View Full Version : Our forefather's weapons- Ramble
hunter63
09-21-2010, 01:34 PM
We (or a lot of us) are now in a position that we can afford different weapons for different tasks.
And spend endless words defending our choices, and preferences.
I remember and I would imagine a lot of us, hearing stories passed down from our Grandfathers, Fathers, Uncles, their older friends about hunting in the past years.
They had to do with......., I only used a .22 to shoot deer, or I used a SS shot gun for everything.........and we get the idea that's is what you want to use as well, footstep following and all.
I had heard the story of my father and uncle buying a "punch" in a punch card during the early 1930's, for a nickel.
Won a SS 12 ga shotgun, both used it for rabbits, ground hogs, deer, ducks, squirrels...as well as any other varmint that came ofter the chickens.
I thought that was cool, and also wanted to use it.
They both told me that they actually hated that gun, it would pinch the web of your right hand between the break and action, when fired, it was so loose.
BUT it was "all they had", so they made do.
Another uncle hunted deer, with a 22, and back then (30's, 40' early 50's) there wasn't many left around, had been just about hunted "Out" in far northern Wisconsin.
He would head down to the water hole at night, shoot one at close range, in the head, just for something to eat.
Asked him about it and again he would just say, that's all I had, so that's what it used.
Later in life my father and uncle both bought use pump shot guns, MF's was a Win model 12, and MU's a Ithaca model 37, both in 16 ga.
Man, they were on top of the world, and spent the rest of their day arguing about whose was better.
As I got older, I had picked up a Ruger .44mag carbine /w scope, MF borrowed it till he died, I also inherited MU's Ruger 44 mag carbine, so I guess their tastes were pretty close.
The point to this rambling is simply, if you can afford it, use the proper tool for the job,.......and if you can't, use what ever you have.
Always be thankful that we can still buy pretty much any firearm we choose (read afford), and still use them freely.
We take this for granted.
BTW I still have most of those old guns, 16 ga shotguns have been passed down to a nephew.(Latest hunting partner)
Camp10
09-21-2010, 08:04 PM
It took me a little while to come to this but it is my way of thinking as well. It doesnt always mean "newer is better" it just means better is better.
My epiphany came in the form of a Leupold scope I borrowed from a friend. I always mounted whatever I could get cheap and for the most part, it did the job but I picked up a Remington pump in 300 Savage right before hunting season and wanted to take it with me for a trip I had planned just a few days later. He let me borrow a 4-12 VXII that he had sitting on his bench.
The first thing I noticed (and as soon as I looked through it)was that the crosshairs were in perfect focus. All my other scopes seemed blurred..just slightly. Next was the great eye relief, then the perfect adjustments...I was hooked.
Winter
09-21-2010, 10:28 PM
The best rifle in the world to a man is the one that works for him.
I'm a bit spoiled. I buy good , mid price rifles, for specific tasks.
Most are of the anti-zombie variety.
rwc1969
09-21-2010, 11:24 PM
I still prefer iron sights, 22's and shotguns, but that's because the woods and laws dictate to me what I need and I only want what I need.
Although, I did by a nice inline muzzy a couple years back and didn't really need it. But, it was a real good deal and a great rifle to boot.
Bought a mini-30 quite a while back and definitely didn't need it. I suppose if the xombies attack i'll be ready. WaWA!
Have plenty of break action shotguns, but bought an 870 that I didn't need, but liked the convenience and extra slug barrel it came with.
Bought a 10/22 and didn't need that, have quite a few .22's already, semi-auto, bolt and single shot. But, I really missed my old 10/22 and just had to get another. LOL!
I say buy whatever you want, need or can afford and don't make excuses, just shoot em and enjoy.
kyratshooter
09-21-2010, 11:30 PM
Sometimes we look at the posts in forums that run the old "If you could pick one gun for....?.... what would it be?" and we actually get tired of prognosticating on the subject. I do anyway.
How often we forget that most of the time we do not get a choice of best knife, best gun, best tent. If you are fully prepared and equipped it is not survival, it is a mild irritation.
I look back to the 1950s when my grandads were both alive. Like your people, they had gone through the depression surviving on the fringes with what they had, one in the south and one in the midwest. They were successful men that had been stripped of everything they owned overnight. Both put a good deal of food on the table with the simple guns left to destitute men.
When they got flush, they replaced the "survival guns" which I know were both ss shotguns, a 16 for the midwestern GP and a 12 for the southern GP.
After what they had been through they did not go "gun crazy". Each one had a Remington .22 simiauto, the same model. Each one had a good shotgun; the midwest gp had a '97 winchester 16ga, southern gp had a Stevens double 12ga. Both had a good S&W revolver.
In our areas there was nothing but small game and that set up served them well. They were so much better than what they had been using they were grateful.
