AR Usage

[TangoFoxtrot]

How many here use an AR-15 for home defense, or for SHTF senarios? What setup do you have? How many mags and ammo do you keep on hand?

[Rick]

Not me. I lost all of my weapons and ammo in the great canoe accident of '10.

AR would make a lousy home defense weapon. Not only is it unwieldy but you run the risk of over penetration and taking out neighbors. I rely mostly on idle threats.

[natertot]

Huh? What? I don't know what you mean by defense. Don't you just call the guys in uniform?

[Wildthang]

Since I live in the country, and my neighbors are not all that close, I would use my AR as home defense without hesitation. It is quick handling, lethal, and in my humble opinion, that is one of the things it was designed to do, defend!
My first line of defense in most cases is my 9mm glock in my nightstand, just something to grab when I'm half asleep. Behind my nightstand is my AR leaning against the wall. If there is more than 2 offenders, and I figure I can't take them out with my Glock, I will retreat back to the bedroom and grab my AR. If I am lucky enough to see them coming before hand, and it appears to be 2 or more, and well armed, I will not even look at the Glock!
My AR has open sights, and a loaded 30 shot magazine, with a good combat light mounted to the forend. I keep 1 extra clip to grab in the nightstand, and that's it. If I cant getem with 2 magazines, I aint gonna getum!
Some may ask, well why dont you just grab the AR and why even keep the glock, and my answer would be, It depends on whether I hear a funny little noise, or windows crashing and people talking as to which I would grab! I like choices!
I have around 8 magazines total for the AR!

[crashdive123]

Sourdough - he didn't mean it. It was just a slip of the tongue. He really meant magazine, not clip.

Whew! Glad I headed that one off.

[Wildthang]

Sourdough - he didn't mean it. It was just a slip of the tongue. He really meant magazine, not clip.

Whew! Glad I headed that one off.

Who said clips? I am pretty sure I call them magazines! Oh, now I see, Please forgive me SD for I have sinned:scared:

[Wildthang]

Who said clips? I am pretty sure I call them magazines! Oh, now I see, Please forgive me SD for I have sinned:scared: I edited it so it wouldn't burn your eyes!

[crashdive123]

Since I live in the country, and my neighbors are not all that close, I would use my AR as home defense without hesitation. It is quick handling, lethal, and in my humble opinion, that is one of the things it was designed to do, defend!
My first line of defense in most cases is my 9mm glock in my nightstand, just something to grab when I'm half asleep. Behind my nightstand is my AR leaning against the wall. If there is more than 2 offenders, and I figure I can't take them out with my Glock, I will retreat back to the bedroom and grab my AR. If I am lucky enough to see them coming before hand, and it appears to be 2 or more, and well armed, I will not even look at the Glock!
My AR has open sights, and a loaded 30 shot magazine, with a good combat light mounted to the forend. I keep 1 extra clipto grab in the nightstand, and that's it. If I cant getem with 2 magazines, I aint gonna getum!
Some may ask, well why dont you just grab the AR and why even keep the glock, and my answer would be, It depends on whether I hear a funny little noise, or windows crashing and people talking as to which I would grab! I like choices!
I have around 8 magazines total for the AR!

I guess two out of three ain't bad.:innocent:

[Wildthang]

I guess two out of three ain't bad.:innocent:

I was trying real hard Crash!

[kyratshooter]

1. In the current world you are not defending your home until the bad guy comes inside. A shotgun will do for inside defense more effectively than an AR and you get three for the price of one.

2. SHTF or TEOTWAWKI is a different time and place. Today is not then and one can only speculate on the conditions in place at that point. You will not know until you point whatever is in your hands down the hallway, out the window or over the berm, and see what is comming at you if you made the right choice.

3. In either of the #2 senerios you do not have enough mags or ammo. No one has enough mags and ammo. Some of us that were in the military have looked at a duce and a half load and said "Go get more!".

4. Guns and ammo are only part of your defense, you also must harden your position. You may very well wish you had spent $500 on barbed wire instead of $1200 on an AR.

[jcullen24]

I don't know how people can say an AR-15 is unwieldy.
I considered the M-16 as perfect for clearing rooms.
I don't have one now, but I'm not bugging in.

[hunter63]

My nephew calls magazines for his Glock "clips" as well,........I have tried to correct him, but maybe its a Glock thing?....a young guy thing?
It's too bad about the canoe accident, I can relate, and I feel your pain....similar thing happen here as well.

Used to keep them in the safe....take them out and look what happens.....Oh well, some day maybe fix the damage,,,,still about a dozen magazines around, "deployed" as it were....

I don't have visions of grandeur as far as single handed hold off the hoards, I would guess that is a last resort, as my guess that any "invaders" would be of the cowardly persuasion and would be a gang.

So for now the .380 PPK will have to do.......

[Wildthang]

1. In the current world you are not defending your home until the bad guy comes inside. A shotgun will do for inside defense more effectively than an AR and you get three for the price of one.

2. SHTF or TEOTWAWKI is a different time and place. Today is not then and one can only speculate on the conditions in place at that point. You will not know until you point whatever is in your hands down the hallway, out the window or over the berm, and see what is comming at you if you made the right choice.

3. In either of the #2 senerios you do not have enough mags or ammo. No one has enough mags and ammo. Some of us that were in the military have looked at a duce and a half load and said "Go get more!".

4. Guns and ammo are only part of your defense, you also must harden your position. You may very well wish you had spent $500 on barbed wire instead of $1200 on an AR.

