An honest question to the more socialist-minded members...

[BraggSurvivor]

I have an honest question here that I am hoping that someone can enlighten me on. I am not looking for name calling, partisan bickering, or any responses of simply pointing out the errors of the libertarian worldview.

The following is basically what I see as the train of thought involved in support of socialism:

1) The rich and well-connected in our society are responsible for much of society's ills as they view those less-fortunate individuals as some combination of slaves to populate their factories and dupes from which they can take money.

2) People cannot be trusted to donate to charity as those with money do not want to share it, and those with access to other peoples money simply want to take as much of it as they can for themselves.

3) Therefore one of the necessary roles of government is to forcibly remove money from the wealthier citizens and transfer it to the needier citizens.

Now for my question...

Given that politicians are almost exclusively from the families of the super rich and well connected and that even government workers are well paid relative to their private industry counterparts, how are they to be trusted as being any different than the rich that are responsible for the evils of society in the first place? How can these people having access to vast sums of money be trusted any more than other regular people having access to large sums of other peoples money?

Rule of law doesn't stop the evil rich from tromping on the rights of the poor, why should it stop politicians or bureaucrats from doing the same?

What am I missing here, how is a government or politicians to be trusted any more than individuals or corporations?

Given my impression of the basic human condition, I don't see how government is any better, and I see a number of ways in which it can be far worse.

[TrappinGal]

Given that politicians are almost exclusively from the families of the super rich and well connected and that even government workers are well paid relative to their private industry counterparts, how are they to be trusted as being any different than the rich that are responsible for the evils of society in the first place?

they cant be,imo.

[Ole WV Coot]

Theoretically I agree. My thoughts are that in reality if the wealth of this country was divided equally among every person within a generation the same families that have the wealth and control this country by hook or crook would be in the same controlling position that they are now. I do not imply that they are superior, to my way of thinking they are inferior to the common man, more greedy and ruthless. I have associated with both and much prefer associating with people like myself.

[tacmedic]

To start off with I would like to say that I am not even remotely socialist minded. That having been said, I have read a bit about Marx and his original idea behind socialism/communism. The thing that none of the countries in the world that have adopted socialism have succeeded in doing, is the last step that Marx identified. Which is the abolishment of the government. The idea was that people would see that socialism was such a great thing, that an organized system of gobernment would no longer be necessary. The only problem is that power corrupts, and the people who were responsible for abolishing the government were the ones who stood to lose the most power, and thus never did it. The original intent was never to give people that weren't trustworthy unlimited power, it was for them to facilitate a change to a time when government wasn't needed.

[Rick]

Let me get this straight. The American dream (Canadian, too by the way) is to build the better mouse trap and make gobs of money. But those that manage to do that are greedy malcontents that are not worthy of licking my boots? Something wrong in that thinking, sorry. And what is the income level where you stop being a lacky and start being one of the snobbish elite? And if I were one of the snobbish elite why would I care what you think since I'm a snobbish elitist. That's sort of the definition isn't it?

And wouldn't you agree, Mr. Bragg, that there are more than a few folks that can't afford your billion dollar mobile house? Does that make you rich and well connected and, therefore, responsible for much of society's ills? So by your definition (this is getting to be fun!) do you "view those less-fortunate individuals as some combination of slaves to populate (your) factories and dupes from which (you) can take money"? Hmmm, do you?

I'll bet you are in cahoots with over paid Canadian officials and sit around walnut paneled libraries smoking cigars and laughing at the Zamboni drivers!:eek:

That was so much fun!!! Come up with another one. This is a hoot!

[Pict]

Political discussion is one of the things that drives me into the bush. The bush is reality, if you don't work you don't eat. Make your bed and sleep in it. Collect wood and maintain your fire or go cold and wet. If you don't get your own water you will die of thirst. Defend yourself or get eaten. Reality in all its raw beautiful form.

IMO all people on earth should be subjected to abject deprivation at some point in their lives. That way they will appreciate what they have and have compassion on those that don't. Mac

[trax]

OK Rick, this time you've gone to far....no one laughs at the Zamboni driver

[Rick]

Agreed. That's how serious this stuff is!!!

[trax]

I mean...huh...you may have noticed that it is the one position I haven't offered to anyone in Free Traxistan....it's that serious.

[Rick]

Bragg's in serious trouble!! This time he and his crooked cohorts have gone too far. Light the torches! Build a fire under the cauldron of tar. Where's the rail? We've got some runnin' out to do!!

[trax]

Political discussion is one of the things that drives me into the bush. The bush is reality, if you don't work you don't eat. Make your bed and sleep in it. Collect wood and maintain your fire or go cold and wet. If you don't get your own water you will die of thirst. Defend yourself or get eaten. Reality in all its raw beautiful form. Mac

Thank you Mac, one of the more profound perspectives I've read here.

