How much would a m91/30 or a M44 cost in today's market?
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Mil-surp fire arms
How much would a m91/30 or a M44 cost in today's market?
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Originally Posted by g.murch
That's rather a loaded question since it's dependent upon the quality of the specific version that one intends to purchase. Not all Mosin-Nagants are created equal and it's well worth the time to look around and see if you can find (for example) one of the ones manufactured by Sako ( for one). In addition you'll need to slug the barrel prior to firing and find out exactly what you've got , I've seen 'em slug all the way from .308 to .317.
It's pretty easy to end up with one that's essentially a piece of junk whilst putting out Mauser type money. A case of Caveat Emptor nowadays with Mosins.
google is your friend
http://www.gunbroker.com/All/BI.aspx...agant+m91%2F30
I've taken a vow of poverty. To annoy me, send money.
http://www.youtube.com/user/FinallyMe78?feature=mhee
Something else you may wish to consider , it's pretty easy to purchase a usable bolt action already equipped with decent glass from Savage and others nowadays , and you'll be close to the same financial outlay perhaps LESS than you would with a Mosin and having to glass it. And you'll have a better rifle and a wider choice in calibers.
The days of the Mosin being an extreme " deal " are over.
Last show I attended in November...91/30 were in the $180 range....M44 and m38 more, Sako rebuilds double that.
And you had to look them over.
I guess I never really got a definitive answer on slugging.....sized all over the map...bore/grooves/1/4 turn away...etc.
Besides no one is gonna let you slug them anyway.....that I know of...in a store, interweb, show....private guy maybe...but gonna be more money.
Then there is ammo....still milsurp around in the .311 range....reloading is tough unless you have newer boxer primed brass.
So you buy a spam can of available ammo du jour....and bang away.
Good luck.....and be aware they are like coat hangers....buy one, play with it for a while....put it in the safe....come back in 6 months and there are 2 more in there.
Pretty cool for a 100 year old rifle, that was hacked out of a railroad rail with an axe....smoothed down on a rock, by the Babushka's on the home front.
Geezer Squad....Charter Member #1
Evoking the 50 year old rule...
First 50 years...worried about the small stuff...second 50 years....Not so much
Member Wahoo Killer knives club....#27
EEeeeegggggggzackly. If an individual wants to insist on going the bolt action mil-surp route they'd be a lot better off exploring the available Mausers , Enfields and Schmidt-Rubins. And insofar as it goes , what with the availability of the Savage , Remington and other "package rifles" well below the 500-600 dollar mark the mil-surps aren't anywhere near the deal they once were.
As far as ammunition , well 7.62 x 54r is all over the place quality and ballistics wise , you'd still need to handload to get the most out of it and that will cost you just as much as other chamberings that are ballistically in the same ballpark i.e. .308 win ( 7.62 x 51) , .30-06 , 7mm rem mag , .270 win , the old .300 savage etc.etc.
And frankly you really can't build diddly squat off the Mosin action , whereas certain Mauser actions and the Enfield make quite a nice basis for building a decent sporting rifle if you wish to do so. I've got a Mauser '98 based custom in .35 Whelen that's one hell of a "keeper" and that shoots on par with anything else in my gunsafes.
Folks need to learn that at times money saved on the front end is false economy that costs you one hell of a lot more cash outlay on the backend. Lots of folks do that with ARs too , by a cheap AR and then end up spending enough money to make it run right to have put them into a Noveske , LMT , Larue etc that would have run right straight out of the box.
The other thing I see constantly is folks cheaping out on the glass they select , a superlative rifle can be ruined with junk glass , the glass makes the rifle not vice versa.
Nice to know some one is living in the lap of luxury and able to pay top dollar for every need!
You buy what you can afford. You put the glass on it you can afford. You shoot the ammo you can afford. Smart is getting the most for your money, not spending as much as you can.
Most of the old Mauser rifles are selling for way past their actual value at this point. And the popularity of "sporterized" and "custom" Mausers has long disappeared. I priced some gunsmith done machine work I could not do myself about a year ago and found that I could buy any rifle I wanted for the price of turning the steps out of a Mauser barrel and rebluing the action. I could have purchased the lathe he was using for the amount of that quote.