Look at me now, I worry about "gaps" in my gun coverage! One for every purpose, some of those purposes being quite absurd and most of them only dreams and not needs. I have guns in my locker that are only there due to the ammo being cheap or the brass available!
klickitat
09-21-2010, 11:36 PM
I ended up with a mental illness brought on by reading too much gun porn as a boy. I figured you had to have a gun for each animal you hunted and for each terrain you hunted that animal in.
When I didn't have the funds for a new gun I spent my days dreaming and hiding in the closet with the latest issue of glossy pictured revolvers. When I became financially stable, I began a campaign that tried to wipe out every gun shop of their inventories. Eventually the fever burned itself out and all I was left with was to hunt.
I came back to my senses and realized that there really was not much of a justification for most of the fire sticks that I owned.
I have 5 core guns and the funny part is that 4 of them would be considered obsolete, yet those are the ones that work best in this area for the game I hunt. BTW the oldest one and the one I lean on most now days is 120 years old.
Alaskan Survivalist
09-22-2010, 11:06 AM
The generation before me fought in WW II and most of the guns they used were military surplus. So was most thier other gear for that matter. Concern for being the best did not matter as much and just being up for task was good enough. Marketing is responsible for most of it.
kyratshooter
09-22-2010, 12:24 PM
The generation before me fought in WW II and most of the guns they used were military surplus. So was most thier other gear for that matter. Concern for being the best did not matter as much and just being up for task was good enough. Marketing is responsible for most of it.
In Alaska that may be so, espically in those harsh conditions where expensive wood and blued metal would not last long. Most of the country has more gentle conditions, shorter hunting seasons and our hunting/camping gear were not daily use items. A few of the old troopers I knew had their Class A uniforms in the closet, but not many of them "prefered" GI gear. It is probably an area related thing.
While most the the "Great Generation" that fought in WW2 and Korea did have a high respect for the work of the Mauser brothers, almost every shooter from that generation that I know owned a Mauser or Enfield, they were also the group that pushed the '94 Winchester into the millions and millions sold catagory.
They were also the group that the most famous of our now classic commercial guns were aimed at. The pre-64 model 70 Winchester, the 600 series Remingtons, the origional .44 mag model 29 S&W, 870 Remington and model 12 Winchester shotguns with the 1100 close behind.
They were the commercial lifeblood of the new Wetherby company, a host of high quality import firms (Huskvarna/Seko/Manlicher) and a fledgling gun magazine industry.
If you check you will find that the big upsurge in outdoor related gear occurred about the time these vets were at the top of their earning power (mid 40s to mid 50s, between 1960-1970), their kids were leaving home and the economy was at an all time high.
You open one of those old vetrans gunsafes and there will be at least 4 things you will find.
1. a surplus bolt action rifle they refer to as their "bad weather gun".
2. at least one rifle in 30-06.
3. a good quality shotgun
4. a good quality American made .22 rifle
Alaskan Survivalist
09-22-2010, 12:29 PM
It could very well be just my area and I was relating my experience. We were invaded in WW II and supplies brought here for the military effort and a lot of surplus was available. Even the Alcan Highway was built for the war.
We have a lot of ex-soldiers here and even though I never served I have been around enough soldiers and surplus gear I think some of it has rubbed off. I use a lot of military surplus in my gear.
kyratshooter
09-22-2010, 01:14 PM
In Alaska you also had a supply problem to deal with after the war. Things shipped up from the lower states were very expensive. You tend to use what is available.
In the lower states the outdoor experience was more likely to include spouse and kids to some degree. A bit of comfort and nice colors is always good to charm the family.
I actually have an aversion to the surplus gear of my own service. If I never laid eyes on another alice pack or AR rifle it would be too soon. The main criterion for equipment to outfit a drafted army is to make is so strong the people using it can not tear it up. Usibility, efficiency, fit, were all secondary to duribility. Mollie gear is not much better.
Like you say though, this is location and personal experience driven.
I know several of my uncles/grandparents bought their homes with the kennel as part of the planning. They all kept either bird dogs or beagles. I do not know a single person today that keeps or trains a dedicated hunting dog.
My family was pretty poor growing up. Dad used to collect salt at a bend in the creek. He'd use it to sprinkle on birds tails and then club them in the head. He couldn't afford a firearm. He tried that on a coyote but he was used to using small clubs on birds and forgot about getting something a bit more stout than a corn stalk. He said that coyote was pretty mad about the whole thing. Fortunately, dad was a fast runner.
kyratshooter
09-22-2010, 03:31 PM
My family was pretty poor growing up. Dad used to collect salt at a bend in the creek. He'd use it to sprinkle on birds tails and then club them in the head. He couldn't afford a firearm. He tried that on a coyote but he was used to using small clubs on birds and forgot about getting something a bit more stout than a corn stalk. He said that coyote was pretty mad about the whole thing. Fortunately, dad was a fast runner.
