The Conspiracy Theory Disease!

[Bushmaster]

I wasn't sure where to post this so move it if necessary. I can't help but noticed how NWO mania is bringing out the worst in tin foil hat wearers. My experience (and on going struggle) is with my grandfather, who used to be someone I looked up to. The man taught me a ton about the outdoors, horsemanship, and firearms and the safe handling of them. I can't help but avoid him now because he has really gone off the deep end. Ask him, and the entire world is going to be run by a single government with a single electronic currency and all of it will be in place by 2012. Of course, the mega banks will eradicate 80% of the population first! I got my first taste of this hogwash last thanksgiving. This was right before I got married so I figured I would let the lady see what she was getting into. Boy, what a surprise. As soon as the food was gone, the doomsday prophecies started flowing. He paused for awhile, so I took the moment to show him the aquaponics system I was looking into making. The only thing he could say was how senate bill s510 was going to outlaw gardens and rainwater collection. I stared at him blankly, not sure how to react to the nonsense he was interrupting me with. Anyone else would be getting back handed at this point. I really don't like being interrupted with stupid comments. Anyway, he goes on to tell me how Alex Jones knows everything and anyone who disagrees is part of the cover up. He says he has stockpiled gold bullion and mountains of ammunition. He has even bought a few AR style rifles (as if that makes a difference) Then as we were leaving he gave me a DVD of the Aaron Russo interview (you know, the one that's free on youtube that I watched two years before) and told me that maybe it will "make me wake up". Somewhere along the way he got ahold of my e-mail address so I now receive Alex Jones crap on a daily basis. This man is a double major in Chemistry and Veterinary Medicine. Behold the mind numbing power of Alex Jones' fear mongering. As if stockpiling weapons would save you from something like this. The only way to survive would be packing light and staying on the move. Trying to make a fortress and having shootouts with the military would only result in having an a10 Warthog turn you into Country Crock. How exactly do you enforce "no rainwater collection". These were actually laws passed on the STATE level in some western states. I have no formal education and I debunked this in 30 mins of research. Meanwhile Mr. Double Major is buying into the tin foil mania that is infowars.com. Thank you Alex Jones for ruining an important person in my life.

[Alaskan Survivalist]

Drink a tall glass of flouridated water and go back to sleep.

[crashdive123]

Bushmaster - you will find that there are about half a dozen or so here that are in line with your dad's way of thinking. They will worship at the alter of Alex Jones and poo poo the rest, much like others will worship at the alter of (pick your source) and poo poo at the musings of Alex Jones.

Time will tell which camp is right.

[randyt]

I see this trend too, especially with the older folks. They have seen a lot of changes in their years and don't like it. Younger folks are numb to it all, it's normal for them/us. Take a older person, they lived in a time when freedom was valued, it was a good life. That life is slowly being eroded away, so what are they going to think? It's now a world full of cant's. I wonder about this myself and have never heard of alex jones or arron russo

[canid]

this is pretty much why i limit my tin-foil hat affinity to matters like extra terrestrial contact cover-ups, industrial technology suppression, the assassination of popular musicians and other such issues. they're more fun for me and i don't have to loose much sleep over it :D

in all seriousness, i feel pretty sure the world is chock full of political conspiracies and i have a hunch none of them are either as coordinated or interesting as they are painted in alex jones films or suspense thriller fiction. most of them seem to involve the short-game pursuit of money. maybe i'm blind.

[Rick]

Don't overlook the possibility that your grandfather is suffering from a mental illness. Does he live alone? Has something happened in his life that would/could cause a major emotional upheaval? People don't just abruptly change, as you described, without some underlying cause. Perhaps it's something he's thought about for a long time and was ready to share his conclusions with you or perhaps he is suffering from an emotional illness brought on by age, disease, or something he's been fighting all his life and you just don't know about.

I'm not suggesting that everyone that supports Alex Jones is mentally ill. If that were true it would explain a lot to me, but I digress. I think it's important for him and you to look a little deeper. Perhaps a physical check up might be in order?

[kyratshooter]

Or perhaps he has lived longer than us, has seen more, can visualize the trend, and he is RIGHT!

Don't let Rick talk you into putting your grandad in the looney bin! He is the resident government informer.

Look at the world your grandad grew up in, and look at what it has been turned into, then try to convince yourself it was all an accident.

I have studied and taught history for most of my life and from what I see the plan set in motion after WW1 is about 8-12 years behind schedule. Regan really messed them up.

[Don]

Bushmaster,

A few posters have already mentioned the generational issue as it relates to your grandfathers attitude. Though it doesn't explain it all away it is a factor in his thinking. I've hit the half century mark my self and work in a public high school. The differences I see in young people today compared to how I grew up do cause me concern. I also have a BA in history which doesn't mean a whole lot by itself but does give me some perspective when comparing todays world to decades previous. It is quite easy to look at current events both domestic and abroad and be very concerned. Those concerns can lead some to believe some crazy things. I often have an internal dialogue with my self about what the future holds. In general I am pessimistic but not hopeless. I have done some accumulating of food and ammo but not a lot compared to some folks. I often go through emergency plans in my head. But when things seem like I am getting obsessed I take a deep breath and put on a favorite DVD and relax. No one can prepare for everything. I wouldn't write your gand-dad off yet, just try to understand his point of veiw and love him for his better points. Don't argue with him, your not going to change an old dogs mind. Just love him.