I bought my MN rifles when they were $65 each in arsenal refurb condition. Ammo was $0.18 per round in spam cans and I found that the Warsaw Pac specs were just as good as the NATO specs with all the ammo I have ever purchased shooting to the same POI and grouping into about 2"@100.
The rifles have increased in price ($150-$350) due to the Russian embargo and ammo is now $150 per spam can if you can find it.
Are the entry level commercial rifles selling for slightly more than the MN better?
They might be but we will need to wait and watch for about 100 years to see if they hold up as well as the MN even without going through two world wars.
I have several of those entry level rifles and I find they shoot reasonably well, even with their cheap glass.
I also have one MN I bought and scoped for less than $150 that shoots as well as any of the entry level commercial rifles using factory ammo.
Last edited by kyratshooter; 12-15-2015 at 02:26 PM.
If you didn't bring jerky what did I just eat?
Yeah, fjrmurch broke the stock off his rifle when he hit a tree with it. My Mosins were dragged from Moscow to Berlin, run over by two tanks and Lord knows how many times it's owner pee'd down the barrel. They still shoot pretty good.
I have one of those budget rifles. $300 for a Remington 710 in 30-06. When I got it, I was lucky to have that much. Later I put a $70 scope on it, even though it came with one. All I can say is that it shoots decent enough but it costs me $1 every time I pull the trigger. I don't shoot it much. My brother and BIL both got a Remington 700 SPS. Both shoot much better than my 710 with me shooting them.
I don't regret buying the 710 for one minute. It has taught me a lot, and now I know what I want in my next one.
I've taken a vow of poverty. To annoy me, send money.
http://www.youtube.com/user/FinallyMe78?feature=mhee
....and the ammo used dug up out of a beet field buried in 1946......
Geezer Squad....Charter Member #1
Evoking the 50 year old rule...
First 50 years...worried about the small stuff...second 50 years....Not so much
Member Wahoo Killer knives club....#27
If you are looking for a cheap mosin, don't over look the Chinese type 58. It is the same thing as the m44 and can be easily had for under $120. I picked up the last one for $85. They look rougher, don't have as nice bores, and require a lot more up front cleaning, but I can't tell a difference in the accuracy or quality compared to the others that I own. That includes Russian 91/30 and m44 as will as a Finnish. a friend of mine also has a sako refurb and I can't tell a difference in accuracy or quality. Looking for cheap and have a $100, then go Chinese type 58.
As far as commercial budget rifles, I have stayed away from those. I have found that you can get a better quality used rifle. Ask Kyrat about my $320 Remington 700. I'll take that any day over the budget stuff.
”There's nothing glorious in dying. Anyone can do it.” ~Johnny Rotten
Nice to know that because I differ in opinion on a much over-rated rifle you'll wax snotty and sarcastic. Real fine way to promote an actual discussion.
Despite your *****umption , I hardly live in the " lap of luxury". What I *do* for part of my living however is work on other folks firearms. And frankly folks who build a sporter out of *ANY* mil-surp and expect to see their money back are barking up the wrong tree , that's again *ANY* mil-surp. You do such a conversion because you like the specific action or the specific rifle. As far as most of todays " entry level bolters" shooting better than the vast majority of Mosins , damned straight they do , and they'll perform better on game with modern over the counter ammunition than a Mosin does with spam can junk , never mind actual handloads researched and developed for the specific rifle.
And that " popularity of Mausers" line of yours , really? I guess you'd be reticent to discuss the modern actions that are basically copies of the Mauser then 'eh? And that crap about " going through two world wars" , I guess we all better run along back to .45-70 ( and yes I've got a couple) since it's " stood the test of time".
And I must have hit a nerve with the comment on glass , you however completely missed the point , so here it is for you again , it's quite analogous to the old Bell Helmets advertisement " do you have a ten dollar head?.......then wear a ten dollar helmet."........
In closing , I t'ain't particularly impressed with your " I bought 'em so long ago I paid $65 FOR 'EM." line , I once bought a whole case of Mosins for 34.95$ apiece , that might give you some clue as to my age and why I am just a tad bit underwhelmed by your " I REALLY told YOU." attitude.
