Living off the land - Would you?

[tunick001]

Sort of like Dick Proenneke and "Into The Wild" style. I've always had a fantasy of a going to some remote untrampled place like Idaho or Montana or Alaska and living off the land and escaping from it all. Going up there with plenty of supplies like shelter, clothes, food. Maybe build a log cabin. But eventually the food is going to run out so I'll have to start fishing and hunting. It might be sort of hard to do though once winter starts.

[MMonette]

I like the idea and sometimes i have the same idea only difference is i would want to predominately live off the land and get some stuff from a nearby town cause i can't identify edible plants (ect) for my life.

[DOGMAN]

Well, I live in the mountains of Montana. In a cabin (I didn't build it) with only wood burning heat, I have to run sled dogs to get home in the winter (or to get to my truck to go town) And, I have a couple of freezers full of Elk and Deer that I eat for most meals. I also have chickens and a small garden. However, I don't feel like Dick or McCandless. Unfortunatly, I still have to work to pay my mortgage (its hard to find free property) and to buy all my other supplies. Having to work really keeps you tied to society. Honestly, I don't know if its still really possible to live as Dick did in this modern era. I know a few guys that come close, but it is damn hard. I wish you the best of luck.

[crashdive123]

If you think about it, we all live off the land. It's just that most of us get a little help. But to answer your question - would I?....yes, but I'd have to learn alot more than I know now. I've got no plans to be completely self sufficient living off the land because I kind of like my life now. Learning more and knowing how are always good things.

[klkak]

When I was young after my father died and my step dad left us. My mother, sisters and I Pretty much lived off the land. Wild game made up our protein. Our fruits and vegetable came from the garden and everything else came from the government warehouse in town. Firewood for heating and cooking and quite often in the winter I had to pack water down from the spring when the black plastic pipe that my step dad never got around to burying froze. For me living off the land is like a full time job. Now I live in a house in a small community. I don't feed the fireplace anymore, it takes to much birch and spruce to get me through the winter. I found it was cheaper and less arduous to use natural gas. I guess I'm good right where I'm at. I know I could do it if I had to. However I don't have to.

[DOGMAN]

I know I could do it if I had to. However I don't have to.

Perspective is funny isn't it. "I don't have to" that speaks volumes. I know what you mean, some people fantasize about living "off the land" but when you have to it isn't always so romantic.

I wouldn't change my life much...but, I am thinking about having a second source of heat for my place. Heating with wood is great except when you wake up and everything is frozen, or you just worked a 14 hour day then, it took you almost 2 hours to get home to a frozen house and no kindling.

And, I hate to admit it, but sometimes I get tired of eating elk. But, all in all I am very happy with my life. There are things I can improve, but I wouldn't want to be anywhere else.

[Mountaintrekker]

