What we can do in hard times ?

[Mags]

What we can do in hard times ?

...for example in case of a big earthquake, tsunami, where you loose everything, no more food, no more tools, where to go to protect yourself from new dangers ( gangs) not having money or stores to reach.

Better run to the forest? isolate yourself or be with a group of trusty people? How to organise us to survive in very hard times?

Please give us as much advise you can come up with.
Thank you.

[Rick]

Your question is simply too vague. Surviving in Alaska is much different than Florida. Winter? Summer? The seasons make a difference as well. Read through this post and if you are still interested then revise your question.

http://www.wilderness-survival.net/forums/showthread.php?5477-Survival-Scenario-Check-List

[Mags]

Every one should say all what knows. Enumerate all what you know no matter zone or season. If you are from Alaska please say the way there people could help themselves to survive, from spring to winter. Are different possibilities for spring, summer, fall and winter. Different plants to survive. Etc. All what you know.
Others from other zones, locations will say what they know.
Thank you.

[Rick]

That doesn't even make sense. You want me to write down everything I know about wilderness survival? I'll be writing volumes. What good does that do? Define the question. Better yet, you write down what YOU would do and then we'll have an example to follow.

[Beans]

In the aftermath of any large disaster there are always debris that can be made/used as tools/ weapons Ect. Just as one example A stick can be used to get you a knife. A knife can be used to make a spear or bow. A spear or bow can be used to get you a firearm and any of those can be used to provide you with food.

Example #2 Receeding flood waters leave behind fish in isolated pools which can be caught and cooked or dried.

Look at the debris left in the aftermath of the tornado that hit Joplin Mo. If you couldn't find tools/weapons or short term food there, not being harsh but the best thing would be just lie down and die.

In my life time, of 67 years, I have lived through Hurricanes, Cyclones, Tornados, floods, typhoons and droughts, Never was i in a position that i couldn't have found tools/weapons or short term food all I had to do was look around me.

A lot of the members here have done the same or more. The will/capabilty to survive is all in the mind, Learn how to use it.

To be in an area without any of these resources you would need to be in a void or on a complete barren rock island. But even then you could use the rocks as tool/weapons.

[SARKY]

I any of those cases, you should actively be putting together a M.A.G. (Mutual Assistance Group) NOW! There is safety in numbers. By having a group to fall back on, you can share skill sets, information, and supplies/tools.

[Sourdough]

Mags,

I am guessing you do not have food and firearms and redundant everything you need cached in 5 different locations in the largest national forest.

It is all about skills. If you got skills no worries. I am 65 years old, I just came back to the cabin from a twilight recon/scouting patrol because my colors & fabrics were wrong. I'll now change into better stealth clothing and go spend three hours night hiking in the woods just back from the river. I'll expect one or two close bear encounters tonight, as the salmon are thick in the streams.

It is all about skill, stealth, practice, patiences, and sometimes luck. 42 years in the Alaska Wilderness and I still have SO much to learn.

Well it is full dark now outside the cabin, and I am off to perfect moving in the wilderness in the dark and rainy night. Damn it is a dark night.

[Beans]

Mags,

I am guessing you do not have food and firearms and redundant everything you need cached in 5 different locations in the largest national forest.

It is all about skills. If you got skills no worries. I am 65 years old, I just came back to the cabin from a twilight recon/scouting patrol because my colors & fabrics were wrong. I'll now change into better stealth clothing and go spend three hours night hiking in the woods just back from the river. I'll expect one or two close bear encounters tonight, as the salmon are thick in the streams.

It is all about skill, stealth, practice, patiences, and sometimes luck. 42 years in the Alaska Wilderness and I still have SO much to learn.

Well it is full dark now outside the cabin, and I am off to perfect moving in the wilderness in the dark and rainy night. Damn it is a dark night.

Go naked covered with mud.:wavey:

[Rick]

See? You should have defined the question. Beans is right unless, of course, all that wood and fish has been contaminated with radiation or chemicals. Then what? Define the question.

