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Thread: .410 in a 45-70

  1. #1

    Default .410 in a 45-70

    I seen on utube a guy shot a few 2.5 .410 shells through his 45-70 the only problem was the brass swelled could there be way to stop that because if you stop the swelling brass then a guy could get more use out of the rifle

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  2. #2

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    Kinda an odd first post.

  3. #3
    Senior Member kyratshooter's Avatar
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    Is a strange first post.

    At least it is only asking about something that is stupid rather than illegal.

    Yes after 35 years of teaching I am going to admit it, teachers lie to prevent hurting their students little feelings, there are stupid questions.

    To answer the question;

    There is no way to stop the swelling of the .410 shell in the 45-70 chamber. The rifle chamber is what it is and was not intended as a shotgun platform for the .410.

    Secondly, the .410 shell is normally not made of brass, it is made of plastic or paper with a brass or steel head and rim section. Shotgun shells, although reloadable, are usually considered disposable items so their slight swelling is not even relevant to their use in an emergency situation in a firearm not intended for their use.

    Third, the proper rifle for use of .410 shells is the 44-40. The .410 was invented as a small game shot load for that particular gun, which is why it is designated by caliber rather than by gauge. They usually swell in the 44-40 too.

    And lastly, if you want to shoot .410 shells on a regular basis get a .410. Most 45-70 rifles are fairly expensive. If you can afford a 45-70 you can afford a flea market $50 .410.

    I do not own a 45-70 but there are others here that do. Just looking at the empty case I would suspect that you could duplicate a .410 1/2oz shot load using the 45-70 brass and some wads. There's plenty of room.

    And as is always noted, the pattern will be bad due to the shot swirling as it goes through the rifling. It is not usually as bad as folks would have you think and most people just repeat the myth without testing it. It is still a close range proposition due to the lack of choke and the small shot load of the .410. I would say 40-50 FEET (not yards) max.
    Last edited by kyratshooter; 10-31-2016 at 11:00 AM.
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  4. #4

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    I learned to hunt small game with a .410 Stevens that was just about as much as I could lift. It's still in my closet, oiled and cared for but for a broken stock. I just hate paying ridiculous prices for the shells or I would be taking it out for squirrels. Not in big game territory so other than my Casul .454 for Alaska my guns are more on the milder calibers.

    ...sure would like to bang some gongs way out there sometime.

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    Rat abatement, Snake away, and Critter Ridder: http://www.taurususa.com/gun-selecto...%20colt&page=1

  6. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by M118LR View Post
    Rat abatement, Snake away, and Critter Ridder: http://www.taurususa.com/gun-selecto...%20colt&page=1
    Didn't grab me or a lot of other people.

  7. #7
    Senior Member kyratshooter's Avatar
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    Got to agree with you Max.

    Taurus took the worst features of a revolver and combined them with the worst features of a shotgun. Most of the reports I hear are that the shotshell is useless and the .45lc accuracy is horrible.

    All that could be done with a snake load from the daily carry pistol.
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    Senior Member hunter63's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by M118LR View Post
    Rat abatement, Snake away, and Critter Ridder: http://www.taurususa.com/gun-selecto...%20colt&page=1
    I'm gonna assume you are referring to a version of a Judge?....page is just a master listing.
    That shoots a .45 lc. not .45/70 and .410 that was the OP's question.

    Circuit Judge (carbine has this set up as well.... that tube helps the pattern out to 25 yard a lot....but again you can't really load 2-.410's a 3 .45 lc with the tube in it....unless you want to give up a pattern
    But not a cool as everyone thinks...one of those, "Seemed to be a good idea at the time"...that no one will admit they made a mistake ...LOL

    H&R/NEF Handi Rifle or Survivor some have a .410/,45 Lc barrel ...is rifled an has a shot straitening screw in tube(looks like a choke)...but can't (shouldn't) shoot the .45 lc thru it.....so if the OP wants to shoot .410's in a .45/70 Handi rifle...buy the .410/.45 barrel....they are still out there, but kinda pricey.
    If its a lever gun ....if the base swells may cause problems ejecting or possible damage.

    BTW I would not try a .410 in a 45/70 either.

    BTW-2....What is up with the whining about the price 45/70 or .410 shells?