We just finished a 2 year stint living "semi" off the land. It's pretty darn tough. You can't leave too long in the winter because everything will freeze. In the summer we couldn't leave for too long because people would steal our stuff.
We had to haul water all the time, we collected snow in the winter and melted it on our wood stove. It takes a lot of snow to make 5 gallons of water!
When the wind would blow at 50mph for 3 days and the temp was minus 20 without the wind chill you really start thinking if this was the right move. Just keeping the place warm and you fed is a full time job. I couldn't imagine cutting all our firewood without a chainsaw. I think I would have collapsed or something.
Having the chimney back up with the wind just right and smoke you out of the cabin at those temps at 2am is something I'll never forget. Nor miss!
Using an outhouse in those cold temps is nothing fun either, now throw in a dose of the flu with that and I'll take indoor plumbing any day.
We shot a lot of deer our first winter, 4 if I recall. Doing the butchering etc. without running water is a long and tedious job.
We still had to go to town every 3 months or so for some groceries. You need salt, sugar, flour, soap, some condensed milk, dry oats, veggies, some liquor etc. We even had solar panels to power our laptop (some dvd watching and games), little fridge/freezer and a couple of compact florescent light bulbs. We also had books and crafts and each other and winter was still long and driving us a bit batty. I couldn't imagine what it would have been like alone. BTW we did this without gov't welfare or SS checks or any regular income. I did odd jobs with my tractor in the summer and my sweetie waited tables at a diner 15 miles away for a month or two in the summer as well.
It was tough but we learned quite a bit. I don't think most people exposed to the "modern world" are capable of really living off the land entirely. I think you would end up living a primitive existence and looking like a wild man pretty quick, not to mention a bit of malnutrition.
Doing it is tough, doing it alone is nuts in my book. Why do you think most primitive cultures (many still today) do it in groups? Dick Proenneke still had supplies flown in to him and mail service. While his living out there the way he did is commendable (my hats off to him) he was not entirely living off the land.
You still need to pay property taxes in most places which is a kick in the butt. The feds don't have too much land left that isn't taxed.
You can drastically reduce your yearly expenses down to almost nothing though by supplementing your food and heat, maybe a marketable craft or skill from the wilds. That's kind of what we are going to do in Alaska on our next run at it. We still need that little bit of society for us to make it work. For us anyway. A bit of a social life with like minded folks would be ideal this go around.
I by no means mean to discourage anyone from trying, I say go for it and more power to you! Unfortunately our government doesn't like people going and living for free, and they make it especially tough for anyone trying to be independent of their system. Basically you need some form of revenue generation to pay those taxes and buy staples.
I'm sure folks like Montana_musher and Klkak and others would agree?
Sorry for rambling on.... it's late.

[canid]

in some ways i know i'd do it if it killed me, but i prefer to be partially dependent, if you know what i mean.

[klkak]

I like topics like this. They make you really think about how your life was, is and could be. Depending on the choices you make.

[Alpine_Sapper]

I do live off the land....My apartment is on the third floor.

[Riverrat]

I am living off the land as much as I want to right now. We grow most of our veggies, hunt for our meat, and I love to fish, trout and salmon. We heat our house with wood, have a furnace in the basement, and that keeps it warm for a the day when we are away. For now this is great for us.

[Ole WV Coot]

I grew up at the end of a hollow in Eastern KY. Everyone had big gardens, canned stuff, had the usual domestic animals. I remember before electricity, outhouse, no phone, heated with a coal stove. Almost everyone I knew was in the same boat, didn't know we were suppose to be poor until I grew up and went out on my own. Looking back it was great, we kids lived in the woods, never wore shoes or anything but a pair of shorts all summer and learned lots from folks born back in the late 1800s(grandpa was born in 1895). I would go back if I could. If the body held together I could easily.

[Rick]

It's one thing to look at the pretty pictures and say, "Boy, I think I'll live there." It's something else to do it. I have no illusions. I've posted elsewhere that I could not do it. Having the knowledge to live that lifestyle isn't enough. Having the desire and the health to do it is also a requirement. I think Mountain Trekker was quite eloquent in his description. No, sir. Not me. I love to visit but I don't want to live there. I think those of you that do are a different breed apart and you have my utmost respect. I'm happy right where I am.

[Aurelius95]

Amen, Rick! Couldn't agree more with you. I enjoy dipping into their world, but I like coming back to mine, as well. As Rick stated, "I think those of you that do are a different breed apart and you have my UTMOST RESPECT."

[LadyTrapper]

Would most certainly love to try...however it will be after the kids have grown and are on their own. My choice for this shouldnt be theirs...so I will wait and see how the future fairs us.

If you think of it, our forefathers knew nothing else but to live off the land...mother nature provides all we need to survive, though she may be a harsh land lord most times....we have simply lost the knowledge and heritage...it has been replaced with convenience and "things".

Luckily...or not so luckily(however you may see it)...living off the land is now a lifestyle "choice", not a way of life.

[Rick]

...we have simply lost the knowledge and heritage...

You are so right about that. That's the reason I'm here and that I spend time in the woods. We've replaced our ancient knowledge with new knowledge. I think there is room in our brains for both and I think there is a LOT of ancient knowledge that shouldn't be forgotten. It's served mankind well for millennium.