I have a lot of ammo, I just dont keep it all in the bedroom. And since the S aint hit the fan yet, I figure for home defense, 2 mags is enough against a would be intruder or 2 or 3 or 4! Shotguns are just not my style, and I dont know why. I like them to hunt birds with, and I love the over under's with the shorgun on the bottom, but for home defense, they would do a lot of damage to your house, and throw a pattern of lead in a broad area, so there are good points and bad points to shotguns. I know they are good for self defense and I probably need to rethink all of that, but I just like pistols and rifles and always have.
But I do plan on buying more mags at the next gun show. Beleive me, if I even think the S is going to hit the fan, I will harden my defense big time!

[shaner]

oh my golly man , u didnt say clips i didnt see it , !!!!!! ok i did but wont rat ya out, iam still a firm believer in a shotgun, for home defense myself, i like a mossberg 410, 18in barreled shotgun with number 7.5 shot, or 6shot 3in, check out some tests on them, close range , its lethal, and the surrouding area pretty much safe, and anyone in the household could use it without fear of recoil on them, and u dont need any clips! or magazines!!!

[hunter63]

.................
But I do plan on buying more mags at the next gun show. Beleive me, if I even think the S is going to hit the fan, I will harden my defense big time!

I don't think it will be announced....if you know what I mean.....

"News Up Date.....SHTF!"
The moment we have all been waiting for is gonna happen a 4:00 P.M, as there are those that don't like to get woken up with crap like this in the middle of the night.

Full story at 11:00

[Wildthang]

I don't think it will be announced....if you know what I mean.....

"News Up Date.....SHTF!"
The moment we have all been waiting for is gonna happen a 4:00 P.M, as there are those that don't like to get woken up with crap like this in the middle of the night.

Full story at 11:00

Yeah Yeah Hunter I know! But I am not going to start building concrete barriers around the house just yet. I can see them coming a long way off where I live. And I think we have time until total chaos from economic collapse takes ahold of us! Or the attack or the Chinese forces for that matter! But I do hope they announce it, that would be handy! Hell they put everything else on the news so why not actually put some useful info on there for a change! Naaaaaaa, that wouldn't happen would it?

[natertot]

I like them to hunt birds with, and I love the over under's with the shorgun on the bottom, but for home defense, they would do a lot of damage to your house, and throw a pattern of lead in a broad area, so there are good points and bad points to shotguns.

Patchin a wall and replacing a window is still a cheaper price than a funeral for yourself or family member. I just call the uniforms, but if I did have boomsticks, 12ga primary, semi-auto handheld secondary. Then again, that is what I was taught in the Navy and in LE/Security training.

[Wildthang]

Patchin a wall and replacing a window is still a cheaper price than a funeral for yourself or family member. I just call the uniforms, but if I did have boomsticks, 12ga primary, semi-auto handheld secondary. Then again, that is what I was taught in the Navy and in LE/Security training.

I actually agree with all of that, but the only shotgun I have is a Remington 1100 with a barrel long enough to reach across the bedroom. I dont know how long the barrel is but it's long, so my AR with the 16" barrel seems a lot more nimble and more gooder for household engagements.
I guess I need to get a short shotgun! See now youv'e done it, I need another frickin gun because of you! I hate you!:eyepoke:

[Rick]

I don't know how people can say an AR-15 is unwieldy.

People didn't I did. You are not clearing rooms. You are defending yourself. That means you take a position and wait on them to come to you. Hopefully, you got the 911 call in. An AR sucks for home defense. Maybe if you live in the country it would be okay but those rounds will go through green board and sheetrock in my house and my neighbor's house.

In a SHTF scenario I won't use it either. My definition of SHTF is tornado or blizzard. I still prefer a shotgun for looters over sending rounds down the block to take out some innocent person.

If I had a weapon or ammo, that is.

[kyratshooter]

You get more for your money with a shotgun than almost any other defense tool.

A $200 pistol is not much pistol.
A $200 simiauto rifle is just a pipe-dream
A $200 pump shotgun is a beast to contend with in any serious social setting.

Besides, if you buy a shotgun you will have something you can actually hunt with in Ohio!

Think about springing $200 for a riot barrel for the 1100. Back in the '70s that was the issue shotgun for the LAPD and several other cities.

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/322510/remington-barrel-remington-1100-12-gauge-2-3-4-18-1-2-improved-cylinder-bead-sight-matte

[Rick]

I put an extended tube on my 1100 and a tactical stock. This is what it looked like before the canoe accident.

http://i348.photobucket.com/albums/q348/safe_zone/Remington1100.jpg

[Wildthang]

You get more for your money with a shotgun than almost any other defense tool.

A $200 pistol is not much pistol.
A $200 simiauto rifle is just a pipe-dream
A $200 pump shotgun is a beast to contend with in any serious social setting.

Besides, if you buy a shotgun you will have something you can actually hunt with in Ohio!

Think about springing $200 for a riot barrel for the 1100. Back in the '70s that was the issue shotgun for the LAPD and several other cities.

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/322510/remington-barrel-remington-1100-12-gauge-2-3-4-18-1-2-improved-cylinder-bead-sight-matte

See, so at the minimum I need to buy a new barell, and probably a tactical stock, so I still hate you:smartass:

[Wildthang]

I put an extended tube on my 1100 and a tactical stock. This is what it looked like before the canoe accident.

http://i348.photobucket.com/albums/q348/safe_zone/Remington1100.jpg

Rickster, just how large of an arsenal did you lose in the infamous canoe wreck?

[Rick]

It makes me weep each time I think about it. In case ATF is reading it was all gone. Each and every one of them. There was an RRA AR15 in the bunch, too. (sigh) Oh, and several thousand rounds of ammo. I don't think I should have loaded all that stuff in the back of the canoe with me. That might have been my mistake.

[Wildthang]

It makes me weep each time I think about it. In case ATF is reading it was all gone. Each and every one of them. There was an RRA AR15 in the bunch, too. (sigh) Oh, and several thousand rounds of ammo. I don't think I should have loaded all that stuff in the back of the canoe with me. That might have been my mistake.