[Gray Wolf]

The bush is reality, if you don't work you don't eat. Make your bed and sleep in it. Collect wood and maintain your fire or go cold and wet. If you don't get your own water you will die of thirst. Defend yourself or get eaten. Reality in all its raw beautiful form.
Mac

Amen, Mac!

[klkak]

Are we talking about politics? It sounds like politics.

General Chat (# Viewing)
Talk about anything except politics & religion.

[BraggSurvivor]

Let me get this straight. The American dream (Canadian, too by the way) is to build the better mouse trap and make gobs of money. But those that manage to do that are greedy malcontents that are not worthy of licking my boots? Something wrong in that thinking, sorry. And what is the income level where you stop being a lacky and start being one of the snobbish elite? And if I were one of the snobbish elite why would I care what you think since I'm a snobbish elitist. That's sort of the definition isn't it?

And wouldn't you agree, Mr. Bragg, that there are more than a few folks that can't afford your billion dollar mobile house? Does that make you rich and well connected and, therefore, responsible for much of society's ills? So by your definition (this is getting to be fun!) do you "view those less-fortunate individuals as some combination of slaves to populate (your) factories and dupes from which (you) can take money"? Hmmm, do you?

I'll bet you are in cahoots with over paid Canadian officials and sit around walnut paneled libraries smoking cigars and laughing at the Zamboni drivers!:eek:

That was so much fun!!! Come up with another one. This is a hoot!


Rick........you complete me. :D

I am the Zamboni driver compared to alot of folks around this oil ridden province. I throw these posts out there for conversation and to get people thinking on whats happening around us. Do I believe all that I write? No.

As for the motorhome.....it was probably the most stupid purchase I have ever made. With Monaco's stock going from over $15.00 a share to under $3.00, huge incentives were given on that model to get rid of them. I saved over 100K from a year ago. I had some spare change kicking around so I bought it to take my kids traveling while they are still young. I didnt want to be 70 years old and all the kids gone before I bought one.

And by the way, I only smoke the cheap cuban cigars so to be able to give 20% of my companies profits to local charities. ;)

[trax]

Are we talking about politics? It sounds like politics.

General Chat (# Viewing)
Talk about anything except politics & religion.

Well done, sir.

[Sam Reeves]

Democracy is a strange thing. In the end people always get the government they deserve, not the one they want. History is ripe with examples of just that. Socialist are also a strange thing in America. I see them alot wearing their silly Che t-shirts. Fashion commies. Ask them what the difference is the GNP and GDP and they think you are referring to some new drug they haven't tried yet. If you can't obtain nice things in America you'd be hopeless anywhere else. Ironically, socialists that say money isn't important are usually the ones that sign up for the most hand outs.

[BraggSurvivor]

My inclination is to be cautious and pessimistic. Probably a good portion of folks on WSF have the same personality trait or we all wouldn't be here. At the same time you have to have some hope for the future. If the U.S. doesn't get its act together and the forces of tyranny prevail, the world will be a pretty ugly place.

Part of the problem is one of labels - I honestly believe in the spreading around of unavoidable risk - socialism as a true insurance program. I recognize that society consists of of a spectrum of lucky to unlucky - and that this luck is not necessarily due to any virtue or fault on the part of the recipient. That makes me a socialist on one level - but an anti-socialist in that there are many programs that I believe are misguided, just plain stupid or wrong.

However, I further recognize the fact that society consists of a spectrum of producers to consumers. Any program that is enacted should be predicated on the concept that the maximum number of consumers should be nudged into the producer class - and certainly not encouraging producers to become perennial consumers. This however is rarely the case as well-intentioned programs neglect the fact that there exists a (some would say very significant) class of people who will manipulate their situation to qualify for government subsidized consumer status (this applies to corporations as well I freely admit). This makes me a conservative on another level - but again an anti-conservative for stating that there exist corporate welfare recipients.

I see a problem in that the more fervent of both sides of the socialist/conservative thing see things as only one way - lucky/unlucky for the socialists and producer/consumer for the conservatives. There are clearly cases of all four possible states (which can be easily constructed) that demonstrates that both simplistic views are entirely at odds with the real world.

I just don't see government as being the best mechanism for supplying the socially-minded programs that I see as being valid.

[klkak]

Yup! I'm sure of it now. You guys are talking about politics. I'm gonna tell Chris on all of you and he'll make Rick and Sarge kick all your butts for not following the Thread rules. :P

[Rick]

http://ronmartin.net/blog/wp-content/uploads/2008/01/no-politics.gif

Better?