[crashdive123]

Please give us as much advise you can come up with.
Thank you.

Who is this us that you refer to? Since you are not being very specific on what you want, what do you intend to do with the information? Just re-post it on another site or forum?

[kyratshooter]

Mr Mags,

Wealready did all you ask.

What you want is already done here. It is called the history of this forum. All you have to do is read all the posts going back to the beginning. You will find the answer to any question you have....eventually.

The real question is, can you remember it all?

[Winnie]

If real hard times hit, I'm getting myself an ocean going canoe, paddling over the Atlantic and moving in with Ya'll. Needless to say, the canoe will not be left with Pal.

[Rick]

I think Mags just wants to populate his/her web site with information. If I'm wrong, I apologize, but that's how it strikes me.

[Winnie]

Well he/she better hadn't use my priceless and essential nugget of information is all I'll say.

[crashdive123]

He/she wouldn't dare.

[Mags]

OK, i came to this site much earlier never registered till last month. But i read few interesting topics. I dared to post this topic just to learn more. If in this group all of you are so perfect and know so many things, think a little bit further, not all have surviving skills, knowledge, that is why i came to learn.
Rick i am surprised you said that, i put your website on mine just to make yours more popular not mine, because yours is the best ever on network with precious information's to survive, and very well organised. (Main page)

I even asked you privately if i can open with this title a topic. I got approved, so all i wanted from all who are willing to talk about this, just to explain in order what to do in a natural calamity if we loose everything? All your informations would stay here nowhere else posted "steal" it from you. :)
Is mentioned here patience first...this is all the patience with young one who want to learn? If we would have to be in a group to help each other, with all what we know to protect ourselves this would be all the patience around us? man that would not be so good.

Beans, Sarky, Sourdough, thank you for your answers that was a good start. :)
Moderators don't be afraid i came here with good intentions not to steal your "tools" :)
If this topic bothers you all so much, just erase it , that will be OK with me.

[crashdive123]

OK, i came to this site much earlier never registered till last month. But i read few interesting topics. I dared to post this topic just to learn more. If in this group all of you are so perfect and know so many things, think a little bit further, not all have surviving skills, knowledge, that is why i came to learn.
Rick i am surprised you said that, i put your website on mine just to make yours more popular not mine, because yours is the best ever on network with precious information's to survive, and very well organised. (Main page)

I even asked you privately if i can open with this title a topic. I got approved, so all i wanted from all who are willing to talk about this, just to explain in order what to do in a natural calamity if we loose everything? All your informations would stay here nowhere else posted "steal" it from you. :)
Is mentioned here patience first...this is all the patience with young one who want to learn? If we would have to be in a group to help each other, with all what we know to protect ourselves this would be all the patience around us? man that would not be so good.

Beans, Sarky, Sourdough, thank you for your answers that was a good start. :)
Moderators don't be afraid i came here with good intentions not to steal your "tools" :)
If this topic bothers you all so much, just erase it , that will be OK with me.

1. Nobody here is perfect, nor did they profess to be.
2. You said you came here to learn, yet when suggestions were made so that the answers you received would be targeted to something more useful you ignored those suggestions.
3. Afraid of your intentions? Not hardly.

[Rick]

I'm sorry, but you didn't ask me anything privately if that was directed at me.

If you truly want to learn that's just fine. I'll be glad to help you. But you've ignored the first directive and just plowed ahead. That's NOT how you learn. If you want to learn then listen to what you are being told and respond accordingly.

[Mags]

Look , a direct question. I am a tourist, lets say in Alaska. I am visiting Anchorage, and i decide to go in nature for a day excursion, with 3 people in a car. We have just what a city person would have on his own bag. Little food, little water,a blanket. No tools.
A big quake is happening, will do big damages. Roads will be cut, no more access back for days. No one knows where we went , telephone connection is cut. No one can use that road because was badly damaged. No more access to be used. None of us is good with orientation, will try to wait in a hope helicopters may show up to check up the roads. What to do if all what you have is consumed, and coldness is increasing, and you can't use the car for protection because got in ditch.