Couln't you have dived down and got some of them out! Surely you weren't haulin guns down a dangerous deep river with killer rapids were you? Where did this happen, I want some new guns?
And why did you have all of those guns and ammo, were you preparing for a duelling banjo attack or something. This is very interesting!

[Rick]

They were being moved across the lake. Canoe is the only way to get to my house. The lake is at least 500 feet deep. How far can scuba go down? It's 3 feet deeper than that. The pickup truck is no problem to balance on the canoe but those guns and all that ammo were a problem. So I don't have anything but my charming good looks anymore....if ATF is reading.

[Wildthang]

They were being moved across the lake. Canoe is the only way to get to my house. The lake is at least 500 feet deep. How far can scuba go down? It's 3 feet deeper than that. The pickup truck is no problem to balance on the canoe but those guns and all that ammo were a problem. So I don't have anything but my charming good looks anymore....if ATF is reading.

Buddy that had to really stink, it makes me want to cry just thinking about it. Dont forget that we love ya brother, ( in a non-brokeback mountain kind of way)!
Man that would really ruin a good weekend!

[Rick]

I tried a big magnet but it came untied. Lost it, too.

[hunter63]

I feel your pain....those canoe accidents were going around a couple of years ago.........It was indeed sad.

[jake abraham]

very sad for you guys

[natertot]

I guess I need to get a short shotgun! See now youv'e done it, I need another frickin gun because of you! I hate you!:eyepoke:

Hey buddy, I'm here for you!

[kyratshooter]

We need to start a canoe accident support group!

I do not currently own a canoe but I do have a John boat that has a real weak drain plug. I worry about that every time I go duck hunting.

[Rick]

That's how it starts. Weak drain plug, boat loaded with weapons. Them BAMO! Before you know it you're callin in the Coast Guard to pluck you out of a raging lake or river. All your weapons and ammo now belong to Davy Jones. I still get cold chills just thinkin about it.

[natertot]

We need to start a canoe accident support group!

I do not currently own a canoe but I do have a John boat that has a real weak drain plug. I worry about that every time I go duck hunting.


I thought that was how you filled the live well!:oops:

[Wildthang]

It helps to talk about it you know, and we are here to listen:smartass:

[Daniel Nighteyes]

1. In the current world you are not defending your home until the bad guy comes inside. A shotgun will do for inside defense more effectively than an AR and you get three for the price of one.

Agreed. That, and a pistol. 'Tis kinda hard dialling the phone while holding a shotgun.


3. In either-- scenario -- you do not have enough mags or ammo. No one has enough mags and ammo. Some of us that were in the military have looked at a deuce-and-a-half load and said "Go get more!"

Dang! I purely resemble that remark!


4. Guns and ammo are only part of your defense, you also must harden your position. You may very well wish you had spent $500 on barbed wire instead of $1200 on an AR.

Or a few strategically-placed quarter-inch hardened steel plates, or...

(The fact that I talk slow doesn't mean that I think slow.)

-- Nighteyes

[Daniel Nighteyes]

... See now youv'e done it, I need another frickin gun because of you! I hate you!:eyepoke:

Nope. You just need a shorter barrel for your Remington 1100. Commonly available, easy to exchange, etc.

-- Nighteyes

[Daniel Nighteyes]

... All your weapons and ammo now belong to Davy Jones....

Nobody better even THINK about confronting ol' Mister Jones...!

[glockcop]

Tests have proven that .223 HP's/SP's have less penetration through common building materials than mostly all defensive pistol rounds, shotgun slugs, or buckshot. I will be clearing my own home after a quick call to the PD so penetration is a concern. I've done a few of my own penetrations test that support the findings that .223 is less penetrative than other stuff out there. So yes, an AR sleeps comfortably under my bed until it may be called upon. As a matter of fact, the AR platform (M4 specifically) is not at all unweildly and is actually taylored to clearing homes by it's shortened design making it very handy around corners. That being said, I also keep a loaded 12 guage pump handy. Can't have too many options. Most legal length shotguns (18") are actually longer than an M4/AR. So if someone considers the AR unweildy indoors, this mindset would ultimately have to apply to their shotgun too.

[Rick]

The M4 wasn't mentioned just the AR. My AR is 37 inches from nose to tail with the butt extended or 34 inches shortened. My .45 is .... well .... a lot shorter. Mine also eats 5.56 FMJ.

[glockcop]

The M4 wasn't mentioned just the AR. My AR is 37 inches from nose to tail with the butt extended or 34 inches shortened. My .45 is .... well .... a lot shorter. Mine also eats 5.56 FMJ.

The M4 is just 2" shorter than a 16" AR. Not alot to talk about. But I see your point about the pistol being much handier:)

[kyratshooter]

That's how it starts. Weak drain plug, boat loaded with weapons. Them BAMO! Before you know it you're callin in the Coast Guard to pluck you out of a raging lake or river. All your weapons and ammo now belong to Davy Jones. I still get cold chills just thinkin about it.


OK so I have the john boat, and the runabout, and the sailboat.....I am pretty sure that's not enough boats I better go check Graig's list real quick!

Does the Coast Guard start charging for services after the second boat goes down?

[natertot]

OK so I have the john boat, and the runabout, and the sailboat.....I am pretty sure that's not enough boats I better go check Graig's list real quick!

Does the Coast Guard start charging for services after the second boat goes down?

Not if you have AAA! You get three sunks a year I believe. :boat:

[Pal334]

I have a Stage Coach type double 12 guage, simple quick and efficient. No "black guns " for me. After 25 plus years finally dawned on me they are not my cup of tea. I follow the KISS principle Keep It Simple Stupid (referring to me of course :) )

[Daniel Nighteyes]

I have a Stage Coach type double 12 guage, simple quick and efficient. No "black guns " for me. After 25 plus years finally dawned on me they are not my cup of tea. I follow the KISS principle Keep It Simple Stupid (referring to me of course :) )

I routinely shoot SASS and Western 3-Gun matches, so I have a special appreciation of that about which you speak. As Jeff Cooper often said, "The gunfight is not won by the first shot, but by the first hit."

