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View Full Version : Private Armies....& Quasi Private Army.....????


Sourdough
06-01-2011, 12:28 AM
What is there to know about private armies. Whats legal, whats NOT legal. Where is the line to not be crossed.....? When does a large team of corporate security personnel get close to being an army......? When does it get on government radar....? etc.
shooter_250
06-01-2011, 12:51 AM
Wow...those are some questions requiring definite parameters...Sour..Are you speaking of US Corps, International Corps or International Mercenaries? Not trying to be a Smart butt, just asking for clarification. The legalities are tremendous, what is legal for one, is not legal for another. Also, does your question include the legalities of a Country hiring a private army?...

I think this can be a fascinating thread, Thanks for starting it.

Lee
Sourdough
06-01-2011, 01:05 AM
Well, I have a neighbor who is a very wealthy. He owns several companies and gambling casinos. He has a large security force. If the SHTF he would have a lot of them here.

I just want to learn a lot about this subject. For example at some point do you have to register your security force if it get to ten thousand men......? Five thousand, Fifty thousand. Dose it go under the radar if you call it a "Private Security Co."....????

If I had a lot of money and I was building a super retreat, I would want security personnel to repel gangs,etc.
1stimestar
06-01-2011, 04:26 AM
We have a local militia. 4 of the leaders just got busted for their 241 plan. Seems the leader got jailed for tax fraud or something so the rest of them demanded his release then they were busted for their plan of killing one cop or judge for every one of them jailed. It was a pretty big deal understandably. My (ex now) husband wasn't part of it at all but did work for the big guy a while last summer.
crashdive123
06-01-2011, 05:35 AM
Blackwater, now Xe was formed in 1997. Not sure of all of the hoops that have to be jumped through to form a company like that, but they are pretty well equipped.
finallyME
06-01-2011, 10:40 AM
In a societal and economic collapse, what incentive is there for someone being paid to be security for some rich guy to stay with his employer? If it was me, I would go home and take care of my family.
BENESSE
06-01-2011, 05:40 PM
In a societal and economic collapse, what incentive is there for someone being paid to be security for some rich guy to stay with his employer? If it was me, I would go home and take care of my family.

Read "Lights Out" or "Patriots", if you haven't already.
The incentive is that there is security in numbers. That everyone watches everyone's back. That chances of survival are better together, with like-minded people than alone. And generally in a SHTF scenario, "employers" ( more like organizational initiators) would allow you to bring your immediate family aboard to for a community where everyone has a skill and a purpose. Makes sense to me.
The secret would be finding a like-minded group in line with your own beliefs and sensibilities. And we all know how hard that is even in this virtual world we belong to.
Sourdough
06-01-2011, 06:37 PM
The even better book was one second after. Even working together 1/2 died, of course it was a novel, but it made good points. One of the first things they did was turn the university into an army base.
SARKY
06-01-2011, 11:00 PM
I think that I for one would prefer a group formed from like minded people who want to work together rather than have a merc. force who could at any time decide they don't like the pay and turn on you,
Winter
06-01-2011, 11:04 PM
Sarky nailed it. Form a community with inherent responsibilities for the residents.

SD, you have the land.
BENESSE
06-02-2011, 01:02 AM
The even better book was one second after. Even working together 1/2 died, of course it was a novel, but it made good points. One of the first things they did was turn the university into an army base.
That WAS a great book--really the best of them all. Very credible, well written. I could relate on many levels. It reinforced something that I believed but didn't really want to acknowledge to myself: the need for a skill that would make one useful to a community and therefore a valuable commodity.

I think that I for one would prefer a group formed from like minded people who want to work together rather than have a merc. force who could at any time decide they don't like the pay and turn on you,
Couldn't agree more. That's why the neighborhood working together in " Lights Out" book made sense and was plausible.
Sourdough
06-02-2011, 02:38 AM
SD, you have the land.

Yes, Now I just need to find 20 young women with good military experience.
NCO
06-02-2011, 07:44 AM
I suppose living in a place where 80% of adult men have military training and there is third most weapons per person in the world is either really bad or really good...
Alaskan Survivalist
06-02-2011, 01:17 PM
Most are speaking as if they donot already have an army of friends, nieghbors and family. Is that truely the case?
Sourdough
06-02-2011, 01:49 PM
Well, back to my original post.........I am now assuming that no one knows of any regulations or restrictions to having a personal security force. Like Federal Laws, Federal Regulations.
Sarge47
06-02-2011, 02:13 PM
You probably would have to be able to show a need for a very large security force, like owning a very large corporation. Maybe you could start a business called "Sourdough's door-less outhouses" or something like that, although I doubt that it would become a very large business to justify such a large security force. Then there's a militia. That name seems to get a bad rap because of all the ding-bats out there plotting against the Government...that makes it Treason. It's treason just for calling them up to stand against the US Government. The late former Governor George Wallace did something like that to try & stop the segregation of schools but had to cave in or else! I know of several other cases as well. If it were me I'd just make it a very large hunting club; might be hard to explain the M-50 Machine gun, hand grenades, LOVs, M-1 Abrahms, etc.. though!

