.22 as a weapon!

[Wildthang]

I have always thought that a .22 rifle is fairly viable as a defense weapon. Not the weapon of choice, but viable if it is all you have. I got in an argument with a guy a while back because he was bragging on his new 9MM semi auto pistol, and I simply stated that within 50 yards it is OK for self defense, but at a 100 yards a .22 would eat his lunch. This guy actually got mad, and was telling me that he could hit a man sized target with a 9MM at 100 yards consistantly. When I ask him if had been target shooting at 100 yards with his new fearsom weapon he stated that he had not shot it yet but was going to the range the next weekend.
Dont get me wrong, for a concealed carry situation there is no doubt that a 9MM is OK, but if I was going to be out in the wilderness trying to survive in a SHTF situation, I would take .22 bolt action or semi auto 10 to 1 over almost any pistol, wouldn't you? And I am speaking of standard semi auto pistols not the Ruger Chargers, or the specialty pistols that shoot rifle cartridges or 10" barreled revolvers with a scope!
Some of these 1st time gun owners just crack me up:smartass:

[2dumb2kwit]

At 25 yards, with a handgun, I'm happy if I'm knocking down most of the bowling pins that I shoot at. At the same distance, with a 10/22 and a 4x scope, I can pick the head off of a squirrel, so's not mess up the meat. :chef:

[kyratshooter]

????AGAIN????

Not again? Please not again!!!

Pulling out the fingernails was bad, cutting off the eyelids was bad, gouging out the left eye was horrible, but ths is more than a human can take.

Please put the .22 shell in the chamber, place it firmly behind my ear (the only place a .22 has a 50/50 chance of success) and end this misery.

[ElevenBravo]

Each situation will dictate what weapon and caliber is best suited. Thats whey there is no "one perfect gun", though the debate still rages on many forums.

[2dumb2kwit]

????AGAIN????

Not again? Please not again!!!

Pulling out the fingernails was bad, cutting off the eyelids was bad, gouging out the left eye was horrible, but ths is more than a human can take.

Please put the .22 shell in the chamber, place it firmly behind my ear (the only place a .22 has a 50/50 chance of success) and end this misery.

...or they could decapitate you........with a Mora. :mellow:

[Sourdough]

My 200 yard Coyote rifle w/ 12X Leupold
http://www.cz-usa.com/products/view/cz-452-ultra-lux/

[Sarge47]

Okay, let's see a show of hands for those that will volunteer to be shot in the chest at 100 yards by a high velocity .22 LR hollow point! (No body armor allowed.) Any takers? :confused1: :innocent: :sneaky2:

[kyratshooter]

Okay, let's see a show of hands for those that will volunteer to be shot in the chest at 100 yards by a high velocity .22 LR hollow point! (No body armor allowed.) Any takers? :confused1: :innocent: :sneaky2:

Tell you what Sarge, I have a .177 high velocity pellet rifle I would not want shot at me at 100 yards!!!! That proves nothing!

I do not want a slingshot or BB gun aimed at me at 100 yards!

That is not an endorsement of either slingshot or bb gun as a survival tool.

If all I had was a .22 I would use it, but I doubt I would voluntarily walk into a survival situation with only a .22 and really do not see how I would wind up in such a drastic and depraved circumstance.

[Echo2]

The lady who taught my NRA instructors class....and my Instructors Pistol, Rifle, Shotgun Disciplines....and my Instructors Home Firearm Safety class.....Carried only a 9 shot .22 LR Taurus revolver.

Any thing is better than nothing....and if a feather weight 22LR light weight pistol is what you are going to use for CCW.....having it is better than not.

If you think most of the criminal element will continue to attack during an onslaught of 22 cal lead flying at them and hitting their mark....Then by all means carry something different.

However....I know of at least 4 instructors personally....who are way more learned than me....that carry either 22lr or 32.

Why some folks get so bent out of shape with other folks opinions is beyond me......cause everyone knows this internet opinion stuff is real serious.....:glare:

[kyratshooter]

deleted...

I must go take an asprin.

[Old Professor]

Personally, my backup self defense handgun is a KelTec PMR30. 30 rounds of Hornady Critical Defense 22 Mag rouinds is going to stop or discourage most attackers. At least until I can reach my shotgun!

[crashdive123]

My 200 yard Coyote rifle w/ 12X Leupold
http://www.cz-usa.com/products/view/cz-452-ultra-lux/

When I click on your link I get "502 Bad Gateway". Is that anything like bad puppy?

[2dumb2kwit]

Personally, my backup self defense handgun is a KelTec PMR30. 30 rounds of Hornady Critical Defense 22 Mag rouinds is going to stop or discourage most attackers. At least until I can reach my shotgun!

Well, now we're getting somewhere. A .22 AND a shotty.

[2dumb2kwit]

When I click on your link I get "502 Bad Gateway". Is that anything like bad puppy?

"502 Bad Gateway"? Is that like not having a door?

[natertot]

A .22 is better than nothing, like a bicycle is better than walking.......How far would you bike before you say "gee, I wish I had a car"?

[Sarge47]

Tell you what Sarge, I have a .177 high velocity pellet rifle I would not want shot at me at 100 yards!!!! That proves nothing!

I do not want a slingshot or BB gun aimed at me at 100 yards!

That is not an endorsement of either slingshot or bb gun as a survival tool.

If all I had was a .22 I would use it, but I doubt I would voluntarily walk into a survival situation with only a .22 and really do not see how I would wind up in such a drastic and depraved circumstance.

You don't live in Illinois, you live in a really cool state! Here you can't even use a high-powered rifle for hunting...only black powder or a shotgun! Besides, .22 ammo costs a lot less! :rambo:

[intothenew]

How far can you walk carrying 40 gallon of diesel fuel vs. one gallon of two stroke mix?

[hunter63]

I have always thought that a .22 rifle is fairly viable as a defense weapon. Not the weapon of choice, but viable if it is all you have. I got in an argument with a guy a while back because he was bragging on his new 9MM semi auto pistol, and I simply stated that within 50 yards it is OK for self defense, but at a 100 yards a .22 would eat his lunch. This guy actually got mad, and was telling me that he could hit a man sized target with a 9MM at 100 yards consistantly. When I ask him if had been target shooting at 100 yards with his new fearsom weapon he stated that he had not shot it yet but was going to the range the next weekend.
Dont get me wrong, for a concealed carry situation there is no doubt that a 9MM is OK, but if I was going to be out in the wilderness trying to survive in a SHTF situation, I would take .22 bolt action or semi auto 10 to 1 over almost any pistol, wouldn't you? And I am speaking of standard semi auto pistols not the Ruger Chargers, or the specialty pistols that shoot rifle cartridges or 10" barreled revolvers with a scope!
Some of these 1st time gun owners just crack me up:smartass:

You know that the only way to settle it between y'all is a day at the range........ain't gotta say it, just gotta do it.....Preformance talks, BS walks......Have at it.

[Bushman]

My 200 yard Coyote rifle w/ 12X Leupold
http://www.cz-usa.com/products/view/cz-452-ultra-lux/

damn good rifles those CZ's..........

I've got the earlier version, once known as 'Brno's.....no idea how many rounds have been through it, was lying rusting in a farmers shed when I found a decade back, but it still puts Powerpoints where they need to go with alacrity. I keep all of my shots to about 70 yds max.........however if you HAD to use it for 'other purposes' I sure as hell wouldn't want to be at the wrong end of 200 yds !!! Likely won't kill ya, barring a fluke shot into an eyeball..... but it'll sure as hell 'discourage' any right thinkin yuman bean !! ;)

[Daniel Nighteyes]

damn good rifles those CZ's..........

Yup. My CZ 452 Varmint, topped with an excellent piece of glass, is an incredibly consistent performer out to about 400 yards (if the wind isn't kicking up). At 400 yds I shoot balloons and paper-plate-sized steel targets to practice my long(er) range shooting -- same type of scope, same general feel, much cheaper to shoot. To prevent anyone from getting the wrong impression, I wouldn't dream of trying it as a "hunting" rifle at anywhere near that distance

I notice, on the CZ website, they've upgraded it just a bit, and renamed it the CZ 453.

[Sarge47]

I know that a high-powered rifle and/or pistol can do a lot more damage than a .22, LR or magnum, however for those of us who don't have the cash for the bigger guns, a .22 LR can still stop somebody, even if it doesn't kill them. Here's an example of the damage that it can do, remember, this is from one round from a .22...I don't know if it was a LR or not.

