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  1. #141
    Administrator Rick's Avatar
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    Oh come on, Winter. Folks are evacuated all the time from wild fires. Ask the folks in California. People would sit in their homes and simply burn up with the house because they either don't think the threat is credible or figure it won't happen to them.


  2. #142

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rick View Post
    Oh come on, Winter. Folks are evacuated all the time from wild fires. Ask the folks in California. People would sit in their homes and simply burn up with the house because they either don't think the threat is credible or figure it won't happen to them.
    Some can fight fires and floods themselves with more conviction since it's thier home. As for the ones that can't and chose to stay they should die otherwise by protecting them from themselves the dumb suckers live to breed and become politicians.

  3. #143
    Senior Member Winter's Avatar
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    Rick, that is not the point at all. A free man should be allowed to make that choice.
    I had a compass, but without a map, it's just a cool toy to show you where oceans and ice are.

  4. #144
    Senior Member BENESSE's Avatar
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    I agree. If someone wanted to commit suicide they should have that right.

  5. #145
    Administrator Rick's Avatar
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    Well, you all seem to forget that when push comes to shove they will be yelling for help then some one will have to risk their life to try and save them. Or......some will say where's AS? I haven't seen him and then folks will head up to his place to try and save him. Finally, if that happened and 10 folks died because they stayed behind everyone of you would be yelling that the government failed. They should have MADE those people leave. It's Katrina all over again.

    I don't care how much conviction you have you will not stop a wild fire. Not with the equipment you have at your home.

    It's just a house. Houses can be replaced. People can't. But if ya'll want to stay behind I'll let you. Then you can all be just like old Harry Truman when Mt. St. Helens burped.

  6. #146
    Senior Member BENESSE's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rick View Post
    But if ya'll want to stay behind I'll let you. Then you can all be just like old Harry Truman when Mt. St. Helens burped.
    I definitely wouldn't stay behind and consider it foolhardy. But if someone's crazy enough to do it, it's their choice. And btw, if they did it against advice to evacuate, then they ought suffer the consequences. No resources wasted on them at the last moment, human or otherwise. People should have a right to be stupid if it doesn't affect anyone else but them, and them alone. (their children, a different story left for another debate)

  7. #147
    Super Moderator crashdive123's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BENESSE View Post
    I definitely wouldn't stay behind and consider it foolhardy. But if someone's crazy enough to do it, it's their choice. And btw, if they did it against advice to evacuate, then they ought suffer the consequences. No resources wasted on them at the last moment, human or otherwise. People should have a right to be stupid if it doesn't affect anyone else but them, and them alone. (their children, a different story left for another debate)
    You and I agree on that.
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  8. #148
    Super Moderator crashdive123's Avatar
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    I do not remember where it happened (Florida, Texas, or elsewhere?) but during a mandatory evacuation due to an approaching Cat 4 hurricane, police where going door to door to make sure residents knew about the evacuation and to see if they needed assistance. If they needed help, they received it. They did not force people to leave their homes. What they did do however was have those that said they were staying sign a form saying that they understood that help would not be on the way. They also had them fill out a next of kin notification card. Some stayed, but the card did the trick in convincing most to leave.
    Can't Means Won't

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  9. #149
    Senior Member BENESSE's Avatar
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    That was more than reasonable, C.

  10. #150

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    So much to learn and a short amont of time to do it in. Glad I found this place.

  11. #151
    Super Moderator crashdive123's Avatar
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    Glad you found this place too. Let me help you find the Introduction section. http://www.wilderness-survival.net/f...-Introductions
    Can't Means Won't

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  12. #152
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    In my situation, most scenarios would result in B/I. There would be no valid reason for mandatory evacuations other than as an exercise in social disruption and so I would have to avoid said Representatives and fail to comply. I do however keep 72 hour bags for all, and have a cache at a midpoint to a B/O locaton. But the realities of trying to move a group of civilians hundreds of miles through potentially hostile territory does not appeal to me in the least and is a last resort option.