Don

[NCO]

What Don said..

[Rick]

Of course, his grandad thought the same thing about the younger generation as did his granddad and his grandad before him Every generation thinks the new generation is going to Checkout in a Handbasket.

[randyt]

I'm with Don on this one. When I'm feeling down I put in a favourite DVD. something like Enemy of the State or Conspiracy Theory. LOL

[Justin Case]

LOl,, Those were good movies ;)

[randyt]

movies?????? I though they were real life documentaries LOL.

[Justin Case]

movies?????? I though they were real life documentaries LOL.

Probably not too far off ;)

[Alaskan Survivalist]

I can't help but to think that people deserve the world they are creating for themselves even if it only exists in thier minds. Good or bad.

[Rick]

Wow! thanks! Utopia here I come.

[Alaskan Survivalist]

Wow! thanks! Utopia here I come.

You do know that is just a commy dream and not a real place....nevermind....have a nice trip.

[BENESSE]

It's all relative. Compared to my friends and neighbors, I'm out there. Compared to some people here, I haven't even paid the price of admission.
You grandfather's OK. Just a matter of degrees of preparedness, that's all.

[Ken]

I myself have have been afraid to post anything here since I discovered that Rick and Sarge and Crashdive are intelligence agents deployed by the executive board of the New World Order. This sinister organization conceals its very existence by operating from an outhouse located in Alaska. From that isolated location, the Supreme Commander of the NWO, a trillionaire by the name of Sourdough, directs all NWO activities using telepathic geese. This information was sent to me by Nativedude, head of the WWR (World Wide Resistance) in a form of Morse code cleverly disguised as tiny dog farts. I'd say more, but I have to retreat to my bunker because I can see the black helicopters coming over the horizon.

[Camp10]

How come I have a Red Rider song stuck in my head after reading this thread?

[crashdive123]

As long as it's not this.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dsKO_r76kfQ

[Justin Case]

fyjpj72n5z4&feature=related

[welderguy]

You all do know that elvise is alive and really runs our government.

[2dumb2kwit]

How come I have a Red Rider song stuck in my head after reading this thread?

Yeah me too.

No, wait....that's a different tune. Here's what I was thinking.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qt0_oPPK6eA

[Rick]

Wait a minute! Hold the phone! Back this truck up! Ken made a post and no one said hello?

High ya, Ken!!

[crashdive123]

Ken who????

[Rick]

No, silly. Ken Who played on Hawaii 50.....I think.

[crashdive123]

Oh --- Ken Yakosabi.

[Bushmaster]

Well the way I see it this whole NWO thing is like the Y2k scare. There was tons of "evidence" that it was going to happen and guess who was on the air new years eve of 1999, screaming about the Russian ICBMs and invasion, planes dropping out of the sky, and "hundreds of thousands" dying. Alex Jones. This is why he is a self promoting lunatic. Now he is taking the 2012 nonsense, something about lizard shape shifters and Planet X, and evil Jewish bankers and rolling it into one big conspiracy story. If you ask me, yes, I believe there are incredibly evil billionaires in the world today, most of whom lean to the extreme liberal left, who have mafia type control over government officials. However, I feel they are more concentrated on being a parasite to the masses rather than killing them off. I mean, even though George Soros is a total scumbag who fancies himself some sort of god, I think he is much happier leeching off the rest of us and trying to make a profit by destroying the dollar than trying to spark some kind of genocide. So yeah, these guys have the cold mentality to kill everyone off but why would they? As long as we are alive and working, they get make billions for nothing.

[Bushmaster]

And as far as I know, my grandfather is mentally sound. He is married. The funny thing is how much he distrusts the federal government. He is employed by the FDA. I don't think he truly has a disease, just a temporary obsession with Alex Jones. I'm sure after 10 years of this nonsense, he will give it up. I just find it very irritating. More importantly though, I feel he is wasting his time worrying about EVERYTHING. Just prepare reasonably and go on living.

[Rick]

It was just a suggestion for a possible cause.

[Alaskan Survivalist]

Y2K only proved it was all hype and Alex Jones only discredits himself and has nothing to do with other information that may be factual. It's not hard to debunk the 6 oclock news these days! To much information today does not stand alone and is most always put into some kind of context by those with an agenda. Between spin, half truths, omissions and flat out lies to believe any of it one way or the other would make you a pawn. Joining together for any purpose plays into the NWO. Stand on your own two feet, reliant on none and thank no man for the right!

[Rick]

Remind me again. How long have they been taking over? Since 1913 and the establishment of the Federal Reserve? (You did read the Profound Revolution, right) I, for one, wish they'd hurry things up a bit. I have these really nifty NWO T-shirts that a bunch of us joined together and had printed. If we have to wait another 60 years the darn things are gonna go out of style. You can buy them at www.we_are_sheeple.com (http://www.we_are_sheeple.com)

[Alaskan Survivalist]

Thier power has been growing a long time. Are you asking when it will be absolute? If an accurate prediction is needed for proof I could turn this on your philosophy as well. When is the economy going to get better and liberty restored to the individual? Give me a date.

[Rick]

I didn't ask for a date. I asked how long they have been planning this take over. 98 years is a long time to plan for anything in politics.