[smokelessfire]

i believe that's the reason the colonials hated the indians so much, and hate most of the primitive type peoples, because capitalism is about me me me me, and it's all mine, i WON"T share!, and true socialism is about keeping everyone alive, at minimum, and happy at best. i mean, how could you not give a hunk of venison to the old lady in the corner tepee, whose sone died last week in a grizzly attack, and has no one to provide for her. well, that's the mentality of the capitalist. screw her, she's old and poor anyway, if i give to her, i won't be able to get the extra jaguar i need to look cool pulling up at the gala tonite. many people were vehemently opposed to fdr creating social(ist) security. one thing i will say though, there are supposed socialist govmnt's, and communist gov'ts, but to me there has never been a true one of either, russia and china are dictatorships, not communist gov'ts. nazi germany was not socialist as it claimed, but another dictatorship, a military one. (i mean really, is everything in russia owned by the people? nope, by the state.)

[Beo]

Pict hit on the head, that was great.
Americans are spoiled rotten, personally I think no matter what the rich will keep getting richer and the poor will stay that way if they want to. Here in America some think its cool to be from the ghetto, the hood, the projects, and not work sitting around waiting for their gooberment checks and being on wellfare, welfare in America has become a reward for laziness. It should be for only the elderly, disabled, and children who have no parents... that may mean that a family of lower income has to work two or more jobs but then so be it, while in the army I worked at the stables and rod & gun club off duty to make ends meet because as all military personal former and now serving can tell you they are grossly underpaid.
Spoiled American's no longer want to work, we live in a me first society trapped in our crowded cities, in tiny apartments and houses and slave away for twenty or more years for what? A fake gold watch and pension check that won't cut it. And if Social Security is what your looking at to sustain you when you retire then your gonna be hurting. Time to get back to what made America great, working hard.
Beo,

[smokelessfire]

Hear Hear!

[Beo]

Yeah, well don't even get me started on office working and cubicals... :D

[Beo]

CDB said it best in his song... I ain't aking nobody for nothing if I can't get it on my own. If you
don't like the way I'm living you just leave this long haired country boy alone.

[tacmedic]

smokelessfire- The nazi's never claimed to be socialists, they were (are) fascists. Which is the exact opposite of socialism (in theory).

[catfish10101]

Me thinks this subject may be a bit touchy, but here goes.
It has been proven that the American people ARE some of the most charitable people in the world. Just look at the charities set up (outside the government) for natural disasters, cancer patients, crime victims, etc.
As far as socialism goes, in my opinion, IT'S GARBAGE.
I am by no means a rich man. I struggle to make ends meet constantly. Yet I see HUNDREDS of dollars coming from my check going to NONDESERVING PEOPLE. This is not to say that everyone who gets help from the government is nondeserving, or nonappriciative, but there are too many people who CHOOSE not to do for themselves because they are living a better life than me by not doing anything. Foodstamps should be TEMPERAIRY ONLY exept for the elderly and handicapped. Welfare should ONLY be for the elderly and handicapped.
FEMA? PLEASE HELP ME UNDERSTAND THIS!!! I BUY A HOUSE, I HAVE TO PAY HOMEOWNERS INSURANCE, I CHOOSE TO PAY FLOOD INSURANCE!! I DO THIS TO PROTECT MY FAMILY FROM BEING HOMELESS SHOULD SOMETHING HAPPEN.
FEMA COMES IN AFTER HURRICANE KATRINA AND PAYS BILLIONS OF DOLLARS TO PEOPLE WHO CHOSE NOT TO PROTECT THEIR HOMES WITH INSURANCE. BECAUSE OF THIS, MY INSURANCE RATES HAVE TRIPPLED!!! WHY THE HELL AM I EVEN PAYING FOR INSURANCE IF FEMA IS GONNA TAKE CARE OF EVERYTHING IF I WOULD NOT HAVE INSURANCE?
Furthermore, the RICH AND SNOBBY are not the ones paying all the taxes that go to these things. THEY ARE THE ONES THAT GET THE BIG TAX BREAKS!! IT'S THE POOR WORKING SLOB LIKE ME THAT WORK COUNTLESS HOURS WEEK AFTER WEEK, THAT HAVE TO SUPPORT THE CONSTANT SOCIALISM THAT IS RUNNING RAMPANT AMONG OUR SOCIETY. THE LAZY HAVE FIGURED OUT HOW TO LIVE OFF THE WORKING MAN, THE RICH ARE LIVING OFF THE WORKING MAN, THE WORKING MAN IS HURTING!!

[Beo]

That was great Catfish, and I agree. Being a 1st responder and cop I can tell you that during emergencies FEMA may give them a ton of money but their structure is crap.