Generally speaking, I'd rather be accurate than fast. (The only exception would occur if I should be up against a fast AND accurate shooter...)

Recognizing, of course, that the stereotypical "Gunsmoke" shootout is just not in reality's realm...

[hunter63]

The thought occurred to me, that when a question is asked about Black rifles for this....and for that,...for house cleaning....zombies etc......Someone wants one, and is looking to justify a reason.....or that the way it seems.

Well, Bunky, I say, just go for it, no need to to have a reason, a "I just want one" is totally within the parameter's of "just because"....Life's to short to dance with ugly women...unless you want to.
Not that was the reason for the OP ...just saying...in general.

[Pal334]

I agree with Daniel, Having been "around the horn", a tour in Vietnam and early Iraq and a few in between, thankfully there are VERY FEW people that are fast AND accurate shooters when their "hinny" is on the line and scared sh**less:). So the KISS principle has served me very well. As you know, gadgets are not the answer, practice with what you have, that is THE answer

[kyratshooter]

Recognizing, of course, that the stereotypical "Gunsmoke" shootout is just not in reality's realm...

I think the same thing each time I see someone recommending training that incorperates advancing on the target in the open, drills in the open, using interior walls for cover......

They never stress laying on the ground shooting at feet under a car or shooting from a seated position with a steering wheel inb your way.

And "clearing the house", I always get a chuckle out of reference to clearing ones house or intruders.

[Rick]

Don't forget shooting over your shoulder while running the other way. I practice that one a lot.

We have a good setup for the home and none of it involves clearing anything. I'll stay in my bedroom while they cart the stuff out the door. It's not that important. There is a .45 and .38 backing it up along with the 911 call either landline or cellular, whichever is required. But I am NOT creeping through the house looking for anything. That's what they pay LEO for.

[Daniel Nighteyes]

I agree with Daniel, Having been "around the horn", a tour in Vietnam and early Iraq...

The only gunfight I ever won was against a young Vietnamese man who had his Lebel rifle slung over his shoulder. My rifle was in my hands. I especially remember his eyes as they went from surprise to determination to realization to resignation, and then to vacancy. Every now and then he still visits me in my sleep. I believe he will be with me to the end of my days.


... gadgets are not the answer, practice with what you have, that is THE answer

Agreed.

[natertot]

I think the same thing each time I see someone recommending training that incorperates advancing on the target in the open, drills in the open, using interior walls for cover......

They never stress laying on the ground shooting at feet under a car or shooting from a seated position with a steering wheel inb your way.

And "clearing the house", I always get a chuckle out of reference to clearing ones house or intruders.

There is a difference between cover and concealment, and you use which ever you have to the best advantage you can get. I don't know who "they" are, but I have found training from vehicles and around vehicles, under obstacles, around barricades and doors, laying on back and firing over your head so you see upside down, and countless other positions. I have also received "clearing" training in both single and team coordinations. The info and training is out there, just gotta dig for it and not go to local Jim Bobs back yard shootin gallery.

[Winter]

People didn't I did. You are not clearing rooms. You are defending yourself. That means you take a position and wait on them to come to you. Hopefully, you got the 911 call in. An AR sucks for home defense. Maybe if you live in the country it would be okay but those rounds will go through green board and sheetrock in my house and my neighbor's house.

.

Situation depends. For instance, it would be your duty and legally justified action to advance till you are closer to the intruder than any of your loved ones.

You can use the penetration for stick built homes to your advantage. The .223 loses energy rapidly and everything it hits, of course, reduces it further.

As in all shooting, try to hit what you aim at.


To the op, 2 mags should be sufficient, one can have a malfunction. Murphy never visits when everything is hunky-dory.

I have a flashlight on mine which is great. If you see a threat you are already pointing a rifle at it. :)


I am trained on an AR. I know the weapon backwards and forwards. It's as close a friend as any of you FOGs double barrels and lever actions.

[Rick]

Another consideration is kid safety. You have to do something to keep kids and grand kids safe when they are at the house. It's a lot easier to move handguns for me than long guns. Yeah, yeah, I know, ya'll have your kids and grand kids trained. Baloney. Accidents happen and kids are kids. What a horrible regret that would be to live with.

[0331exmc]

As you know, gadgets are not the answer, practice with what you have, that is THE answer

X2 for that. Guy with a bunch of tricked out "safe queens" don't worry me none. Now a Guy with an old sidearm, bluing worn thru, with permanent heat/powder discoloring at the muzzle. That there is the one ya got to keep an eye on.

Beware the dude that only own's 1 gun. Probaly knows how to shoot that thing pretty good.

[natertot]

Another consideration is kid safety. You have to do something to keep kids and grand kids safe when they are at the house. It's a lot easier to move handguns for me than long guns. Yeah, yeah, I know, ya'll have your kids and grand kids trained. Baloney. Accidents happen and kids are kids. What a horrible regret that would be to live with.

+1 on that Rick! Keeping guns away from little ones and yet having it readily available can be kinda tricky. I think it is paramount that the kiddos in your household understand them, but kids don't always have sound judgement 100% of the time.

[wholsomback]

Oh by the way the last 911 call that was made in my neighborhood took them 26 minutes to responde so I wouldn't count on that pill to save your can and I live in the city,go figure.I would rather rely on my weapons than the we'll show up when it's over crowd.