About 47 years ago there was this guy who nobody really liked. Then I read in the paper that he'd thrown a loaded .22 into a closet and it went off, shooting him in the chest. There is another version that says he was shot by somebody else for seeing the wrong girl, but who knows for sure. What we do know, however, is that the bullet went into his chest and lodged somewhere in his spine and he's still a parapalegic in a wheelchair to this day. There was no way he could get back up and come after anybody, he was down for the count, although not dead.

If I had the dough I'd buy a Ruger Mini 14 and a 1911 .45. Theyre on my "wish list," but I don't see that happening. Also, if push comes to shove I have a .20 ga. with 00 buckshot for close range. Either one will get the job done...and, oh yeah, I have several 25 round clips for the Ruger 10/22 if I need them. :ph34r:

[kyratshooter]

OK folks, the state you live in and price does not change ballistics.

It's still a .22. Better than nothing but still not a real gun.

If you shoot anything enough, with whatever you have, it will eventually die of blood loss.

[Echo2]

http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5304/5629655320_770cfe7a65_z.jpg

http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5107/5737650792_0f05a3f3a9_z.jpg

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7136/6881988750_ca0f8c4ca9_z.jpg

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8006/7270045504_2401fefc5e_z.jpg

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7265/7701245010_a83569b4bf_z.jpg

Last time I checked these were real guns

[kyratshooter]

Lets just say that for the money you put into all that you could have had a real gun!

[Echo2]

These are just some of my 22s....If you mean higher cal guns....I got a couple.

You should invest in a 22.....and practice....it is a very capable gun.

[crashdive123]

I have several 22's. I'll be picking up another this Friday - ya gotta love when your favorite gun shop runs a Black Friday sale.

[Daniel Nighteyes]

If I had the dough I'd buy a Ruger Mini 14 and a 1911 .45.

Sarge,

Save yer money by not buying the Mini-14. After all, IMO, it's the rifle that spawned the term "minute-of-barn-door accuracy."

For several, extremely personal reasons, I used to be a major opponent of anything that smacked of the original "poodle-shooter" (AR-16). I owned two Mini-14's (an original 180- series and a 181-series), and considered myself well-heeled. I did, that is, until Chance decreed that I should shoot a modern-day AR-15.

With a little careful shopping, Sarge, you should be able to equip yourself with a modern AR-15 at about the same price you'd spend on a Mini-14. And once you get it out to the range, you won't BELIEVE the difference in accuracy/consistency with just about any ammo you can feed it.

-- Nighteyes

[deafdave3]

I'm also a big fan of .22's.... both handgun and rifles.

[kyratshooter]

These are just some of my 22s....If you mean higher cal guns....I got a couple.

You should invest in a 22.....and practice....it is a very capable gun.

Echo, I have 6-8 .22s and several K rounds in the gun room. I'm just razzing folks to keep the thread going! So far it's working.

[Echo2]

Echo, I have 6-8 .22s and several K rounds in the gun room. I'm just razzing folks to keep the thread going! So far it's working.

Same here.

[hunter63]

http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5304/5629655320_770cfe7a65_z.jpg

http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5107/5737650792_0f05a3f3a9_z.jpg

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7136/6881988750_ca0f8c4ca9_z.jpg

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8006/7270045504_2401fefc5e_z.jpg

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7265/7701245010_a83569b4bf_z.jpg

Last time I checked these were real guns

As the OP stated ...22 as a weapon, I have to give style points for bolting on, be it factory or after market BadAzz, tactcool stuff..........What no Bull Pup?

[Echo2]

As the OP stated ...22 as a weapon, I have to give style points for bolting on, be it factory or after market BadAzz, tactcool stuff..........What no Bull Pup?

They stock on the take down was a true mod and fit.

The others were a lot of strip it down and build it up.....a bit of clean up work on triggers and fit.

The MKIII at the bottom is waiting to have a SparrowSS mounted to it.....PacLite upper and a Volquartsen lower.......I'm working a custom bolt pin and light weight bolt/w spring....to quite it even further...:)

[kyratshooter]

And in the end

it's still

just a .22!

[hunter63]

Shushhhh, I'm getting around to pushing off an add on Bull Pup stock,on him that I have laying around, left over from my "those are tactcool and gotta have one"...., phase.

[Echo2]

So which of those are "tacticool"?

The bullpups are junk...there is a reason you took it off....interesting concept....trigger and girth are ridiculous.

I love 22lr guns....been collecting them for years. I'm a 10/22 and MKII junkie....but not limited to that.....last count was 31.

The M&P 15/22 was acquired in a trade....and is one of the funnest training weapons I own....the pic above is set up in a night time pest dispatcher......PVS14 and PAQ/4C. 2 skunks, a possum, and a coyote have all met their doom for messing around the chicken coop in the wee hours.

The Mrs is in love with a 5" SS bull barrel MKII.....and at 10 yards can hold a 8" group while rapid firing. She knows the weapon....and is good with it. I have no qualms with her using it for self defense....due to the fact she is comfortable with it. Would I prefer she use a 9mm or greater.....yes....but rounds on target wouldn't be the same. We are working on her training with a Glock 19....and she is coming along nicely.

I just don't see folks getting blasted for thinking the 22lr is a valid firearm....as being constructive....just critical and self righteous.

I have sent well....WELL over 20k rounds of 22lr down range....and am a better shooter with harder cals for doing so. Any time spent with the firearm in your hand.....learning grip....sight picture....stance....is going to help.....and if I happen to be out with nothing but the first pistol I ever bought with me...a 6 7/8" Gov't Model MKII.....God help ya if I perceive you as a mortal threat.

[hunter63]

Yeah, you are correct.....and a 30 rd mag won't fit too well....LOL, but hey, gotta give a guy credit for trying to unload an "extra"....

Won a Mossberg Plinkster with the M&P stock in a raffle at a DU event, and yeah it looks cool, and fun to play with....

Tactical just isn't my thing....but hey, everyone has to collect something.

[Wildthang]

Lets just say that for the money you put into all that you could have had a real gun!

You just need the frontal area of a large bullet so you can hit large targets. Like your brother hepit said, bulley placement is where it's at, and a 9MM is no protection:smartass:

[Sarge47]

Sarge,

Save yer money by not buying the Mini-14. After all, IMO, it's the rifle that spawned the term "minute-of-barn-door accuracy."

For several, extremely personal reasons, I used to be a major opponent of anything that smacked of the original "poodle-shooter" (AR-16). I owned two Mini-14's (an original 180- series and a 181-series), and considered myself well-heeled. I did, that is, until Chance decreed that I should shoot a modern-day AR-15.

With a little careful shopping, Sarge, you should be able to equip yourself with a modern AR-15 at about the same price you'd spend on a Mini-14. And once you get it out to the range, you won't BELIEVE the difference in accuracy/consistency with just about any ammo you can feed it.

-- Nighteyes

Both my oldest (Marine) son and my kid brother own AR 15's. Around here they run about a grand. The Wacko that entered Farm King with one, shot at the cops, then put one into his oown head didn't help much, sorry to say.

AR-15: $995.00 + tax

Mini 14: $695 + tax

1911 .45: $600 to $1100 + tax

Ruger Mark II: $300 + tax.

Ruger 10/22: $250 and up + tax.

The ability to put a .22LR round through a human eyeball at 100 yards: Priceless! :rambo:

[kyratshooter]

Yea, but you are not going to be able to do that with a stock 10/22 or MkII!

I have owned both and neither will give eyeball accuracy @100yds even after being tuned severely.

Neither will 99.9% of the.22s out there.

[deafdave3]

Yea, but you are not going to be able to do that with a stock 10/22 or MkII!

I have owned both and neither will give eyeball accuracy @100yds even after being tuned severely.

Neither will 99.9% of the.22s out there.

My Savage Mark 2 gives that kind of accuracy with Wolf Target Match.

[ElevenBravo]

8552
Carry on folks, enjoying the amazing 22 thread that in the past went the same direction on multiple forums! Bravo!

[Sourdough]

http://www.cz-usa.com/products/view/cz-452-ultra-lux/Rimfire >


CZ 452 Ultra Lux



Product Description


The CZ 452 Ultra Lux is a beechwood version of the CZ 452 Lux. The Ultra Lux has a 28” barrel for more precise shooting with the factory equipped CZ tangent sights. The beechwood stock is offered on this model to bring our customers the same quality you expect from CZ-USA at a lower price. A 10 round magazine is included.

Choose your configuration:

.22 LR, 10-round magazine, beechwood, golden features, 28.625 inch barrel.



