Gun control. social engineering?

[oly]

Has anyone ever noticed that there's statistic on gun violence and I don't see any statistics on other violent crimes?

I see alot of social engineering on this subject.

[Rick]

Oly, there are statistics on all violent and non-violent crimes. It's broken down into age, sex, geography, urban vs. rural and a few other ways. The Bureau of Justice Statistics is chartered to keep track of data like that.

http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/

You can also view similar data in the FBI's Uniform Crime Reports.

http://www.fbi.gov/ucr/ucr.htm#cius

This is from the Bureau of Justice Statics and is based on 2005, which is the latest available.

Weapon use
In 2005, 24% of the incidents of violent crime, a weapon was present.

Offenders had or used a weapon in 48% of all robberies, compared with 22% of all aggravated assaults and 7% of all rapes/sexual assaults in 2005.

Homicides are most often committed with guns, especially handguns. In 2005, 55% of homicides were committed with handguns, 16% with other guns, 14% with knives, 5% with blunt objects, and 11% with other weapons.

[2dumb2kwit]

If it makes you feel any better, I think the whole world has gone mad.

A former soldier who handed a discarded shotgun in to police faces at least five years imprisonment for "doing his duty".

Paul Clarke, 27, was found guilty of possessing a firearm at Guildford Crown Court on Tuesday – after finding the gun and handing it personally to police officers on March 20 this year.

http://www.thisissurreytoday.co.uk/n...l/article.html

[Sourdough]

If it makes you feel any better, I think the whole world has gone mad.

This is a good thing. It was a predictable result. If one can stand back far enough to see.

[2dumb2kwit]

It does appear, that there is a glimmer of hope, in the world.

OTTAWA - The national debate over gun control that many Canadians thought had been resolved a decade ago has roared back to life after the House of Commons voted in principle Wednesday to end the long-gun registry.

http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/can...rals_-NDP.html

[Stony]

don't you guys agree to safe handling, storage, and keeping firearms out of the hands of criminals?
if there would be some form of mandatory training , licensing and registration of owner and firearm, maybe the gun crime rate would drop.
a national firearm acquisition permit for anyone wanting to buy, sell or own firearms,
issued after mendatory training by national firearms insructors.
national registration of all handguns by the justice department would curb the illegal sale to gangbangers, dopers and people who should not own any guns.
anyone convicted of a crime with jail time looses his gun permit either of time or for life.

so, before you all fly off your handle and start attcking me, maybe you think about how much safer the whole country would be.

[2dumb2kwit]

The country would be safer, if everyone was armed.

[NCO]

Or no one.

[2dumb2kwit]

Or no one.

Regardless of laws, someone will always be armed.

[NCO]

Wouldn't it then be better to minimize the amount of armed people.

[2dumb2kwit]

Wouldn't it then be better to minimize the amount of armed people.

Not in my opinion. I think that would just create a target rich environment.(For the bad guys)

We have a saying, over here....."If you outlaw guns, then only outlaws will have them."

I have never seen a study, that says that gun control has reduced crime. In fact, here, the cities with the strictest gun control laws, have the highest crime rates.

[Old GI]

You might call it - Victim Creation Program.

Modern history is resplendent with factual accounts of what an armed citizenry can do and what happens when that is not the case. Example, when the state of Florida created the concealed carry program, crime dropped dramatically (has be verified).

[Rick]

don't you guys agree to safe handling, storage, and keeping firearms out of the hands of criminals?
if there would be some form of mandatory training , licensing and registration of owner and firearm, maybe the gun crime rate would drop.
a national firearm acquisition permit for anyone wanting to buy, sell or own firearms,
issued after mendatory training by national firearms insructors.
national registration of all handguns by the justice department would curb the illegal sale to gangbangers, dopers and people who should not own any guns.
anyone convicted of a crime with jail time looses his gun permit either of time or for life.

so, before you all fly off your handle and start attcking me, maybe you think about how much safer the whole country would be.

Indeed. It's worked very well to date with automobiles. Strict licensing, training and registration has dropped the death rate associated with them to ... oh, wait ... no it hasn't. Sorry, my bad.

Forgive me, perhaps I'm wrong, but every weapon has a serial number and each number is recorded (at least in my state) when it's sold. That hasn't stopped the sale of weapons to undesirables and it never will. Those sales are generated through stolen weapons so a registry simply doesn't work.

