A simple question.

**doug1980** · 03-13-2009, 01:20 PM

Well without getting into politics here I had a question for all of you. We all have seen the way our Country is headed. Some believe it will crumble others believe it will bounce back and many are just plain ignorant to what is going on. No matter what you believe may happen, how many here would do whatever it takes to prevent the worst? We all plan for different scenarios here, and that is great but we also try to avoid bad things from happening. So lets say our great country is on the verge of collapse, would you be willing to fight for it or would you just “Bug In/Bug Out” as you have planned for?

**Rick** · 03-13-2009, 01:25 PM

I guess I don't understand your question. Are you assuming some outside force is attacking? If that's the case then I'd have to say that I have no military training, no combat experience so it would pretty easy for me to say yes. I think I'd step to the forefront. I guess I would see myself as some of the resistance fighters in France, Belgium, Luxembourg or some other European country during WWII. At my age I'm not certain what benefit I would be but I guess I would make a mean cook or company clerk.

**grundle** · 03-13-2009, 01:28 PM

I have been working on this sort of "total prevention" for several years now. Everyone has their own idea of "prepared" so I will just give you mine.

It is a 100% self-contained system. A lot of people like to describe this as "off-grid". Whatever you want to call it, it would be enough land to support a yearly variety crop that not only could be stored, but the excess could be used for commerce.

It would have to be on a parcel of land that has aquifers and water running through it.

A protein crop would also be managed via livestock and other animals. For this to be a reality I imagine it would have to be based on a small community of people and not necessarily one small family trying to do all the work.

I will probably make the initial land purchase early next year.

As for fighting for the country. I see that as a separate issue altogether. Are we talking civil disorder, or a foreign entity invading? I am all for protecting the land I love and I have no problem serving for my country.

**doug1980** · 03-13-2009, 01:31 PM

Originally Posted by Rick

I guess I don't understand your question. Are you assuming some outside force is attacking? If that's the case then I'd have to say that I have no military training, no combat experience so it would pretty easy for me to say yes. I think I'd step to the forefront. I guess I would see myself as some of the resistance fighters in France, Belgium, Luxembourg or some other European country during WWII. At my age I'm not certain what benefit I would be but I guess I would make a mean cook or company clerk.

Well I had to leave it vague to stay in the boundaries of this forum. It could be anything from standing up to threats within our very own country to foriegn invaders. Whatever you as an individual think will happen. As I said everyone has their own view on what may or may not happen. I know what I think will happen, and I would resist in a heartbeat if it came to that. Way before I would decide to tuck tail and run or hide.

**Rick** · 03-13-2009, 01:40 PM

No matter what happens I guess I believe there will be government in place and a standing army. If things were really that bad I'd do whatever they requested me to. My guess is that would be to get the heck out of the way but so be it.

**gryffynklm** · 03-13-2009, 01:51 PM

Originally Posted by doug1980

Well I had to leave it vague to stay in the boundaries of this forum. It could be anything from standing up to threats within our very own country to foriegn invaders. Whatever you as an individual think will happen. As I said everyone has their own view on what may or may not happen. I know what I think will happen, and I would resist in a heartbeat if it came to that. Way before I would decide to tuck tail and run or hide.

This forum is a place to discuss all scenarios. You want us to give an answer to an open ended question. From my perspective how do you plan on resisting an economic collapse, how about another Katrina? Are you asking us to answer in the context of Military take over or civil unrest.

"I know what I think will happen, and I would resist in a heartbeat if it came to that. Way before I would decide to tuck tail and run or hide."

If you want us to answer in the context of what you think will happen you need to give us more info.

I have been resisting Natural disasters and economic collapse all my life. I have and will continue to fight that from happening. I am a bit offended that you are implying that preparing for its possibility is tuck tail.

As far as a physical threat to life and country I will do what I must to protect that.

I'm not military and have little weapon skills.

So what were you talking about?

**doug1980** · 03-13-2009, 02:12 PM

Originally Posted by gryffynklm

This forum is a place to discuss all scenarios. You want us to give an answer to an open ended question. From my perspective how do you plan on resisting an economic collapse, how about another Katrina? Are you asking us to answer in the context of Military take over or civil unrest.

"I know what I think will happen, and I would resist in a heartbeat if it came to that. Way before I would decide to tuck tail and run or hide."

If you want us to answer in the context of what you think will happen you need to give us more info.

I have been resisting Natural disasters and economic collapse all my life. I have and will continue to fight that from happening. I am a bit offended that you are implying that preparing for its possibility is tuck tail.

As far as a physical threat to life and country I will do what I must to protect that.

I'm not military and have little weapon skills.

So what were you talking about?

Well see you just answered the question for your scenario and what you would do. I have no specific scenario that I want answered. And if you were offended than I appologize I prepare as you do. But to me bugging out is retreating, is it not? Whether by choice or not, nothing wrong with that if it keeps you and yours alive. The root of this is would you just bug out at the first sign of trouble. Not natural disasters, but failure in the system, be it the Government, civil unrest, economic collapse.

