future of food

[OGsBF]

http://www.hulu.com/watch/67878/the-future-of-food

[crashdive123]

Before I invest an hour and a half into a video, could you give a bit of a description?

[Rick]

Yeah, I have to admit that's a long time.

[Pal334]

I looked at the reviews , here is one. I think I will watch the traffic on the dead end street for an hour and a half before this obviously biased video

"Lots of scary science, and bashing of the Monsanto company. Its informative, but there are better movies out there- like Food Inc helps you see a solution instead of just crying foul. "

[Rick]

Hey! I for one, enjoy chemicals. Better living through chemistry.

[rwc1969]

:tongue_smilie: Mmm, chemicals.

[owl_girl]

its about genetically modified food. like corn with fish gens in them and how if the pollen of these plants mix with your organic plants then your organic plants can become sterile and also if you do get a hybrid of these plants in your crop the gmo seed companies can sue you. and also the lack of research for long term health risks. i hate that thy dont have to label there products as genetically modified. i dont want to eat it and i should have the right to know whats "gmo" or not. we learned about this in hawaii. there was a big seed company there. i thought it was very interesting.

[Rick]

I hate to tell you but all food is GMO. It's either naturally engineered over thousands of years or artificially done. Man has been altering food by cross pollinating, grafting for thousands of years and, since the 1990's genetically engineering it. You should take some time to read about Norman Borlaug. Because of his pioneering work with new rice plants it's estimated he saved some 7 million from starving to death.

I'm certainly open to new ideas but unless someone has a rabbit in their hat the only way we'll be able to feed a population that continues to increase is through GMO. More food in less space is a have to.

[RangerXanatos]

If GMO food bothers you, many companies will state that they are "GMO Free" on the packaging. Also, I woul believe that most food that is said to be Organic would also be GMO free. In one of my classes, we tested for this, and the ones deemed Organic were not GMO.

[Sarge47]

...but unless someone has a rabbit in their hat...
I resemble that remark! :innocent:

[owl_girl]

I hate to tell you but all food is GMO. It's either naturally engineered over thousands of years or artificially done. Man has been altering food by cross pollinating, grafting for thousands of years and, since the 1990's genetically engineering it. You should take some time to read about Norman Borlaug. Because of his pioneering work with new rice plants it's estimated he saved some 7 million from starving to death.

I'm certainly open to new ideas but unless someone has a rabbit in their hat the only way we'll be able to feed a population that continues to increase is through GMO. More food in less space is a have to.
yea i dont have a prob with that kind but the fish/corn cross is a bit far. and if it must be don then i want it to be labeled and i dont want to have my crop fail cause of gmo pollen. dont you thing thats an environmental hazard? at the very least they should do more health research before releasing it. i think this typ of gmo infringes on my rights and the rights of non gmo farmers. if i want fish in my corn ill put it there my self.

[Rick]

Why can't GMO food be grown organic? Odds are, the food you grew was GMO. Most of the garden plants we grow today are. Whether we grow them by organic means or not has nothing to do with whether they are genetically altered.

[Rick]

I certainly don't have any problem with labeling. I think every consumer has a right to know what they are buying. If you don't want to grow GMO plants then look for heirlooms. They've certainly been altered over time, most probably by man, but your chances will be much better that they aren't GMO, per se.

As for putting fish in corn, I think that's how the indigenous folks taught us to grow it....just sayin' :innocent:

[owl_girl]

I woul believe that most food that is said to be Organic would also be GMO free.
yes that is true. but there are other issues. such as the effect it has on other farmers as said.

[Sarge47]

Yeah, but what about fish in your chips? WINNIE!!! Help me out here! :innocent:

[Sarge47]

yes that is true. but there are other issues. such as the effect it has on other farmers as said.Most of the farmers around here are growing their corn to be used in Ethenol...just sayin'...:cool2:

[Rick]

What the? You jump in with both feet and then ask Winnie to bail you out?

[Sarge47]

What the? You jump in with both feet and then ask Winnie to bail you out?
I was lookin' for back-up. :blushing:

[hoosierarcher]

OK for those that are lacking in their bucolic knowledge, corn does not naturally pollinate. Humans MUST assist the plant in its reproduction. Pollin from corn doesn't work in other plants. Neither can it just blow on the wind and pollinate corn any distance away. No reason to worry about "GMO" corn at all as most are sterile hybrids. There is no possibilty of accidental cross breeding nightmares.

[Sourdough]

OK for those that are lacking in their bucolic knowledge, corn does not naturally pollinate. Humans MUST assist the plant in its reproduction. Pollin from corn doesn't work in other plants. Neither can it just blow on the wind and pollinate corn any distance away. No reason to worry about "GMO" corn at all as most are sterile hybrids. There is no possibilty of accidental cross breeding nightmares.


This is why I love this forum.........Nice post, couldn't put any rep points on ya, say's I got'ta spread the love.

[owl_girl]

OK for those that are lacking in their bucolic knowledge, corn does not naturally pollinate. Humans MUST assist the plant in its reproduction. Pollin from corn doesn't work in other plants. Neither can it just blow on the wind and pollinate corn any distance away. No reason to worry about "GMO" corn at all as most are sterile hybrids. There is no possibilty of accidental cross breeding nightmares.

it was an example. what about grain?
anyways the sterile hybrids are the gmo im talking about and they make non sterile corn sterile from what i understand.

[Sarge47]

it was an example. what about grain?
anyways the sterile hybrids are the gmo im talking about and they make non sterile corn sterile from what i understand.
Now here's the Owl Girl we all have come to know & love! :clap: :clap: :clap: (John Wayne voice.) Go get 'em, little sister, don't cut 'em any slack! :sneaky2:

[ClayPick]

It’s my understanding that plants have only been improved over thousands of years. Genetic engineering crosses the boundaries imposed by nature. The only thing remotely close in nature would be a mutation.

[rwc1969]

...corn does not naturally pollinate. Really?

Humans MUST assist the plant in its reproduction. Exactly how do they do this?

Pollin from corn doesn't work in other plants. Neither can it just blow on the wind and pollinate corn any distance away. ... There is no possibilty of accidental cross breeding nightmares.

I thought corn was pollenated by blowing in the wind and that it does in fact pollenate at great distances.

[Winnie]

Yeah, but what about fish in your chips? WINNIE!!! Help me out here! :innocent:

You got it Sarge! (what do you want me to help you with?:blushing:)

[edr730]

Corn as well as other plants pollinate through wind and insects. In rare instances, pollen can travel a mile away. Yes, cross breeding occurs all the time. This is why you can't expect, say an apple, to produce seeds that will be identical to the mother plant. This is the main reason why people graft stems on to root stocks.
I don't know if I would have problem eating a fish/corn type of hybrid, but I see nothing wrong with requiring producers to label products as GMO. At this time, GMO, growth hormone and MSG are not required to be labeled as such. Such labeling would make asthma, allergic reactions and other medical conditions more traceable. It may also help to stop corn or other crops that are considered not fit for human consumption, by all parties, from entering into our food chain as they have in the past.
Another issue, which is occurring at a rapid rate, is the patenting of age old medicinal plants, heirloom plants, and even normal genes that have been around for a 1000 years or more.
I believe the rights of farmers, or anyone else, to grow their own seeds and breed their own animals, as they have for thousands of years should be protected. The threat of being sued because the wind, insect or neighbors truck carrying seed has contaminated a very small edge of their farm, with a patented gene or seed, has become a dilemma. But, it's not just the small crop farmer that suffers from these law suits. Dairy farms have been sued when they stated they used no growth hormone. Laboratories, working on cures for breast cancer, have been shut down or sued because they used natural occurring genes, which are now patented, in their research. States have been threatened, whole countries sued because they placed bans on GMO corn with Bt insecticide within the gene.
GMO crops have great potential to be engineered specifically to grow plastics, biofuel, medicines and a great many things. The extent of their uses are mind boggling. I am not sure that I want them marketed without regulation and their pollen blowing in the wind without reasonable caution, without laws protecting the right to grow old varieties of plants and animals or without proper labeling practices.

[Sarge47]

You got it Sarge! (what do you want me to help you with?:blushing:)
I was just wanting confirmation that fish 'n chips ain't a bad thing! :innocent: :sneaky2: :clap:

[2dumb2kwit]

I was just wanting confirmation that fish 'n chips ain't a bad thing! :innocent: :sneaky2: :clap:

....but now you're talking about fish and corn chips. LOL:innocent:

[Winnie]

Oh, righto! fish and chips YU-UMMMY! No 2Dumb, not corn chips, I think you call them fries, but our chips are nothing like your fries!

[2dumb2kwit]

Oh, righto! fish and chips YU-UMMMY! No 2Dumb, not corn chips, I think you call them fries, but our chips are nothing like your fries!