[Alaskan Survivalist]

I didn't ask for a date. I asked how long they have been planning this take over. 98 years is a long time to plan for anything in politics.

That's why they call themselves progressives.

[SARKY]

All of this wouldn't be an issue except that so many politicians have been using the catch phrase NWO. Have any of read the book "The creature from Jekyl Island"? I is a very interesting read and I highly recommend it.

[Alaskan Survivalist]

It's also an issue for Christians that were fortold of this day thousands of years ago. I've risked my life in many ways for nothing more than kicks. Much more than this is at risk for believers.

[Rick]

The politicians that tossed the term around were primarily found in the 30's and 40's and meant it profoundly different than is being construed here.

Let's not delve off into religion. No good will come of that either.

[Alaskan Survivalist]

Agreed, but to ignore its influence on events....like so many things..."damned if you do, damned if you don't".

I see slow colllapse happening when so many survivalists are preparing for sudden collapse. "Doomers" would prefer sudden collapse as it would leave more resources to rebuild but this is not the way things are happening. As long as it comes slow enough to be accepted by the masses it will continue and the internet is a good guage to measure discontent and contributing to the efficient implimentation. It's coming fast but not instantly yet but that to may change when they get thier ducks in a row. The only power they have is what we give them. They are threatened by independence and self reliance. While there are not enough people to change the coarse of events, self reliance will serve those who practice it to the degree they can achieve it. This is what seperates it from all the organized efforts to make things better and doomed to fail unless everybody gets involved. It's not going to happen.

[Rick]

Truth be told there is a huge benefit to a single currency and a single, overriding government. International commerce is being dragged along with an archaic method of finance utilizing currency exchange rates that don't provide any value add to the process. Fifty states work more of less harmoniously under a single federal government so why wouldn't 195 countries operate in the same way? Wars would become a thing of the past excepting for pockets of rebels that we see operating today.

[Alaskan Survivalist]

Truth be told there is a huge benefit to a single currency and a single, overriding government. International commerce is being dragged along with an archaic method of finance utilizing currency exchange rates that don't provide any value add to the process. Fifty states work more of less harmoniously under a single federal government so why wouldn't 195 countries operate in the same way? Wars would become a thing of the past excepting for pockets of rebels that we see operating today.

If that does not scare the OP I don't know what will.

[NCO]

Read NY-Times article about zombie banks and euro... just saying...

[BENESSE]

Truth be told there is a huge benefit to a single currency and a single, overriding government. International commerce is being dragged along with an archaic method of finance utilizing currency exchange rates that don't provide any value add to the process. Fifty states work more of less harmoniously under a single federal government so why wouldn't 195 countries operate in the same way? Wars would become a thing of the past excepting for pockets of rebels that we see operating today.

IMO, that could never work. Whatever the incentive, it could hardly make up for incompatible differences in various nationalities, religions and centuries long history of conflict and regional grudges. The former Yugoslavia is a perfect example of that--three different nationalities, three different religions, one currency and a major post communist cluster-schtup. 195 countries you say? Can't even pick 5 that can get along.

[Rick]

That's what they said about those dang colonists, too.

[BENESSE]

That couldn't be more different. They were starting off with a common goal, escaping persecution and venturing into a new land.
The 185 countries you have in mind would stand a better chance of getting along under one govt. if they colonized another planet.

[NCO]

Aye and what it was that happened in the 19th century when the states agreed to disagree... Oh well, At least with EU it isn't working too well. I guess that we should donate every person in the world a mora, then they would have a real trouble on their hands and could concentrate on that.

[sushidog]

Yes, tyranny and slavery is much more efficient than freedom, justice and free will. The whip is much more efficient than persuasion. An single currency is easily controlled for absolute power and world dominion. I submit your own example, consider our our corrupt, overbloated federal government - intent on stealing the property of those who have earned it, with the design of distributing it as political rewards amongst their cronies. They will continue until they kill the goose that lays the golden eggs. Enjoy the feast, cause it will be your last.

Some of us believe in Bible prophecy and the future it fortells. Far too many of us see things the way you do, Rick (I assume you know better and are just playing devil's advovcate for the sake of a spirited discussuin). ;) Some of us know how it all ends. (Here's a clue, it gets very bad before it gets better.)

There are some things worth sacrificing to prevent, even at the ultimate price. My father knew this when he stood against the Nazis in WWII. Though he knew what the end would be, he believed he could delay it for a season. He was right. Now it's our turn to stay the tide. What will we do on our watch?

Choose the fairest and most intelligent among us as your God-King, the result will always be the same. The only chance we have of preventing the slaughter is to divide the power up equally as best we can by a system of checks and balances, as our founding fathers intended here. Still a tyrant will rise intent on Lording over us. Ultimately we will allow it, and receive the reward we deserve. Many will die, but a few sheep will be prevented this mercy for as briefly as it pleases the Enemy. A single currency is the Enemy's greatest tool to accomplish his ends. I portend that each state should have their own sovergn currency to protect us from the fed's gustatory excesses. Alas, it's too late to save us. If we ever move to a common world currency we're done. Why do you think the euro was proposed and adopted? It's merely a tool to subjugate Europe, and it's working exactly as intended.