:rambo: :m107: :gunsmilie: :jango: :tank: :whistling: :sneaky2: :innocent: :cool2:
crashdive123
06-02-2011, 03:30 PM
Most are speaking as if they donot already have an army of friends, nieghbors and family. Is that truely the case?

No...............
Alaskan Survivalist
06-02-2011, 03:31 PM
My last post was a hint. By all means continue discussing private armies and security forces on an open forum. No one is listening.
Sourdough
06-02-2011, 04:32 PM
My last post was a hint. By all means continue discussing private armies and security forces on an open forum. No one is listening.

I could care less who is listening. I just want to know about this subject. I am not afraid of my government. And if the time ever comes that I need to be, I'll worry about it then.
Winnie
06-02-2011, 05:03 PM
The Atholl Highlanders are a private Regiment http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atholl_Highlanders. The Duke of Atholl is the only person other than the Monarch who can legally raise a private army in Great Britain.
crashdive123
06-02-2011, 05:10 PM
I could care less who is listening. I just want to know about this subject. I am not afraid of my government. And if the time ever comes that I need to be, I'll worry about it then.

Couldn't agree more. If it ain't illegal, then I ain't worried. Rep sent.
BENESSE
06-02-2011, 06:11 PM
Most are speaking as if they donot already have an army of friends, nieghbors and family. Is that truely the case?

In our case, that's truly the case.
Pal334
06-02-2011, 07:33 PM
Well, back to my original post.........I am now assuming that no one knows of any regulations or restrictions to having a personal security force. Like Federal Laws, Federal Regulations.

In general, there are no Federal restrictions on Private Security Forces. However there are the obvious Federal weapons laws that would have to be dealt with. The exception would be those forces that are formed to perform contract security work for the Federal Government ( this does not appear to be the point of your question). The most pertinent regulations are those that your locality or state would impose . Example, here in New Jersey it is very difficult to have private or contract security armed. But it is relatively easy to be licensed to provide unarmed security.
Alaskan Survivalist
06-02-2011, 09:36 PM
I could care less who is listening. I just want to know about this subject. I am not afraid of my government. And if the time ever comes that I need to be, I'll worry about it then.

It serves a useful purpose, like "a canary in the coal mine". Nice of you to volunteir.
JPGreco
06-02-2011, 10:00 PM
Yeah, I would think the hardest regulations would be the weapons regulations. After that, it would be the hurdles of setting it up to protect the company from litigation when it came to using force to repel intruders. Then getting insurance for your company.

Though, I must say that I think your are mistaken about the loyalty of an employee to an employee. Most armed security agencies aren't loyal to their employer. Groups like blackwater are only loyal because of the power that the employer offers to them. I would think most security forces would quickly turn on an employer or abandon them in a SHTF scenario and band together with other memebers of the security team who they work with day in and day out, unless the employer can continue to offer something they need.
Winter
06-02-2011, 11:20 PM
Most are speaking as if they donot already have an army of friends, nieghbors and family. Is that truely the case?

I don't trust easily. I have not the time to Infantry train my non-infantry trained friends.

Furthermore, "Paramilitary training" is against the law in Alaska. Search and rescue is not. Dangerous area search and rescue is not. Combat search and rescue isn't either.