[BENESSE]

For a start we need to enforce gun laws that are on the books now.
Mandatory background checks, sufficient waiting time for licensing, serious prosecution of unlawful weapons posession.
Obviously, people with a criminal record shouldn't be allowed to own a gun at all and neither should those who have a record of mental instability.

Yeah, criminals will always be able to obtain guns because they are criminals.
And drug addicts will always find a way to get drugs. That's no excuse for getting lax.

Maybe we won't save enough lives to suit some of you but if one of those lives lost belonged to your loved one you'd sing a different tune.

[2dumb2kwit]

For a start we need to enforce gun laws that are on the books now.
Mandatory background checks, sufficient waiting time for licensing, serious prosecution of unlawful weapons posession.
Obviously, people with a criminal record shouldn't be allowed to own a gun at all and neither should those who have a record of mental instability.

Yeah, criminals will always be able to obtain guns because they are criminals.
And drug addicts will always find a way to get drugs. That's no excuse for getting lax.

Maybe we won't save enough lives to suit some of you but if one of those lives lost belonged to your loved one you'd sing a different tune.

We would save a lot more "loved ones" if we would not let true criminals loose on society.

BTW, saving one life is great, but not if the policies used to do it, cost hundreds of lives.

[2dumb2kwit]

Obviously, people with a criminal record shouldn't be allowed to own a gun at all and neither should those who have a record of mental instability.

I'm pretty sure that we all agree with that....but on the other hand, if they are a danger to the public, why are they on the street?

[BENESSE]

We would save a lot more "loved ones" if we would not let true criminals loose on society.

BTW, saving one life is great, but not if the policies used to do it, cost hundreds of lives.

Agree about criminals loose in society. But that's an entirely different issue.

There are many whose first criminal act involved a gun--Columbine killers, John Hinckley, Virginia Tech killer, Mark David Chapman, The Maryland snipers, etc., etc. These people obviously shouldn't have had access to guns in the first place.

As far as your second point, what's your point?

When people call for stricter gun control laws they are not talking about people like Rick, Crash or Sarge. Thy are talking about unpredictable nuts. Can't imagine anyone having a problem with that.

[2dumb2kwit]

Agree about criminals loose in society. But that's an entirely different issue.

There are many whose first criminal act involved a gun--Columbine killers, John Hinckley, Virginia Tech killer, Mark David Chapman, The Maryland snipers, etc., etc. These people obviously shouldn't have had access to guns in the first place.

As far as your second point, what's your point?

When people call for stricter gun control laws they are not talking about people like Rick, Crash or Sarge. Thy are talking about unpredictable nuts. Can't imagine anyone having a problem with that.

How do you know who will, in the future, commit a crime? Imposing more laws, on buying guns, makes it harder for crash, rick, me, etc., to buy a gun. It does not make it any harder for a criminal, to get one. He is already getting it illegally.
If it is harder for me, crash, etc, to get a gun, then you raise the chance of someone not having one, that may have, other wise, been able to save lives.(My second point.) A lot of lives are saved,each year, by lawful gun owners. Why make it harder on them?

I don't know about all your examples, but the columbine killers, stole those guns. The Va. Tech killer, bought those guns legally. (Yeah, he passed the back ground check.)

[NightShade]

don't you guys agree to safe handling, storage, and keeping firearms out of the hands of criminals?
if there would be some form of mandatory training , licensing and registration of owner and firearm, maybe the gun crime rate would drop.
a national firearm acquisition permit for anyone wanting to buy, sell or own firearms,
issued after mendatory training by national firearms insructors.
national registration of all handguns by the justice department would curb the illegal sale to gangbangers, dopers and people who should not own any guns.
anyone convicted of a crime with jail time looses his gun permit either of time or for life.

so, before you all fly off your handle and start attcking me, maybe you think about how much safer the whole country would be.

gangbangers and criminals don't typically buy their guns legally anyways friend... just more hurdles for us law-abiders.... 2dumb is right.. we would be safer if everyone was armed

[Rick]

You're right Benesse. And...you'll find that some had been declared incompetent, which should have precluded them from acquiring guns and some "borrowed" guns from relatives.

There are more than enough laws on the books today to deal with folks that should not receive weapons. In fact, a few too many in my book.