“Instead of a Dark Lord, you would have a queen, not dark but beautiful and terrible as the dawn! Tempestuous as the sea, and stronger than the foundations of the earth! All shall love me and despair!” Lady Galadriel, Lord of the Rings

Is it a coincidence that the most powerful weapon in the world, coins, are round like a ring? I think not.

Chip

[Rick]

Let's look at this in the logical progression. Family units gathered together for protection and efficiency. Soon clans joined together then small geographic regions, the kingdom formed (or whatever the title of the day was) then countries. One has to conclude that the next logical step would be something larger still. Perhaps we're not ready for a single, unified government but larger autonomous governments could exist and, in fact, do in practice just not in name. There are many countries that have come together under some alliance to reach a common goal. The North Atlantic Treaty Organization (NATO) being one, GATT, MAI, UNTS, League of Nations, etc.

As to common currencies, that would be the easiest of all to implement and there really is no reason not to do it. The EURO is a good example of how well it can be implemented.

Chip - I'm sorry, but if you really ARE a believer then you know you have no power to change the pre-ordained and neither did your father. I'm sorry you equate authority with a whip. It sounds like you feel you have no control over your life. Is it a coincidence that a club hurts when you get slugged? I think not. Didn't have anything to do with the paragraph but neither did the coin/ring thingie so there. :whistling:

AS - I do agree that there is a slow progression toward a single unified authority (for lack of a better word). I thinks it's a very long way down a road that neither of us will see. I would encourage you to read anything by Robert Mundell who is a professor of economics at Columbia University. Awards out the wazoo for his incredible work on optimum currency areas of which the Euro is one. He was one of the men that put together the whole Euro project and brought it to reality. He's a supply-sider and one of the founders of it.

[Alaskan Survivalist]

With global government all the worlds problems will no longer be isolated and be our problem as well. Which is more likely, that we will raise the stardard of living for the rest of the world or that they will be able to lower ours to thier level and then there will be no one to come to the rescue. I've heard that if all the world consumed the way Americans do it would take 6 planets to supply the raw materials. Imagine how many poor people of the world would come to America in a world without borders. End wars? Maybe, but they would be replaced by food riots in bread lines and total submission will be required to get anything. Ownership is even being claimed for the rain that falls from the sky. No matter how you divide the pie there just is not enough for everybody and I like the system that has me as one of the well off.

[Rick]

But only if you arrive at the conclusions you did. The world's problems are not isolated. They are ours already. Japan, Libya, Afghanistan to name a few. We deal with the world's problems every day whether we are hauling bags of grain out of a chopper or paying higher prices at the grocery store. Our standard of living is based largely on our productivity. A rate that has been increasing nearly every year. But if the world rises to our standard of living then there is no incentive to come here. If one currency means 1 dollar anywhere in the world why go thousands of miles away to make the same 1 dollar you can make at home? If everyone is at the same standard of living there is no need to come to the rescue. But when it comes right down to it. It's not a matter of Big Brother taking over anything. It's a matter of loosing what little we have to hang on to. It's the sounds that keep us up at night. The fear that someone else might get what we have. Isn't it?

[Alaskan Survivalist]

Yes. We have already given much of our soverienty to the NWO already.

Here is more. The LOST treaty.http://real-agenda.com/2010/07/30/law-of-the-sea-treaty-and-the-national-ocean-council/

[Alaskan Survivalist]

Yes. We have already given much of our soverienty to the NWO already.

Here is more. The LOST treaty.http://real-agenda.com/2010/07/30/law-of-the-sea-treaty-and-the-national-ocean-council/

PS. I think you are confusing deficet spending with productivity.

[Rick]

First - On your blogger. The very first thing I do when I'm given these types of things to read is research the author. That's before I even read his words. I look for an address. If the author doesn't bother to say this is me and where I am then I don't put much stock in what he says. When you can't find any information on an author then it just becomes one man's opinion and I don't put any more faith in that than I do the next guy.

Productivity is measurable and quantifiable just like deficit spending or any other accounting function. The American worker is the most productive worker in the world. Much of that comes from automation but don't discount their hard work either.

[BENESSE]

But only if you arrive at the conclusions you did. The world's problems are not isolated. They are ours already. Japan, Libya, Afghanistan to name a few. We deal with the world's problems every day whether we are hauling bags of grain out of a chopper or paying higher prices at the grocery store. Our standard of living is based largely on our productivity. A rate that has been increasing nearly every year. But if the world rises to our standard of living then there is no incentive to come here. If one currency means 1 dollar anywhere in the world why go thousands of miles away to make the same 1 dollar you can make at home? If everyone is at the same standard of living there is no need to come to the rescue. But when it comes right down to it. It's not a matter of Big Brother taking over anything. It's a matter of loosing what little we have to hang on to. It's the sounds that keep us up at night. The fear that someone else might get what we have. Isn't it?

Up to a point. There are so many other factors that can make a huge difference and an unwelcome burden on other players. Case in point for the EU: Greece...and Portugal as of lately.
We constantly gripe about CA, but they are still one of ours. Our dirty laundry. Don't think we'd do too well with say, France or Italy or God forbid, Russia. We'd have us a civil war II on our hands.