How to start a fire with out any matches, what to consume to resist? what plants would be good to get some water if is no river near.?

[Mags]

Oh, sorry Rick, i confused the names. The email came back to me from Chris, sending me :



Yes you can open a new forum topic with that title.
And yes you're free to link to us.

Chris
Webmaster

[gryffynklm]

I was writing while MAG posted. THanks for the clarification. I don't live in alaska, I would be of little help.

MAGS, I live too far from your location. Unfortunately, if I were to offer advice according to my personal experience and geographic location it may cause you great difficulty, hardship, and perhaps death under some circumstances. It would irresponsible for me to to offer advice that could cause more harm then good.

Until some tells me that I'm an expert at some thing, I am not an expert. I just have an opinion and that doesn't necessarily carry value.

If you can give us an introduction with some geographic and climatic information we may be able to offer some suggestions.

As for your original post.

Get to safety

I would suggest that you find strength in a group of people. Many necessary tasks will need to be performed in an emergency situation. A group is better suited to getting those necessary tasks accomplished.

Organizing a group of people often falls on someone who in the middle of the crisis demonstrates the personality and ability to "organize". If no one shows that ability and no one steps up things can fall to chaos. If you have to ask, you may not be the best candidate we don't know anything about you.

In the united States we have The Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA). They have a website that includes emergency preparedness information Each state also has similar information available specific to the hazard potentials for that state.

Look up EMERGENCY PREPAREDNESS followed by the country, state or provence that you live in. For example EMERGENCY PREPAREDNESS Japan.

With out your help understanding the specifics of your geography thats all I can do.

It is inconsiderate of you to expect our members to spend considerable time writing EVERY THING WE KNOW because you do not need information that does not apply to your country, climate and geography. I myself will not offer information that may be inappropriate to your location.

[cowgirlup]

Look , a direct question. I am a tourist, lets say in Alaska. I am visiting Anchorage, and i decide to go in nature for a day excursion, with 3 people in a car. We have just what a city person would have on his own bag. Little food, little water,a blanket. No tools.
A big quake is happening, will do big damages. Roads will be cut, no more access back for days. No one knows where we went , telephone connection is cut. No one can use that road because was badly damaged. No more access to be used. None of us is good with orientation, will try to wait in a hope helicopters may show up to check up the roads. What to do if all what you have is consumed, and coldness is increasing, and you can't use the car for protection because got in ditch.

How to start a fire with out any matches, what to consume to resist? what plants would be good to get some water if is no river near.?

That is one darned unlucky group. You're probably all going to die.

But in the off chance fate will smile on you You should be OK without food for a few days. Maybe you could sponge up some dew or catch some rain to keep you hydrated. If the car isn't submerged in water you might be able to shelter in it. Or since there are three of you maybe you could get it out. Don't see why it would matter if you are good with orienting yourselves. Just follow the destroyed road back the way you came if you decide to try and walk out. if anyone is wearing glasses you might be able to start a fire with a lense and burn a tire for a signal. Providing you all remember that gasoline is flamable. Hmmm... Do they still put cigarette lighters in cars??? yeah, I'm gettin old...er.


Can't believe no one took any decent supplies for day in nature in Alaska.
Probably all gonna die.

[JPGreco]

It sounds like you aren't well versed in the subject so you should read up on the many topics on the subforums. Yes, specifics dictate survival in different areas of the world, but basics are applied everywhere. If you don't know the basics, the specifics are of little value. I've still never tried making fire with just sticks, so if I can't do that, what good would knowing the best wood to use in every area of the world be? I wouldn't be able to make fire anyway.

I question your basic analysis of your situations based on the statement about the car not being useable shelter because it is in a ditch. As stated, unless the car is submerged it is viable shelter, even if upside down.