If you want an *actual* viable discussion then try modifying your approach and attitude , if you can't exercise the same sort of civility you'd like to be approached with then I have no use for you and will just ignore you until you finally piss me off enough for the Texas/Cajun to come on out. I ya are agonna treat people with that Yankee attitude then folks are pretty bound to treat YOU as if you're a Yankee..........plain enough for ya?
Have a good day there Bud.
Last edited by RoninAmok; 12-15-2015 at 07:28 PM.
Oh!
You mean if I agree with you we can talk?
And I can not say anything that you might twist and cut and paste into something that was not the intent of what I said.
If you can not stand anyone having even the slightest difference in opinion with you then you are definitely in the wrong place.
You have 11 posts and are already picking a fight for dominance so no one will question anything you say for fear of being flamed? Where have we seen that recently? Are you into kayaking by any chance?
Last edited by kyratshooter; 12-15-2015 at 08:39 PM.
If you didn't bring jerky what did I just eat?
Pretty good show...... Hey Crash, got the number for that bookie handy? I think I want to put $150 down on this. It'll buy me another worthless Mosin that shoots fantastically!
”There's nothing glorious in dying. Anyone can do it.” ~Johnny Rotten
Hummmm IP address is...?
Geezer Squad....Charter Member #1
Evoking the 50 year old rule...
First 50 years...worried about the small stuff...second 50 years....Not so much
Member Wahoo Killer knives club....#27
Let it go fellas. It's almost Christmas and not worth it.
Very good.
For the OP, a typical Russian 91/30 will run you about 150 to 200 out the door whereas a m44 will cost about 250 - 300.
There are other Mosins, some will cost less but most will cost more.
As for modifying a Mosin, you will not get the return on investment. However, the Mosin is a good firearm to tinker with since they are simple, parts are cheap, and you aren't devaluing anything. The Mosin was designed to be worked on in the field by under skilled riflemen with only the little tool, the bayonet, and a bullet to use to conduct repairs. The Mosin is heavy, but saying it is rugged and durable is a big understatement. For less than $200 you can have a gun which even a below average shooter can hit targets out to 200 yds and will take down any living thing on this continet. Can't go wrong in my book.
Heck..... i might go buy #6 now.....
”There's nothing glorious in dying. Anyone can do it.” ~Johnny Rotten
@ RoninAmok - Just so you know, Kyrat probably has an equal if not more "gun" time than you and has earned the respect of most of the members on this board. The amount of knowledge I've gleaned from him is both priceless and appreciated. He freely offers suggestions to better the shooter and/or the weapon and it's based on "hands on" time; in the shop and in the field.
At 11 posts you haven't spent the time to know the members or their personalities. Much harder in a two dimensional media than in person. You mistook his post for something that it wasn't and took offense when none was offered.
Is that what I said? Don't run your red herring crap on me , as for " picking a fight" , far from it. I'm just rather disinclined to put up with rude Yankee bull***t , you have no manners and evidently don't much care for getting back what you hand out.
And what does " number of posts" have to do with anything , that seems to indicate that your opinion is that folks without a requisite number of posts aren't allowed to disagree with your opinion. Who was that who was attempting dominance again?
Folks aren't *required* to agree with you , get used to it.
Nope I didn't take his post for something it wasn't , and at 70 years old I'm sorta disinclined to take rudeness laying down. He may or may not have a much time as regards firearms as I do , he may have knowledge to impart. But the fact remains that his social skills are more than a bit lacking , along with the corollary that he attempted to piss on the wrong leg.
He fully intended to be castigatory and rude , he fully intended to attempt to put words in my mouth that I didn't say. And frankly if he wishes to ignore the realities of the Mosin platform that's fine , if wishes to use me a whipping post for his FanBoi crap it's not. I din't even remotely put the platform down , I cited the realities and he jumped bad before we could even get to the negatives versus the positives of the specific platform.
In addition to THAT , there's his implied bull****. I've had no conversation as regards " kayaks" so that attempt to tar me with some sort of dirty brush is just a chicken**** tactic.
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