If anything describes post SHTF activities better then "combat search and rescue" I don't know what it is.
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lambdatransition (http://lambdatransition.ru)laminatedmaterial (http://laminatedmaterial.ru)lammasshoot (http://lammasshoot.ru)lamphouse (http://lamphouse.ru)lancecorporal (http://lancecorporal.ru)lancingdie (http://lancingdie.ru)landingdoor (http://landingdoor.ru)landmarksensor (http://landmarksensor.ru)landreform (http://landreform.ru)landuseratio (http://landuseratio.ru)languagelaboratory (http://languagelaboratory.ru)largeheart (http://largeheart.ru)lasercalibration (http://lasercalibration.ru)laserlens (http://laserlens.ru)laserpulse (http://laserpulse.ru)
yellowcab
12-12-2025, 09:52 PM
laterevent (http://laterevent.ru)latrinesergeant (http://latrinesergeant.ru)layabout (http://layabout.ru)leadcoating (http://leadcoating.ru)leadingfirm (http://leadingfirm.ru)learningcurve (http://learningcurve.ru)leaveword (http://leaveword.ru)machinesensible (http://machinesensible.ru)magneticequator (http://magneticequator.ru)magnetotelluricfield (http://magnetotelluricfield.ru)mailinghouse (http://mailinghouse.ru)majorconcern (http://majorconcern.ru)mammasdarling (http://mammasdarling.ru)managerialstaff (http://managerialstaff.ru)manipulatinghand (http://manipulatinghand.ru)
manualchoke (http://manualchoke.ru)medinfobooks (http://medinfobooks.ru)mp3lists (http://mp3lists.ru)nameresolution (http://nameresolution.ru)naphtheneseries (http://naphtheneseries.ru)narrowmouthed (http://narrowmouthed.ru)nationalcensus (http://nationalcensus.ru)naturalfunctor (http://naturalfunctor.ru)navelseed (http://navelseed.ru)neatplaster (http://neatplaster.ru)necroticcaries (http://necroticcaries.ru)negativefibration (http://negativefibration.ru)neighbouringrights (http://neighbouringrights.ru)objectmodule (http://objectmodule.ru)observationballoon (http://observationballoon.ru)
obstructivepatent (http://obstructivepatent.ru)oceanmining (http://oceanmining.ru)octupolephonon (http://octupolephonon.ru)offlinesystem (http://offlinesystem.ru)offsetholder (http://offsetholder.ru)olibanumresinoid (http://olibanumresinoid.ru)onesticket (http://onesticket.ru)packedspheres (http://packedspheres.ru)pagingterminal (http://pagingterminal.ru)palatinebones (http://palatinebones.ru)palmberry (http://palmberry.ru)papercoating (http://papercoating.ru)paraconvexgroup (http://paraconvexgroup.ru)parasolmonoplane (http://parasolmonoplane.ru)parkingbrake (http://parkingbrake.ru)
partfamily (http://partfamily.ru)partialmajorant (http://partialmajorant.ru)quadrupleworm (http://quadrupleworm.ru)qualitybooster (http://qualitybooster.ru)quasimoney (http://quasimoney.ru)quenchedspark (http://quenchedspark.ru)quodrecuperet (http://quodrecuperet.ru)rabbetledge (http://rabbetledge.ru)radialchaser (http://radialchaser.ru)radiationestimator (http://radiationestimator.ru)railwaybridge (http://railwaybridge.ru)randomcoloration (http://randomcoloration.ru)rapidgrowth (http://rapidgrowth.ru)rattlesnakemaster (http://rattlesnakemaster.ru)reachthroughregion (http://reachthroughregion.ru)
readingmagnifier (http://readingmagnifier.ru)rearchain (http://rearchain.ru)recessioncone (http://recessioncone.ru)recordedassignment (http://recordedassignment.ru)rectifiersubstation (http://rectifiersubstation.ru)redemptionvalue (http://redemptionvalue.ru)reducingflange (http://reducingflange.ru)referenceantigen (http://referenceantigen.ru)regeneratedprotein (http://regeneratedprotein.ru)reinvestmentplan (http://reinvestmentplan.ru)safedrilling (http://safedrilling.ru)sagprofile (http://sagprofile.ru)salestypelease (http://salestypelease.ru)samplinginterval (http://samplinginterval.ru)satellitehydrology (http://satellitehydrology.ru)
scarcecommodity (http://scarcecommodity.ru)scrapermat (http://scrapermat.ru)screwingunit (http://screwingunit.ru)seawaterpump (http://seawaterpump.ru)secondaryblock (http://secondaryblock.ru)secularclergy (http://secularclergy.ru)seismicefficiency (http://seismicefficiency.ru)selectivediffuser (http://selectivediffuser.ru)semiasphalticflux (http://semiasphalticflux.ru)semifinishmachining (http://semifinishmachining.ru)spicetrade (http://spicetrade.ru)spysale (http://spysale.ru)stungun (http://stungun.ru)tacticaldiameter (http://tacticaldiameter.ru)tailstockcenter (http://tailstockcenter.ru)
tamecurve (http://tamecurve.ru)tapecorrection (http://tapecorrection.ru)tappingchuck (http://tappingchuck.ru)taskreasoning (http://taskreasoning.ru)technicalgrade (http://technicalgrade.ru)telangiectaticlipoma (http://telangiectaticlipoma.ru)telescopicdamper (http://telescopicdamper.ru)temperateclimate (http://temperateclimate.ru)temperedmeasure (http://temperedmeasure.ru)tenementbuilding (http://tenementbuilding.ru)tuchkas (http://tuchkas.ru/)ultramaficrock (http://ultramaficrock.ru)ultraviolettesting (http://ultraviolettesting.ru)