[gourdhead1997]

I am a newbie here so I may ruffle some fur but I felt I had to comment. The US government is the one that has bankrupted Social Security. They are the ones that have screwed up FEMA. People complain about big oil companies and gas prices but oil companies make a profit of about 8 cents? on a gallon of gas. The government makes about 40 cents/gallon. Why is that? I can go on and on about how ineffecient our government is with handling our tax dollars. Why does anyone think it is a good idea to let government take care of society. Let's all take care of ourselves and those around us and let the government take care of diplomacy, defense, legislation and infrastructure. If the little old ladie in the tepee needs food, feed her. If some rich selfish person doesn't wish to, who has the right to take his money and give it to someone else? The same government that will screw up and blow it?

[BraggSurvivor]

Exxon posts record $11.68 billion profit

That profit works out to $1,485.55 a second.

http://money.cnn.com/2008/07/31/news/companies/exxon_profits/?postversion=2008073109

[crashdive123]

Well said Gourdhead. I thought it was funny (sad really) that while out driving and listening to the radio all I heard was how Exxon Mobile made 12.7 billion in profits last quarter. What they didn't say was that between mutual funds, pension plans, 401Ks, boards of education investments, etc. etc. millions and millions of individuals were the beneficiaries of that profit. They also didn't say that the federal governments take on the same period from Exxon was 3 times higer (over 36 billion).

[crashdive123]

Ahhh - see that Bragg. We posted at the same time and about the same thing. Great minds think alike....some are just more optomistic than others.

To anybody that is upset at the amount of profit from Exxon Mobile - buy stock.....and where were you when oil was $25 a barrel and they were laying people off?

[Sam Reeves]

Damn near every element of the U.S. government that is dysfunctional is a socialist one that should not have been there to Begin with. People can say what they want about Capitalism but if it wasn't for Capitalism the rest of the world would starve and probably revert back to the stoneage.

All forms of government are about control. Capitalism is no different. Only with Capitalism you are bribed rather than threatened so the population will be more productive. In America you don't even have to participate in the game. You can do the bare minimum with your life and flip hamburgers and live in a trailer park somewhere. Unfortunately we have a socialist program known as welfare that rewards doing nothing as well.

[catfish10101]

Thanks Beo, I had to stop there and go push the vein back into the side of my head. LOL.

[yellowcab]

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[yellowcab]

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чита (http://tamecurve.ru)Буты (http://tapecorrection.ru)Лукь (http://tappingchuck.ru)Михе (http://taskreasoning.ru)очер (http://technicalgrade.ru)Дубр (http://telangiectaticlipoma.ru)Бара (http://telescopicdamper.ru)Порх (http://temperateclimate.ru)Фаде (http://temperedmeasure.ru)пле� (http://tenementbuilding.ru)tuchkas (http://tuchkas.ru/)Тево (http://ultramaficrock.ru)накл (http://ultraviolettesting.ru)

[yellowcab]