Price

$409.00 USD

.22 LR



Magazine Capacity

5 or10 or single



Magazine Type

Detachable



Rate of Twist

1:16 in



Dimensions



Weight

6.800 lbs



Overall Length

46.420 in



Barrel Length

28.620 in



Length of Pull

13.740 in



Features



Barrel

Cold Hammer Forged



Barrel Finish

Blued



Receiver Finish

Blued



Stock

Beechwood



Trigger

Poundage ADJ



Sights

Iron, Adjustable



Safety

Manual Firing Pin Block

[crashdive123]

The M&P 15/22 was acquired in a trade....and is one of the funnest training weapons I own.....

That's what I plan on picking up Friday if the sale price is right. I'll have it set up identically to my S&W M&P 15T and use it as a trainer.

[Sarge47]

Yea, but you are not going to be able to do that with a stock 10/22 or MkII!

I have owned both and neither will give eyeball accuracy @100yds even after being tuned severely.

Neither will 99.9% of the.22s out there.

I didn't say that I could do it, I just said it was priceless! I remember when I was a lot younger, my brother and I had disturbed a Bumble Bee hive and they were flying around. He took them out, one at a time with his .22 semi-auto. I don't care if I kill an attacker or not, just put them down so they can't get up again any time soon is alright by me! :rambo:

[Echo2]

That's what I plan on picking up Friday if the sale price is right. I'll have it set up identically to my S&W M&P 15T and use it as a trainer.

Much cheaper to run drills with.

[2dumb2kwit]

Sarge,

Save yer money by not buying the Mini-14. After all, IMO, it's the rifle that spawned the term "minute-of-barn-door accuracy."

For several, extremely personal reasons, I used to be a major opponent of anything that smacked of the original "poodle-shooter" (AR-16). I owned two Mini-14's (an original 180- series and a 181-series), and considered myself well-heeled. I did, that is, until Chance decreed that I should shoot a modern-day AR-15.

With a little careful shopping, Sarge, you should be able to equip yourself with a modern AR-15 at about the same price you'd spend on a Mini-14. And once you get it out to the range, you won't BELIEVE the difference in accuracy/consistency with just about any ammo you can feed it.

-- Nighteyes

Don't let what the old mini-14 did turn you against the newer ones. The one I had, would shoot 1-1/2" to 2" inch groups at 100 yards all day long, and if I tried really hard, I could keep them inside of 1-1/2". My best 5 shot group being 1.125". Most of the people that I have talked to, with the newer ones have had about the same results. By the way....that 1.125" 100 yards group was with Wolf military classic ammo. I honestly believe that gun is a 1 moa gun. (I'm just not a 1 moa shooter.)

On the other hand, of the 10 to 15 AR-15's that I have seen guys shoot, where I shoot, none of them has gone all day without jamming at least a couple of times. NOT ONE. I went for a while without cleaning that mini-14, just so I could tell the AR guys how many rounds it had fired without cleaning...or a single jam. I finally cleaned it after a few months and a few hundred rounds. (It had still never jammed.)

I'm not a gun guru, and I'm not real smart, but I do try to learn from my experiences. I'd take one of the newer Mini-14's over an AR, even if they were the same price.

[2dumb2kwit]

That's what I plan on picking up Friday if the sale price is right. I'll have it set up identically to my S&W M&P 15T and use it as a trainer.


Much cheaper to run drills with.

Cheaper than an inverter, or batteries?:munchies:

[crashdive123]

Yes, and they don't talk back.

[GreatUsername]

I won't say that I know much about other rounds, but the .22 lr is something with which I am well acquainted, having competed for years now in smallbore. You probably won't see me talking much about other rounds, or the attributes of various pistols and "shotties" ;) due to my experience being almost exclusively in the smallbore targetshooting arena, but I'd like to impart my opinion on this matter. I know how sensitive the subject of .22 stopping power is, particularly on this forum (I've read you guys a lot, found those arguments fascinating) but I have to say that using a .22 as a weapon is contingent on a few factors:

Do you have no other options? If so: .22 is great.

What type of ammo are you using? If hypersonic, that can work, particularly at long range, and if hollowpoint, that's a better self defense round than a plain, all lead bullet. The big issue with high-velocity and copper-jackets is that at close range they will tend to "pencil" through your target, which is not only less effective, but it also could endanger anyone or anything behind the target.

Are you using a pistol or a rifle? I'd say that for this one, it gets a bit fuzzy. As a rifle round, the .22 makes a great deal more sense, in my opinion, based on the precision required to make it effective, but if you are very well practiced with your pistol, and using the right ammo, it could work well for in-home or short-range defense, and has the lovely benefit of not overpenetrating through walls (generally), so you don't accidentally kill your neighbors if you miss (though if you miss, you probably shouldn't be using a .22 in the first place)

And lastly, on the subject of missing, just how accurate are you? A torso shot anywhere with a .45, 9 mm, or .357 is usually enough to stop or kill, unless someone is pretty cranked up on substances, but a .22 generally will not do that. It will hurt. It will certainly kill. But it isn't as fast. It's the difference between being hit by a car, and being hit by a train. I'd reccomend against assuming the shot alone will kill quickly, humanely, or stop an immediate threat with the immediacy you desire, because while it will get the job done MOST of the time, a sloppy shot may not be enough. I would however say that .22 can be a VERY effective weapon if you are accurate enough to hit heart, spine, brain, or other immediate stoppers like that. However, for practical reasons, that means you'd either be shooting from a distance so you have time to line up the shot, or else be confident that you have learned point-shoot aiming well enough.

Again, do take this with a grain of salt, as the vast majority of my experience is with .22 and other smaller calibers. I think that different rounds are suited to different purposes, and that while the .22 may not be as ideal, it is certainly lethal, and I wouldn't rule it out as a weapon, particularly under the right conditions.

[ElevenBravo]

of the 10 to 15 AR-15's that I have seen guys shoot, where I shoot, none of them has gone all day without jamming at least a couple of times.


just so I could tell the AR guys

Ahhh, I knew the "ARs are bad" thingy would sneak in here somehow...

[Wildthang]

Well you are all way off topic except sourdough and 11 bravo, but just to clear things up, or make them worse, I was talking about a 22-250, hey it's still a .22, it will shoot MOA, it will shoot out eye balls, it will instantly kill an attacker, it doesn't jam, it outshoots any AR or M14 that ever existed. Oh, did I say it was a 22:smartass: And Kyrat probbaly still thinks it's not a real gun but would not want to be shot with it!

[Echo2]

Lol.....:)

[ElevenBravo]

Im almost sure the OP was talking about the .22 of the LR variation. Hell, a .223 is close enough to be in the .22 spectrum, but I doubt it would be in the context of the spirit of the post.

[2dumb2kwit]

Ahhh, I knew the "ARs are bad" thingy would sneak in here somehow...

LOL...I guess I did sound like that. I'm sure that there are tons of really good ones. Heck, I have to think there is a reason for so many of them being made. Let's just say that it is not my personal preference. I would never tell anyone not to get one, but what I have seen will keep me from wanting one.

[hunter63]

Well you are all way off topic except sourdough and 11 bravo, but just to clear things up, or make them worse, I was talking about a 22-250, hey it's still a .22, it will shoot MOA, it will shoot out eye balls, it will instantly kill an attacker, it doesn't jam, it outshoots any AR or M14 that ever existed. Oh, did I say it was a 22:smartass: And Kyrat probbaly still thinks it's not a real gun but would not want to be shot with it!

Well at least it took awhile.....besides Krat is messing with you, just to see if we can get 14 pages of every oddball variation of .22 that ever exsisted...
So I'm on to .204 Ruger.....

[2dumb2kwit]

If we're going to use a .22 as a weapon, let's see some pictures of your .22 with a bayonet.

[Wildthang]

If we're going to use a .22 as a weapon, let's see some pictures of your .22 with a bayonet.

Well I'm sure Echo2 has one, he has every bolt on option made for a .22:smartass:

[Wildthang]

Well the guy that has the new 9MM pistol is going to be at the range this weekend, and I am going to get him over to the 100 yard range and see if he can even hit a target at a 100 yards, then I will show him what my little cheap Marlin .22 will do, which should settle the argument. If this guy can even stir up dust below the target I will be really surprised!

[Echo2]

Well I'm sure Echo2 has one, he has every bolt on option made for a .22:smartass:

Nope....only muzzle attachment would be a suppressor....:).....waiting patiently.

However.....I have the TS 22LR conversion for my Glock17.......and they make a rail bayonet for that......and Christmas is a coming.....

