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Thread: Cast bullets....failure

  1. #1
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    Default Cast bullets....failure

    Test fired some 300 Blackout rounds that I reloaded with hand cast lead bullets. Most of them chambered ok but the accuracy was terrible. Only one or two bullets hit the paper target at 75 yards. Even more disturbing was every round blew out the primers when fired. I was hand loading a couple of cast bullet rounds without the magazine in the gun only to have a discarded primers drop into my hand. I checked the other casings and none of them still had the primers in them.

    The pulled 308 tracer bullets I bought a couple of weeks ago fired just fine. I very carefully indicated these bullets in my lathe and turned down the bullet shanks. Before, the bullet shanks were out of round and tapered so when loaded into the brass the neck was oversized and would not enter the firing chamber. I turned down the bullet shanks to .3070. These bullets cost me $39 for 250 bullets. However, it takes me just over one minute to indicate the bullets in my lathe and turn them down. These bullets fire fairly accurately and the primers remain in the casing after fired.
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    Last edited by jim Glass; 08-27-2016 at 09:58 AM.


  2. #2
    Senior Member aflineman's Avatar
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    Check your seating depth. Does not take much with the BO to overpressure. What powder ya using?
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  3. #3
    Senior Member kyratshooter's Avatar
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    I have never used cast lead through any of my gas operated rifles. I always worried about leading up the gas system.

    Many rifles want a gas check on the bullet base for best accuracy. I can not get any accuracy out of my .223 cast lead reloads without gas checks.

    I have to agree with AFL. I have never seen blown primers unless the primer pockets were over sized, there was extreme pressure. or excessive headspace.

    There can be other causes for popped primers. It sometimes happens with machine guns when they fire before lockup and is the reason military ammo primers are crimped in place.

    I have also had primer setback when firing squib loads of wax bullets, but those were used in revolvers and did not pop out, they just locked up the cylinder.

    Is you load on the low side of the chart?

    In fact, where did you get cast bullet data for .300BO? Is it in the books yet?
    Last edited by kyratshooter; 08-28-2016 at 02:23 AM.
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  4. #4
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    I was using 24 grains of H110 and the primers were fully seated. However, I did feel the primers inserted a little easier into the Blackout casing than the 223 casings. The 24 grains of H110 is the load I used for my 148 grain bullets so I used the same on the cast bullets although they are around 200 grain. Near as I can tell every round loaded with cast bullet released the primers. The other loads with 148 grain metal jacket, did not blow out the primers.

    I purchased the Lyman reloading book but did not see a data listing for the Blackout. I also looked for a drawing for a gas check for the 300 blackout so I could make some of my own but never found any exact dimensions for the blackout. I'm wondering if the cast bullets came apart before reaching the paper target.

    At this point it appears casting bullets is more trouble that it is worth. But I think should try using gas checks and a different powder load.

    Well, I have plenty of the tracer rounds that work well after turning down the bullet shanks.
    Last edited by jim Glass; 08-28-2016 at 09:50 AM.

  5. #5
    Senior Member aflineman's Avatar
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    24 grain is pretty hot for H110. IIRC 20 grain is max for the 125gr ballistic tips I mainly load. My SBR seems to like 18.7 grain with the 125s. Most of my .300blk loading data has came from the Handloader's magazine and/or powder manufacturers website(s).
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  6. #6
    Senior Member kyratshooter's Avatar
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    Jim, I see 18 grains of H110 with a 125 gn bullet as absolute max on the Hodgin website.

    By that load data you are a full 1/3 over max with just the 125 gn bullet and your pressures on a 200gn lead bullet would be off the charts!

    You really need to go by the recommendations and not just stick some amount of whatever you have and the nearest bullet you see into the case.

    Buy some proper .300BO bullets and stick to the recommended loads for each individual weight. Data for a 100gn bullet is not safe for a 125 gn bullet and 150gn bullet data is not correct or safe for a 200gn bullet.

    Hodgin do not even have a 200gn load for H110.

    Be assured that you have fully proof tested your .300 upper.
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  7. #7
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    OK, I stand corrected. The last 300 Blackout I reloaded was 148 grain and I used 15 grains of H110 powder not 25. However, the cast bullet was 220 grain and I assumed a heavier bullet would require more powder not less so I figured 15 grains would be safe. Lesson learned.

    I did find some load data for the 300 Blackout and they recomend 9.9 grains of H110 for a 220 grain bullet so I used 50% more powder than recomended. The next question is there a difference between a jacketed bullet and cast bullet of the same weight when it comes to powder amounts?

    http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j2...dgdonData.gifI.

    Sorry about the confusion, my fault. More to reloading than I ever thought. You folks are the only support I have, thanks.
    Last edited by jim Glass; 08-28-2016 at 07:26 PM.

  8. #8
    Senior Member kyratshooter's Avatar
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    There are differences in the load data for cast and jacketed slugs.

    Lead is "slicker" and will give higher velocities and lower pressures with the same amount of powder. Jacketed bullets create more friction going down the bore and give higher pressures.

    The Lyman books are real good for showing this because they give lots of data for lead and jacketed bullets of the same weight. But the Lyman books I have give no data for the .300BO.

    Another problem is that an unprotected lead bullet base will melt due to the powder discharge, then the mist of melted powder will turn solid in the bore filling the lands with lead and providing the "leading" that everyone fears. This melting of the base also creates accuracy problems due to making the slugs inconsistent.

    The "gas check" is a little cap of copper or aluminum that covers the base of the bullet and stops that problem.

    In pistols and most rifles if one keeps the velocity down to 1000fps there is usually not a real leading problem during the average shooting session.

    For velocities above 1000fps the melted lead can clog up a bore within a dozen shots and really mess up a .357 or .44mag, or a rifle bore. Gas checks are about the only way one can use the full potential of high velocity lead pistol bullets.

    There are some folks that shoot big bore rifles using lead bullets at 1500-2000fps but they size them perfectly and lube them well. Some even use paper patches around the slug.
    Last edited by kyratshooter; 08-28-2016 at 08:10 PM.
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