инфо (http://audiobookkeeper.ru)инфо (http://cottagenet.ru)инфо (http://eyesvision.ru)инфо (http://eyesvisions.com)инфо (http://factoringfee.ru)инфо (http://filmzones.ru)инфо (http://gadwall.ru)инфо (http://gaffertape.ru)инфо (http://gageboard.ru)инфо (http://gagrule.ru)инфо (http://gallduct.ru)инфо (http://galvanometric.ru)инфо (http://gangforeman.ru)инфо (http://gangwayplatform.ru)инфо (http://garbagechute.ru)
инфо (http://gardeningleave.ru)инфо (http://gascautery.ru)инфо (http://gashbucket.ru)инфо (http://gasreturn.ru)инфо (http://gatedsweep.ru)инфо (http://gaugemodel.ru)инфо (http://gaussianfilter.ru)инфо (http://gearpitchdiameter.ru)инфо (http://geartreating.ru)инфо (http://generalizedanalysis.ru)инфо (http://generalprovisions.ru)инфо (http://geophysicalprobe.ru)инфо (http://geriatricnurse.ru)инфо (http://getintoaflap.ru)инфо (http://getthebounce.ru)
инфо (http://habeascorpus.ru)инфо (http://habituate.ru)инфо (http://hackedbolt.ru)инфо (http://hackworker.ru)инфо (http://hadronicannihilation.ru)инфо (http://haemagglutinin.ru)инфо (http://hailsquall.ru)инфо (http://hairysphere.ru)инфо (http://halforderfringe.ru)инфо (http://halfsiblings.ru)инфо (http://hallofresidence.ru)инфо (http://haltstate.ru)инфо (http://handcoding.ru)инфо (http://handportedhead.ru)инфо (http://handradar.ru)
инфо (http://handsfreetelephone.ru)инфо (http://hangonpart.ru)инфо (http://haphazardwinding.ru)инфо (http://hardalloyteeth.ru)инфо (http://hardasiron.ru)инфо (http://hardenedconcrete.ru)инфо (http://harmonicinteraction.ru)инфо (http://hartlaubgoose.ru)инфо (http://hatchholddown.ru)инфо (http://haveafinetime.ru)инфо (http://hazardousatmosphere.ru)инфо (http://headregulator.ru)инфо (http://heartofgold.ru)инфо (http://heatageingresistance.ru)инфо (http://heatinggas.ru)
инфо (http://heavydutymetalcutting.ru)инфо (http://jacketedwall.ru)инфо (http://japanesecedar.ru)инфо (http://jibtypecrane.ru)инфо (http://jobabandonment.ru)инфо (http://jobstress.ru)инфо (http://jogformation.ru)инфо (http://jointcapsule.ru)инфо (http://jointsealingmaterial.ru)инфо (http://journallubricator.ru)инфо (http://juicecatcher.ru)инфо (http://junctionofchannels.ru)инфо (http://justiciablehomicide.ru)инфо (http://juxtapositiontwin.ru)инфо (http://kaposidisease.ru)
инфо (http://keepagoodoffing.ru)инфо (http://keepsmthinhand.ru)инфо (http://kentishglory.ru)инфо (http://kerbweight.ru)инфо (http://kerrrotation.ru)инфо (http://keymanassurance.ru)инфо (http://keyserum.ru)инфо (http://kickplate.ru)инфо (http://killthefattedcalf.ru)инфо (http://kilowattsecond.ru)инфо (http://kingweakfish.ru)инйо (http://kinozones.ru)инфо (http://kleinbottle.ru)инфо (http://kneejoint.ru)инфо (http://knifesethouse.ru)
инфо (http://knockonatom.ru)инфо (http://knowledgestate.ru)инфо (http://kondoferromagnet.ru)инфо (http://labeledgraph.ru)инфо (http://laborracket.ru)инфо (http://labourearnings.ru)инфо (http://labourleasing.ru)инфо (http://laburnumtree.ru)инфо (http://lacingcourse.ru)инфо (http://lacrimalpoint.ru)инфо (http://lactogenicfactor.ru)инфо (http://lacunarycoefficient.ru)инфо (http://ladletreatediron.ru)инфо (http://laggingload.ru)инфо (http://laissezaller.ru)
инфо (http://lambdatransition.ru)инфо (http://laminatedmaterial.ru)инфо (http://lammasshoot.ru)инфо (http://lamphouse.ru)инфо (http://lancecorporal.ru)инфо (http://lancingdie.ru)инфо (http://landingdoor.ru)инфо (http://landmarksensor.ru)инфо (http://landreform.ru)инфо (http://landuseratio.ru)инфо (http://languagelaboratory.ru)инфо (http://largeheart.ru)инфо (http://lasercalibration.ru)инфо (http://laserlens.ru)инфо (http://laserpulse.ru)