[Rick]

Your point is valid but is it really any different than having California, Massachusetts or Illinois in the very same boat under the federal umbrella? States operate in a more or less autonomous fashion. Why wouldn't gov'ts? There are a myriad of issues that would need to be resolved not the least of which is political dogma so all this can only be theoretical in nature. But I don't see a difference between unified states and unified countries. There are actually huge benefits to people in the realm of social services as well as proper utilization of raw materials.

Remember too that at one point in time they were our clan, our town, then our state before we ever considered our country.

[BENESSE]

Unified states worked for us as an experiment never to be repeated.
It didn't work for the Soviet Union, it didn't work for Yugoslavia and even NATO has frequent problems when one of the countries isn't on board with mostly us.
The only time it could work IMO, is if we faced a threat from space aliens.

[crashdive123]

I for one do not want a "one world" anything, be it currency or government or anything else. I believe (as I think many here do) in American exceptionalism. It is my belief that it is because of the freedom that beats in the hearts of every human being were allowed to flourish and grow due to the way in which this country was founded. Our founding documents laid the ground work for this to take place. If other nations "want what we got/had", then the framework that needs to be followed is clear.

Please do not misunderstand my statements. They are not meant as a negative commentary about any other country.

[Alaskan Survivalist]

Rick, I use a different method to digest my information. I take it all in and then toss what does not fit. Manfacturing up? When you count McDonalds assembling hamburgers. The numbers are being manipulated. S&P warned the US on coarse to loose it's AAA credit rating yesterday sending stocks tumbling. It's like you covering all your expenses with a credit card thinking you are doing ok when your credit card is maxed. The forces keeping inflation in check at this point are wages are not going up, food and fuel is not figured in, the housing market is collapsing and giving money to the banks seems to be a black hole because they are sitting on it. Our money supply has trippled in the last two years making every dollar you have worth a third of its value when that money gets into circulation. Then there is dwindling resources with emerging markets raising demand. Why is gold at record highs if the economy is doing so well? There is plenty of bad news on all fronts you just seem to be ignoring.

[Rick]

Now you're all over the board.

The problem with tossing out what you don't want is you only keep what fits your paradigm. If you toss the authors that are nobodies (since anyone can blog their little hearts out introducing you to their reality) and look for only those that are legitimate, have credentials to back up their thoughts, and have been recognized as leaders in their fields, then your time is worthwhile and you are more apt to come away learning something. At least that's been my experience. I don't waste my time on wannabe famous folks.

McDonalds is not included in the manufacturing sector.

I don't understand why you keep saying the numbers are being manipulated. They are public record. There are any number of legitimate watch dog groups that closely monitor the numbers. If they thought for a minute they were being manipulated they would be blowing the whistle and filing class action lawsuits. That's not happening. The numbers are defined, their sources are defined the mathematics are defined. Anyone can follow the numbers.

Debt is a concern and a large one. I've said all along what has to happen and even made predictions on what will happen. I'll say it one more time. Services will be cut and taxes will be increased to resolve the debt issue. We have until roughly 2020 to fix the debt issue but the longer we wait the more painful it will be. Stocks are back up this morning on word that housing starts have increased and a rebound of benchmark indexes. You can not take one index and look at one day and proclaim anything from it.

I'm not ignoring anything. I recognize and have said over and over that the economy is not good. What I've said and continue to say is it is a business cycle and we will get through it. You can not claim that the economy is worse today than it was in 2009. I guess you could but you would be wildly inaccurate.

[Rick]

B - I'm sorry but I can't accept your argument nor am I suggesting that the U.S. (or any other country) lose its autonomy. Cities and towns are more or less autonomous as are states. That's true in more of the civilized countries as well. France has regions (states), Germany has regions (states), even our good friends in GB have regions (states). They all operate with some autonomy and they all get along, except at rugby time.

[sushidog]

Rick if you've ever been to a Soccer game in Germany you'd know their states aren't just contentious at Rugby time. ;)

Returning to your earlier comment on my post, and without trying to sound too religious, which I'm not, I'd like to address the issue of predestination - more of a metaphysical issue actually. I don't believe that we, as individuals, are predestined to anything, because we possess free will. At any time we may individually or collectively choose a different path and alter the future. This does not contradict the Bible which states that neither the day nor the hour of his coming no man noeth - implying the future is not fixed, but is fluid within certain parameters. But just as we cannot predict the certainly of a given random event, (such as a coin toss) one can predict with certainty the probability of an event occuring given a sufficient number of events of known probability. If we, being mere mortals, can understand and apply this concept, how much more so can a supreme being be in predicting future events without the constraints of time?

You can't argue that the Greatest Generation fought real evil in this world and defeated it. When I use the term defeat evil, I do so metaphorically, as evil can never be truly defeated by us, only delayed. This is what I hope to do, for as long as possible, as I know the day will come that the good of this world can no longer stand before all the world's evil powers concentrated against us. So to answer your question, I have no hope in the strength of my own arms, for I know the Enemy, and he is greater than I - but there is One greater than he. It upon this knowledge that I have hope in the resurection of the just. If this seems fatalistic, so be it, but it is the only thing I believe one has to look forward to these days - that and the rapture, which if you believe in it, great, but personally I hold out no hope there.