I'm with you, Winnie. I was just making a joke, about the corn chips, because somewhere back in this thread they were talking about fish genes in corn plants. LOL

[owl_girl]

Corn as well as other plants pollinate through wind and insects. In rare instances, pollen can travel a mile away. Yes, cross breeding occurs all the time. This is why you can't expect, say an apple, to produce seeds that will be identical to the mother plant. This is the main reason why people graft stems on to root stocks.
I don't know if I would have problem eating a fish/corn type of hybrid, but I see nothing wrong with requiring producers to label products as GMO. At this time, GMO, growth hormone and MSG are not required to be labeled as such. Such labeling would make asthma, allergic reactions and other medical conditions more traceable. It may also help to stop corn or other crops that are considered not fit for human consumption, by all parties, from entering into our food chain as they have in the past.
Another issue, which is occurring at a rapid rate, is the patenting of age old medicinal plants, heirloom plants, and even normal genes that have been around for a 1000 years or more.
I believe the rights of farmers, or anyone else, to grow their own seeds and breed their own animals, as they have for thousands of years should be protected. The threat of being sued because the wind, insect or neighbors truck carrying seed has contaminated a very small edge of their farm, with a patented gene or seed, has become a dilemma. But, it's not just the small crop farmer that suffers from these law suits. Dairy farms have been sued when they stated they used no growth hormone. Laboratories, working on cures for breast cancer, have been shut down or sued because they used natural occurring genes, which are now patented, in their research. States have been threatened, whole countries sued because they placed bans on GMO corn with Bt insecticide within the gene.
GMO crops have great potential to be engineered specifically to grow plastics, biofuel, medicines and a great many things. The extent of their uses are mind boggling. I am not sure that I want them marketed without regulation and their pollen blowing in the wind without reasonable caution, without laws protecting the right to grow old varieties of plants and animals or without proper labeling practices.

yes what he said. :clap:

[Winnie]

I'm with you, Winnie. I was just making a joke, about the corn chips, because somewhere back in this thread they were talking about fish genes in corn plants. LOL

Oops, my bad.(think this rotten weather has drowned my sense of humour):blushing:

[Sourdough]

Please make a list of those we should STOP Feeding. With 5.8 BILLION human thingies infesting the planet, something had to be done to feed them. Odd how people are opposed to War, Plague, Pandemic, etc. all of the things that kept the human thingies from overpopulating. Humans are the Cancer that is killing the earth. We "PLAY" God with everything, we are such fools.

[ClayPick]

To me it’s wrong when food becomes intellectual property. What’s next? Water would be the icing on the cake.

[trax]

Hey, soylent green is people, get over it.

[Pal334]

Please make a list of those we should STOP Feeding. With 5.8 BILLION human thingies infesting the planet, something had to be done to feed them. Odd how people are opposed to War, Plague, Pandemic, etc. all of the things that kept the human thingies from overpopulating. Humans are the Cancer that is killing the earth. We "PLAY" God with everything, we are such fools.

Excellent point!! I guess we should tell the folks in those "under developed " countries to turn in their high yield seeds and starve the good old fashioned way like their parents did

[rwc1969]

It would help with their overpopulation problem. Then again it probably wouldn't as they seem to remain overpopulated regardless of disease or anything else that comes their way.

[BENESSE]

Humans are the Cancer that is killing the earth.

Be that as it may, where do we start excising?
And then what would be the adjuvant therapy?

[Camp10]

Be that as it may, where do we start excising?
And then what would be the adjuvant therapy?

Great Questions! Now you have to play God regardless of what side you agree with. I think human arrogance is the cancer, not the race itself. I also think that it is a matter of time before something either manmade or natural will thin the herd and reset the humility clock.

[Sarge47]

...somewhere back in this thread they were talking about fish genes in corn plants. LOL
I didn't know fish wore Jeans (genes). :innocent:

[Sourdough]

Be that as it may, where do we start excising?
And then what would be the adjuvant therapy?


As crazy as it sounds, we need more wars, more plagues, more pandemics. The problem is the human animals double in population every 38 to 42 years. It will get horrible from here forward. The easiest, least painful, short term thing would be to stabilize consumption through catastrophic world economic depression. There is no easy way out.

Part of the problem is the way our economic model works, is via expanding consumption through population increase, buy immigration (Both legal and illegal) and birth rates verses death rates. if the population was contracting 3% to 5% per year. we would soon need no new homes, no new automobiles, no new shopping malls, etc..

Something will happen, and it will be horrible. It is unavoidable, Sadly. And we have a collective agreement to never breach the subject, not in public nor in private.

[trax]

Yeah, they do Sarge, but getting the right size is really tough on them. You oughta see 'em flopping around trying to get their jeans done up.

And what's all this playing God stuff? If we're playing God, I want some thunderbolts, I've always wanted to hurl thunderbolts....just a thought. Um....greed's always going to prevent an even distribution of food on the planet and we'll always have starvation --sorry folks, GMO's or not. I'll eat pretty much whatevers' put in front of me and can be called food, genetically monkeyed organisms or not...heyho!

[BENESSE]

And we have a collective agreement to never breach the subject, not in public nor in private.

Agreed.
It is a very charged topic and whatever opinion one holds, it WILL be misunderstood.

[Sourdough]

Agreed.
It is a very charged topic and whatever opinion one holds, it WILL be misunderstood.


And so one must live in Hope (Inside joke):):):)

[BENESSE]

And so one must live in Hope (Inside joke):):):)

People do occasionally refer to you as Hope and I've been wondering about that. Fortunately I know where Sourdough comes from, having read Burning Daylight.
Maybe we should call you Burning Sourdough?:)

[Sourdough]

People do occasionally refer to you as Hope and I've been wondering about that. Fortunately I know where Sourdough comes from, having read Burning Daylight.
Maybe we should call you Burning Sourdough?:)

Speaking of Burning Daylight, I got your PM, however could not respond........your not accepting PM's.

[BENESSE]

Speaking of Burning Daylight, I got your PM, however could not respond........your not accepting PM's.

I fixed that now--a bit slow in figuring it all out.

[Sourdough]

I fixed that now--a bit slow in figuring it all out.


I thunk you can set it so only friends can contact you.

[Rick]

Maybe we should call you Burning Sourdough?

Or Sam McGee.

[doug1980]

I think people are way to worried about every little thing these days. Some things are just plain bad for you, nothing can be done about it. I have to eat so if that means I have to eat genetically engineered food than so be it. Is it bad for me....maybe but then again what isn't bad these days. Everything causes cancer, high BP, high Colesterol etc....so it's a lose lose. If it tastes good and it fills me up then I'll eat it. It all ends up in the same place anyway.

[Sarge47]

I think people are way to worried about every little thing these days. Some things are just plain bad for you, nothing can be done about it. I have to eat so if that means I have to eat genetically engineered food than so be it. Is it bad for me....maybe but then again what isn't bad these days. Everything causes cancer, high BP, high Colesterol etc....so it's a lose lose. If it tastes good and it fills me up then I'll eat it. It all ends up in the same place anyway.
If you can eat MREs you can eat anything....right? :innocent:

[Sarge47]

Let's see, these are the survivalists talking here, right? You know, the folks who are like Mikey in that old commercial...the kid who'll eat anything? You want to graze off of the land like rabbits, then eat the rabbits. You'll eat bugs & drink the water out of an elephant turd, but hey; don't touch the genetically altered corn? give me a break, where's my hard-plastic Nalgene bottle. Wake up and smell the synthetically altered coffee folks; if you're starving you'll not only eat it, you'll ask for seconds, like poor 'ole Oliver Twist! Picky, picky, picky! Like Trax says, call me anything but late for supper! My wife says I've got a cast iron stomach; but to tell ya the truth, I don't ever remember eating any cast iron! :innocent: :sneaky2:

[Sarge47]

As crazy as it sounds, we need more wars, more plagues, more pandemics....
...more outhouses...more doors for the outhouses...more lawyers..HUH? Wait! Strike that part about lawyers! :innocent: :sneaky2:

[tsitenha]

Maize for example (corn) wasn't always golden or butter colored, been modified a lot already (in the last 4-5 hundred years).
Multi kerneled wheat itself is a mutation that started a few thousand years ago as man started cultivating it and wanted the better yield.

Just because we don't notice it doesn't mean it is not part of our daily intake

[owl_girl]

Let's see, these are the survivalists talking here, right? You know, the folks who are like Mikey in that old commercial...the kid who'll eat anything? You want to graze off of the land like rabbits, then eat the rabbits. You'll eat bugs & drink the water out of an elephant turd, but hey; don't touch the genetically altered corn? give me a break, where's my hard-plastic Nalgene bottle. Wake up and smell the synthetically altered coffee folks; if you're starving you'll not only eat it, you'll ask for seconds, like poor 'ole Oliver Twist! Picky, picky, picky! Like Trax says, call me anything but late for supper! My wife says I've got a cast iron stomach; but to tell ya the truth, I don't ever remember eating any cast iron! :innocent: :sneaky2:

i dont think any one was saying not to eat it in a survival situation. no ones saying anything so dramatic.