**gryffynklm** · 03-13-2009, 02:21 PM

I'm good. Just hard to give a quick answer on an open question.

**Sourdough** · 03-13-2009, 02:44 PM

Bernie Madoff is an economic terrorist, and should be sent to Git mo like other terrorist and interrogated to discover who else is involved. It now appears that there are hundreds of these ponzie con-artist who are destroying the country. We need a non-violent revolution to overthrow the economic terrorist, punish them for the destruction of the country, and the money they and corporate leaders have bilked returned to the national treasury. Also incompetent government officials like Hank Paulson should go to jail also...

Thats my story, this country is near economic ruin because of greed and corruption both in and out of government, And our failure to be outraged by these acts is both cowardice, and treasonous by Me, YOU and every AMERICAN.

**doug1980** · 03-13-2009, 02:47 PM

Originally Posted by hopeak

Bernie Madoff is an economic terrorist, and should be sent to Git mo like other terrorist and interrogated to discover who else is involved. It now appears that there are hundreds of these ponzie con-artist who are destroying the country. We need a non-violent revolution to overthrow the economic terrorist, punish them for the destruction of the country, and the money they and corporate leaders have bilked returned to the national treasury. Also incompetent government officials like Hank Paulson should go to jail also...

Thats my story, this country is near economic ruin because of greed and corruption both in and out of government, And our failure to be outraged by these acts is both cowardice, and treasonous by Me, YOU and every AMERICAN.

Well that pretty much sums up my feelings as well. Good post hopeak you hit the nail on the head.

**Sourdough** · 03-13-2009, 02:53 PM

Originally Posted by doug1980

Well that pretty much sums up my feelings as well. Good post hopeak you hit the nail on the head.

It may have crossed the line, about government talk, and it may get deleted, but I am really pissed that we as a nation are not outraged about this.

**doug1980** · 03-13-2009, 02:57 PM

Originally Posted by hopeak

It may have crossed the line, about government talk, and it may get deleted, but I am really pissed that we as a nation are not outraged about this.

I agree 100%. That why I believe planning and being prepared is important but so is some action. I would rather not have to bug out or in, but the way it's going that is a very real threat these days. I would rather stand up and fight for what right than live under such oppression, or on the run.

**last one standing** · 03-13-2009, 03:02 PM

Wow I'm pissed off to Hopeak how many of our blue collar brothers are out of work due to this white collar greed. Peoples heads should roll bring back public shaming and stoning

**Ole WV Coot** · 03-13-2009, 03:57 PM

Well, staying within all lines I'll just say This is one old dog that ain't gonna be whipped in his own backyard.

**crashdive123** · 03-13-2009, 04:11 PM

Originally Posted by Ole WV Coot

Well, staying within all lines I'll just say This is one old dog that ain't gonna be whipped in his own backyard.

Yep - couldn't agree more.

**Pal334** · 03-13-2009, 04:27 PM

Originally Posted by Ole WV Coot

Well, staying within all lines I'll just say This is one old dog that ain't gonna be whipped in his own backyard.

Suffice it to say "they " better bring their lunch buckets" if they want a tussle. I don't look for trouble, but never ran from it either.

**SARKY** · 03-13-2009, 05:51 PM

I took an oath to protect and defend this country against ALL enemies forgien and DOMESTIC! Even though I am retired from the military, I still hold that oath as valid.
As to fighting or cutting and running....a smart tactiction knows when a tactical withdrawal is in order. And if pushed, I have the skills and historical backround to make Rambo look like a piker.

**wildography** · 03-13-2009, 07:02 PM

LOL... some interesting posts; by the way, I agree with you Hopeak... were I President... there'd be a whole lot of corporate leadership receiving BO money that would be cleaning toilets... 'nuff said on that (don't wanna cross the political rule).

The original post/question is very broad; so many what-ifs and variables. However, I often hear people talk about "fighting" against the troops coming to get your guns, etc...

I have way too much respect for our military to try and fight them "straight up"... yes, granted, about 60% of the military are your average "joes", about 20% are about worthless, and about 20% can be "hell on wheels" in any kind of fight... guerilla "warfare", mobility, escape & evasion are really the only ways to "survive" if TSHTF, resulting in TEOTWAWKI, military intervention, and martial law.

But yeah... who'da thunk that our country would end up like it is now? The past few days, everyone is crowing about how the ST. Market is rebounding... hurumph! If I had any money, I'd bet its gonna fall below 6500 before May.

I was at the library today, looking for some "survival type" books; with the library system, here in Colorado Springs, you can see if the books are checked out or if they are available. One thing that I noticed... almost ALL of the survival books are checked out... and some of the more popular one's (like Stroud's) have waiting lists of weeks!. Hmmm... that tells me that people are concerned about the way things are heading...