[2dumb2kwit]

Oops! I called it a bayonet. To be tacticool on the interweb, I think I'm supposed to call it a ""stabby".:gun_bandana:

[hunter63]

Oops! I called it a bayonet. To be tacticool on the interweb, I think I'm supposed to call it a ""stabby".:gun_bandana:


Bohahahahaha, you just made me spruew...Stabby,,,,,Brohahahaha....shotty+stabby= mall ninja....LOL

[ElevenBravo]

mall ninja
This whole thread is starting to sound mall nijaneze. :laugh:

[kyratshooter]

This whole thread is starting to sound mall nijaneze. :laugh:

You said it, I didn't.

These .22 threads eventually start crawling with mallninjas, mallcops and mall rangers.

[Wildthang]

You said it, I didn't.

These .22 threads eventually start crawling with mallninjas, mallcops and mall rangers.

Okay so you began this thread pretty much saying that .22's were really not even a gun, now you are saying that the lowly .22 attracts mall rats, weirdos, and crawling ninjas. My God where does it ever end.
Some day you are going to be lost in the woods with a .22 and finally figure out that it is the finest rifle to own in a survival scenario. But because of your outward negativity, that is the reason you cant get one shot kills on those racoons:smartass:

[crashdive123]

Krat - I know I might need an extra trailer, but I will gladly take possession of the many 22's that you own.

[hunter63]

.22's are like potato chips.....can't have just one, LOL...everone should have 10 or 20, ...stay away from the canoe......

[Adventure Wolf]

Every forum that has a gun section has this discussion going on constantly. I have never seen a gun cause so many polarized opinions then the .22.

[alaskabushman]

First of all, there are different types of survival. Did you just crash your bush plane in the wilderness? Did you just survive a natural disaster only to find yourself protecting your home and loved ones from looters? Are you walking across a dark parking lot and are accosted by a thug with a knife? All of these are "survival" situations. The merits of the .22 have long been lauded by everyday people and gun "gurus"; Jeff Cooper, Jack O'Conner, Elmer Kieth, Pete Brown, and many others (not to mention contemporary writers). The .22 Short was introduced in 1857 and is the first American metallic cartridge and its still in production today! The .22 LR itself was invented in 1871 and is still alive and well today. I personally have killed a deer with a .22 Mag, and dispatched a wounded Alaskan black bear with a .22 pistol, and killed anther with a .223. Do I hunt blackies with a .22? No way, but I know that in a wilderness survival scenario that the light recoil, low noise, affordable .22 is capable of more than just plinking. My great grandfather owned a strawberry field and often killed deer that were eating his livelihood. I have heard several stories of deer being killed with .22 rifles and pistols.
Do I carry a .22 for defense? No, a .38 or 9mm is my medicine, but I would rather have a .22 in my pocket than a .44 locked up at home. On top of all this, shooting a .22 frequently just makes you a better shot overall.

[hunter63]

Well, alaskabushman, seems this thread was enough to get you back from 2009....LOL, welcome back.

Lots of wisdom in that post, but how many times have you killed a white tail (or any game animal for that matter) and found a old .22 wound that has healed badly?

[alaskabushman]

Thanks! I was signing up so I could reply to this very thread....but it wouldn't let me, for some reason my email address was already in use...so I tried signing in with an old password. Apparently I was on here sometime in the past. Oh well.

I have shot animals that were wounded previously, but were these .22 wounds? I am sure some of them are, but poor shooting is the fault of the shooter and not always the cartridges or the guns fault. Oftentimes people overestimate their skill or their cartridges ability. You can shoot a deer with a .270 and with a crappy shot the deer may still survive. Wild animals are tough critters, and while I have never lost an animal personally I have been with people who have, and I'm sure I may someday. In a survival situation, I dont care how many deer I wound before I kill one, my survival is of utmost importance. Ethics change when its a fight for your life.

[Wildthang]

Well I wouldn't want a .22 where many large predators roam, but anywhere else it would be my gun of choice. Now I'm not Bear Grylls but it seems there is much more opportunity in most places to take small game, more often than anything else. And the .22 is the best rifle for that without a doubt. The AR-7 .22 is the rifle given to pilots to survive with in case they crash so there must be some reason the government thinks the .22 is a survival rifle.
Most of the year when you see people out in the woods, they are packing a .22 rifle or pistol, so there must be a reason that so many people carry .22's................Hmmmmmm what could it be?
My parents lived on a farm in eastern Oklahoma for many years and this place was in the middle of nowhere. All they had was a 12 ga. shotgun, and a .22 bolt action rifle. When they heard something, or felt threatened in any way, they grabbed the .22 and not the shotgun. I ask dad why he picked the .22 over the shotgun and he said, bird shot rarely stops anybody for long, but I can put a real hurtin on them with the old .22 from 100 yards away or more.
My dad felt safe ony having an old Springfield .22 bolt action as a home defense gun, and never once wanted a high powered rifle! That old Springfield .22 has killed more deer and small game than all of my guns combined because it was their food gun for 50 years. The shotgun was used for quail and rabbits, and the .22 was used for squirrel, deer and self defense, I still have those guns and they bring back a lot of old memories.
My dad and mom were both excellent shots, and used to sit in the shade and target practice trying to outshoot each other, so shot placement was never thought about, it just happened and all with open sights, they thought scopes were too expensive and couldn't see any reason to spend that much money when they could hit the target everytime with open sights.
By the time I was somewhere between 2 and 4 years old, they had me shooting that old .22, and was hunting with it by the time I was 8 years old alongside my dad packing his old 12ga.
They were dirt poor, but if they suddenly came by a lot of money, I seriously doubt if they would have bought a large bore rifle because the .22 got the job done!
I remember the time thet a rabbid cow ran my mom and 2 of my sisters up a tree, and they were in that tree for 4 hours until me and dad went looking for them. When he fugured out that the cow was rabbid, he put her down with 2 or 3 shots right between the eyes and never once thought, man I wish I had an AR-15!

[Echo2]

You'll never get some of the folks to let go of their "Dirty Harry" ideology......best just to know your capabilities and limitations with which ever gun you choose to carry.

[Renatus]

deleted.....

[hunter63]

Should I be using regular or synthetic oil in my 2009 Ford F-150?

Go with suggested manufactures recommendations for warranty reasons.....

[Sarge47]

Go with suggested manufactures recommendations for warranty reasons.....

And if it dies on ou shoot it with a .22! :2:

[cwi555]

This is always an interesting topic to me on survival/prep forums. There is the inevitable mall ninja quotes, the 22Lr is the best thing since sliced bread quotes, and the list goes on.
There is also the unmentioned elephant in the room as with most of these threads.

SHTF, TEOTWAWKI, or any other situation where there is no medivac, no chopper to carry you out, or ambulance EMT's to patch you up and carry you to medical aid, your likely dead from any gun shot wound be it a 22 or a 44 mag. The only real difference we are talking here is time to zero heart beat.
Unless you were a sniper, or other spec ops with advanced medical training with good supplies, your time to ZHB is ticking the moment that lead makes a hole in your body, much less multiple holes.
The vast majority of combat vets who were shot, cops who were shot, or any other victim of gunshot wounds are around to tell the tale because of advanced medical care.
A look back in history will graphically display that. For America, the deadliest war was the American civil war. 718,000 dead counting both sides. By contrast, WWII claimed 418,000 lives, and WWI 116,500.
If we had only had 1800's medical tech for WWII, that number would have been closer to a million instead of 418,000. Specifically, in 1942, the war department changed the criteria for a purple heart. The meritorious service element was stripped from the purple heart. Fatal wounds and non-fatal wounds were the new criteria retroactive to Dec 7, 1941. The war department records listed 964,000 purple hearts issued and since 418,000 were fatal, that leaves us with and estimated half a million wounded vets who survived either being blown up or shot. (remember, I am only talking American losses here)
By contrast, any serious wound in the civil war was a much higher probability of being a death sentence. Especially so for bullet wounds regardless of caliber due to infection if nothing else.
If we back further in history and to other countries, it makes even the civil war look like a cake walk. The An Lushan Rebellion in China Circa 755AD claimed an estimated 33 million lives. That was ~15% of the worlds estimated population at the time. If you got stabbed, cut, or shot with an arrow, you were pretty well screwed.

The bottom line is, any gunshot wound that does not have rapid medical care available will likely kill you. For that matter, you can simply cut yourself building a shelter and get yourself killed. Dead is dead, be it a .22 gunshot, a mace to the face, or an open wound from a careless axe stroke.

[Echo2]

This is always an interesting topic to me on survival/prep forums. There is the inevitable mall ninja quotes, the 22Lr is the best thing since sliced bread quotes, and the list goes on.
There is also the unmentioned elephant in the room as with most of these threads.