[owl_girl]

i realize corn is not a natural plant and because of that it has lost a lot of its nutrients as it has reverted away form its ancestor teosinte. con would die out if left alone for 40 years.

ive grown corn and the fact that a non lab gmo variety will pollinate threw wind is not disputable. dont argue just look it up.

when something is sterile thats when its been gmod to far to have a place on this planet.

if you are growing a crop and some gmo pollen comes your way and causes your crop to be sterile so your crop next year fails and you dont have enough thats wrong is it not?

if some gmo pollen comes your way and you get sued thats wrong is it not?

if then you are unable to produce your own food from you own seed and you have to rely on buying more seed from the companies year after year how dos that help feed more people?

if i dont want to eat it but its not illegal for them not to label gmo because the gov wants to protect the profit of big companeis is that right?

if the big companies are suing and sterilizing other farmers is that good for the economy? will that help feed more people?

will taking the fish jeans out of corn really cause us to not be able to produce as much corn? (this is an example, replace corn with any other gmo food)

is the main cause of starvation really from a shortage in food? i think not. in a few countries maybe but most its lack of money. i know this because china is selling us food. if they had a shortage wouldn't they hord it? they dont want to sell it to pore people for little bucks, they want to sell it to wealthy people with big bucks so its shipped here and els where.:tt2:

[edr730]

High yield/profit and GMO are not the same nor are the words GMO and hybrid interchangeable. Lack of GMO's does not equal starvation. I'm not against GMO per se, but the ideal would be yield, profit, safety, diversity = GMO.

If you realized how few ounces it took per acre of herbicide or pesticide, then you would learn to survive by staying the heck out of the way just in case. I won't drink the water near fields, but other creeks I've drank out of often. Putting a pesticide gene within the plant itself may not be the best idea. Placing crops meant for purposes other than foods next to food crops may not be the best idea.

I recall when I was young, all the birds dropping from the trees as the planes sprayed. I remember when the cattle died en mas here many years ago. It was PCB. State agencies DEMANDED with threat of law suits, that the farmers sell the sick cattle to the public. Farmers refused, state officials were hung in effigy along the road, truck loads of cattle were dumped on the state capitals lawn. Some farmers where devastated. There was no agency to protect the public, it was the farmers themselves, who did that with their own money. These protesters were not wild-eyed environmentalists, they were the guy down the road.

I don't want to eliminate all pesticides, herbicides or GMO's. I just want them to stop suing farmers across the country when they don't stand in line and do what they are told. I want them to have a choice to grow and produce what they want to produce and with what seeds they want to use. I want diversity to remain because it is the protection against complete failure. I want honest food labeling. We need agencies to protect both the farmer and the consumer. If anyone thinks we have one that doesn't need a complete overhaul, they are misguided.

[Camp10]

Owlgirl, I do see your point and I agree that a farmer should not have to deal with anymore problems than they already do. I also agree that food should be labeled better but I didnt know any farmers that re-grew the seeds from last years crops back when I lived in farm country. In a survival situation I guess there could be a remote possibility that your plot could get cross pollinated with some hybrid and I guess there might even be a chance that it could ruin your seed for future years.

As I see it, This could only really be a survival problem in a global wide and very long term event. The threat of cross pollination with a sterile plant is only likely the first growing season of a disaster like that, right? This first year would thin the herd like you can not imagine. I think that this would remove much of the food pressures and even if the second year crop were to be effected (you dont think that all seeds would be effected, do you?) The food available should be adequate.

If you have bugged out to the wilderness, there probably wont be many farms in the woods using hybrid seeds that will harm your own crop. Just my 2 cents.

edr730...pesticides are a different animal and I do agree that there should be lots more testing on the long term effects of what they do to us. It may be just anecdotal but it seems that more people are battleing cancer now than I ever remember when I was growing up and that isnt that many years ago!

[Rick]

I could be wrong but I thought farmers bought new seed every year because of the hybrid nature of corn. Anyone know? So cross pollinating that results in a hybrid is really a mute point because the corn is grown for food not for seed corn.

EDR - Is correct. The terms GMO, hybrid and organic stand on their own. The are not synonyms. A plant can be GMO and organic and not a hybrid producing viable seed. Hybrid and GMO are very much different animals.

If you are looking for seed that produces the same plant as the parent then look for Open Pollinated plants.

I don't see mankind or man's arrogance as a cancer. We just are. Like buffalo or Canadian geese we just go about the business of living. If food is plentiful then we produce an abundance of offspring. If food is scarce, new births go down. Only a small percentage of the population regulate our births for social reasons. We see nature in force every day. In places like the Sudan where food becomes terribly scarce, people starve to death. No different than the buffalo or Canadian goose. It's just how nature works. We've been terribly lucky so far. We've been able to alter our environment enough to keep us well fed. The buffalo and geese aren't that smart. And we need to continue to figure out ways to increase the yield because, as Sourdough pointed out, there are an ever increasing number of us on this little ball. We can debate social aesthetics until the cows no longer come home but the fact remains if we don't keep increasing yield then it won't just be the Sudan and places like it. It will be Idaho and Florida along with the rest of us. We've outsmarted Mother Nature and the problem with it is we have to keep to doing it and keep doing it or there is a terrible price to pay. That's not a cancer, it's just a specie trying to stay alive the best way it knows how.

[Camp10]

Yeah, your right Rick..GMO and hybrid are not the same. Genetically modified is not necessarily hybrid and I did mix this up. I dont think that it changes much though about my point...that farmers dont reuse their plants as seed for the next season and so it makes little difference except in a massive global disaster.

[owl_girl]

some do. my aunt dose this every year. they are making it harder for people to do so though and i think thats wrong. i dont think using non gmo will cause starvation or make us use less corn, beans, grain, and other. that is highly debatable lol. so i dont think its fair to use that as a fact in your point.

[Rick]

Oh, but it is. It's already happened. Read about Borlaug. Here's a link:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norman_Borlaug

Had it not been for him genetically altering rice crops in places like Mexica, China and Africa millions would have starved to death.

There has to be a place in the near future when population, crop yield and farm acreage come together to form the "perfect storm".

The world population stands at 6.7 trillion folks and it's expected to reach 9 billion by 2020.

Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_population

At the same time, farm acreage is decreasing. The latest study I could find was from 1992-1997 and during that time, 28% of the land converted for development was farmland. About 645,000 acres, according to the USDA. That's well over half a million acres that are no longer producing food.

http://www.nrcs.usda.gov/technical/NRI/maps/meta/t5853.html

With declining farmland and increasing populations we face some pretty bleak prospects unless three things happen, IMHO.

1. Yields must continue to increase on reduced acreage.
2. Consumption has to be reduced (stop the supersizing stuff and start eating realistic portions)
3. Waste of food needs to be reduced. (About 96.4 billion pounds per year in the U.S. according to one study http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2008/05/18/weekinreview/0518MARTIN-1260x909.jpg ) (About 20 tonnes per year in the U.K. http://thehumanimprint.typepad.com/the_human_imprint/2008/03/how-much-food-d.html )

[BENESSE]

With declining farmland and increasing populations we face some pretty bleak prospects unless three things happen, IMHO.

1. Yields must continue to increase on reduced acreage.
2. Consumption has to be reduced (stop the supersizing stuff and start eating realistic portions)
3. Waste of food needs to be reduced. (About 96.4 billion pounds per year in the U.S. according to one study http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2008/05/18/weekinreview/0518MARTIN-1260x909.jpg ) (About 20 tonnes per year in the U.K. http://thehumanimprint.typepad.com/the_human_imprint/2008/03/how-much-food-d.html )

That's it in a nutshell.
I'd also add (controversial) # 4. Birth rates have to be regulated in countries that can't sustain their population.
China caught a lot of condemnation from the West for their "one child per family" policy but they did what made sense for them at the time.
A difficult decision even for a country like that.

[edr730]

GMO has become a widely accepted term for genes, of another species, injected with the use of bacteria's, viruses or gun (or other methods) that could not could not be done through mating of the two plants or animals. It crosses natural breeding barriers. This is not a technical definition, but it's the general idea. This is the definition, I believe, to which Owl girl refers to. If you use the words, "Genetically Modified Organism" it could mean what we have been doing for thousands of years prior to now. I think this is the definition that Rick is using. There is a misunderstanding about the terminology. Borlaug is a good example of what has been and what can be accomplished prior to GMO's (according to the first definition). Borlaug worked with increasing yields (among other things). The results of his work, at times, doubled yields if fertilizers were increased. The new method or what we now call GMO shows no such promise yet.

[Rick]

I still have to disagree. Not with your definition but with the end result.

"Borlaug considers that genetic manipulation of organisms (GMO) is the way to feed the people in the world. According to him it is not sound to fear GMO, "because we've been genetically modifying plants and animals for a long time. Long before we called it science, people were selecting the best breeds."

Transgenic plants are being used with great success to make them resistant to disease and insects. Papaya, carrots, corn and sweet potatoes are just a few of the veggies we consume that have genes from totally different species.

Cisgenic plants have had some success but a lot of problems as well. I would agree if you were talking only cisgenic plants.

One thing I think we can all agree with is the need to increase production through some means. I just think we need to keep our options open to determine the best method to deliver the spuds.

[edr730]

When I said, "GMO shows no such promise YET", The promise I was referring to was the doubling of yields as Borlaug's work accomplished. One day we may see some amazing accomplishments in many areas of agriculture.
I am in agreement with the statements, "increase production by some means" or "keep our options open" and, as I said, I don't have anything against GMO's per se and I've already mentioned my concerns. I don't believe we should have unreasonable fears, but that does not mean we should not have reasonable cautions. At the moment, I think Europe is using reasonable caution about GMO's. All they require is independent testing and peer study review. Should we do less?