[Rick]

I can't say that we have that problem. We have a lot of LEO and they have a lot of visibility. They are usually on site in 2-3 minutes in force. I have no problem with any of our first responders. Medics and Fire are just down the street. Well, okay, when they hit that dang train horn at 2 a.m. when they zip past the house but other than that.....

[hunter63]

+1 on that Rick! Keeping guns away from little ones and yet having it readily available can be kinda tricky. I think it is paramount that the kiddos in your household understand them, but kids don't always have sound judgement 100% of the time.

If yu don't have young one around much....this can be a big deal.....heads up for sure

PS: natertot check this out.....http://www.wilderness-survival.net/forums/showthread.php?13608-Buckeyes-for-arthritis&highlight=buckeye

[natertot]

If yu don't have young one around much....this can be a big deal.....heads up for sure

PS: natertot check this out.....http://www.wilderness-survival.net/forums/showthread.php?13608-Buckeyes-for-arthritis&highlight=buckeye

I do have little one's around all the time. I have a four year old daughter and a son that will be two a little later this summer. My duty pistol is the most prevalent one around and I make an effort to show it to them and explain it to them at their level. My daughter has even held it several times after I cleared it and she calls the muzzle the "owwie end". A little over a year ago, she had a pet snail die and I explained to her that if she points the "owwie end" at something, it could be like her snail. I can tell by her facial expressions that she understands it, but I wouldn't leave it in her reach because she doesn't understand how to operate it.

Thanks for the link......

[Winter]

Another consideration is kid safety. You have to do something to keep kids and grand kids safe when they are at the house. It's a lot easier to move handguns for me than long guns. Yeah, yeah, I know, ya'll have your kids and grand kids trained. Baloney. Accidents happen and kids are kids. What a horrible regret that would be to live with.

You mean it is easier for you to carry a handgun down the hall than a rifle? I'd have to agree. It is also easier to carry a toothpick than a q-tip, but a rifle, handgun, toothpick, and q-tip all take one hand and the same amount of steps.

[Chris]

I think I would want easy access to both a tactical rifle and a shotgun, and a handgun. I don't own a rifle currently, being as I live in the city, but as soon as I move or sooner it is on my list.

I wouldn't try clearing my house though. All the bedrooms are up stairs, secure the stairs. If I could herd all the kids into the master bathroom or something I'd do that, but that might not be realistic in the middle of the night.

I hope to buy a legal transferable smg one day, that would probably end up being my preference. That basically is as much as a new car though.

[MMonette]

Im on the AR group. Its the cheapest option to cover the requirements I have. I wanted precision at long ranges, but also want high ammo captivities and a semi auto configuration. That would mean buying two guns, or getting a high-end AR. Don't get me wrong Im still getting a pistol and a shotgun but they aren't going to be a primary option more of a special purpose role.

[kyratshooter]

What are you planning on doing with all that Captive ammo?

[crashdive123]

Now, now....we don't pick on you when your fingers don't cooperate with your brain.:innocent:

[Desert Rat!]

It makes me weep each time I think about it. In case ATF is reading it was all gone. Each and every one of them. There was an RRA AR15 in the bunch, too. (sigh) Oh, and several thousand rounds of ammo. I don't think I should have loaded all that stuff in the back of the canoe with me. That might have been my mistake.You know any time you mix boats and beer this happens, I just can't believe the amount of quality firearms that have sunk to the bottom of the Colorado River in such an incident, sad but true!

[Rick]

The really bad part is I don't drink. It's stipulated in my witness protection agreement. Ooops. I probably shouldn't have mentioned that. Just forget you heard it.

[Geek]

I can't say that we have that problem. We have a lot of LEO and they have a lot of visibility. They are usually on site in 2-3 minutes in force. I have no problem with any of our first responders. Medics and Fire are just down the street. Well, okay, when they hit that dang train horn at 2 a.m. when they zip past the house but other than that.....

Here in the People's Republic of New Jersey, the LEOs don't believe in guns. When I went to pick up my state firearms permit the guy issuing it asked if I had any questions. I decided to make small talk and asked if he had any pistol recommendations. He replies "I don't know anything about them." so I asked "Well, what is that you're wearing?" He replies "9mm Glock." so I ask, "Do you like it?" He replies "I qualify once every 6 months, but otherwise I don't use it."

If I have a home invasion, I'm afraid to call 911. I don't want some innocent LEO to get hurt. :-)

[kyratshooter]

There was a time, long, long ago in a medium sized town in Tennessee, where the Chief of Police informed his department that if he was ever taken hostage they were NOT to call out the SWAT team.

He told the dispatcher that in case of emergency she was to call the guys at the gun shop.

[MMonette]

What are you planning on doing with all that Captive ammo?

You sir, get one point. :airhorn:I read, read, and re-read that post at least twenty times to find all the messed up grammar and stuff that one evaded me.

[hunter63]

Some time them there spell checkers don' know what you mean.......

[kyratshooter]

Now, now....we don't pick on you when your fingers don't cooperate with your brain.:innocent:

SINCE WHEN??

There is no mercy in this arena. None that I have seen.

The point is that I screw up so much it is great fun to catch someone else with their fingers tangled up on occasion.

[studderingdave]

I use my AR to maintain the skills i learned on the M16 while is was in the USMC. I shoot weekly, albeit not at the ranges I was used to in the service. I keep 4 magazines full, and stockpile ammo regularly with a decent amount of flow between stockpiles to ensure round freshness.

[kyratshooter]

I keep 4 magazines full, and stockpile ammo regularly with a decent amount of flow between stockpiles to ensure round freshness.

What is the "use by" date on M16 stuff?

I'm shooting reloads I built 20 years ago, have a couple of spam cans of Russian fodder from the '70s and just finished up a batch of .303 surplus dated from the 1950s. Does M16 ammo start molding after a certain date?