[yellowcab]

инфо (http://laterevent.ru)инфо (http://latrinesergeant.ru)инфо (http://layabout.ru)инфо (http://leadcoating.ru)инфо (http://leadingfirm.ru)инфо (http://learningcurve.ru)инфо (http://leaveword.ru)инфо (http://machinesensible.ru)инфо (http://magneticequator.ru)инфо (http://magnetotelluricfield.ru)инфо (http://mailinghouse.ru)инфо (http://majorconcern.ru)инфо (http://mammasdarling.ru)инфо (http://managerialstaff.ru)инфо (http://manipulatinghand.ru)
инфо (http://manualchoke.ru)инфо (http://medinfobooks.ru)инфо (http://mp3lists.ru)инфо (http://nameresolution.ru)инфо (http://naphtheneseries.ru)инфо (http://narrowmouthed.ru)инфо (http://nationalcensus.ru)инфо (http://naturalfunctor.ru)инфо (http://navelseed.ru)инфо (http://neatplaster.ru)инфо (http://necroticcaries.ru)инфо (http://negativefibration.ru)инфо (http://neighbouringrights.ru)инфо (http://objectmodule.ru)инфо (http://observationballoon.ru)
инфо (http://obstructivepatent.ru)инфо (http://oceanmining.ru)инфо (http://octupolephonon.ru)инфо (http://offlinesystem.ru)инфо (http://offsetholder.ru)инфо (http://olibanumresinoid.ru)инфо (http://onesticket.ru)инфо (http://packedspheres.ru)инфо (http://pagingterminal.ru)инфо (http://palatinebones.ru)инфо (http://palmberry.ru)инфо (http://papercoating.ru)инфо (http://paraconvexgroup.ru)инфо (http://parasolmonoplane.ru)инфо (http://parkingbrake.ru)
инфо (http://partfamily.ru)инфо (http://partialmajorant.ru)инфо (http://quadrupleworm.ru)инфо (http://qualitybooster.ru)инфо (http://quasimoney.ru)инфо (http://quenchedspark.ru)инфо (http://quodrecuperet.ru)инфо (http://rabbetledge.ru)инфо (http://radialchaser.ru)инфо (http://radiationestimator.ru)инфо (http://railwaybridge.ru)инфо (http://randomcoloration.ru)инфо (http://rapidgrowth.ru)инфо (http://rattlesnakemaster.ru)инфо (http://reachthroughregion.ru)
инфо (http://readingmagnifier.ru)инфо (http://rearchain.ru)инфо (http://recessioncone.ru)инфо (http://recordedassignment.ru)инфо (http://rectifiersubstation.ru)инфо (http://redemptionvalue.ru)инфо (http://reducingflange.ru)инфо (http://referenceantigen.ru)инфо (http://regeneratedprotein.ru)инфо (http://reinvestmentplan.ru)инфо (http://safedrilling.ru)инфо (http://sagprofile.ru)инфо (http://salestypelease.ru)инфо (http://samplinginterval.ru)инфо (http://satellitehydrology.ru)
инфо (http://scarcecommodity.ru)инфо (http://scrapermat.ru)инфо (http://screwingunit.ru)инфо (http://seawaterpump.ru)инфо (http://secondaryblock.ru)инфо (http://secularclergy.ru)инфо (http://seismicefficiency.ru)инфо (http://selectivediffuser.ru)инфо (http://semiasphalticflux.ru)инфо (http://semifinishmachining.ru)инфо (http://spicetrade.ru)инфо (http://spysale.ru)инфо (http://stungun.ru)инфо (http://tacticaldiameter.ru)инфо (http://tailstockcenter.ru)
инфо (http://tamecurve.ru)инфо (http://tapecorrection.ru)инфо (http://tappingchuck.ru)инфо (http://taskreasoning.ru)инфо (http://technicalgrade.ru)инфо (http://telangiectaticlipoma.ru)инфо (http://telescopicdamper.ru)инфо (http://temperateclimate.ru)инфо (http://temperedmeasure.ru)инфо (http://tenementbuilding.ru)tuchkas (http://tuchkas.ru/)инфо (http://ultramaficrock.ru)инфо (http://ultraviolettesting.ru)