SHTF, TEOTWAWKI, or any other situation where there is no medivac, no chopper to carry you out, or ambulance EMT's to patch you up and carry you to medical aid, your likely dead from any gun shot wound be it a 22 or a 44 mag. The only real difference we are talking here is time to zero heart beat.
Unless you were a sniper, or other spec ops with advanced medical training with good supplies, your time to ZHB is ticking the moment that lead makes a hole in your body, much less multiple holes.
The vast majority of combat vets who were shot, cops who were shot, or any other victim of gunshot wounds are around to tell the tale because of advanced medical care.
A look back in history will graphically display that. For America, the deadliest war was the American civil war. 718,000 dead counting both sides. By contrast, WWII claimed 418,000 lives, and WWI 116,500.
If we had only had 1800's medical tech for WWII, that number would have been closer to a million instead of 418,000. Specifically, in 1942, the war department changed the criteria for a purple heart. The meritorious service element was stripped from the purple heart. Fatal wounds and non-fatal wounds were the new criteria retroactive to Dec 7, 1941. The war department records listed 964,000 purple hearts issued and since 418,000 were fatal, that leaves us with and estimated half a million wounded vets who survived either being blown up or shot. (remember, I am only talking American losses here)
By contrast, any serious wound in the civil war was a much higher probability of being a death sentence. Especially so for bullet wounds regardless of caliber due to infection if nothing else.
If we back further in history and to other countries, it makes even the civil war look like a cake walk. The An Lushan Rebellion in China Circa 755AD claimed an estimated 33 million lives. That was ~15% of the worlds estimated population at the time. If you got stabbed, cut, or shot with an arrow, you were pretty well screwed.

The bottom line is, any gunshot wound that does not have rapid medical care available will likely kill you. For that matter, you can simply cut yourself building a shelter and get yourself killed. Dead is dead, be it a .22 gunshot, a mace to the face, or an open wound from a careless axe stroke.

Will you please stop being the voice of reason....:)....we'll have none of that in this thread!!

[cwi555]

Will you please stop being the voice of reason....:)....we'll have none of that in this thread!!

My apologies :ohno: please continue :gun_bandana::shuriken::saberbattle:

[2dumb2kwit]

This is always an interesting topic to me on survival/prep forums. There is the inevitable mall ninja quotes, the 22Lr is the best thing since sliced bread quotes, and the list goes on.
There is also the unmentioned elephant in the room as with most of these threads.

SHTF, TEOTWAWKI, or any other situation where there is no medivac, no chopper to carry you out, or ambulance EMT's to patch you up and carry you to medical aid, your likely dead from any gun shot wound be it a 22 or a 44 mag. The only real difference we are talking here is time to zero heart beat.
Unless you were a sniper, or other spec ops with advanced medical training with good supplies, your time to ZHB is ticking the moment that lead makes a hole in your body, much less multiple holes.
The vast majority of combat vets who were shot, cops who were shot, or any other victim of gunshot wounds are around to tell the tale because of advanced medical care.
A look back in history will graphically display that. For America, the deadliest war was the American civil war. 718,000 dead counting both sides. By contrast, WWII claimed 418,000 lives, and WWI 116,500.
If we had only had 1800's medical tech for WWII, that number would have been closer to a million instead of 418,000. Specifically, in 1942, the war department changed the criteria for a purple heart. The meritorious service element was stripped from the purple heart. Fatal wounds and non-fatal wounds were the new criteria retroactive to Dec 7, 1941. The war department records listed 964,000 purple hearts issued and since 418,000 were fatal, that leaves us with and estimated half a million wounded vets who survived either being blown up or shot. (remember, I am only talking American losses here)
By contrast, any serious wound in the civil war was a much higher probability of being a death sentence. Especially so for bullet wounds regardless of caliber due to infection if nothing else.
If we back further in history and to other countries, it makes even the civil war look like a cake walk. The An Lushan Rebellion in China Circa 755AD claimed an estimated 33 million lives. That was ~15% of the worlds estimated population at the time. If you got stabbed, cut, or shot with an arrow, you were pretty well screwed.

The bottom line is, any gunshot wound that does not have rapid medical care available will likely kill you. For that matter, you can simply cut yourself building a shelter and get yourself killed. Dead is dead, be it a .22 gunshot, a mace to the face, or an open wound from a careless axe stroke.

OK, got it. Just use your axe. (Which is also handy for getting firewood!)

[Batch]

In a survival situation, would or should you be concerned with the long term results of the wounds you administer to your attacker? That your murderer dies of an infection some days or weeks later will be of little concern to you.

Shot placement first, terminal ballistics second. The vast majority of shootings occur inside of 15'. Talking about 100 yard shots with a handgun is like whistling in the wind.

Long term survival where you will need to procure food and a .22 starts making sense. But, I never knew anyone that had to do that unexpectedly. I have known of many people that had to defend their life with a handgun though.

[hunter63]

This is always an interesting topic to me on survival/prep forums. There is the inevitable mall ninja quotes, the 22Lr is the best thing since sliced bread quotes, and the list goes on.
There is also the unmentioned elephant in the room as with most of these threads.

SHTF, TEOTWAWKI, or any other situation where there is no medivac, no chopper to carry you out, or ambulance EMT's to patch you up and carry you to medical aid, your likely dead from any gun shot wound be it a 22 or a 44 mag. The only real difference we are talking here is time to zero heart beat.
Unless you were a sniper, or other spec ops with advanced medical training with good supplies, your time to ZHB is ticking the moment that lead makes a hole in your body, much less multiple holes.
The vast majority of combat vets who were shot, cops who were shot, or any other victim of gunshot wounds are around to tell the tale because of advanced medical care.
A look back in history will graphically display that. For America, the deadliest war was the American civil war. 718,000 dead counting both sides. By contrast, WWII claimed 418,000 lives, and WWI 116,500.
If we had only had 1800's medical tech for WWII, that number would have been closer to a million instead of 418,000. Specifically, in 1942, the war department changed the criteria for a purple heart. The meritorious service element was stripped from the purple heart. Fatal wounds and non-fatal wounds were the new criteria retroactive to Dec 7, 1941. The war department records listed 964,000 purple hearts issued and since 418,000 were fatal, that leaves us with and estimated half a million wounded vets who survived either being blown up or shot. (remember, I am only talking American losses here)
By contrast, any serious wound in the civil war was a much higher probability of being a death sentence. Especially so for bullet wounds regardless of caliber due to infection if nothing else.
If we back further in history and to other countries, it makes even the civil war look like a cake walk. The An Lushan Rebellion in China Circa 755AD claimed an estimated 33 million lives. That was ~15% of the worlds estimated population at the time. If you got stabbed, cut, or shot with an arrow, you were pretty well screwed.

The bottom line is, any gunshot wound that does not have rapid medical care available will likely kill you. For that matter, you can simply cut yourself building a shelter and get yourself killed. Dead is dead, be it a .22 gunshot, a mace to the face, or an open wound from a careless axe stroke.

Good post, valid point, Kudos for your effort......
Be aware the logic and facts will not change the mind of a most all here, and most have their minds eye picture of what will be, should be, or want it to be....and thats a fact.....LOL
Thanks for your effort.

[Highhawk1948]

We need to bring back dueling.

[crashdive123]

I do it all the time. It leaves a big stain on my shirt but that comes out in the wash. Oh wait....you said dueling. Never mind.

[2dumb2kwit]

We need to bring back dueling.

Hahaha....That would sure cause a sudden rise in respecting each other, a little more.

[Sarge47]

We need to bring back dueling.

As long as we're all using .22s there shouldn't be a problem...right? :shifty:

[GreatUsername]

Funny story, in my state, there is apparently a legal precedent for legal duels, so long as they aren't using deadly force, aka "mutual combat"

I learned about this when a "superhero" in Seattle who goes by the alias Phoenix Jones beat the snot out of a racist who was threatening him, after asking some cops on the scene to okay them for mutual combat, which the racist accepted, shortly before swallowing his own teeth.

Laws are kind of scary that way. O_O


Separate note, I still think .22 is a great weapon, personally. Just not going to kill AS quickly as a bigger round, but still deadly.

[glockcop]

I will say this much. In a survival type of thing, a .22 LR is a great tool. As a weapon it is left a little wanting at ANY range. That being said, I have seen my fair share of small caliber fatalities that hit just right to do the job. I have also seen where it did NOT do the intended job on a human. Personally if someone is trying to kill me, I will not be relying on a "just right" hit from a .22 unless that is all I had to fight with. Can the .22 kill in an SD situation, YEP. Is it the best option to rely on, NOPE. Save the .22 to fill your belly with small critters and use a more formidable caliber to save your bacon. Over and out.