[Rick]

60 days. All 5.56 and .223 ammo should be forwarded to me for disposal. No need to thank me.

[crashdive123]

60 days. All 5.56 and .223 ammo should be forwarded to me for disposal. No need to thank me.

Uh oh..... THE RANGE IS HOT!

[karatediver]

60 days. All 5.56 and .223 ammo should be forwarded to me for disposal. No need to thank me.

If you live in California it is 45 days and you need the proper paperwork to dispose of the ammo. So call me because I have the requisite expertise for this state. In this state for quantities of one thousand rounds or more we will even pick it up from you at no charge. There is also no charge for the paperwork or disposal fee.

[hunter63]

Back in the olden days, BI, A fella used to go done to a gun shop, with an owner, and gunsmith, 3 cronies that hung out there, but didn't buy anything, .....You would ask a question, like how long can I keep ammo before it goes bad.....and" It" would start, the BS I mean......

Picture if you will, Cliff Clavin talking to Normie at Cheers........

Now that we have that picture in your head.......

Should mags be kept loaded?, and spring compressed?
If its damp, will the shells corrode?
Will ammo go bad if kept in a cool dry place?, Hot and wet?
How many mags do you need? Keep the gun loaded?

These these subjects get talked about over and over, and I can't tell you what the answer is............

It just seems to me that you can have the experience in the comfort of your own home, .......
Thankfully we have the Interweb......

[crashdive123]

It just seems to me that you can have the experience in the comfort of your own home, .......
Thankfully we have the Interweb......

Or using the WiFi at your local saloon.

[hunter63]

Well, yeah, there is that....not my fault, ya know?......We all have to do what we have to do.....

[kyratshooter]

Back in the olden days, BI, A fella used to go done to a gun shop, with an owner, and gunsmith, 3 cronies that hung out there, but didn't buy anything, .....You would ask a question, like how long can I keep ammo before it goes bad.....and" It" would start, the BS I mean......


I strongly resemble that remark, having valliently filled all four positions at one time or another.

How think you that I have such ability to innocently stir up a hornet's nest with a single post?

I can not remember the last time I saw a querry posted that I had not seen previously and could not provide at least two pro and con references. Just pick a side, I'll take the other.

Except for the "anybody here own?" questions. I have been far too busy hanging out at the gun shop, and receintly on the internet, to make enough excess cash to OWN much of anything!

Then I moved 2 miles from the free public range and all hope for a few normal days at the end of my life was lost.

[hunter63]

Heh, heh, heh, It worked.......
Congrats on the range.

[Beans]

The only gunfight I ever won was against a young Vietnamese man who had his Lebel rifle slung over his shoulder. My rifle was in my hands. I especially remember his eyes as they went from surprise to determination to realization to resignation, and then to vacancy. Every now and then he still visits me in my sleep. I believe he will be with me to the end of my days.Agreed.

The night visits never go away, some of them just come a calling less and less as time passes. I am thankful that they vist me and I am not visiting them.
Semper FI

[Wildthang]

Well luckily I dont have kids in the house, and I'm far enough out in the country that I dont have to worry about neighbors, so I have a Glock 9mm, .357 Mag, and a .380 in my night stand, and an AR standing in the corner by the bed. So if someone breaks into my house and we hear them, they are going to get shot.
I will call 911 after it's over so they can come and help clean up the mess!

[randyt]

If not a shotgun I think a SKS with "clips" would suffice. It has a fixed magazine so no worries on losing a magazine.

[yellowcab]

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[yellowcab]

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[yellowcab]

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[yellowcab]

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инфо (http://readingmagnifier.ru)инфо (http://rearchain.ru)инфо (http://recessioncone.ru)инфо (http://recordedassignment.ru)инфо (http://rectifiersubstation.ru)инфо (http://redemptionvalue.ru)инфо (http://reducingflange.ru)инфо (http://referenceantigen.ru)инфо (http://regeneratedprotein.ru)инфо (http://reinvestmentplan.ru)инфо (http://safedrilling.ru)инфо (http://sagprofile.ru)инфо (http://salestypelease.ru)инфо (http://samplinginterval.ru)инфо (http://satellitehydrology.ru)
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инфо (http://tamecurve.ru)инфо (http://tapecorrection.ru)инфо (http://tappingchuck.ru)инфо (http://taskreasoning.ru)инфо (http://technicalgrade.ru)инфо (http://telangiectaticlipoma.ru)инфо (http://telescopicdamper.ru)инфо (http://temperateclimate.ru)инфо (http://temperedmeasure.ru)инфо (http://tenementbuilding.ru)tuchkas (http://tuchkas.ru/)инфо (http://ultramaficrock.ru)инфо (http://ultraviolettesting.ru)

[yellowcab]