You say that in jest, but do not realize how close to the truth it is. My x-FIL was one of five children to a widowed mother during the depression. He and his brothers kept the family fed with slingshots made from Model-T innertubes. They shot anything that would hold still and plopped it into the pot. Songbirds, possoms, rabbits, muskrats, frogs, they ate absolutely anything they could kill.
To his last days he prefered spearing frogs to shooting them (a waste of .22 shells) and prefered hanging limb lines to sitting and fishing.
He joined the Army in 1939 and was in the First Division. He already had two years in when WW2 started. He was in N Africa, Siciley, Italy and Normandy. He once told me he was fighting in Chech territory when the war was declared over. He did not have a very high opinion of me due to me being an officer. The one thing he did say in my favor was that being an officer was better than being a commie-draft-dodger.
Dad did have a Damascus SXS that I managed to inherit. He used it to put food on the table as well up until his service in WWII. He never picked up another weapon once he got home. He would tell me how to hunt but he would never go. So a lot of my early learning was trial and error.
hunter63
09-22-2010, 06:01 PM
I was always lusting after the Winchester M '94 30-30 at the local hardware store, still remember it was $79 bucks brand new.
After all all the cool movie guys were shooting lever action rifles.
Never got to buy that one, but later my first rifle was a Win '94 in Win .32 special.
Still my favorite brush gun.
I'm thinking that the "collection disease" was caused by this early unsatisfied desire for that 30-30.
I do not own one to this day,.............. just to get even!
I might relent if a good deal comes around, though.
P.S. How many of y'all carry an empty gun case in the truck........Just in case.
crashdive123
09-22-2010, 06:38 PM
P.S. How many of y'all carry an empty gun case in the truck........Just in case.
Heck - that's why I drive a truck - lots more room than in a trunk.:innocent:
Carry a gun case?! You don't negotiate one with the sale? Be still my beating heart. (He's just kiddin', Rick, honest)
klickitat
09-22-2010, 08:09 PM
hehehe Where is my blanket? What you got for trading stock hunter?
He's got a wife. I might be able to negotiate something here. I'll need a slight fee of course. 20% sounds fair.
klickitat
09-22-2010, 09:08 PM
calm down Rick. I was talking guns. Wilderness Survival has just taken on a whole new meaning.
Here is a my brother's and mine website:
Ooops. Sorry. You can post a link to your web site in the body of the post. You can put it in your signature, though.
klickitat
09-22-2010, 09:27 PM
sorry, I wasn't trying to break rules
I know you weren't. You were just pushing the envelope. Testing the waters. Running it up the flagpole to see who saluted. etc. etc.
hunter63
09-23-2010, 11:58 AM
He's got a wife. I might be able to negotiate something here. I'll need a slight fee of course. 20% sounds fair.
She not for sale or trade (at least today) who else would put up with my for 40 + years? Not many.
I would most likely starve and go naked.
We don't have a barter board or clasifieds on here, that I know of.
Okay, I can work with that. Klickitat, Hunter is willing to go naked. So what will you put up? Come one fellahs, I'm trying to negotiate here. I need that 20%! You can use a pair of pants and a shirt can't you?
kyratshooter
09-23-2010, 01:00 PM
She not for sale or trade (at least today) who else would put up with my for 40 + years? Not many.
I would most likely starve and go naked.
We don't have a barter board or clasifieds on here, that I know of.
I have a reenactment friend we named "Two Ponies". She is a gormet cook and sews and knits. She was complaining about being divorced and needing a man so I told her I could find her one in camp, so I was running around trying to trade her for two ponies.
The deal clincher was that even if she was gitting a bit old the cooking and sewing would make her worth at least two ponies.
She said she could use two ponies and I told her that was my finders fee!
The name stuck, as they always do, and she has never forgiven me.
:knight:
hunter63
09-23-2010, 01:35 PM
I have a reenactment friend we named "Two Ponies". She is a gormet cook and sews and knits. She was complaining about being divorced and needing a man so I told her I could find her one in camp, so I was running around trying to trade her for two ponies.
The deal clincher was that even if she was gitting a bit old the cooking and sewing would make her worth at least two ponies.
She said she could use two ponies and I told her that was my finders fee!
The name stuck, as they always do, and she has never forgiven me.
:knight:
LOL, we used to do the same thing with DD and her friend/s (seemed we always had a couple of extra kids along, trading stock?)
One of my friends would show up (in full garb, nose ring and all) with a couple of blankets, rifle and beaver hides.
Wanting to trade for the women, DD friend asked what was going on, DD told her that I was going to sell them........Those kids still talk about that.
P.S. We have a friend that is named "Two Moons", I'll let y'all figure that one out on your own, LOL
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05-18-2026, 10:28 AM
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