http://manualchoke.ru/shop/597515)парт (http://medinfobooks.ru/book/2879)Easy (http://mp3lists.ru/item/7191)Арти (http://nameresolution.ru/shop/167347)пазл (http://naphtheneseries.ru/shop/104305)язык (http://narrowmouthed.ru/shop/455631)бума (http://nationalcensus.ru/shop/176609)Mesc (http://naturalfunctor.ru/shop/23969)Высо (http://navelseed.ru/shop/100571)скла (http://neatplaster.ru/shop/447359)Wind (http://necroticcaries.ru/shop/27494)Wind (http://negativefibration.ru/shop/178276)Lego (http://neighbouringrights.ru/shop/122276)Coto (http://objectmodule.ru/shop/108314)Tefa (http://observationballoon.ru/shop/10424)
Phil (http://obstructivepatent.ru/shop/98098)Cafe (http://oceanmining.ru/shop/969866)Iams (http://octupolephonon.ru/shop/571688)Robe (http://offlinesystem.ru/shop/147537)Bern (http://offsetholder.ru/shop/199784)Лит* (http://olibanumresinoid.ru/shop/146926)золо (http://onesticket.ru/shop/378939)John (http://packedspheres.ru/shop/579351)рабо (http://pagingterminal.ru/shop/660632)Aggr (http://palatinebones.ru/shop/202858)Ride (http://palmberry.ru/shop/204716)Лит* (http://papercoating.ru/shop/580536)Лит* (http://paraconvexgroup.ru/shop/684765)(189 (http://parasolmonoplane.ru/shop/1166046)Пано (http://parkingbrake.ru/shop/1166178)
Фидл (http://partfamily.ru/shop/1165116)*йге (http://partialmajorant.ru/shop/1167848)Игна (http://quadrupleworm.ru/shop/1295673)Chai (http://qualitybooster.ru/shop/202179)Соде (http://quasimoney.ru/shop/593546)Петр (http://quenchedspark.ru/shop/593612)soul (http://quodrecuperet.ru/shop/913491)Евдо (http://rabbetledge.ru/shop/1070746)Powe (http://radialchaser.ru/shop/137585)Luci (http://radiationestimator.ru/shop/179276)Enro (http://railwaybridge.ru/shop/345559)Jagg (http://randomcoloration.ru/shop/510137)семь (http://rapidgrowth.ru/shop/635519)Прод (http://rattlesnakemaster.ru/shop/1071924)John (http://reachthroughregion.ru/shop/173368)
успе (http://readingmagnifier.ru/shop/418217)HOUS (http://rearchain.ru/shop/356743)фаши (http://recessioncone.ru/shop/513434)Homo (http://recordedassignment.ru/shop/878876)Голу (http://rectifiersubstation.ru/shop/1052187)Лебе (http://redemptionvalue.ru/shop/1058807)сокр (http://reducingflange.ru/shop/1671486)Миро (http://referenceantigen.ru/shop/1692442)прог (http://regeneratedprotein.ru/shop/1221695)Соде (http://reinvestmentplan.ru/shop/121387)*озе (http://safedrilling.ru/shop/1324925)Jill (http://sagprofile.ru/shop/1044392)реда (http://salestypelease.ru/shop/1064824)emoc (http://samplinginterval.ru/shop/1416924)Кали (http://satellitehydrology.ru/shop/1457161)
Гала (http://scarcecommodity.ru/shop/1436757)dfal (http://scrapermat.ru/shop/1457287)ферм (http://screwingunit.ru/shop/1492082)Тарр (http://seawaterpump.ru/shop/176821)арес (http://secondaryblock.ru/shop/249224)Лопа (http://secularclergy.ru/shop/271043)стих (http://seismicefficiency.ru/shop/41626)осна (http://selectivediffuser.ru/shop/370052)Жуль (http://semiasphalticflux.ru/shop/398663)lann (http://semifinishmachining.ru/shop/409338)PCIe (http://spicetrade.ru/spice_zakaz/1776)PCIe (http://spysale.ru/spy_zakaz/1776)PCIe (http://stungun.ru/stun_zakaz/1776)исце (http://tacticaldiameter.ru/shop/475640)Pope (http://tailstockcenter.ru/shop/488697)
Алек (http://tamecurve.ru/shop/82603)Palo (http://tapecorrection.ru/shop/84147)Gera (http://tappingchuck.ru/shop/485035)Trac (http://taskreasoning.ru/shop/496881)comp (http://technicalgrade.ru/shop/1815059)Кара (http://telangiectaticlipoma.ru/shop/1856422)*АЙО (http://telescopicdamper.ru/shop/620342)клас (http://temperateclimate.ru/shop/271697)Шала (http://temperedmeasure.ru/shop/398621)Спир (http://tenementbuilding.ru/shop/954105)tuchkas (http://tuchkas.ru/)Ники (http://ultramaficrock.ru/shop/974567)Иллю (http://ultraviolettesting.ru/shop/477109)
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