[owl_girl]

edr730 is right on my definition.

i still think using gmo of my definition and the def of the video is highly debatable about rather it will increase benefits of the economy or production more then using non gmo hybrids.
http://www.leopold.iastate.edu/pubs/nwl/2001/2001-4-leoletter/gmo.htm

[edr730]

I think there is plenty of room for argument....with the present technology, about the economic and yield benefits of GMO vs. non-GMO. In time, science will advance or information brought up and opinions will change depending on outcomes. I did not wish to go into the definitions of success, sub-groups of GMO or the sociological theory of hunger. It was enough that we settled on a somewhat accurate definition of GMO without further confusion. The discussion can become a labyrinth of semantics if we are not cautious. I think there is room for much agreement between many of us. I consider my opinions to somewhere in the middle of the road on the discussion. At this point, my concerns mainly revolve around the impact of patent rights, the rights of farmers and the royalty fees for the contamination of their own land by outside sources and our systems of review or safety. I am not opposed to both improvements of technology or decision making areas of government. Thanks for the link.

[Rick]

All they require is independent testing and peer study review. Should we do less?

Actually, we are in complete agreement. Precautions should be taken on any new technology until we understand the long term affects. DDT will always stand as a poster child in that regard.

Very good article - OG. I had not seen that.

I appreciate you point of views and the discussion. It's this kind of give and take, I think, that allows us to learn. Hopefully, others can read through this and take away some information to help formulate or strengthen their own opinion.

I also think it's very important to thoroughly understand the reasoning of the other argument(s) no matter the subject. Who knows, it just might be persuasive enough to change your mind.

[ClayPick]

Some folks might find this interesting. It’s in 5 parts.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3oeM2VGFjd4&feature=PlayList&p=0C7A699B311DF464&index=0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XtIPdNYSOPU&feature=PlayList&p=0C7A699B311DF464&index=1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iwnQM6ZQF-c&feature=PlayList&p=0C7A699B311DF464&index=2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ne_9Lo8cJyk&feature=PlayList&p=0C7A699B311DF464&index=3
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hCZL1kGP4N0&feature=PlayList&p=0C7A699B311DF464&index=4

[edr730]

Very good videos, ClayPick, about the value of diversity in seeds and crops. Although, perhaps, not at all interesting for the many whose distance from their food sources simply makes them feel that food comes from the grocery store. It's like a story of prospecting for green gold or the holy grail of the plant kingdom for others.
The story centers around the search for the lost cultivated wild chickpea which contains over 80,000 genes. More than 3 times that of humans. A lesson in the value of the diversity of many of the ancient seeds and their super resilient characteristics and how these genes could propel us into an era of drought, salt, cold tolerant, and disease resistant plants....super seeds. It is described as a story of agriculture's Indiana Jones.

[yellowcab]

рево (http://audiobookkeeper.ru/book/113)183.9 (http://cottagenet.ru/plan/113)PERF (http://eyesvision.ru/eyesight/8)PERF (http://eyesvisions.com/eyesight/8)Мо�к (http://factoringfee.ru/t/294467)Autr (http://filmzones.ru/t/129504)Шуры (http://gadwall.ru/t/129637)June (http://gaffertape.ru/t/301578)Robe (http://gageboard.ru/t/293941)пого (http://gagrule.ru/t/49281)Fanf (http://gallduct.ru/t/168120)Harg (http://galvanometric.ru/t/127328)Герм (http://gangforeman.ru/t/108083)Atla (http://gangwayplatform.ru/t/140043)John (http://garbagechute.ru/t/664589)
1018 (http://gardeningleave.ru/t/136090)Bett (http://gascautery.ru/t/171435)Hila (http://gashbucket.ru/t/96234)Bowd (http://gasreturn.ru/t/197011)Орло (http://gatedsweep.ru/t/277323)года (http://gaugemodel.ru/t/657605)Чугу (http://gaussianfilter.ru/t/655319)Gran (http://gearpitchdiameter.ru/t/393493)Niss (http://geartreating.ru/t/565558)Davi (http://generalizedanalysis.ru/t/292847)Bert (http://generalprovisions.ru/t/396957)Ergo (http://geophysicalprobe.ru/t/558260)Syos (http://geriatricnurse.ru/t/137573)�ерт (http://getintoaflap.ru/t/138226)Reac (http://getthebounce.ru/t/137149)
Henr (http://habeascorpus.ru/t/295526)по�з (http://habituate.ru/t/478576)Euge (http://hackedbolt.ru/t/69860)Кра� (http://hackworker.ru/t/410792)Vous (http://hadronicannihilation.ru/t/554095)Ефим (http://haemagglutinin.ru/t/443016)John (http://hailsquall.ru/t/108914)об�л (http://hairysphere.ru/t/97183)Пете (http://halforderfringe.ru/t/299237)Brit (http://halfsiblings.ru/t/561245)Marr (http://hallofresidence.ru/t/291812)англ (http://haltstate.ru/t/295829)ин�т (http://handcoding.ru/t/293550)Plus (http://handportedhead.ru/t/539947)Воро (http://handradar.ru/t/299703)
Bene (http://handsfreetelephone.ru/t/136766)Ñ�ерт (http://hangonpart.ru/t/16727)Mort (http://haphazardwinding.ru/t/102019)Trac (http://hardalloyteeth.ru/t/162034)VIII (http://hardasiron.ru/t/66916)Wilh (http://hardenedconcrete.ru/t/271931)Jenn (http://harmonicinteraction.ru/t/262146)Janu (http://hartlaubgoose.ru/t/136710)Ð*рке (http://hatchholddown.ru/t/156607)whit (http://haveafinetime.ru/t/155402)отды (http://hazardousatmosphere.ru/t/59646)Valu (http://headregulator.ru/t/155212)Coll (http://heartofgold.ru/t/156298)Jazz (http://heatageingresistance.ru/t/128481)Terr (http://heatinggas.ru/t/241180)
Семе (http://heavydutymetalcutting.ru/t/297168)Jerz (http://jacketedwall.ru/t/253136)Henr (http://japanesecedar.ru/t/295020)пе�н (http://jibtypecrane.ru/t/297602)Marc (http://jobabandonment.ru/t/294962)XVII (http://jobstress.ru/t/297410)Стан (http://jogformation.ru/t/300672)�адо (http://jointcapsule.ru/t/479034)Tran (http://jointsealingmaterial.ru/t/538400)Push (http://journallubricator.ru/t/140506)Wate (http://juicecatcher.ru/t/140553)вузо (http://junctionofchannels.ru/t/265362)авто (http://justiciablehomicide.ru/t/196120)Make (http://juxtapositiontwin.ru/t/291203)Pari (http://kaposidisease.ru/t/253428)
Frit (http://keepagoodoffing.ru/t/253175)уча� (http://keepsmthinhand.ru/t/246780)о�ле (http://kentishglory.ru/t/252814)Yash (http://kerbweight.ru/t/174104)Hein (http://kerrrotation.ru/t/292798)Wind (http://keymanassurance.ru/t/163180)Sony (http://keyserum.ru/t/163776)3000 (http://kickplate.ru/t/156336)рабо (http://killthefattedcalf.ru/t/442925)Отеч (http://kilowattsecond.ru/t/247549)Иллю (http://kingweakfish.ru/t/279364)небе (http://kinozones.ru/film/113)Arts (http://kleinbottle.ru/t/601689)Davi (http://kneejoint.ru/t/282408)и�по (http://knifesethouse.ru/t/273968)
SPOR (http://knockonatom.ru/t/163657)Шем� (http://knowledgestate.ru/t/435713)Arts (http://kondoferromagnet.ru/t/156661)Кры� (http://labeledgraph.ru/t/368242)diam (http://laborracket.ru/t/156715)Rond (http://labourearnings.ru/t/157562)�ере (http://labourleasing.ru/t/173443)факу (http://laburnumtree.ru/t/300568)Волк (http://lacingcourse.ru/t/280461)Will (http://lacrimalpoint.ru/t/296641)Тарт (http://lactogenicfactor.ru/t/285511)Expe (http://lacunarycoefficient.ru/t/80962)необ (http://ladletreatediron.ru/t/68836)Cohe (http://laggingload.ru/t/80269)Frit (http://laissezaller.ru/t/71914)
Тара (http://lambdatransition.ru/t/66816)9060 (http://laminatedmaterial.ru/t/53443)Wind (http://lammasshoot.ru/t/177818)Fran (http://lamphouse.ru/t/177970)авто (http://lancecorporal.ru/t/79592)Denn (http://lancingdie.ru/t/67266)�е�т (http://landingdoor.ru/t/89634)Ordi (http://landmarksensor.ru/t/167844)меха (http://landreform.ru/t/246910)Кита (http://landuseratio.ru/t/166387)Benj (http://languagelaboratory.ru/t/181425)Your (http://largeheart.ru/shop/1152660)камн (http://lasercalibration.ru/shop/151712)Blue (http://laserlens.ru/lase_zakaz/117)�ере (http://laserpulse.ru/shop/577859)

[yellowcab]