[crashdive123]

Look , a direct question. I am a tourist, lets say in Alaska. I am visiting Anchorage, and i decide to go in nature for a day excursion, with 3 people in a car. We have just what a city person would have on his own bag. Little food, little water,a blanket. No tools.
A big quake is happening, will do big damages. Roads will be cut, no more access back for days. No one knows where we went , telephone connection is cut. No one can use that road because was badly damaged. No more access to be used. None of us is good with orientation, will try to wait in a hope helicopters may show up to check up the roads. What to do if all what you have is consumed, and coldness is increasing, and you can't use the car for protection because got in ditch.

How to start a fire with out any matches, what to consume to resist? what plants would be good to get some water if is no river near.?

I am far from Alaska, so the suggestions I give will be generic in nature. I'll leave the Alaska specific stuff to our Alaskan members. As far as what a city person carries? I know you looked at the template for scenarios - it would have been useful if you used it. I will just focus on one thing. Stay with the vehicle. You said it's in the ditch - OK. You need to signal others that you are stranded. You have a few options here. Starting a fire that produces a lot of smoke is one option. Using gasoline from the vehicle and the battery (along with some ripped out wiring) and you should be able to start a fire with relative ease. Keep the fire going. Green vegetation will produce large amounts of smoke. Your spare tire (and other tires if you can get them off) will produce an immense amount of thick, black smoke. Do not use one unless you hear potential rescuers (plane, helicopter, hikers) because they will not burn that long (20 - 40 minutes). Another method is rip the mirrors off the vehicle and use as signal mirrors. The vehicle horn can also be used for signalling (three blasts at a time if potential rescuers are in the area). The vehicle offers a lot more options for your safety as well.

If you want to provide more "stuff" as outlined in the scenario checklist we may be able to provide more answers.

[Mags]

Thank you so much for all your answers. :) You see was not that hard to do it :)
Now i know at least i can use a tire to make smoke for 20-40 minutes. You see, you teach me something new. :) Or to do an effort and follow backwards the road if i am not injured and i can resist to walk back.(If the distance is not to far).
I will follow to get more info from FEMA's site.

[Rick]

Do I have a map? If so I can calculate how far it is back to Anchorage or to one of the smaller towns. If all three of us can walk then perhaps that's our alternative. We can follow the road. Was anyone injured in the wreck? Depending on how late in the day it is I'll either stay put for the night or start walking. The devil is in the details. Scanarios are good learning tools but people are forced to make assumptions when they are not well defined.

Based solely on your explanation I'm going to use the car for heat. Just being in a ditch doesn't render it inoperable. I'll run the engine 10 minutes of every hour with the windows cracked and make certain the exhaust isn't blocked. That will keep us from freezing to death. We can gather firewood in between warming sessions in the car. I'll assume I have nearly a full tank of gas so that will last me quite a while but the wood gathering will be a good mental exercise to keep everyone focused on something other than the predicament we are in. And if we do have to sit it out for days the firewood will come in handy.

There are no plants that I know of in Alaska that can replace water. However, Anchorage and the vicinity has access to a lot of fresh water. Since the water we had is in plastic bottles we are going to use those to boil water and purify it. The Pink Salmon are running so we'll have access to food at the nearest river and rivers/creeks are pretty abundant, too.

Since the only major road in and out of Anchorage is route 1 we'll just sit tight because the state folks will be assessing the condition of route 1 and they will be flying over in a chopper in the next day or two. We just have to be comfortable until then. If they don't show then we can strip out some wiring for cordage and make some shelter. The Chugach forest is close if we went south or Nancy Lake if we went north so there's plenty of resources available.

[crashdive123]

Thank you so much for all your answers. :) You see was not that hard to do it :)
Now i know at least i can use a tire to make smoke for 20-40 minutes. You see, you teach me something new. :) Or to do an effort and follow backwards the road if i am not injured and i can resist to walk back.(If the distance is not to far).
I will follow to get more info from FEMA's site.

Actually it was a lot harder than it should have been.

[Mags]

Thank you, Rick.

[DOGMAN]

What we can do in hard times ?

...for example in case of a big earthquake, tsunami, where you loose everything, no more food, no more tools, where to go to protect yourself from new dangers ( gangs) not having money or stores to reach.