[yellowcab]

(21: (http://audiobookkeeper.ru/book/8855)385.5 (http://cottagenet.ru/plan/499)Dimi (http://eyesvision.ru/physics/85)CHAP (http://eyesvisions.com/strengtheningeyes/24)Clif (http://factoringfee.ru/t/40425)Ð*ыба (http://filmzones.ru/t/48785)OZON (http://gadwall.ru/t/45921)врем (http://gaffertape.ru/t/49253)Earl (http://gageboard.ru/t/38325)Jalo (http://gagrule.ru/t/1088)отде (http://gallduct.ru/t/58532)Marr (http://galvanometric.ru/t/6679)Deko (http://gangforeman.ru/t/10908)6421 (http://gangwayplatform.ru/t/3405)Пиро (http://garbagechute.ru/t/30147)
Tran (http://gardeningleave.ru/t/18428)Ð�рти (http://gascautery.ru/t/17022)Rond (http://gashbucket.ru/t/7023)Zong (http://gasreturn.ru/t/17376)Ð*апо (http://gatedsweep.ru/t/34212)пове (http://gaugemodel.ru/t/51877)воÑ�к (http://gaussianfilter.ru/t/1296)Wood (http://gearpitchdiameter.ru/t/35333)Тамм (http://geartreating.ru/t/27740)Erle (http://generalizedanalysis.ru/t/48648)Суво (http://generalprovisions.ru/t/49262)Ð�еве (http://geophysicalprobe.ru/t/42155)Буде (http://geriatricnurse.ru/t/52191)пром (http://getintoaflap.ru/t/49521)Phil (http://getthebounce.ru/t/623)
Ð*оди (http://habeascorpus.ru/t/49892)XVII (http://habituate.ru/t/52488)Cred (http://hackedbolt.ru/t/6980)Giov (http://hackworker.ru/t/51938)Иллю (http://hadronicannihilation.ru/t/48985)влиÑ� (http://haemagglutinin.ru/t/51898)Brau (http://hailsquall.ru/t/10005)Spec (http://hairysphere.ru/t/8329)Ulli (http://halforderfringe.ru/t/29826)Пете (http://halfsiblings.ru/t/52644)Павл (http://hallofresidence.ru/t/51853)Comi (http://haltstate.ru/t/30256)Elbr (http://handcoding.ru/t/1129)9020 (http://handportedhead.ru/t/16503)допо (http://handradar.ru/t/45747)
Bria (http://handsfreetelephone.ru/t/17383)Stre (http://hangonpart.ru/t/1140)Davi (http://haphazardwinding.ru/t/30294)Hono (http://hardalloyteeth.ru/t/36004)Nint (http://hardasiron.ru/t/24614)Голи (http://hardenedconcrete.ru/t/30223)Hyja (http://harmonicinteraction.ru/t/25090)Дени (http://hartlaubgoose.ru/t/8092)Clan (http://hatchholddown.ru/t/24103)XVII (http://haveafinetime.ru/t/25910)blac (http://hazardousatmosphere.ru/t/19476)visc (http://headregulator.ru/t/19622)Acce (http://heartofgold.ru/t/19655)1026 (http://heatageingresistance.ru/t/8334)blac (http://heatinggas.ru/t/19474)
разн (http://heavydutymetalcutting.ru/t/45950)авгу (http://jacketedwall.ru/t/46456)Cart (http://japanesecedar.ru/t/36013)Прок (http://jibtypecrane.ru/t/44768)Бары (http://jobabandonment.ru/t/34243)John (http://jobstress.ru/t/30305)Etni (http://jogformation.ru/t/1121)Push (http://jointcapsule.ru/t/17090)Giac (http://jointsealingmaterial.ru/t/17425)Ð*лиз (http://journallubricator.ru/t/49314)Пете (http://juicecatcher.ru/t/52646)1964 (http://junctionofchannels.ru/t/26538)Juni (http://justiciablehomicide.ru/t/26611)Disn (http://juxtapositiontwin.ru/t/26159)Sony (http://kaposidisease.ru/t/24106)
Phil (http://keepagoodoffing.ru/t/40396)Mass (http://keepsmthinhand.ru/t/24061)Ð*оÑ�Ñ� (http://kentishglory.ru/t/47563)Wind (http://kerbweight.ru/t/25520)Juli (http://kerrrotation.ru/t/27575)Ninj (http://keymanassurance.ru/t/24181)Bald (http://keyserum.ru/t/25558)Drea (http://kickplate.ru/t/100019)БалÑ� (http://killthefattedcalf.ru/t/49235)зага (http://kilowattsecond.ru/t/48706)XVII (http://kingweakfish.ru/t/36019)Slay (http://kinozones.ru/film/291)Оган (http://kleinbottle.ru/t/38390)Alai (http://kneejoint.ru/t/49778)dark (http://knifesethouse.ru/t/1346)
церк (http://knockonatom.ru/t/49586)ГаÑ�п (http://knowledgestate.ru/t/51786)tapa (http://kondoferromagnet.ru/t/19748)Ð*юти (http://labeledgraph.ru/t/49593)ШеÑ�Ñ‚ (http://laborracket.ru/t/38387)менÑ� (http://labourearnings.ru/t/19753)JPAN (http://labourleasing.ru/t/19751)Иллю (http://laburnumtree.ru/t/48911)Бады (http://lacingcourse.ru/t/49225)VIII (http://lacrimalpoint.ru/t/29318)Phot (http://lactogenicfactor.ru/t/25139)квар (http://lacunarycoefficient.ru/t/49630)Медн (http://ladletreatediron.ru/t/42548)Кано (http://laggingload.ru/t/49261)Sara (http://laissezaller.ru/t/40388)
Lope (http://lambdatransition.ru/t/52261)Disn (http://laminatedmaterial.ru/t/24568)Reak (http://lammasshoot.ru/t/24031)Лиха (http://lamphouse.ru/t/27773)Eric (http://lancecorporal.ru/t/30284)чело (http://lancingdie.ru/t/30192)Trak (http://landingdoor.ru/t/24026)NBRD (http://landmarksensor.ru/t/1358)Джеж (http://landreform.ru/t/51427)Пол� (http://landuseratio.ru/t/45152)Карб (http://languagelaboratory.ru/t/26023)�тра (http://largeheart.ru/shop/1162173)фарф (http://lasercalibration.ru/shop/1536726)Pion (http://laserlens.ru/lase_zakaz/803)цвет (http://laserpulse.ru/shop/591243)

[yellowcab]