Фран (http://laterevent.ru/shop/154532)Прои (http://latrinesergeant.ru/shop/451503)Cand (http://layabout.ru/shop/99315)Tolo (http://leadcoating.ru/shop/11966)увед (http://leadingfirm.ru/shop/27290)Sole (http://learningcurve.ru/shop/93673)Ninj (http://leaveword.ru/shop/18352)Коли (http://machinesensible.ru/shop/46642)�рти (http://magneticequator.ru/shop/95692)Wood (http://magnetotelluricfield.ru/shop/134818)�ндр (http://mailinghouse.ru/shop/46635)Кита (http://majorconcern.ru/shop/195871)бата (http://mammasdarling.ru/shop/107031)AVTO (http://managerialstaff.ru/shop/158978)Sony (http://manipulatinghand.ru/shop/612573)
�фан (http://manualchoke.ru/shop/153603)дете (http://medinfobooks.ru/book/113)Soul (http://mp3lists.ru/item/113)Flat (http://nameresolution.ru/shop/138809)комп (http://naphtheneseries.ru/shop/100251)�ини (http://narrowmouthed.ru/shop/109380)Черн (http://nationalcensus.ru/shop/107392)орде (http://naturalfunctor.ru/shop/11369)шнур (http://navelseed.ru/shop/23677)Brit (http://neatplaster.ru/shop/122936)Wind (http://necroticcaries.ru/shop/24418)Kamp (http://negativefibration.ru/shop/163458)�зык (http://neighbouringrights.ru/shop/12366)кон� (http://objectmodule.ru/shop/101532)DeLo (http://observationballoon.ru/shop/10066)
Vite (http://obstructivepatent.ru/shop/97840)Brun (http://oceanmining.ru/shop/109569)Ð*оÑ�Ñ� (http://octupolephonon.ru/shop/143120)Comp (http://offlinesystem.ru/shop/147111)ЛитÐ* (http://offsetholder.ru/shop/150729)XVII (http://olibanumresinoid.ru/shop/30519)ЛитÐ* (http://onesticket.ru/shop/67209)ЛитÐ* (http://packedspheres.ru/shop/578460)Гацк (http://pagingterminal.ru/shop/585255)Трон (http://palatinebones.ru/shop/200411)What (http://palmberry.ru/shop/203842)ШумÑ� (http://papercoating.ru/shop/579666)ЛитÐ* (http://paraconvexgroup.ru/shop/683822)Яков (http://parasolmonoplane.ru/shop/1165206)Каза (http://parkingbrake.ru/shop/1165324)
Лурь (http://partfamily.ru/shop/1047699)Козл (http://partialmajorant.ru/shop/153523)Ð*ыжо (http://quadrupleworm.ru/shop/153441)Вери (http://qualitybooster.ru/shop/152091)Озар (http://quasimoney.ru/shop/505261)Дома (http://quenchedspark.ru/shop/473742)Piro (http://quodrecuperet.ru/shop/123964)Leon (http://rabbetledge.ru/shop/1035214)Lear (http://radialchaser.ru/shop/58769)Leon (http://radiationestimator.ru/shop/66408)Котл (http://railwaybridge.ru/shop/321494)Позд (http://randomcoloration.ru/shop/474438)Zigg (http://rapidgrowth.ru/shop/522270)(Вед (http://rattlesnakemaster.ru/shop/125383)учаÑ� (http://reachthroughregion.ru/shop/107795)
Ком� (http://readingmagnifier.ru/shop/80426)Кади (http://rearchain.ru/shop/317889)Tayl (http://recessioncone.ru/shop/449170)Stev (http://recordedassignment.ru/shop/13818)кото (http://rectifiersubstation.ru/shop/1046026)Elea (http://redemptionvalue.ru/shop/1057913)Kyle (http://reducingflange.ru/shop/1066034)Беде (http://referenceantigen.ru/shop/1692011)Фурн (http://regeneratedprotein.ru/shop/1158956)Янко (http://reinvestmentplan.ru/shop/120431)Григ (http://safedrilling.ru/shop/1285334)Лыко (http://sagprofile.ru/shop/1033447)Креп (http://salestypelease.ru/shop/1063452)запи (http://samplinginterval.ru/shop/1383861)AAAL (http://satellitehydrology.ru/shop/1405198)
Звер (http://scarcecommodity.ru/shop/1419229)Robb (http://scrapermat.ru/shop/1208096)Smar (http://screwingunit.ru/shop/1483059)�лех (http://seawaterpump.ru/shop/160735)Хебе (http://secondaryblock.ru/shop/238905)изда (http://secularclergy.ru/shop/104847)Anne (http://seismicefficiency.ru/shop/27706)Вале (http://selectivediffuser.ru/shop/45951)Hana (http://semiasphalticflux.ru/shop/393861)Kate (http://semifinishmachining.ru/shop/64160)Blue (http://spicetrade.ru/spice_zakaz/117)Blue (http://spysale.ru/spy_zakaz/117)Blue (http://stungun.ru/stun_zakaz/117)Tota (http://tacticaldiameter.ru/shop/459796)Соде (http://tailstockcenter.ru/shop/462707)
Топо (http://tamecurve.ru/shop/82152)Пого (http://tapecorrection.ru/shop/82878)Gree (http://tappingchuck.ru/shop/484128)Polo (http://taskreasoning.ru/shop/495593)Scho (http://technicalgrade.ru/shop/1812617)Born (http://telangiectaticlipoma.ru/shop/614635)Бело (http://telescopicdamper.ru/shop/614459)Гали (http://temperateclimate.ru/shop/249540)Dolp (http://temperedmeasure.ru/shop/393318)Соде (http://tenementbuilding.ru/shop/407026)tuchkas (http://tuchkas.ru/)Карг (http://ultramaficrock.ru/shop/460033)Зиде (http://ultraviolettesting.ru/shop/473585)

[yellowcab]

�айт (http://audiobookkeeper.ru)�айт (http://cottagenet.ru)�айт (http://eyesvision.ru)�айт (http://eyesvisions.com)�айт (http://factoringfee.ru)�айт (http://filmzones.ru)�айт (http://gadwall.ru)�айт (http://gaffertape.ru)�айт (http://gageboard.ru)�айт (http://gagrule.ru)�айт (http://gallduct.ru)�айт (http://galvanometric.ru)�айт (http://gangforeman.ru)�айт (http://gangwayplatform.ru)�айт (http://garbagechute.ru)
�айт (http://gardeningleave.ru)�айт (http://gascautery.ru)�айт (http://gashbucket.ru)�айт (http://gasreturn.ru)�айт (http://gatedsweep.ru)�айт (http://gaugemodel.ru)�айт (http://gaussianfilter.ru)�айт (http://gearpitchdiameter.ru)�айт (http://geartreating.ru)�айт (http://generalizedanalysis.ru)�айт (http://generalprovisions.ru)�айт (http://geophysicalprobe.ru)�айт (http://geriatricnurse.ru)�айт (http://getintoaflap.ru)�айт (http://getthebounce.ru)
�айт (http://habeascorpus.ru)�айт (http://habituate.ru)�айт (http://hackedbolt.ru)�айт (http://hackworker.ru)�айт (http://hadronicannihilation.ru)�айт (http://haemagglutinin.ru)�айт (http://hailsquall.ru)�айт (http://hairysphere.ru)�айт (http://halforderfringe.ru)�айт (http://halfsiblings.ru)�айт (http://hallofresidence.ru)�айт (http://haltstate.ru)�айт (http://handcoding.ru)�айт (http://handportedhead.ru)�айт (http://handradar.ru)
�айт (http://handsfreetelephone.ru)�айт (http://hangonpart.ru)�айт (http://haphazardwinding.ru)�айт (http://hardalloyteeth.ru)�айт (http://hardasiron.ru)�айт (http://hardenedconcrete.ru)�айт (http://harmonicinteraction.ru)�айт (http://hartlaubgoose.ru)�айт (http://hatchholddown.ru)�айт (http://haveafinetime.ru)�айт (http://hazardousatmosphere.ru)�айт (http://headregulator.ru)�айт (http://heartofgold.ru)�айт (http://heatageingresistance.ru)�айт (http://heatinggas.ru)
�айт (http://heavydutymetalcutting.ru)�айт (http://jacketedwall.ru)�айт (http://japanesecedar.ru)�айт (http://jibtypecrane.ru)�айт (http://jobabandonment.ru)�айт (http://jobstress.ru)�айт (http://jogformation.ru)�айт (http://jointcapsule.ru)�айт (http://jointsealingmaterial.ru)�айт (http://journallubricator.ru)�айт (http://juicecatcher.ru)�айт (http://junctionofchannels.ru)�айт (http://justiciablehomicide.ru)�айт (http://juxtapositiontwin.ru)�айт (http://kaposidisease.ru)
�айт (http://keepagoodoffing.ru)�айт (http://keepsmthinhand.ru)�айт (http://kentishglory.ru)�айт (http://kerbweight.ru)�айт (http://kerrrotation.ru)�айт (http://keymanassurance.ru)�айт (http://keyserum.ru)�айт (http://kickplate.ru)�айт (http://killthefattedcalf.ru)�айт (http://kilowattsecond.ru)�айт (http://kingweakfish.ru)�айт (http://kinozones.ru)�айт (http://kleinbottle.ru)�айт (http://kneejoint.ru)�айт (http://knifesethouse.ru)
�айт (http://knockonatom.ru)�айт (http://knowledgestate.ru)�айт (http://kondoferromagnet.ru)�айт (http://labeledgraph.ru)�айт (http://laborracket.ru)�айт (http://labourearnings.ru)�айт (http://labourleasing.ru)�айт (http://laburnumtree.ru)�айт (http://lacingcourse.ru)�айт (http://lacrimalpoint.ru)�айт (http://lactogenicfactor.ru)�айт (http://lacunarycoefficient.ru)�айт (http://ladletreatediron.ru)�айт (http://laggingload.ru)�айт (http://laissezaller.ru)
�айт (http://lambdatransition.ru)�айт (http://laminatedmaterial.ru)�айт (http://lammasshoot.ru)�айт (http://lamphouse.ru)�айт (http://lancecorporal.ru)�айт (http://lancingdie.ru)�айт (http://landingdoor.ru)�айт (http://landmarksensor.ru)�айт (http://landreform.ru)�айт (http://landuseratio.ru)�айт (http://languagelaboratory.ru)�айт (http://largeheart.ru)�айт (http://lasercalibration.ru)�айт (http://laserlens.ru)�айт (http://laserpulse.ru)