The problem with evil is, being a primordial force, it cannot be defeated by force of arms or other mortal means. Tolkein knew this well. That's why I briefly alluded to his work in trying to establish my point, however I appologize as the message was obviously muddled. Tolkien encapsulated all the perceived evil in the world in one simple device - the ring of power, which was able to control many peoples of impure hearts through their weaknesses, lusts and vices. Money can be looked upon in the same illustrative light, being a tool for good or bad, depending on the purity of our hearts. (Note: it is the love of money that the scriptures warn us is the root of all evil, not money itself, which is neutral, (like firearms) possessing no attributes of good or evil in and of itself.) However it is apparent that money, as a form of concentrated power, is and always has been the principle tool of the forces of evil - much like Tolkeins one ring. The goal of the good Hobbit was to destroy the ring by casting it into the abyss from which it came, thus removing its power from the world. Such power is to great to be weilded my mortal men, for in the use of such vast power that one becomes corrupt. The Hobbit's simple goal must be ours as well. We need to minimize and dilute the powerful forces of this world, so they can not easily be turned against us to our destruction. The short list of these forces is obviously headed with one common world government, with one common currency coming in a close second (which can be withheld to starve the masses, and fund armies, forcing those who would submit to be slaves of the Evil One.) Though this scenario cannot be avoided, if one accepts sacred scripture (be he Christian, Jew or Muslim) on face value, it can, however, be delayed - hopefully for many years beyond my own.

Centralizing money, government, armies, and indeed any seat of power only makes them easier to wield as a weapon to whatever end the user has in mind. Keeping us from cooperating and forming an evil, centralized power, such as God taught us in the tower of Babel story (whether you believe it a historical event or a mere parable), should be our goal here and now. That is unless you're a crazy 12er, like Ahmadinejad, who want's to hasten the coming of the 12th Imam (the Al-Mahdi) through war and chaos. It really doesn't matter if you or I believe in these things or not, as there are many millions of people who do and will act according to their beliefs - if they have the ability.

Do you think for Ahmadinejad would hesitate for an instant from nuking Israel (his avowed enemy who he has sworn to destroy) if he had the opportunity? If there ever will be a world government, it will be a Muslim Caliphate. Heaven help us all then.

Chip

[Rick]

Sounded pretty religious to me. I don't know anything about Lord of the Rings. I've never read or watched it. I agree that money is evil, however. I think you should send all you have to me and I'll dispose of it for you. No, no. No need to thank me. That's what friends are for.

You're welcome to make any bad analogy you want. You can make just as many good ones, however. If folks truly believe that governments composed of men are evil. If they fear them at their hearts core then they should be more than motivated to run for office and correct that problem. I doubt the freshmen Congressmen are part of any conspiracy. The certainly aren't acting liking it because they are defying both parties in their actions. Yet, folks will label them part of the problem. They would label you part of the problem if you were in office. It's just so much easy to point a finger and blame someone else that do something about it.

[BENESSE]

B - I'm sorry but I can't accept your argument nor am I suggesting that the U.S. (or any other country) lose its autonomy. Cities and towns are more or less autonomous as are states. That's true in more of the civilized countries as well. France has regions (states), Germany has regions (states), even our good friends in GB have regions (states). They all operate with some autonomy and they all get along, except at rugby time.

Regions within a single country are not in dispute. That's different from states within a country (as in the former USSR) and republics (as in the former YU)--which would more closely approximate a collection of countries (195 per your suggestion) with a single currency and a single, overriding government. (your words)
Again, USA (with it's independent states) is an exception and exceptional in pulling that off so successfully, but IMHO that would be pretty unimaginable with any other countries. The common goals are hardly common and the differences are insurmountable at this stage in our history.

[BENESSE]

And even if countries all agreed on common goals (as we have more or less in our country) the way to achieving them is what would create major conflict if contemplated on a global scale. Look how much we butt heads in the US despite the fact that we're that shining city upon a hill. What's left for the ghettos in the valley?

[Rick]

I don't know for sure but I know what flows downhill if that helps.

[yellowcab]

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[yellowcab]

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[yellowcab]

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[yellowcab]