    The very discussion on this topic highlights the difficulties in group dynamics that would arise in these situations, and this among a group of people who are largely more mature and experienced. We all know that the longer a situation lasts, the more important a group wll become to long term viability, even if that group is just a few neighbors who help look after each others interests. I believe that is why it is so important to get to know your neighbors, local crafters, mechanics, tradesmen etc. before any situation ever occurs. The knowledge of whom to avoid, and with whom you may find common cause could well be more far valuable than an extra 1,000 rnds of 7.62.

    One thing that bothers me about these discussions is how quickly some seem ready to strip individuals of their God given Rights for the 'good of the group'. Just because I join a group does not mean all that I possess becomes communal property! It gives no leader the right to seize my knife be it $100 or $1! It does mean that I will apply my labors and resources to the success of the group for that becomes my success, it does mean that I will follow the leadership of the group so long as it is just and competent leadership. If I found the group to not be of that type I would leave, and what I brought would leave with me, and if the group prevented that there would likely be blood. (probably mostly mine for that is how these things go)

    So choose wisely with whom you become associated!

  13. #153
    Senior Member Thaddius Bickerton's Avatar
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    So long as that "rules upheld with force" includes the option of taking my stuff and leaving if I don't agree.

    I do not belong to anyone, will not live my life for the sake of another against my will nor will I ask another to live their life for mine.

    If a group is already deterorating into a dictatorship, then no thank you , not the place I want to live.

    Any group not based on the concept of ownership of ones own life, property and the fruit of ones labors is not for me.

    The only moral way for individuals to interact is by mutual agreement to mutual benefit without the use of fear force or fraud.

    In other words I I have a knife someone else wants to use, then borrow, rent, or buy it, but no you will only take it by killing me which is evil.

    Group property is communism, and certainly not for me or any free man.

  14. #154

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    If you want security you will have to give up rights unless you want to protect yourself on your own, then there is no need for that in a group

  15. #155
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    Quote Originally Posted by FVR View Post
    This kind of gives all the impression of one's self.

    Here goes.

    I have always been the loner, don't depend on anyone. That way, you don't get let down. I can function very well in a team, if the team members all have the same common goal, and they take is seriously.

    I am an alpha male.

    Like wareagle, people give me a wide berth as I am not a friendly looking guy. Well, I'm just not friendly. No tats just the 100 yard stare.

    I am known as the guy that gets the job done. So, that is what I would do. You need a ditch, I'll get it made, you need wood, done. You stand over me and try to give me orders with your hands in your pocket, we gonna have a little talk.

    I don't play the little horseplay games that some young men play. If I'm going to use my strength, it's serious.

    I am also a warrior as volwest and wareagle are. No better, no worse.

    If ryaninmaine shows up with his 5 brothers and 5 brothers in law, I will be packing my bags. Too many family members, ya piss one off and the whole clan comes looking for you. Tensions are going to be high and control is paramount.

    So, if you wanted me in the group, I'd come in. If you did not, I'd go on my way down the trail.
    Very well said FVR. We would likely get along just fine. I am not afraid of work in any way shape or form. People generally don't mess with me either.

  16. #156

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    I've done law and security when I was in the Army, I've worked as a tracker, and use to split firewood with mauls, wedges and torpedoes. I've done a lot of cooking for myself, another words I guess I qualify as a pain in the back britches pocket. I have even taken care of horses and calves. I miss those days.

  17. #157

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    I"ve had many scores of people sat that they want to hook up with me. I always reply" I understand that, now explain why I should want to hook up with you?". :-) Very few have any sort of answer, much less one that interests me in them.

  18. #158
    Woodsman Adventure Wolf's Avatar
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    Good link, good post. Thanks for sharing.

  19. #159
    Super-duper Moderator Sarge47's Avatar
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    Cool Bump!

    So here's the skinny; I just posted a new blog on bugging out and referenced the 1st post on this thread that WE posted way back in 2007. Click on the link....
    SARGE
    "Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe."
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    Proud father of a US Marine....SEMPER FI!

    They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.
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  20. #160

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    Great resource. Thanks again
    Outdoor survivalist, cook, and fur hat wearer
    Also a lightweight camping fanatic and hammock nerd

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