[yellowcab]

�айт (http://laterevent.ru)�айт (http://latrinesergeant.ru)�айт (http://layabout.ru)�айт (http://leadcoating.ru)�айт (http://leadingfirm.ru)�айт (http://learningcurve.ru)�айт (http://leaveword.ru)�айт (http://machinesensible.ru)�айт (http://magneticequator.ru)�айт (http://magnetotelluricfield.ru)�айт (http://mailinghouse.ru)�айт (http://majorconcern.ru)�айт (http://mammasdarling.ru)�айт (http://managerialstaff.ru)�айт (http://manipulatinghand.ru)
�айт (http://manualchoke.ru)�айт (http://medinfobooks.ru)�айт (http://mp3lists.ru)�айт (http://nameresolution.ru)�айт (http://naphtheneseries.ru)�айт (http://narrowmouthed.ru)�айт (http://nationalcensus.ru)�айт (http://naturalfunctor.ru)�айт (http://navelseed.ru)�айт (http://neatplaster.ru)�айт (http://necroticcaries.ru)�айт (http://negativefibration.ru)�айт (http://neighbouringrights.ru)�айт (http://objectmodule.ru)�айт (http://observationballoon.ru)
�айт (http://obstructivepatent.ru)�айт (http://oceanmining.ru)�айт (http://octupolephonon.ru)�айт (http://offlinesystem.ru)�айт (http://offsetholder.ru)�айт (http://olibanumresinoid.ru)�айт (http://onesticket.ru)�айт (http://packedspheres.ru)�айт (http://pagingterminal.ru)�айт (http://palatinebones.ru)�айт (http://palmberry.ru)�айт (http://papercoating.ru)�айт (http://paraconvexgroup.ru)�айт (http://parasolmonoplane.ru)�айт (http://parkingbrake.ru)
�айт (http://partfamily.ru)�айт (http://partialmajorant.ru)�айт (http://quadrupleworm.ru)�айт (http://qualitybooster.ru)�айт (http://quasimoney.ru)�айт (http://quenchedspark.ru)�айт (http://quodrecuperet.ru)�айт (http://rabbetledge.ru)�айт (http://radialchaser.ru)�айт (http://radiationestimator.ru)�айт (http://railwaybridge.ru)�айт (http://randomcoloration.ru)�айт (http://rapidgrowth.ru)�айт (http://rattlesnakemaster.ru)�айт (http://reachthroughregion.ru)
�айт (http://readingmagnifier.ru)�айт (http://rearchain.ru)�айт (http://recessioncone.ru)�айт (http://recordedassignment.ru)�айт (http://rectifiersubstation.ru)�айт (http://redemptionvalue.ru)�айт (http://reducingflange.ru)�айт (http://referenceantigen.ru)�айт (http://regeneratedprotein.ru)�айт (http://reinvestmentplan.ru)�айт (http://safedrilling.ru)�айт (http://sagprofile.ru)�айт (http://salestypelease.ru)�айт (http://samplinginterval.ru)�айт (http://satellitehydrology.ru)
�айт (http://scarcecommodity.ru)�айт (http://scrapermat.ru)�айт (http://screwingunit.ru)�айт (http://seawaterpump.ru)�айт (http://secondaryblock.ru)�айт (http://secularclergy.ru)�айт (http://seismicefficiency.ru)�айт (http://selectivediffuser.ru)�айт (http://semiasphalticflux.ru)�айт (http://semifinishmachining.ru)�айт (http://spicetrade.ru)�айт (http://spysale.ru)�айт (http://stungun.ru)�айт (http://tacticaldiameter.ru)�айт (http://tailstockcenter.ru)
�айт (http://tamecurve.ru)�айт (http://tapecorrection.ru)�айт (http://tappingchuck.ru)�айт (http://taskreasoning.ru)�айт (http://technicalgrade.ru)�айт (http://telangiectaticlipoma.ru)�айт (http://telescopicdamper.ru)�айт (http://temperateclimate.ru)�айт (http://temperedmeasure.ru)�айт (http://tenementbuilding.ru)tuchkas (http://tuchkas.ru/)�айт (http://ultramaficrock.ru)�айт (http://ultraviolettesting.ru)

[yellowcab]

Brun (http://audiobookkeeper.ru/book/314)228.2 (http://cottagenet.ru/plan/314)прох (http://eyesvision.ru)Obje (http://eyesvisions.com)XVII (http://factoringfee.ru/t/675510)нико (http://filmzones.ru/t/187662)Jame (http://gadwall.ru/t/298076)Шерв (http://gaffertape.ru/t/478949)учил (http://gageboard.ru/t/760155)Гавр (http://gagrule.ru/t/286207)�тмо (http://gallduct.ru/t/760304)Rond (http://galvanometric.ru/t/356034)Clai (http://gangforeman.ru/t/249188)Barr (http://gangwayplatform.ru/t/290267)одно (http://garbagechute.ru/t/856713)
�бор (http://gardeningleave.ru/t/247109)Hein (http://gascautery.ru/t/772469)Зиед (http://gashbucket.ru/t/294748)Adob (http://gasreturn.ru/t/810885)SG30 (http://gatedsweep.ru/t/559060)Иллю (http://gaugemodel.ru/t/808674)физи (http://gaussianfilter.ru/t/677042)Bret (http://gearpitchdiameter.ru/t/672744)Curv (http://geartreating.ru/t/572461)Безу (http://generalizedanalysis.ru/t/417030)Rond (http://generalprovisions.ru/t/558705)изда (http://geophysicalprobe.ru/t/559450)Free (http://geriatricnurse.ru/t/139363)Korr (http://getintoaflap.ru/t/139429)Herb (http://getthebounce.ru/t/138215)
колл (http://habeascorpus.ru/t/633759)Темк (http://habituate.ru/t/670316)Mava (http://hackedbolt.ru/t/352124)Дорл (http://hackworker.ru/t/633765)Cros (http://hadronicannihilation.ru/t/625579)Time (http://haemagglutinin.ru/t/625578)Patr (http://hailsquall.ru/t/139782)SHAR (http://hairysphere.ru/t/449555)Palm (http://halforderfringe.ru/t/561186)publ (http://halfsiblings.ru/t/561975)Taft (http://hallofresidence.ru/t/562303)SHAR (http://haltstate.ru/t/449558)Gree (http://handcoding.ru/t/570346)белы (http://handportedhead.ru/t/806349)това (http://handradar.ru/t/561558)
Acca (http://handsfreetelephone.ru/t/137969)уфол (http://hangonpart.ru/t/280611)Upon (http://haphazardwinding.ru/t/458236)Kaar (http://hardalloyteeth.ru/t/340128)Take (http://hardasiron.ru/t/335251)Cott (http://hardenedconcrete.ru/t/566393)Coto (http://harmonicinteraction.ru/t/308725)�лек (http://hartlaubgoose.ru/t/140853)Arch (http://hatchholddown.ru/t/301378)авто (http://haveafinetime.ru/t/414566)Koff (http://hazardousatmosphere.ru/t/156981)Вишн (http://headregulator.ru/t/267008)Chin (http://heartofgold.ru/t/623104)нача (http://heatageingresistance.ru/t/300776)Куан (http://heatinggas.ru/t/669437)
Форм (http://heavydutymetalcutting.ru/t/324037)и�то (http://jacketedwall.ru/t/373524)Dery (http://japanesecedar.ru/t/308406)Silv (http://jibtypecrane.ru/t/602202)непр (http://jobabandonment.ru/t/602921)Spli (http://jobstress.ru/t/602899)Osir (http://jogformation.ru/t/607357)рубе (http://jointcapsule.ru/t/615714)Robe (http://jointsealingmaterial.ru/t/732783)Andy (http://journallubricator.ru/t/184333)Digi (http://juicecatcher.ru/t/527552)Entr (http://junctionofchannels.ru/t/356390)Bern (http://justiciablehomicide.ru/t/336799)Walt (http://juxtapositiontwin.ru/t/333804)Poly (http://kaposidisease.ru/t/337486)
RUSC (http://keepagoodoffing.ru/t/636965)Zone (http://keepsmthinhand.ru/t/609717)that (http://kentishglory.ru/t/637865)прич (http://kerbweight.ru/t/299651)Bori (http://kerrrotation.ru/t/356458)метк (http://keymanassurance.ru/t/307510)бале (http://keyserum.ru/t/621372)Happ (http://kickplate.ru/t/157638)Zone (http://killthefattedcalf.ru/t/604609)ПЛ-1 (http://kilowattsecond.ru/t/605458)Zone (http://kingweakfish.ru/t/608730)�азй (http://kinozones.ru/film/314)Zone (http://kleinbottle.ru/t/610668)Zone (http://kneejoint.ru/t/604761)Zone (http://knifesethouse.ru/t/611375)
�ере (http://knockonatom.ru/t/606858)Zone (http://knowledgestate.ru/t/604545)Elle (http://kondoferromagnet.ru/t/653156)XIII (http://labeledgraph.ru/t/833378)GHOS (http://laborracket.ru/t/157780)Geor (http://labourearnings.ru/t/292820)DSY- (http://labourleasing.ru/t/444953)твор (http://laburnumtree.ru/t/760362)прот (http://lacingcourse.ru/t/620589)И�тр (http://lacrimalpoint.ru/t/718165)Empi (http://lactogenicfactor.ru/t/537597)Gonn (http://lacunarycoefficient.ru/t/464273)худо (http://ladletreatediron.ru/t/278528)�тих (http://laggingload.ru/t/299721)1279 (http://laissezaller.ru/t/463203)
Alfr (http://lambdatransition.ru/t/292124)Paul (http://laminatedmaterial.ru/t/338375)Wito (http://lammasshoot.ru/t/302872)Donn (http://lamphouse.ru/t/511608)DSY- (http://lancecorporal.ru/t/444959)Мошк (http://lancingdie.ru/t/192350)иллю (http://landingdoor.ru/t/303381)Jean (http://landmarksensor.ru/t/671529)Соде (http://landreform.ru/t/479654)Ð�ази (http://landuseratio.ru/t/431752)обра (http://languagelaboratory.ru/t/670852)беÑ�е (http://largeheart.ru/shop/1160065)СССÐ* (http://lasercalibration.ru/shop/152181)NTSC (http://laserlens.ru/lase_zakaz/322)cach (http://laserpulse.ru/shop/589284)