�ме� (http://audiobookkeeper.ru/book/7449)293.5 (http://cottagenet.ru/plan/177)CHAP (http://eyesvision.ru)TREA (http://eyesvisions.com/stories-from-the-clinic-sun-treatment)Morr (http://factoringfee.ru/t/1204136)Digi (http://filmzones.ru/t/1040029)Supe (http://gadwall.ru/t/1203327)Jewe (http://gaffertape.ru/t/1102888)�луж (http://gageboard.ru/t/1095990)�туд (http://gagrule.ru/t/1025138)хоро (http://gallduct.ru/t/1163569)трен (http://galvanometric.ru/t/1245330)Грам (http://gangforeman.ru/t/1348624)�ико (http://gangwayplatform.ru/t/1696989)куль (http://garbagechute.ru/t/1241950)
Pete (http://gardeningleave.ru/t/1069443)Ritz (http://gascautery.ru/t/1147017)Marc (http://gashbucket.ru/t/1070227)Wien (http://gasreturn.ru/t/1148418)фон- (http://gatedsweep.ru/t/977181)Буши (http://gaugemodel.ru/t/1238925)Окла (http://gaussianfilter.ru/t/1376307)psyc (http://gearpitchdiameter.ru/t/1115863)Dave (http://geartreating.ru/t/1097445)Mort (http://generalizedanalysis.ru/t/1081916)When (http://generalprovisions.ru/t/1101277)отды (http://geophysicalprobe.ru/t/1083042)Bruc (http://geriatricnurse.ru/t/1245178)Scha (http://getintoaflap.ru/t/1144985)XVII (http://getthebounce.ru/t/850241)
Grea (http://habeascorpus.ru/t/1088850)Jill (http://habituate.ru/t/1092561)Ташк (http://hackedbolt.ru/t/1208422)�мвр (http://hackworker.ru/t/1328634)Your (http://hadronicannihilation.ru/t/1103548)(Пет (http://haemagglutinin.ru/t/1098285)Glen (http://hailsquall.ru/t/1127173)John (http://hairysphere.ru/t/1083791)Свет (http://halforderfringe.ru/t/963313)Emil (http://halfsiblings.ru/t/1027955)Зими (http://hallofresidence.ru/t/935601)Kath (http://haltstate.ru/t/935971)Tesc (http://handcoding.ru/t/1027778)Caff (http://handportedhead.ru/t/1143682)Kapr (http://handradar.ru/t/898249)
Gill (http://handsfreetelephone.ru/t/1028380)�ерт (http://hangonpart.ru/t/1066517)Robe (http://haphazardwinding.ru/t/850763)Веза (http://hardalloyteeth.ru/t/676059)Цечо (http://hardasiron.ru/t/785043)Henr (http://hardenedconcrete.ru/t/947168)Coto (http://harmonicinteraction.ru/t/975454)Соде (http://hartlaubgoose.ru/t/848389)Петр (http://hatchholddown.ru/t/945487)Koff (http://haveafinetime.ru/t/1547391)Панк (http://hazardousatmosphere.ru/t/1252570)This (http://headregulator.ru/t/1547442)ELEG (http://heartofgold.ru/t/1547816)�цен (http://heatageingresistance.ru/t/1042992)Happ (http://heatinggas.ru/t/1343236)
Jona (http://heavydutymetalcutting.ru/t/1182876)Ulri (http://jacketedwall.ru/t/769788)Сафр (http://japanesecedar.ru/t/830947)Ð*евв (http://jibtypecrane.ru/t/1246194)Иллю (http://jobabandonment.ru/t/811646)Ð*оби (http://jobstress.ru/t/833773)Mari (http://jogformation.ru/t/1032668)Ñ�ерт (http://jointcapsule.ru/t/1148095)Poul (http://jointsealingmaterial.ru/t/1196928)Ð*обо (http://journallubricator.ru/t/1230747)Ñ�ерт (http://juicecatcher.ru/t/1148096)Sela (http://junctionofchannels.ru/t/1180763)Mari (http://justiciablehomicide.ru/t/1182275)Clic (http://juxtapositiontwin.ru/t/1183642)Jame (http://kaposidisease.ru/t/1180407)
Ezek (http://keepagoodoffing.ru/t/1181479)Зван (http://keepsmthinhand.ru/t/813427)Митр (http://kentishglory.ru/t/1183479)Serg (http://kerbweight.ru/t/1188015)Ð�льб (http://kerrrotation.ru/t/820713)Ð*оÑ�Ñ� (http://keymanassurance.ru/t/795586)Пала (http://keyserum.ru/t/1181284)Шеве (http://kickplate.ru/t/1354709)Ñ�тра (http://killthefattedcalf.ru/t/1346335)Hesi (http://kilowattsecond.ru/t/1096863)фант (http://kingweakfish.ru/t/1308769)Ð�або (http://kinozones.ru/film/7449)Bria (http://kleinbottle.ru/t/1199652)Sonh (http://kneejoint.ru/t/1139074)Холм (http://knifesethouse.ru/t/1711240)
Матв (http://knockonatom.ru/t/1010112)Davi (http://knowledgestate.ru/t/1210922)факу (http://kondoferromagnet.ru/t/1459307)Поле (http://labeledgraph.ru/t/1250779)Коми (http://laborracket.ru/t/1308619)Zone (http://labourearnings.ru/t/1548891)Zone (http://labourleasing.ru/t/1548601)Zone (http://laburnumtree.ru/t/1190981)Zone (http://lacingcourse.ru/t/1189636)Chet (http://lacrimalpoint.ru/t/1188916)Zone (http://lactogenicfactor.ru/t/1187251)Rond (http://lacunarycoefficient.ru/t/1193999)Zone (http://ladletreatediron.ru/t/1192331)Zone (http://laggingload.ru/t/1190634)Zone (http://laissezaller.ru/t/1192274)
Zone (http://lambdatransition.ru/t/1192320)Rond (http://laminatedmaterial.ru/t/1194004)авто (http://lammasshoot.ru/t/1241524)Zone (http://lamphouse.ru/t/1185467)Zone (http://lancecorporal.ru/t/1185418)Zone (http://lancingdie.ru/t/1186862)R084 (http://landingdoor.ru/t/1189038)Paul (http://landmarksensor.ru/t/1320230)Zone (http://landreform.ru/t/1187298)R3A8 (http://landuseratio.ru/t/1185659)Zone (http://languagelaboratory.ru/t/1191430)пати (http://largeheart.ru/shop/1161898)XVII (http://lasercalibration.ru/shop/1434353)DX-C (http://laserlens.ru/lase_zakaz/1001)�лад (http://laserpulse.ru/shop/591043)

[yellowcab]