    How many are you gonna shoot?
    Not many will WANT to shoot too .45/70 unless you are sighting in...or hunting.....not many use them for shooting beer cans or stop signs...and the ones that do ...eith can afford it or re-load.

    Same with .410,.....whine about the price of something you are gonna shoot BYB, squirrels. coons garden pests and maybe take bird hunting....
    Not like shoot a few 25 rounds or 100 round of trap or sheet?
    Rant over.....

    Then do it on a $500 buck phone......?????
    Last edited by hunter63; 10-31-2016 at 01:12 PM.
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  9. #9

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    The Judge IMHO is a ridiculously cumbersome heavy POC. I can kill a poisonous snake with a stick and save hundreds of dollars. As far as personal defense... if I empty a 6 shot .22 revolver into your stomach, you are going to hurt. Thanks Phil for confirming combat experience, a piece of concrete in your gut will double you over. Confirmed. Does my wife need a .44 mag carry? nope.

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    Just tossing the concept out there. If you really wanted a 45/410 the old O/U shotgun rifle combo's make more sense. Seems as if there are allot of Taurus Revolver models for such a failed product, while the number of usable O/U shotgun rifle combos gets smaller.

  11. #11

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    Because there are a lot of ignorant gun buyers.

  12. #12

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    Where's the OP?

  13. #13
    Senior Member hunter63's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by madmax View Post
    Because there are a lot of ignorant gun buyers.
    Quote Originally Posted by madmax View Post
    Where's the OP?
    Long gone..... drive by no doubt....But I do hope no one will try a .410 in a .45/70.
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  14. #14

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    Delete this post cause Crash might get mad at me.
    Last edited by madmax; 10-31-2016 at 01:49 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by madmax View Post
    Delete this post cause Crash might get mad at me.
    You do realize that I can read deleted posts right? No it wasn't me. Mad? Nah......sleep lightly at KICCO though.
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  16. #16

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    Crap. You're a sneaky #######. Who moderates you?

    You show up armed with your wife armed too. Jeez. I guess I won't moon you two at a remote camp.

    And I thought I worried about Danny and Mike...
    Last edited by madmax; 10-31-2016 at 04:44 PM.

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    Senior Member randyt's Avatar
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    In years past folks would shoot .410 in 45-70 trapdoor springfields, usually the extractor broke. Probably hard extraction due to a swelled shell. Sometimes they would even file a V-notch into the top of the receiver and then pull off the rear sights. I have a action modified as such. It seems like it would be a easy endeavour to load 45-70 with shot and forego shooting a .410 in a 45-70 chambered rifle.
    so the definition of a criminal is someone who breaks the law and you want me to believe that somehow more laws make less criminals?

  18. #18

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    I just don't want Crash's wife chasing me around the campground shooting me with any caliber.

    Ya know I'm kidding lady.

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    Hunter63......can you clarify your post regarding the nef survivor rifle. I have one and i'm 99% sure the barrel is marked 45 colt and 410.......why should I not fire rounds 45 colt thru it?

  20. #20
    Senior Member hunter63's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shiftyer1 View Post
    Hunter63......can you clarify your post regarding the nef survivor rifle. I have one and i'm 99% sure the barrel is marked 45 colt and 410.......why should I not fire rounds 45 colt thru it?
    You are correct...talking about shooting a .45 bullet barrel that rifled... without that tube installed.

    BUT if it has the "screw in shot straightening tube...looks like screw-in a choke...used for shoot .410 shot shells.....the groves are straight not rifled...and may restrict the bore...Or so says the manual...
    I'll see if I can find it.

    Rossi recommends the same....in the Circuit Judge Carbine.....Same tube...
    Excerpt from the Rossi Manual
    http://www.rossiusa.com/manuals.cfm
    Quote>
    .CAUTION Do not use the STRAIGHT RIFLED CHOKE, when shooting .45LC or .410 solid slugs. Remove the straight rifled choke and install the “THREAD PROTECTOR SLEEVE” .

    Now some of those H&R had the straight grooved tube as well.....Mine does.
    Pattern is much better with that tube installed.

    Then again some of .410/.45 lc. had smooth choke or no tube at all.....I am told....
    Does your have the screw in tube?
    Last edited by hunter63; 10-31-2016 at 11:26 PM.
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