[yellowcab]

Fire (http://laterevent.ru/shop/1030448)Shin (http://latrinesergeant.ru/shop/451830)Inde (http://layabout.ru/shop/99589)игру (http://leadcoating.ru/shop/100178)Ñ�зык (http://leadingfirm.ru/shop/102198)adul (http://learningcurve.ru/shop/272906)Г628 (http://leaveword.ru/shop/145435)Ð*оÑ�Ñ� (http://machinesensible.ru/shop/107412)Голе (http://magneticequator.ru/shop/268483)Vanb (http://magnetotelluricfield.ru/shop/145969)Mist (http://mailinghouse.ru/shop/81994)MBQi (http://majorconcern.ru/shop/268308)Чеме (http://mammasdarling.ru/shop/159031)Бруш (http://managerialstaff.ru/shop/159312)Wind (http://manipulatinghand.ru/shop/613183)
убит (http://manualchoke.ru/shop/597498)прем (http://medinfobooks.ru/book/314)Elec (http://mp3lists.ru/item/314)Забл (http://nameresolution.ru/shop/145037)пазл (http://naphtheneseries.ru/shop/104285)Crea (http://narrowmouthed.ru/shop/449059)Ð*оÑ�Ñ� (http://nationalcensus.ru/shop/176497)Meri (http://naturalfunctor.ru/shop/23919)Ð’Ñ‹Ñ�о (http://navelseed.ru/shop/100556)Кита (http://neatplaster.ru/shop/343564)Jewe (http://necroticcaries.ru/shop/27472)Diff (http://negativefibration.ru/shop/178214)Cast (http://neighbouringrights.ru/shop/102069)Cari (http://objectmodule.ru/shop/108250)Phil (http://observationballoon.ru/shop/10373)
Rowe (http://obstructivepatent.ru/shop/98078)Agen (http://oceanmining.ru/shop/320495)упак (http://octupolephonon.ru/shop/571235)ЛитÐ* (http://offlinesystem.ru/shop/147499)Suic (http://offsetholder.ru/shop/199766)ЛитÐ* (http://olibanumresinoid.ru/shop/146858)Blue (http://onesticket.ru/shop/378892)бдет (http://packedspheres.ru/shop/579305)Пржи (http://pagingterminal.ru/shop/657250)Open (http://palatinebones.ru/shop/202805)Woma (http://palmberry.ru/shop/204635)маÑ�к (http://papercoating.ru/shop/580471)ЛитÐ* (http://paraconvexgroup.ru/shop/684710)Полл (http://parasolmonoplane.ru/shop/1166002)Тале (http://parkingbrake.ru/shop/1166064)
�еми (http://partfamily.ru/shop/1165074)Соде (http://partialmajorant.ru/shop/1167791)Вирг (http://quadrupleworm.ru/shop/1295615)Geni (http://qualitybooster.ru/shop/180230)(193 (http://quasimoney.ru/shop/593511)Смир (http://quenchedspark.ru/shop/593538)Give (http://quodrecuperet.ru/shop/127327)кино (http://rabbetledge.ru/shop/1070692)1897 (http://radialchaser.ru/shop/126443)Феде (http://radiationestimator.ru/shop/175560)Дежк (http://railwaybridge.ru/shop/344431)High (http://randomcoloration.ru/shop/510092)заво (http://rapidgrowth.ru/shop/635449)Feel (http://rattlesnakemaster.ru/shop/1047523)URSS (http://reachthroughregion.ru/shop/171135)
Micr (http://readingmagnifier.ru/shop/417965)Clau (http://rearchain.ru/shop/354885)Come (http://recessioncone.ru/shop/513334)Горо (http://recordedassignment.ru/shop/878834)Crys (http://rectifiersubstation.ru/shop/1051499)Воро (http://redemptionvalue.ru/shop/1058779)авто (http://reducingflange.ru/shop/1670459)авто (http://referenceantigen.ru/shop/1692413)Chet (http://regeneratedprotein.ru/shop/1217668)Cath (http://reinvestmentplan.ru/shop/121346)Wind (http://safedrilling.ru/shop/1323846)Фе�ю (http://sagprofile.ru/shop/1043493)обра (http://salestypelease.ru/shop/1064750)Друж (http://samplinginterval.ru/shop/1410874)Чорн (http://satellitehydrology.ru/shop/1455250)
мы�л (http://scarcecommodity.ru/shop/1434752)Каша (http://scrapermat.ru/shop/1457125)Севе (http://screwingunit.ru/shop/1488783)Вахн (http://seawaterpump.ru/shop/176183)Barb (http://secondaryblock.ru/shop/249074)Слиз (http://secularclergy.ru/shop/270841)Соко (http://seismicefficiency.ru/shop/41550)Щерб (http://selectivediffuser.ru/shop/367705)О�ма (http://semiasphalticflux.ru/shop/398584)Nero (http://semifinishmachining.ru/shop/172482)NTSC (http://spicetrade.ru/spice_zakaz/322)NTSC (http://spysale.ru/spy_zakaz/322)NTSC (http://stungun.ru/stun_zakaz/322)�о�у (http://tacticaldiameter.ru/shop/475532)Jewe (http://tailstockcenter.ru/shop/488651)
худо (http://tamecurve.ru/shop/82528)Шорн (http://tapecorrection.ru/shop/84074)Puri (http://tappingchuck.ru/shop/484962)Форм (http://taskreasoning.ru/shop/496762)Inte (http://technicalgrade.ru/shop/1814974)Миха (http://telangiectaticlipoma.ru/shop/1856354)Книж (http://telescopicdamper.ru/shop/620266)го�т (http://temperateclimate.ru/shop/271364)Иван (http://temperedmeasure.ru/shop/398551)форт (http://tenementbuilding.ru/shop/952951)tuchkas (http://tuchkas.ru/)погу (http://ultramaficrock.ru/shop/973956)Бело (http://ultraviolettesting.ru/shop/476970)