Лопа (http://laterevent.ru/shop/1178794)Roya (http://latrinesergeant.ru/shop/453416)Cata (http://layabout.ru/shop/599696)Rune (http://leadcoating.ru/shop/600478)Shaw (http://leadingfirm.ru/shop/106452)прош (http://learningcurve.ru/shop/466140)Fion (http://leaveword.ru/shop/619934)Exot (http://machinesensible.ru/shop/302377)B730 (http://magneticequator.ru/shop/576670)0000 (http://magnetotelluricfield.ru/shop/446417)elec (http://mailinghouse.ru/shop/269159)WALL (http://majorconcern.ru/shop/621890)проб (http://mammasdarling.ru/shop/576987)Blue (http://managerialstaff.ru/shop/612493)креп (http://manipulatinghand.ru/shop/1040547)
�нго (http://manualchoke.ru/shop/601184)меди (http://medinfobooks.ru/book/733)kBit (http://mp3lists.ru/item/7449)Roge (http://nameresolution.ru/shop/1151092)Vali (http://naphtheneseries.ru/shop/563985)упак (http://narrowmouthed.ru/shop/461934)рабо (http://nationalcensus.ru/shop/1055983)ALL4 (http://naturalfunctor.ru/shop/576463)кори (http://navelseed.ru/shop/103129)Кита (http://neatplaster.ru/shop/455512)Wind (http://necroticcaries.ru/shop/178712)LANG (http://negativefibration.ru/shop/622350)Micr (http://neighbouringrights.ru/shop/642295)Asia (http://objectmodule.ru/shop/447904)Sony (http://observationballoon.ru/shop/10053)
Chou (http://obstructivepatent.ru/shop/175889)Cafe (http://oceanmining.ru/shop/397755)Fitn (http://octupolephonon.ru/shop/571871)заве (http://offlinesystem.ru/shop/149359)Байк (http://offsetholder.ru/shop/203293)ИÑ�ае (http://olibanumresinoid.ru/shop/150513)ONLI (http://onesticket.ru/shop/580671)Jewe (http://packedspheres.ru/shop/583180)ЛитÐ* (http://pagingterminal.ru/shop/685011)ЛитÐ* (http://palatinebones.ru/shop/684415)Amer (http://palmberry.ru/shop/689221)ЛитÐ* (http://papercoating.ru/shop/584418)ЛеÑ�и (http://paraconvexgroup.ru/shop/689859)Ð*ади (http://parasolmonoplane.ru/shop/1171186)диле (http://parkingbrake.ru/shop/1171184)
Mark (http://partfamily.ru/shop/1174249)Stev (http://partialmajorant.ru/shop/1173383)ауди (http://quadrupleworm.ru/shop/1543310)Syst (http://qualitybooster.ru/shop/1539142)Long (http://quasimoney.ru/shop/596435)Мушк (http://quenchedspark.ru/shop/765785)авто (http://quodrecuperet.ru/shop/1073369)Alek (http://rabbetledge.ru/shop/1076109)know (http://radialchaser.ru/shop/345768)Prim (http://radiationestimator.ru/shop/510611)�об� (http://railwaybridge.ru/shop/634979)Горш (http://randomcoloration.ru/shop/899255)О�ок (http://rapidgrowth.ru/shop/970063)один (http://rattlesnakemaster.ru/shop/1210572)Audi (http://reachthroughregion.ru/shop/392971)
обор (http://readingmagnifier.ru/shop/515225)теат (http://rearchain.ru/shop/796586)(Тре (http://recessioncone.ru/shop/645110)Горо (http://recordedassignment.ru/shop/1029351)заве (http://rectifiersubstation.ru/shop/1055418)Бел� (http://redemptionvalue.ru/shop/1063646)Екат (http://reducingflange.ru/shop/1686465)Гала (http://referenceantigen.ru/shop/1694065)англ (http://regeneratedprotein.ru/shop/1766605)Weav (http://reinvestmentplan.ru/shop/1775301)Иллю (http://safedrilling.ru/shop/1820203)Соде (http://sagprofile.ru/shop/1058518)Заха (http://salestypelease.ru/shop/1850391)�бил (http://samplinginterval.ru/shop/1876402)Вовч (http://satellitehydrology.ru/shop/1898093)
Mill (http://scarcecommodity.ru/shop/1494083)Лени (http://scrapermat.ru/shop/1497085)ШклÑ� (http://screwingunit.ru/shop/1497107)пунк (http://seawaterpump.ru/shop/1584404)Шней (http://secondaryblock.ru/shop/1431806)Прит (http://secularclergy.ru/shop/1492947)Крап (http://seismicefficiency.ru/shop/347651)Ð*евÑ� (http://selectivediffuser.ru/shop/402024)Прох (http://semiasphalticflux.ru/shop/403080)Игна (http://semifinishmachining.ru/shop/1689971)DX-C (http://spicetrade.ru/spice_zakaz/1001)DX-C (http://spysale.ru/spy_zakaz/1001)DX-C (http://stungun.ru/stun_zakaz/1001)Choc (http://tacticaldiameter.ru/shop/484359)Subw (http://tailstockcenter.ru/shop/492509)
Dece (http://tamecurve.ru/shop/499837)Игна (http://tapecorrection.ru/shop/502723)Доук (http://tappingchuck.ru/shop/489085)возр (http://taskreasoning.ru/shop/500486)Scor (http://technicalgrade.ru/shop/1823385)Шуби (http://telangiectaticlipoma.ru/shop/1881899)Плот (http://telescopicdamper.ru/shop/1915311)Кези (http://temperateclimate.ru/shop/790376)�гее (http://temperedmeasure.ru/shop/403049)авто (http://tenementbuilding.ru/shop/982205)tuchkas (http://tuchkas.ru/)Криж (http://ultramaficrock.ru/shop/982530)Spec (http://ultraviolettesting.ru/shop/484685)

[yellowcab]

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[yellowcab]

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