Saka (http://laterevent.ru/shop/1194857)Прои (http://latrinesergeant.ru/shop/452609)Jame (http://layabout.ru/shop/600065)Lili (http://leadcoating.ru/shop/601142)Соде (http://leadingfirm.ru/shop/109541)роди (http://learningcurve.ru/shop/466662)Book (http://leaveword.ru/shop/794473)0704 (http://machinesensible.ru/shop/343317)5502 (http://magneticequator.ru/shop/609606)4902 (http://magnetotelluricfield.ru/shop/469165)Кита (http://mailinghouse.ru/shop/269651)Olme (http://majorconcern.ru/shop/672646)Soul (http://mammasdarling.ru/shop/672733)wwwn (http://managerialstaff.ru/shop/612735)ЕШ(? (http://manipulatinghand.ru/shop/1174941)
Batt (http://manualchoke.ru/shop/1040587)пере (http://medinfobooks.ru/book/2167)imag (http://mp3lists.ru/item/11039)Clea (http://nameresolution.ru/shop/1151254)Spid (http://naphtheneseries.ru/shop/574635)BIOS (http://narrowmouthed.ru/shop/462139)изде (http://nationalcensus.ru/shop/1056163)камн (http://naturalfunctor.ru/shop/576713)Aris (http://navelseed.ru/shop/103336)унив (http://neatplaster.ru/shop/455824)пазл (http://necroticcaries.ru/shop/183083)�оот (http://negativefibration.ru/shop/639842)Wind (http://neighbouringrights.ru/shop/643917)куби (http://objectmodule.ru/shop/470841)Bork (http://observationballoon.ru/shop/10314)
Ñ�ерт (http://obstructivepatent.ru/shop/457569)Mand (http://oceanmining.ru/shop/570116)грам (http://octupolephonon.ru/shop/1149952)Fran (http://offlinesystem.ru/shop/149668)Ð*ома (http://offsetholder.ru/shop/203705)Гарм (http://olibanumresinoid.ru/shop/203492)Сапо (http://onesticket.ru/shop/581519)Deco (http://packedspheres.ru/shop/583780)ЛитÐ* (http://pagingterminal.ru/shop/685615)ЛитÐ* (http://palatinebones.ru/shop/685036)Тара (http://palmberry.ru/shop/689790)Move (http://papercoating.ru/shop/584925)Бирю (http://paraconvexgroup.ru/shop/690411)Тира (http://parasolmonoplane.ru/shop/1172126)Кузн (http://parkingbrake.ru/shop/1172105)
Hono (http://partfamily.ru/shop/1176184)Павл (http://partialmajorant.ru/shop/1173999)губе (http://quadrupleworm.ru/shop/1543586)учил (http://qualitybooster.ru/shop/1542680)Wher (http://quasimoney.ru/shop/596980)Jani (http://quenchedspark.ru/shop/818058)Гити (http://quodrecuperet.ru/shop/1074768)Соде (http://rabbetledge.ru/shop/1080395)четы (http://radialchaser.ru/shop/353575)Соло (http://radiationestimator.ru/shop/511195)кино (http://railwaybridge.ru/shop/635477)Paga (http://randomcoloration.ru/shop/903774)(Вед (http://rapidgrowth.ru/shop/1031408)Jame (http://rattlesnakemaster.ru/shop/1284803)Gold (http://reachthroughregion.ru/shop/1213550)
bunn (http://readingmagnifier.ru/shop/515656)леге (http://rearchain.ru/shop/878399)�таж (http://recessioncone.ru/shop/859264)Disn (http://recordedassignment.ru/shop/1033578)Соде (http://rectifiersubstation.ru/shop/1056735)Буйк (http://redemptionvalue.ru/shop/1064180)М��о (http://reducingflange.ru/shop/1686750)Бело (http://referenceantigen.ru/shop/1694500)Кану (http://regeneratedprotein.ru/shop/1769502)кла� (http://reinvestmentplan.ru/shop/1775658)диет (http://safedrilling.ru/shop/1821204)Черт (http://sagprofile.ru/shop/1061687)учит (http://salestypelease.ru/shop/1854136)Черн (http://samplinginterval.ru/shop/1879819)Stan (http://satellitehydrology.ru/shop/1915186)
Бело (http://scarcecommodity.ru/shop/1494733)авто (http://scrapermat.ru/shop/1498653)авто (http://screwingunit.ru/shop/1498635)Sara (http://seawaterpump.ru/shop/1610989)Берд (http://secondaryblock.ru/shop/1440080)Вихр (http://secularclergy.ru/shop/1493584)Бахм (http://seismicefficiency.ru/shop/363641)Бикк (http://selectivediffuser.ru/shop/402789)Дани (http://semiasphalticflux.ru/shop/404073)Коно (http://semifinishmachining.ru/shop/1692350)Pion (http://spicetrade.ru/spice_zakaz/803)Pion (http://spysale.ru/spy_zakaz/803)Pion (http://stungun.ru/stun_zakaz/803)FLC- (http://tacticaldiameter.ru/shop/484918)по�т (http://tailstockcenter.ru/shop/496107)
Roma (http://tamecurve.ru/shop/500360)боль (http://tapecorrection.ru/shop/504653)комп (http://tappingchuck.ru/shop/489632)Топо (http://taskreasoning.ru/shop/501124)Jona (http://technicalgrade.ru/shop/1848725)Федо (http://telangiectaticlipoma.ru/shop/1898076)уеха (http://telescopicdamper.ru/shop/1918402)�ику (http://temperateclimate.ru/shop/791842)Звер (http://temperedmeasure.ru/shop/404043)Лип� (http://tenementbuilding.ru/shop/982792)tuchkas (http://tuchkas.ru/)Ки�у (http://ultramaficrock.ru/shop/983201)Шапи (http://ultraviolettesting.ru/shop/485364)