Better run to the forest? isolate yourself or be with a group of trusty people? How to organise us to survive in very hard times?

Please give us as much advise you can come up with.
Thank you.

First thing I would do would be, make a spear out of stout stick. I keep a pocket knife on me. with that I would whittle a sharp point onto a sapling so I would have a weapon. I would then abandon my car, friends and family and sleek off in to the thickest forest I could find. I would urinate all over my shoes to mask the scent of the city so if any looters with attack dogs started to track me I could illude them. I would find some string and tie that to the end of my stick and use an old coat hanger to make a hook, and then with my own hair trimmings I would make a collection of flies so I could fly fish for my dinner on a nearby brook. I would use my glasses as a magnifying glass and start a fire to cook the fish. I would find an old beer bottle in the brush and use that as a canteen. I would pick polk salad and dandelions and eat me some greens as a side dish to my trout. I would find a cave and live in it, or if no cave available I would build a nice log cabin. I would lurk around trailheads and try to find a female jogger to persuade into leaving behind the ruins of civilization and make her my mountain bride, we would then reproduce three children to carry on the human race. I feel I could do this anywhere- Alaska, Alabama, or Africa- the basic tenets of survival are the same everywhere

[Mags]

Thank you Dogman, you brought a smile :) . Should i say now i am available for ....cave mans? :)) Juuust kiiiidiiing :))

[Rick]

Exactly what method are you going to use to persuade the jogger? That's important stuff that a guy like me needs to know.

[Beans]

Mag

First thing is not to panic. Do an inventory of everything you have. Not only is that useful it will help calm you down. review the inventory list and then decide what do you need first. IS it a fire, water, shelter All of this is based upon what you have available, hence the inventory list.

If you can get in the vehicle you have shelter. If you near a water source that part is solved. items from the car will start a fire, that part is solved. Don't get over whelmed just solve one problem at a time, trying to solved them all at once will get you flustered and you won't solve any of them.

Pick out a need/problem and then search this forum for an answer. when you get the answer you want/need identify the next problem repeat the search.
an example: Newspaper or for that matter any paper makes good insulation, so does the foam in the vehicle seats, just stuff it inside your clothing. Use the vehicle's hubcaps as dishes, boil water in them, carry water in them, use them as pans skillets Etc. you can use them to dig with. The car's ashtray can be used as a cup. The antenna as a fishing pole or a spear or a defense weapon. Get smacked HARD with one once and you will see what I mean. people have even made .22 cal zip guns out of the car antennas.
Us the oil to coat your skin to keep from getting sunburn. Use the water in your radiator to make mud to coat your skin to keep bugs off you. The glass in the headlights can be used a cutting edge. remove the headlights and strip wire from the vehicle connect to battery to make a signaling device.

YOUR tires provide they are not flat will float, five tires fastened together could make a floation device to help you across a small body of water.
Before you have your "adventure" go outside to your car and try to figure out everything you could use off/out of it and what you would use it for. You will be surprised.

[Rick]

You really need to buy a new car. All my stuff is plastic. :blush:

[Mags]

Thank you Beans, Rick, I will do a deep research in all topics, will take some time. :)

[nig]

Hi do yourself a bob ( bug out bag) i have 1 for me and 1 for my 7 year old and even if we got to the park she takes hers it also gives her a bit of Independents.its got everthing in there she needs.she knows if she gets stung to chew up some ribwort and place on the sting.
she knows 3 other names for that plant and uses and also eats raw nettels tacos is one of her favourites.

[DOGMAN]

Exactly what method are you going to use to persuade the jogger? That's important stuff that a guy like me needs to know.

I learned somethings online http://www.howtopickupwomen.org/
i am going to use these techniques, if they fail....then, waterboarding

[Rick]

Does your wife know about this?

[DOGMAN]

Uh, No and lets keep that way- wise guy

[yellowcab]

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[yellowcab]

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[yellowcab]

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[yellowcab]

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