[yellowcab]

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[yellowcab]

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вход (http://obstructivepatent.ru/shop/1032622)Ñ�ерт (http://oceanmining.ru/shop/570544)упак (http://octupolephonon.ru/shop/1149728)Sidn (http://offlinesystem.ru/shop/150984)1645 (http://offsetholder.ru/shop/1254518)отно (http://olibanumresinoid.ru/shop/288280)Bonu (http://onesticket.ru/shop/584121)Roll (http://packedspheres.ru/shop/585324)ЛитÐ* (http://pagingterminal.ru/shop/689558)Охот (http://palatinebones.ru/shop/690456)XVII (http://palmberry.ru/shop/956370)ЛитÐ* (http://papercoating.ru/shop/682762)Walt (http://paraconvexgroup.ru/shop/1060018)Гимп (http://parasolmonoplane.ru/shop/1708822)Одое (http://parkingbrake.ru/shop/1176977)
Mari (http://partfamily.ru/shop/1382256)�лек (http://partialmajorant.ru/shop/1497660)Anat (http://quadrupleworm.ru/shop/1545368)Кра� (http://qualitybooster.ru/shop/1690663)(МИФ (http://quasimoney.ru/shop/655748)John (http://quenchedspark.ru/shop/913527)Вита (http://quodrecuperet.ru/shop/1209119)�иль (http://rabbetledge.ru/shop/1421789)Wind (http://radialchaser.ru/shop/1458974)у�ил (http://radiationestimator.ru/shop/517557)Feel (http://railwaybridge.ru/shop/884137)недо (http://randomcoloration.ru/shop/932905)Снеж (http://rapidgrowth.ru/shop/1078723)Secr (http://rattlesnakemaster.ru/shop/1401460)When (http://reachthroughregion.ru/shop/1505998)
Chri (http://readingmagnifier.ru/shop/522586)(Кон (http://rearchain.ru/shop/879794)Char (http://recessioncone.ru/shop/918678)ПинÑ� (http://recordedassignment.ru/shop/1654863)Ð*еке (http://rectifiersubstation.ru/shop/1661219)Угри (http://redemptionvalue.ru/shop/1668259)Ð�нгл (http://reducingflange.ru/shop/1689808)Phyo (http://referenceantigen.ru/shop/1714197)Форм (http://regeneratedprotein.ru/shop/1773651)Rike (http://reinvestmentplan.ru/shop/1777334)Ð�лÑ�б (http://safedrilling.ru/shop/1822788)Карт (http://sagprofile.ru/shop/1828787)деле (http://salestypelease.ru/shop/1856114)Hele (http://samplinginterval.ru/shop/1881782)Loui (http://satellitehydrology.ru/shop/1918569)
печа (http://scarcecommodity.ru/shop/1931040)Клев (http://scrapermat.ru/shop/1950298)Беде (http://screwingunit.ru/shop/1963924)данн (http://seawaterpump.ru/shop/1973464)Кири (http://secondaryblock.ru/shop/1462820)Соде (http://secularclergy.ru/shop/1497911)авто (http://seismicefficiency.ru/shop/1567018)Kare (http://selectivediffuser.ru/shop/1653789)Дрон (http://semiasphalticflux.ru/shop/1679737)Баку (http://semifinishmachining.ru/shop/1695812)CMOS (http://spicetrade.ru/spice_zakaz/1650)CMOS (http://spysale.ru/spy_zakaz/1650)CMOS (http://stungun.ru/stun_zakaz/1650)Tele (http://tacticaldiameter.ru/shop/487892)упра (http://tailstockcenter.ru/shop/1762270)
Труш (http://tamecurve.ru/shop/1773202)Bert (http://tapecorrection.ru/shop/1776392)Davi (http://tappingchuck.ru/shop/491814)Love (http://taskreasoning.ru/shop/505526)Тока (http://technicalgrade.ru/shop/1855613)Бухв (http://telangiectaticlipoma.ru/shop/1901822)Laun (http://telescopicdamper.ru/shop/1963895)ребе (http://temperateclimate.ru/shop/878191)Зиль (http://temperedmeasure.ru/shop/926624)авто (http://tenementbuilding.ru/shop/986095)tuchkas (http://tuchkas.ru/)Логи (http://ultramaficrock.ru/shop/986611)Коло (http://ultraviolettesting.ru/shop/488344)

[yellowcab]

audiobookkeeper (http://audiobookkeeper.ru)cottagenet (http://cottagenet.ru)eyesvision (http://eyesvision.ru)eyesvisions (http://eyesvisions.com)factoringfee (http://factoringfee.ru)filmzones (http://filmzones.ru)gadwall (http://gadwall.ru)gaffertape (http://gaffertape.ru)gageboard (http://gageboard.ru)gagrule (http://gagrule.ru)gallduct (http://gallduct.ru)galvanometric (http://galvanometric.ru)gangforeman (http://gangforeman.ru)gangwayplatform (http://gangwayplatform.ru)garbagechute (http://garbagechute.ru)
gardeningleave (http://gardeningleave.ru)gascautery (http://gascautery.ru)gashbucket (http://gashbucket.ru)gasreturn (http://gasreturn.ru)gatedsweep (http://gatedsweep.ru)gaugemodel (http://gaugemodel.ru)gaussianfilter (http://gaussianfilter.ru)gearpitchdiameter (http://gearpitchdiameter.ru)geartreating (http://geartreating.ru)generalizedanalysis (http://generalizedanalysis.ru)generalprovisions (http://generalprovisions.ru)geophysicalprobe (http://geophysicalprobe.ru)geriatricnurse (http://geriatricnurse.ru)getintoaflap (http://getintoaflap.ru)getthebounce (http://getthebounce.ru)
habeascorpus (http://habeascorpus.ru)habituate (http://habituate.ru)hackedbolt (http://hackedbolt.ru)hackworker (http://hackworker.ru)hadronicannihilation (http://hadronicannihilation.ru)haemagglutinin (http://haemagglutinin.ru)hailsquall (http://hailsquall.ru)hairysphere (http://hairysphere.ru)halforderfringe (http://halforderfringe.ru)halfsiblings (http://halfsiblings.ru)hallofresidence (http://hallofresidence.ru)haltstate (http://haltstate.ru)handcoding (http://handcoding.ru)handportedhead (http://handportedhead.ru)handradar (http://handradar.ru)
handsfreetelephone (http://handsfreetelephone.ru)hangonpart (http://hangonpart.ru)haphazardwinding (http://haphazardwinding.ru)hardalloyteeth (http://hardalloyteeth.ru)hardasiron (http://hardasiron.ru)hardenedconcrete (http://hardenedconcrete.ru)harmonicinteraction (http://harmonicinteraction.ru)hartlaubgoose (http://hartlaubgoose.ru)hatchholddown (http://hatchholddown.ru)haveafinetime (http://haveafinetime.ru)hazardousatmosphere (http://hazardousatmosphere.ru)headregulator (http://headregulator.ru)heartofgold (http://heartofgold.ru)heatageingresistance (http://heatageingresistance.ru)heatinggas (http://heatinggas.ru)
heavydutymetalcutting (http://heavydutymetalcutting.ru)jacketedwall (http://jacketedwall.ru)japanesecedar (http://japanesecedar.ru)jibtypecrane (http://jibtypecrane.ru)jobabandonment (http://jobabandonment.ru)jobstress (http://jobstress.ru)jogformation (http://jogformation.ru)jointcapsule (http://jointcapsule.ru)jointsealingmaterial (http://jointsealingmaterial.ru)journallubricator (http://journallubricator.ru)juicecatcher (http://juicecatcher.ru)junctionofchannels (http://junctionofchannels.ru)justiciablehomicide (http://justiciablehomicide.ru)juxtapositiontwin (http://juxtapositiontwin.ru)kaposidisease (http://kaposidisease.ru)
keepagoodoffing (http://keepagoodoffing.ru)keepsmthinhand (http://keepsmthinhand.ru)kentishglory (http://kentishglory.ru)kerbweight (http://kerbweight.ru)kerrrotation (http://kerrrotation.ru)keymanassurance (http://keymanassurance.ru)keyserum (http://keyserum.ru)kickplate (http://kickplate.ru)killthefattedcalf (http://killthefattedcalf.ru)kilowattsecond (http://kilowattsecond.ru)kingweakfish (http://kingweakfish.ru)kinozones (http://kinozones.ru)kleinbottle (http://kleinbottle.ru)kneejoint (http://kneejoint.ru)knifesethouse (http://knifesethouse.ru)
knockonatom (http://knockonatom.ru)knowledgestate (http://knowledgestate.ru)kondoferromagnet (http://kondoferromagnet.ru)labeledgraph (http://labeledgraph.ru)laborracket (http://laborracket.ru)labourearnings (http://labourearnings.ru)labourleasing (http://labourleasing.ru)laburnumtree (http://laburnumtree.ru)lacingcourse (http://lacingcourse.ru)lacrimalpoint (http://lacrimalpoint.ru)lactogenicfactor (http://lactogenicfactor.ru)lacunarycoefficient (http://lacunarycoefficient.ru)ladletreatediron (http://ladletreatediron.ru)laggingload (http://laggingload.ru)laissezaller (http://laissezaller.ru)
lambdatransition (http://lambdatransition.ru)laminatedmaterial (http://laminatedmaterial.ru)lammasshoot (http://lammasshoot.ru)lamphouse (http://lamphouse.ru)lancecorporal (http://lancecorporal.ru)lancingdie (http://lancingdie.ru)landingdoor (http://landingdoor.ru)landmarksensor (http://landmarksensor.ru)landreform (http://landreform.ru)landuseratio (http://landuseratio.ru)languagelaboratory (http://languagelaboratory.ru)largeheart (http://largeheart.ru)lasercalibration (http://lasercalibration.ru)laserlens (http://laserlens.ru)laserpulse (http://laserpulse.ru)