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partfamily (http://partfamily.ru)partialmajorant (http://partialmajorant.ru)quadrupleworm (http://quadrupleworm.ru)qualitybooster (http://qualitybooster.ru)quasimoney (http://quasimoney.ru)quenchedspark (http://quenchedspark.ru)quodrecuperet (http://quodrecuperet.ru)rabbetledge (http://rabbetledge.ru)radialchaser (http://radialchaser.ru)radiationestimator (http://radiationestimator.ru)railwaybridge (http://railwaybridge.ru)randomcoloration (http://randomcoloration.ru)rapidgrowth (http://rapidgrowth.ru)rattlesnakemaster (http://rattlesnakemaster.ru)reachthroughregion (http://reachthroughregion.ru)
readingmagnifier (http://readingmagnifier.ru)rearchain (http://rearchain.ru)recessioncone (http://recessioncone.ru)recordedassignment (http://recordedassignment.ru)rectifiersubstation (http://rectifiersubstation.ru)redemptionvalue (http://redemptionvalue.ru)reducingflange (http://reducingflange.ru)referenceantigen (http://referenceantigen.ru)regeneratedprotein (http://regeneratedprotein.ru)reinvestmentplan (http://reinvestmentplan.ru)safedrilling (http://safedrilling.ru)sagprofile (http://sagprofile.ru)salestypelease (http://salestypelease.ru)samplinginterval (http://samplinginterval.ru)satellitehydrology (http://satellitehydrology.ru)
scarcecommodity (http://scarcecommodity.ru)scrapermat (http://scrapermat.ru)screwingunit (http://screwingunit.ru)seawaterpump (http://seawaterpump.ru)secondaryblock (http://secondaryblock.ru)secularclergy (http://secularclergy.ru)seismicefficiency (http://seismicefficiency.ru)selectivediffuser (http://selectivediffuser.ru)semiasphalticflux (http://semiasphalticflux.ru)semifinishmachining (http://semifinishmachining.ru)spicetrade (http://spicetrade.ru)spysale (http://spysale.ru)stungun (http://stungun.ru)tacticaldiameter (http://tacticaldiameter.ru)tailstockcenter (http://tailstockcenter.ru)
tamecurve (http://tamecurve.ru)tapecorrection (http://tapecorrection.ru)tappingchuck (http://tappingchuck.ru)taskreasoning (http://taskreasoning.ru)technicalgrade (http://technicalgrade.ru)telangiectaticlipoma (http://telangiectaticlipoma.ru)telescopicdamper (http://telescopicdamper.ru)temperateclimate (http://temperateclimate.ru)temperedmeasure (http://temperedmeasure.ru)tenementbuilding (http://tenementbuilding.ru)tuchkas (http://tuchkas.ru/)ultramaficrock (http://ultramaficrock.ru)ultraviolettesting (http://ultraviolettesting.ru)

[yellowcab]

�айт (http://audiobookkeeper.ru)�айт (http://cottagenet.ru)�айт (http://eyesvision.ru)�айт (http://eyesvisions.com)�айт (http://factoringfee.ru)�айт (http://filmzones.ru)�айт (http://gadwall.ru)�айт (http://gaffertape.ru)�айт (http://gageboard.ru)�айт (http://gagrule.ru)�айт (http://gallduct.ru)�айт (http://galvanometric.ru)�айт (http://gangforeman.ru)�айт (http://gangwayplatform.ru)�айт (http://garbagechute.ru)
�айт (http://gardeningleave.ru)�айт (http://gascautery.ru)�айт (http://gashbucket.ru)�айт (http://gasreturn.ru)�айт (http://gatedsweep.ru)�айт (http://gaugemodel.ru)�айт (http://gaussianfilter.ru)�айт (http://gearpitchdiameter.ru)�айт (http://geartreating.ru)�айт (http://generalizedanalysis.ru)�айт (http://generalprovisions.ru)�айт (http://geophysicalprobe.ru)�айт (http://geriatricnurse.ru)�айт (http://getintoaflap.ru)�айт (http://getthebounce.ru)
�айт (http://habeascorpus.ru)�айт (http://habituate.ru)�айт (http://hackedbolt.ru)�айт (http://hackworker.ru)�айт (http://hadronicannihilation.ru)�айт (http://haemagglutinin.ru)�айт (http://hailsquall.ru)�айт (http://hairysphere.ru)�айт (http://halforderfringe.ru)�айт (http://halfsiblings.ru)�айт (http://hallofresidence.ru)�айт (http://haltstate.ru)�айт (http://handcoding.ru)�айт (http://handportedhead.ru)�айт (http://handradar.ru)
�айт (http://handsfreetelephone.ru)�айт (http://hangonpart.ru)�айт (http://haphazardwinding.ru)�айт (http://hardalloyteeth.ru)�айт (http://hardasiron.ru)�айт (http://hardenedconcrete.ru)�айт (http://harmonicinteraction.ru)�айт (http://hartlaubgoose.ru)�айт (http://hatchholddown.ru)�айт (http://haveafinetime.ru)�айт (http://hazardousatmosphere.ru)�айт (http://headregulator.ru)�айт (http://heartofgold.ru)�айт (http://heatageingresistance.ru)�айт (http://heatinggas.ru)
�айт (http://heavydutymetalcutting.ru)�айт (http://jacketedwall.ru)�айт (http://japanesecedar.ru)�айт (http://jibtypecrane.ru)�айт (http://jobabandonment.ru)�айт (http://jobstress.ru)�айт (http://jogformation.ru)�айт (http://jointcapsule.ru)�айт (http://jointsealingmaterial.ru)�айт (http://journallubricator.ru)�айт (http://juicecatcher.ru)�айт (http://junctionofchannels.ru)�айт (http://justiciablehomicide.ru)�айт (http://juxtapositiontwin.ru)�айт (http://kaposidisease.ru)
�айт (http://keepagoodoffing.ru)�айт (http://keepsmthinhand.ru)�айт (http://kentishglory.ru)�айт (http://kerbweight.ru)�айт (http://kerrrotation.ru)�айт (http://keymanassurance.ru)�айт (http://keyserum.ru)�айт (http://kickplate.ru)�айт (http://killthefattedcalf.ru)�айт (http://kilowattsecond.ru)�айт (http://kingweakfish.ru)�айт (http://kinozones.ru)�айт (http://kleinbottle.ru)�айт (http://kneejoint.ru)�айт (http://knifesethouse.ru)
�айт (http://knockonatom.ru)�айт (http://knowledgestate.ru)�айт (http://kondoferromagnet.ru)�айт (http://labeledgraph.ru)�айт (http://laborracket.ru)�айт (http://labourearnings.ru)�айт (http://labourleasing.ru)�айт (http://laburnumtree.ru)�айт (http://lacingcourse.ru)�айт (http://lacrimalpoint.ru)�айт (http://lactogenicfactor.ru)�айт (http://lacunarycoefficient.ru)�айт (http://ladletreatediron.ru)�айт (http://laggingload.ru)�айт (http://laissezaller.ru)
�айт (http://lambdatransition.ru)�айт (http://laminatedmaterial.ru)�айт (http://lammasshoot.ru)�айт (http://lamphouse.ru)�айт (http://lancecorporal.ru)�айт (http://lancingdie.ru)�айт (http://landingdoor.ru)�айт (http://landmarksensor.ru)�айт (http://landreform.ru)�айт (http://landuseratio.ru)�айт (http://languagelaboratory.ru)�айт (http://largeheart.ru)�айт (http://lasercalibration.ru)�айт (http://laserlens.ru)�айт (http://laserpulse.ru)