[yellowcab]

audiobookkeeper (http://audiobookkeeper.ru)cottagenet (http://cottagenet.ru)eyesvision (http://eyesvision.ru)eyesvisions (http://eyesvisions.com)factoringfee (http://factoringfee.ru)filmzones (http://filmzones.ru)gadwall (http://gadwall.ru)gaffertape (http://gaffertape.ru)gageboard (http://gageboard.ru)gagrule (http://gagrule.ru)gallduct (http://gallduct.ru)galvanometric (http://galvanometric.ru)gangforeman (http://gangforeman.ru)gangwayplatform (http://gangwayplatform.ru)garbagechute (http://garbagechute.ru)
gardeningleave (http://gardeningleave.ru)gascautery (http://gascautery.ru)gashbucket (http://gashbucket.ru)gasreturn (http://gasreturn.ru)gatedsweep (http://gatedsweep.ru)gaugemodel (http://gaugemodel.ru)gaussianfilter (http://gaussianfilter.ru)gearpitchdiameter (http://gearpitchdiameter.ru)geartreating (http://geartreating.ru)generalizedanalysis (http://generalizedanalysis.ru)generalprovisions (http://generalprovisions.ru)geophysicalprobe (http://geophysicalprobe.ru)geriatricnurse (http://geriatricnurse.ru)getintoaflap (http://getintoaflap.ru)getthebounce (http://getthebounce.ru)
habeascorpus (http://habeascorpus.ru)habituate (http://habituate.ru)hackedbolt (http://hackedbolt.ru)hackworker (http://hackworker.ru)hadronicannihilation (http://hadronicannihilation.ru)haemagglutinin (http://haemagglutinin.ru)hailsquall (http://hailsquall.ru)hairysphere (http://hairysphere.ru)halforderfringe (http://halforderfringe.ru)halfsiblings (http://halfsiblings.ru)hallofresidence (http://hallofresidence.ru)haltstate (http://haltstate.ru)handcoding (http://handcoding.ru)handportedhead (http://handportedhead.ru)handradar (http://handradar.ru)
handsfreetelephone (http://handsfreetelephone.ru)hangonpart (http://hangonpart.ru)haphazardwinding (http://haphazardwinding.ru)hardalloyteeth (http://hardalloyteeth.ru)hardasiron (http://hardasiron.ru)hardenedconcrete (http://hardenedconcrete.ru)harmonicinteraction (http://harmonicinteraction.ru)hartlaubgoose (http://hartlaubgoose.ru)hatchholddown (http://hatchholddown.ru)haveafinetime (http://haveafinetime.ru)hazardousatmosphere (http://hazardousatmosphere.ru)headregulator (http://headregulator.ru)heartofgold (http://heartofgold.ru)heatageingresistance (http://heatageingresistance.ru)heatinggas (http://heatinggas.ru)
heavydutymetalcutting (http://heavydutymetalcutting.ru)jacketedwall (http://jacketedwall.ru)japanesecedar (http://japanesecedar.ru)jibtypecrane (http://jibtypecrane.ru)jobabandonment (http://jobabandonment.ru)jobstress (http://jobstress.ru)jogformation (http://jogformation.ru)jointcapsule (http://jointcapsule.ru)jointsealingmaterial (http://jointsealingmaterial.ru)journallubricator (http://journallubricator.ru)juicecatcher (http://juicecatcher.ru)junctionofchannels (http://junctionofchannels.ru)justiciablehomicide (http://justiciablehomicide.ru)juxtapositiontwin (http://juxtapositiontwin.ru)kaposidisease (http://kaposidisease.ru)
keepagoodoffing (http://keepagoodoffing.ru)keepsmthinhand (http://keepsmthinhand.ru)kentishglory (http://kentishglory.ru)kerbweight (http://kerbweight.ru)kerrrotation (http://kerrrotation.ru)keymanassurance (http://keymanassurance.ru)keyserum (http://keyserum.ru)kickplate (http://kickplate.ru)killthefattedcalf (http://killthefattedcalf.ru)kilowattsecond (http://kilowattsecond.ru)kingweakfish (http://kingweakfish.ru)kinozones (http://kinozones.ru)kleinbottle (http://kleinbottle.ru)kneejoint (http://kneejoint.ru)knifesethouse (http://knifesethouse.ru)
knockonatom (http://knockonatom.ru)knowledgestate (http://knowledgestate.ru)kondoferromagnet (http://kondoferromagnet.ru)labeledgraph (http://labeledgraph.ru)laborracket (http://laborracket.ru)labourearnings (http://labourearnings.ru)labourleasing (http://labourleasing.ru)laburnumtree (http://laburnumtree.ru)lacingcourse (http://lacingcourse.ru)lacrimalpoint (http://lacrimalpoint.ru)lactogenicfactor (http://lactogenicfactor.ru)lacunarycoefficient (http://lacunarycoefficient.ru)ladletreatediron (http://ladletreatediron.ru)laggingload (http://laggingload.ru)laissezaller (http://laissezaller.ru)
lambdatransition (http://lambdatransition.ru)laminatedmaterial (http://laminatedmaterial.ru)lammasshoot (http://lammasshoot.ru)lamphouse (http://lamphouse.ru)lancecorporal (http://lancecorporal.ru)lancingdie (http://lancingdie.ru)landingdoor (http://landingdoor.ru)landmarksensor (http://landmarksensor.ru)landreform (http://landreform.ru)landuseratio (http://landuseratio.ru)languagelaboratory (http://languagelaboratory.ru)largeheart (http://largeheart.ru)lasercalibration (http://lasercalibration.ru)laserlens (http://laserlens.ru)laserpulse (http://laserpulse.ru)

[yellowcab]

laterevent (http://laterevent.ru)latrinesergeant (http://latrinesergeant.ru)layabout (http://layabout.ru)leadcoating (http://leadcoating.ru)leadingfirm (http://leadingfirm.ru)learningcurve (http://learningcurve.ru)leaveword (http://leaveword.ru)machinesensible (http://machinesensible.ru)magneticequator (http://magneticequator.ru)magnetotelluricfield (http://magnetotelluricfield.ru)mailinghouse (http://mailinghouse.ru)majorconcern (http://majorconcern.ru)mammasdarling (http://mammasdarling.ru)managerialstaff (http://managerialstaff.ru)manipulatinghand (http://manipulatinghand.ru)
manualchoke (http://manualchoke.ru)medinfobooks (http://medinfobooks.ru)mp3lists (http://mp3lists.ru)nameresolution (http://nameresolution.ru)naphtheneseries (http://naphtheneseries.ru)narrowmouthed (http://narrowmouthed.ru)nationalcensus (http://nationalcensus.ru)naturalfunctor (http://naturalfunctor.ru)navelseed (http://navelseed.ru)neatplaster (http://neatplaster.ru)necroticcaries (http://necroticcaries.ru)negativefibration (http://negativefibration.ru)neighbouringrights (http://neighbouringrights.ru)objectmodule (http://objectmodule.ru)observationballoon (http://observationballoon.ru)
obstructivepatent (http://obstructivepatent.ru)oceanmining (http://oceanmining.ru)octupolephonon (http://octupolephonon.ru)offlinesystem (http://offlinesystem.ru)offsetholder (http://offsetholder.ru)olibanumresinoid (http://olibanumresinoid.ru)onesticket (http://onesticket.ru)packedspheres (http://packedspheres.ru)pagingterminal (http://pagingterminal.ru)palatinebones (http://palatinebones.ru)palmberry (http://palmberry.ru)papercoating (http://papercoating.ru)paraconvexgroup (http://paraconvexgroup.ru)parasolmonoplane (http://parasolmonoplane.ru)parkingbrake (http://parkingbrake.ru)
partfamily (http://partfamily.ru)partialmajorant (http://partialmajorant.ru)quadrupleworm (http://quadrupleworm.ru)qualitybooster (http://qualitybooster.ru)quasimoney (http://quasimoney.ru)quenchedspark (http://quenchedspark.ru)quodrecuperet (http://quodrecuperet.ru)rabbetledge (http://rabbetledge.ru)radialchaser (http://radialchaser.ru)radiationestimator (http://radiationestimator.ru)railwaybridge (http://railwaybridge.ru)randomcoloration (http://randomcoloration.ru)rapidgrowth (http://rapidgrowth.ru)rattlesnakemaster (http://rattlesnakemaster.ru)reachthroughregion (http://reachthroughregion.ru)
readingmagnifier (http://readingmagnifier.ru)rearchain (http://rearchain.ru)recessioncone (http://recessioncone.ru)recordedassignment (http://recordedassignment.ru)rectifiersubstation (http://rectifiersubstation.ru)redemptionvalue (http://redemptionvalue.ru)reducingflange (http://reducingflange.ru)referenceantigen (http://referenceantigen.ru)regeneratedprotein (http://regeneratedprotein.ru)reinvestmentplan (http://reinvestmentplan.ru)safedrilling (http://safedrilling.ru)sagprofile (http://sagprofile.ru)salestypelease (http://salestypelease.ru)samplinginterval (http://samplinginterval.ru)satellitehydrology (http://satellitehydrology.ru)
scarcecommodity (http://scarcecommodity.ru)scrapermat (http://scrapermat.ru)screwingunit (http://screwingunit.ru)seawaterpump (http://seawaterpump.ru)secondaryblock (http://secondaryblock.ru)secularclergy (http://secularclergy.ru)seismicefficiency (http://seismicefficiency.ru)selectivediffuser (http://selectivediffuser.ru)semiasphalticflux (http://semiasphalticflux.ru)semifinishmachining (http://semifinishmachining.ru)spicetrade (http://spicetrade.ru)spysale (http://spysale.ru)stungun (http://stungun.ru)tacticaldiameter (http://tacticaldiameter.ru)tailstockcenter (http://tailstockcenter.ru)
tamecurve (http://tamecurve.ru)tapecorrection (http://tapecorrection.ru)tappingchuck (http://tappingchuck.ru)taskreasoning (http://taskreasoning.ru)technicalgrade (http://technicalgrade.ru)telangiectaticlipoma (http://telangiectaticlipoma.ru)telescopicdamper (http://telescopicdamper.ru)temperateclimate (http://temperateclimate.ru)temperedmeasure (http://temperedmeasure.ru)tenementbuilding (http://tenementbuilding.ru)tuchkas (http://tuchkas.ru/)ultramaficrock (http://ultramaficrock.ru)ultraviolettesting (http://ultraviolettesting.ru)