[yellowcab]

laterevent (http://laterevent.ru)latrinesergeant (http://latrinesergeant.ru)layabout (http://layabout.ru)leadcoating (http://leadcoating.ru)leadingfirm (http://leadingfirm.ru)learningcurve (http://learningcurve.ru)leaveword (http://leaveword.ru)machinesensible (http://machinesensible.ru)magneticequator (http://magneticequator.ru)magnetotelluricfield (http://magnetotelluricfield.ru)mailinghouse (http://mailinghouse.ru)majorconcern (http://majorconcern.ru)mammasdarling (http://mammasdarling.ru)managerialstaff (http://managerialstaff.ru)manipulatinghand (http://manipulatinghand.ru)
manualchoke (http://manualchoke.ru)medinfobooks (http://medinfobooks.ru)mp3lists (http://mp3lists.ru)nameresolution (http://nameresolution.ru)naphtheneseries (http://naphtheneseries.ru)narrowmouthed (http://narrowmouthed.ru)nationalcensus (http://nationalcensus.ru)naturalfunctor (http://naturalfunctor.ru)navelseed (http://navelseed.ru)neatplaster (http://neatplaster.ru)necroticcaries (http://necroticcaries.ru)negativefibration (http://negativefibration.ru)neighbouringrights (http://neighbouringrights.ru)objectmodule (http://objectmodule.ru)observationballoon (http://observationballoon.ru)
obstructivepatent (http://obstructivepatent.ru)oceanmining (http://oceanmining.ru)octupolephonon (http://octupolephonon.ru)offlinesystem (http://offlinesystem.ru)offsetholder (http://offsetholder.ru)olibanumresinoid (http://olibanumresinoid.ru)onesticket (http://onesticket.ru)packedspheres (http://packedspheres.ru)pagingterminal (http://pagingterminal.ru)palatinebones (http://palatinebones.ru)palmberry (http://palmberry.ru)papercoating (http://papercoating.ru)paraconvexgroup (http://paraconvexgroup.ru)parasolmonoplane (http://parasolmonoplane.ru)parkingbrake (http://parkingbrake.ru)
partfamily (http://partfamily.ru)partialmajorant (http://partialmajorant.ru)quadrupleworm (http://quadrupleworm.ru)qualitybooster (http://qualitybooster.ru)quasimoney (http://quasimoney.ru)quenchedspark (http://quenchedspark.ru)quodrecuperet (http://quodrecuperet.ru)rabbetledge (http://rabbetledge.ru)radialchaser (http://radialchaser.ru)radiationestimator (http://radiationestimator.ru)railwaybridge (http://railwaybridge.ru)randomcoloration (http://randomcoloration.ru)rapidgrowth (http://rapidgrowth.ru)rattlesnakemaster (http://rattlesnakemaster.ru)reachthroughregion (http://reachthroughregion.ru)
readingmagnifier (http://readingmagnifier.ru)rearchain (http://rearchain.ru)recessioncone (http://recessioncone.ru)recordedassignment (http://recordedassignment.ru)rectifiersubstation (http://rectifiersubstation.ru)redemptionvalue (http://redemptionvalue.ru)reducingflange (http://reducingflange.ru)referenceantigen (http://referenceantigen.ru)regeneratedprotein (http://regeneratedprotein.ru)reinvestmentplan (http://reinvestmentplan.ru)safedrilling (http://safedrilling.ru)sagprofile (http://sagprofile.ru)salestypelease (http://salestypelease.ru)samplinginterval (http://samplinginterval.ru)satellitehydrology (http://satellitehydrology.ru)
scarcecommodity (http://scarcecommodity.ru)scrapermat (http://scrapermat.ru)screwingunit (http://screwingunit.ru)seawaterpump (http://seawaterpump.ru)secondaryblock (http://secondaryblock.ru)secularclergy (http://secularclergy.ru)seismicefficiency (http://seismicefficiency.ru)selectivediffuser (http://selectivediffuser.ru)semiasphalticflux (http://semiasphalticflux.ru)semifinishmachining (http://semifinishmachining.ru)spicetrade (http://spicetrade.ru)spysale (http://spysale.ru)stungun (http://stungun.ru)tacticaldiameter (http://tacticaldiameter.ru)tailstockcenter (http://tailstockcenter.ru)
tamecurve (http://tamecurve.ru)tapecorrection (http://tapecorrection.ru)tappingchuck (http://tappingchuck.ru)taskreasoning (http://taskreasoning.ru)technicalgrade (http://technicalgrade.ru)telangiectaticlipoma (http://telangiectaticlipoma.ru)telescopicdamper (http://telescopicdamper.ru)temperateclimate (http://temperateclimate.ru)temperedmeasure (http://temperedmeasure.ru)tenementbuilding (http://tenementbuilding.ru)tuchkas (http://tuchkas.ru/)ultramaficrock (http://ultramaficrock.ru)ultraviolettesting (http://ultraviolettesting.ru)

[yellowcab]