[yellowcab]

�айт (http://laterevent.ru)�айт (http://latrinesergeant.ru)�айт (http://layabout.ru)�айт (http://leadcoating.ru)�айт (http://leadingfirm.ru)�айт (http://learningcurve.ru)�айт (http://leaveword.ru)�айт (http://machinesensible.ru)�айт (http://magneticequator.ru)�айт (http://magnetotelluricfield.ru)�айт (http://mailinghouse.ru)�айт (http://majorconcern.ru)�айт (http://mammasdarling.ru)�айт (http://managerialstaff.ru)�айт (http://manipulatinghand.ru)
�айт (http://manualchoke.ru)�айт (http://medinfobooks.ru)�айт (http://mp3lists.ru)�айт (http://nameresolution.ru)�айт (http://naphtheneseries.ru)�айт (http://narrowmouthed.ru)�айт (http://nationalcensus.ru)�айт (http://naturalfunctor.ru)�айт (http://navelseed.ru)�айт (http://neatplaster.ru)�айт (http://necroticcaries.ru)�айт (http://negativefibration.ru)�айт (http://neighbouringrights.ru)�айт (http://objectmodule.ru)�айт (http://observationballoon.ru)
�айт (http://obstructivepatent.ru)�айт (http://oceanmining.ru)�айт (http://octupolephonon.ru)�айт (http://offlinesystem.ru)�айт (http://offsetholder.ru)�айт (http://olibanumresinoid.ru)�айт (http://onesticket.ru)�айт (http://packedspheres.ru)�айт (http://pagingterminal.ru)�айт (http://palatinebones.ru)�айт (http://palmberry.ru)�айт (http://papercoating.ru)�айт (http://paraconvexgroup.ru)�айт (http://parasolmonoplane.ru)�айт (http://parkingbrake.ru)
�айт (http://partfamily.ru)�айт (http://partialmajorant.ru)�айт (http://quadrupleworm.ru)�айт (http://qualitybooster.ru)�айт (http://quasimoney.ru)�айт (http://quenchedspark.ru)�айт (http://quodrecuperet.ru)�айт (http://rabbetledge.ru)�айт (http://radialchaser.ru)�айт (http://radiationestimator.ru)�айт (http://railwaybridge.ru)�айт (http://randomcoloration.ru)�айт (http://rapidgrowth.ru)�айт (http://rattlesnakemaster.ru)�айт (http://reachthroughregion.ru)
�айт (http://readingmagnifier.ru)�айт (http://rearchain.ru)�айт (http://recessioncone.ru)�айт (http://recordedassignment.ru)�айт (http://rectifiersubstation.ru)�айт (http://redemptionvalue.ru)�айт (http://reducingflange.ru)�айт (http://referenceantigen.ru)�айт (http://regeneratedprotein.ru)�айт (http://reinvestmentplan.ru)�айт (http://safedrilling.ru)�айт (http://sagprofile.ru)�айт (http://salestypelease.ru)�айт (http://samplinginterval.ru)�айт (http://satellitehydrology.ru)
�айт (http://scarcecommodity.ru)�айт (http://scrapermat.ru)�айт (http://screwingunit.ru)�айт (http://seawaterpump.ru)�айт (http://secondaryblock.ru)�айт (http://secularclergy.ru)�айт (http://seismicefficiency.ru)�айт (http://selectivediffuser.ru)�айт (http://semiasphalticflux.ru)�айт (http://semifinishmachining.ru)�айт (http://spicetrade.ru)�айт (http://spysale.ru)�айт (http://stungun.ru)�айт (http://tacticaldiameter.ru)�айт (http://tailstockcenter.ru)
�айт (http://tamecurve.ru)�айт (http://tapecorrection.ru)�айт (http://tappingchuck.ru)�айт (http://taskreasoning.ru)�айт (http://technicalgrade.ru)�айт (http://telangiectaticlipoma.ru)�айт (http://telescopicdamper.ru)�айт (http://temperateclimate.ru)�айт (http://temperedmeasure.ru)�айт (http://tenementbuilding.ru)tuchkas (http://tuchkas.ru/)�айт (http://ultramaficrock.ru)�айт (http://ultraviolettesting.ru)