[DOGMAN]

Unfortunately our government doesn't like people going and living for free, and they make it especially tough for anyone trying to be independent of their system. Basically you need some form of revenue generation to pay those taxes and buy staples.
I'm sure folks like Montana_musher and Klkak and others would agree?
Sorry for rambling on.... it's late.

Your right on the money. I thought about this a lot last night after my initial posts. What could I have done different to lead a more simple life off the land, and not have to earn so much money to keep the dream afloat.

So, it made me remember Thoreau's experiement. Thoreau actually built his cabin on Ralph Waldo Emersons land, and exchanged labor for rent essentially. I think that is the secret...don't "own" your own land. Find a like minded person and exchange labor to build a small cabin on their place, and then help out and do chores at their place- a couple of hours a day would help them greatly and then allow you the rest of the time to meet your own needs. Also, if you could just walk over to work you would not need a vehicle so thats cutting a huge expense there as well. With no mortgage, and no vehicle expenses- life owuld be cheap. Odd jobs of dishwashing, occasional carpentry or the like could pay for your supplies. Simplify!

[Rick]

I think it's a great idea but the down side is you just built your home on someone else's property. If the two of you have a falling out the other person just acquired a small cabin and you are out in the cold.

[trax]

I've done 'living off the land' in varying degrees throughout my life, and I will again. I know that some supplies are going to have to come from town because producing them on my own isn't practical. What are the odds of a successful coffee bean crop in north/central Manitoba? Not much of a farmer at any rate, although I can tweak a few veggies out of the ground.


Providing meat, putting up the house, ensuring clean water supply and garbage and waste water elimination without screwing the environment, firewood for heat, I got all those covered in terms of knowing how I want it, what I want etc. Just got unfinished business in civilization like I've mentioned in other posts.

[Mountaintrekker]

There are ways to get back to a more natural or in touch with the wilderness lifestyle. We still want to do this, (my fiance and I). There are several ways you could approach it, but like everything, there are consequences.

1. You could go off into the wilds with the gear on your back and make a go of it. You would be squatting on gov't, blm or state land and would be ducking and hiding from the feds. You may make it for a bit, but you have that fear of getting caught and booted or arrested hanging over you.

2. You could do as Montana_Musher suggested and find a friend to work out some sort of arrangement with. Hopefully you will be able to generate a few dollars to buy staples with. Just don't piss off your buddy!

3. You could look for land to purchase outright that has no property taxes and make sure all of your resources are within walking distance. You will still need to buy hunting and fishing licenses to be legit. And the more you have, the more money it will take to maintain these items. Vehicles, plumbing, electricity, guns and ammo etc.

4. You could try and buy some land for cash and build a modest cabin. You will need to have some sort of revenue coming in. The key here is to hunt, fish grow a garden, maybe have some chickens or aquaponics to subsist on. You need to generate your own electricity and live very frugally. Indoor plumbing is a Godsend! Cut your own wood for heat and keep the monthly bills to a bare minimum or almost nil.

5. Live in a modern house with your electricity, water, heat, cable, phone,food etc. all provided by someone else and work 40+ hours a week to pay for it all. This isn't a bad thing, it's the norm. It's just not how I choose to live.

We are trying to go with option .4 at the moment. Trying to do it with a part time job is a bit of a pain as it detracts energy from your projects and everything takes longer. Short of winning the lottery or getting a sizable inheritance we have not found another way to do this. If you want to do this, the goal is to not overextend yourself. Have no debt! Only buy what you can afford so you are not required to go to work everyday to pay for things.
The other thing I was thinking about, if you choose options 1-5. Location, location, location! The farther you need to travel for work, food, water etc. the more tied into the system you will be. You will need a means of conveyance to get you there.
I think there is a symbiotic approach to melding ancient ways with our modern lifestyle. There has to be a lot of give and take... obviously. I think it can and should be done by whomever wants to. Our planet will thank us.
We are on this earth for a very short time and I don't want to spend the majority of it working a meaningless job making someone else rich and not seeing or experiencing what is means to be human. This is a wonderful place this earth, go out and experience it. Just respect your fellow man and never take more than you need.

It can be done.