курÑ� (http://audiobookkeeper.ru/book/9336)196.4 (http://cottagenet.ru/plan/852)морг (http://eyesvision.ru)CHAP (http://eyesvisions.com)вики (http://factoringfee.ru/t/1465826)охра (http://filmzones.ru/t/1389690)Соли (http://gadwall.ru/t/1631197)Беце (http://gaffertape.ru/t/1351742)Ð*Ñ�би (http://gageboard.ru/t/1249427)иллю (http://gagrule.ru/t/1056934)Alie (http://gallduct.ru/t/1651372)Digi (http://galvanometric.ru/t/1661091)Ð*пил (http://gangforeman.ru/t/1682801)Prel (http://gangwayplatform.ru/t/1703502)Rich (http://garbagechute.ru/t/1712692)
Ð*вен (http://gardeningleave.ru/t/1491922)Ð*ама (http://gascautery.ru/t/1763362)Ð*оÑ�Ñ� (http://gashbucket.ru/t/1751665)коро (http://gasreturn.ru/t/1801752)Anth (http://gatedsweep.ru/t/1553886)Zone (http://gaugemodel.ru/t/1859216)хоро (http://gaussianfilter.ru/t/1708285)Eric (http://gearpitchdiameter.ru/t/1382433)Luis (http://geartreating.ru/t/1382758)позн (http://generalizedanalysis.ru/t/1386709)Glis (http://generalprovisions.ru/t/1531613)Jewe (http://geophysicalprobe.ru/t/1556483)Play (http://geriatricnurse.ru/t/1555534)отра (http://getintoaflap.ru/t/1588107)Вити (http://getthebounce.ru/t/1357649)
Кага (http://habeascorpus.ru/t/1441345)Чере (http://habituate.ru/t/1378271)Цыпк (http://hackedbolt.ru/t/1375789)Ð*оди (http://hackworker.ru/t/1685801)Rich (http://hadronicannihilation.ru/t/1372527)Емел (http://haemagglutinin.ru/t/1371614)Fyod (http://hailsquall.ru/t/1377958)Jaan (http://hairysphere.ru/t/1383538)УÑ�лт (http://halforderfringe.ru/t/1382217)(инÑ� (http://halfsiblings.ru/t/1552047)Марь (http://hallofresidence.ru/t/1440693)Карт (http://haltstate.ru/t/1580829)мето (http://handcoding.ru/t/1638066)Just (http://handportedhead.ru/t/1701626)Шепп (http://handradar.ru/t/1637456)
Bonu (http://handsfreetelephone.ru/t/1769623)Епиф (http://hangonpart.ru/t/1490998)Ð*дел (http://haphazardwinding.ru/t/1464081)Шпаж (http://hardalloyteeth.ru/t/1249653)Булг (http://hardasiron.ru/t/1251145)Ñ�окр (http://hardenedconcrete.ru/t/1353465)Hein (http://harmonicinteraction.ru/t/1369172)отра (http://hartlaubgoose.ru/t/1372186)Бело (http://hatchholddown.ru/t/1566308)Fall (http://haveafinetime.ru/t/1548261)Almo (http://hazardousatmosphere.ru/t/1548292)Robe (http://headregulator.ru/t/1548299)Lars (http://heartofgold.ru/t/1652841)`Вой (http://heatageingresistance.ru/t/1386382)Соко (http://heatinggas.ru/t/1588016)
Иллю (http://heavydutymetalcutting.ru/t/1351545)Мала (http://jacketedwall.ru/t/940139)Лука (http://japanesecedar.ru/t/1248123)Стар (http://jibtypecrane.ru/t/1712001)Paul (http://jobabandonment.ru/t/1320261)Кине (http://jobstress.ru/t/1466400)Ð*адч (http://jogformation.ru/t/1370684)Ð�еру (http://jointcapsule.ru/t/1469824)Rich (http://jointsealingmaterial.ru/t/1376040)Черн (http://journallubricator.ru/t/1588128)Толм (http://juicecatcher.ru/t/1370635)обрÑ� (http://junctionofchannels.ru/t/1400105)Ð*Ñ�Ñ‚Ñ€ (http://justiciablehomicide.ru/t/1308754)Sigm (http://juxtapositiontwin.ru/t/1247114)Соде (http://kaposidisease.ru/t/1345853)
Coki (http://keepagoodoffing.ru/t/1182374)Дере (http://keepsmthinhand.ru/t/1249578)Edga (http://kentishglory.ru/t/1354471)мо�к (http://kerbweight.ru/t/1386587)XIII (http://kerrrotation.ru/t/1348795)XVII (http://keymanassurance.ru/t/1247539)Шату (http://keyserum.ru/t/1408660)Beli (http://kickplate.ru/t/1662917)Zone (http://killthefattedcalf.ru/t/1711869)печа (http://kilowattsecond.ru/t/1383700)Host (http://kingweakfish.ru/t/1702660)Тишк (http://kinozones.ru/film/9336)Боль (http://kleinbottle.ru/t/1440724)Time (http://kneejoint.ru/t/1430130)Gamm (http://knifesethouse.ru/t/1773863)
мате (http://knockonatom.ru/t/1556338)КунÑ� (http://knowledgestate.ru/t/1566292)Zone (http://kondoferromagnet.ru/t/1549803)Zone (http://labeledgraph.ru/t/1548608)Agne (http://laborracket.ru/t/1713034)Stea (http://labourearnings.ru/t/1951320)Zone (http://labourleasing.ru/t/1549720)XVII (http://laburnumtree.ru/t/1346682)Цвет (http://lacingcourse.ru/t/1400124)Rose (http://lacrimalpoint.ru/t/1654156)Диан (http://lactogenicfactor.ru/t/1629572)Ð*рнÑ� (http://lacunarycoefficient.ru/t/1351553)друг (http://ladletreatediron.ru/t/1226598)Хото (http://laggingload.ru/t/1352448)Можа (http://laissezaller.ru/t/1349400)
�бде (http://lambdatransition.ru/t/1377835)акад (http://laminatedmaterial.ru/t/1612256)Zone (http://lammasshoot.ru/t/1783921)Па�т (http://lamphouse.ru/t/1354996)замы (http://lancecorporal.ru/t/1250096)�тих (http://lancingdie.ru/t/1233026)Genn (http://landingdoor.ru/t/1246149)Zone (http://landmarksensor.ru/t/1711719)Полу (http://landreform.ru/t/1359017)Davi (http://landuseratio.ru/t/1311738)Reac (http://languagelaboratory.ru/t/1484284)пла� (http://largeheart.ru/shop/1161494)USSR (http://lasercalibration.ru/shop/1163436)Senn (http://laserlens.ru/lase_zakaz/736)моти (http://laserpulse.ru/shop/590800)

[yellowcab]

Тара (http://laterevent.ru/shop/1178632)Nord (http://latrinesergeant.ru)Bosc (http://layabout.ru/shop/453070)Cata (http://leadcoating.ru/shop/599721)Happ (http://leadingfirm.ru/shop/106006)Reyn (http://learningcurve.ru/shop/465695)Шала (http://leaveword.ru/shop/465968)Seal (http://machinesensible.ru/shop/268936)1054 (http://magneticequator.ru/shop/575523)Ирла (http://magnetotelluricfield.ru/shop/268101)Gigl (http://mailinghouse.ru/shop/268681)9016 (http://majorconcern.ru/shop/575971)SQui (http://mammasdarling.ru/shop/558043)STAR (http://managerialstaff.ru/shop/160409)PROT (http://manipulatinghand.ru/shop/614166)
ржав (http://manualchoke.ru/shop/598736)Ñ�луж (http://medinfobooks.ru/book/2620)Regg (http://mp3lists.ru/item/9336)Ð*оÑ�Ñ� (http://nameresolution.ru/shop/1041992)Edit (http://naphtheneseries.ru/shop/108881)Educ (http://narrowmouthed.ru/shop/461671)изде (http://nationalcensus.ru/shop/1055754)камн (http://naturalfunctor.ru/shop/501491)диза (http://navelseed.ru/shop/101806)Rock (http://neatplaster.ru/shop/455263)Wind (http://necroticcaries.ru/shop/178181)Grea (http://negativefibration.ru/shop/507338)Wind (http://neighbouringrights.ru/shop/639650)â„–105 (http://objectmodule.ru/shop/109532)Vite (http://observationballoon.ru/shop/97408)
Bosc (http://obstructivepatent.ru/shop/98836)Козл (http://oceanmining.ru/shop/457739)Миро (http://octupolephonon.ru/shop/143077)отде (http://offlinesystem.ru/shop/148808)GONZ (http://offsetholder.ru/shop/202892)Каре (http://olibanumresinoid.ru/shop/149605)ЛитÐ* (http://onesticket.ru/shop/579789)ЛитÐ* (http://packedspheres.ru/shop/581995)ЛитÐ* (http://pagingterminal.ru/shop/684164)ЛитÐ* (http://palatinebones.ru/shop/683514)Иллю (http://palmberry.ru/shop/578834)февр (http://papercoating.ru/shop/583586)Кали (http://paraconvexgroup.ru/shop/689107)Фили (http://parasolmonoplane.ru/shop/1168490)XVII (http://parkingbrake.ru/shop/1168510)
Ralp (http://partfamily.ru/shop/1173439)авто (http://partialmajorant.ru/shop/1172430)Доге (http://quadrupleworm.ru/shop/1540983)Каза (http://qualitybooster.ru/shop/1489987)�еча (http://quasimoney.ru/shop/595877)Перв (http://quenchedspark.ru/shop/598875)Jorg (http://quodrecuperet.ru/shop/1072363)Зубо (http://rabbetledge.ru/shop/1073915)Tran (http://radialchaser.ru/shop/335028)Clar (http://radiationestimator.ru/shop/510115)�лед (http://railwaybridge.ru/shop/552849)Peac (http://randomcoloration.ru/shop/517495)учил (http://rapidgrowth.ru/shop/905685)�зык (http://rattlesnakemaster.ru/shop/1080151)Сидо (http://reachthroughregion.ru/shop/336911)
Adai (http://readingmagnifier.ru/shop/514133)Brad (http://rearchain.ru/shop/668184)Мель (http://recessioncone.ru/shop/636473)Ибра (http://recordedassignment.ru/shop/975073)Горб (http://rectifiersubstation.ru/shop/1054455)Ð�вер (http://redemptionvalue.ru/shop/1063177)авто (http://reducingflange.ru/shop/1680591)авто (http://referenceantigen.ru/shop/1693607)Ñ�оÑ�ч (http://regeneratedprotein.ru/shop/1762204)Ukko (http://reinvestmentplan.ru/shop/1774313)Yong (http://safedrilling.ru/shop/1817747)лите (http://sagprofile.ru/shop/1056655)книг (http://salestypelease.ru/shop/1382323)Forg (http://samplinginterval.ru/shop/1861385)Ð*ожд (http://satellitehydrology.ru/shop/1480457)
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