"Alone."

[Rick]

And that doesn't include the times his boss used it to build a fire under him. Just sayin'.

[NightSG]

The regulation against water filters & purification tablets was a bonehead decision, IMO, as this caused at least one of the group intestinal distress.

I don't think I would have given a large supply, but IMO, 10-20 liters worth of sterilant (iodine, potassium permanganate, chlorine, whatever) among the "freebie" items would probably be a good idea to give them time to settle in, or get reestablished if their fire is swamped out for whatever reason.

Alan was my pick to win, however Sam surprised me. I thought he'd be one of the 1st few out. I wonder how he felt when he found out he missed it by only one spot away?...

Hopefully after the details came out, he realized that Alan was settled in for the long haul and would easily have stayed well past the birth of Sam's son. Half a million is a lot of money, but the birth of your first child is priceless.

[NightSG]

If I was to take a food item it would be the
1. 5 lbs of beef jerky (protein)
Not
2. 5 lbs of dried pulses/legumes/lentils mix (starch and carbs)

Protein is available wherever animals are. Especially for that region and time of year, I'd go for more carbs. (Didn't see any berries or other sources of fast burn energy.) Probably the gorp rather than the plain chocolate, since I could pick out the part I needed at the time.

Under Tools I wonder where the line between hunting knife and machete are crossed and might try to get by with a long knife with saw like teeth on back but no saw would be super difficult, also very difficult without an axe.

Depends on how much they knew about the area beforehand; a machete wouldn't be on my list after looking at it. Maybe a kukri like Alan's and a saw, though it sure would be nice to have a ~6" knife too. As much as Cody Lundin does with a Mora, I consider a hatchet a luxury, and the ones lugging full sized felling axes didn't seem to be getting much use out of them that a heavy kukri wouldn't have done pretty well.

Rule is if you don't use it on multiple trips don't take it next time, lighten your rucksack, ask any special forces or marine who has done forward missions where speed was critical. They might say "what the heck leave that at home dude."

Again, there's a huge difference between light, fast, and mobile, and "go here and make this spot home for as long as you can." If I'm going to be on the move every day trying to cover ground, a heavy canvas tarp is off the list, as is all other shelter building gear beyond lashings and a light tarp for nightly lean-tos. Fire building becomes more critical for movement too, since there's no way to just keep banking and reviving one fire. Water purification changes too; don't want to purify 40lbs of water or catch that much rain then lug it up a mountain, but if you can rig storage in a long term camp, it's sure a nice bit of insurance to have.

[WalkingTree]

Sam surprised me. I thought he'd be one of the 1st few out. I wonder how he felt when he found out he missed it by only one spot away?

Really, it should make him feel pretty good. He should claim it as a bragging right. Best consolation that there is for not winning. He was second right behind the winner...a whipperschnapper neck-and-neck with the old man who won. One of the few who didn't really whimp out, but instead was hanging pretty good. That'd make me feel pretty good about myself. Though it's not a win, I'd brag the hay out of that.

[WalkingTree]

If I was to take a food item it would be the
5 lbs of beef jerky (protein)

Not
5 lbs of dried pulses/legumes/lentils mix (starch and carbs)

That one had me thinking - I've no experience or knowledge here. Was thinking of the jerky, biltong, and pemmican...but started considering the salt content of all of those coupled with how they are dehydrated themselves already. I imagined them sucking all the water right out of me while believing that I was keeping a calm tummy in the first few days hustling and burning energy to get some things established early.

Btw, does anyone have any more knowledge or experience here? Is the salt content of the other stuff an issue or not?

Otherwise, while I do like the protein, as nightsg I like the idea of the starches and carbs more considering that I'd only have it for that initial boost when first going out there and trying to get a lot done fast early. But, I'm wondering if the salt content is a real concern in these survival contexts. Anybody know?

[NightSG]

But, I'm wondering if the salt content is a real concern in these survival contexts. Anybody know?

In that context, extra salt isn't needed; these guys weren't sweating off a gallon or two a day the way they would be down here or in a jungle. Hyponatremia isn't much of a risk when a major chunk of your diet is saltwater fish, mussels, seaweed, etc. Whether the extra salt in jerky or biltong would actually be a detriment, I don't know for sure, but unless they wolfed down the entire five pounds in one or two sittings, I doubt it.

[Batch]

Even if someone had a diet that should be low in salt like Hypertension. The jerky would not cause a problem unless you ate a lot each day. And then your blood pressure is usually only raised about 10 mm of HG with a high sodium diet. The caloric loss should offset that easily.

The jerky added to a soup type meal of what every you can obtain can be a real game changer. Adding a protein source to a dried grain or a collected plant or starch is definitely a comfort where you might not be able to collect protein.

[Sarge47]

It was meant to be a challenge with emergency back up Sarge47 not a vacation trip for fun and relaxation.

http://www.history.com/shows/alone/a...ohibited-items

I still think it was a silly premise. Some challenge. The producers were really fortunate nobody died or got seriously injured. I don't care what "waivers" might have been signed, they still could have been sued and lost if there were any fatalities. I also say that it wasn't survival since to be rescued all's they had to do was make a phone call! I did learn some things on there...mostly what "not" to do...

[Sarge47]

I was wondering as the show progressed why weren't the guys doing more with their shelters like the fella did with the "YURT" shelter? Sam was in a bad position as he got a lot of wind. Had he fortified his shelter with branches he might have had a better time of it. Then the thought hit me, lack of food causes problems, both mental and physical. Low energy level as well as mental lethargy are common under such circumstances....

[NightSG]

I also say that it wasn't survival since to be rescued all's they had to do was make a phone call!

I don't think there has ever been any sort of "survival" event or show that didn't include some way to "tap out," and in an endurance challenge like this, the only other way to lose would be to die out there. That would have made for a lot more episodes, but I don't think the world is quite ready for a real "The Long Walk" (or in this case, Long Sit There) type show just yet.

[Winter]

I quit smoking in Feb 2014 but you'd never find me without a lighter. I'd take a Bic over a ferro rod any day. But, I carry both.

[WalkingTree]

I was wondering as the show progressed why weren't the guys doing more with their shelters like the fella did with the "YURT" shelter? Sam was in a bad position as he got a lot of wind. Had he fortified his shelter with branches he might have had a better time of it. Then the thought hit me, lack of food causes problems, both mental and physical. Low energy level as well as mental lethargy are common under such circumstances....

Yes...this is one of the things that I think about with these shows. They don't seem to do or try much. Lots of their difficulties stem from them not actually doing or attempting very much. And then I remember that you can get quite lethargic fast when living the physical lifestyle in the elements that it is and without much water and food. Your very first day trying to procure potable water and/or put together shelter which is even half useful, can wear you out if you don't take in water and food that same day, then after that many people can only get more lazy almost against their will. So if you can't get over that first hump, it can all go down hill from there.

This is one reason why I don't really like things like the 3-3-3 rule, because it doesn't really communicate much and can even be deceptive without deeper understanding than rule-of-thumb clichés. Sure, you can survive 3 weeks without food, 3 days without water...but what that really means is that's the period of time before you probably die, if you don't get rescued or magically have water and food immediately. In other words, after 3 weeks without food or 3 days without water or 3 hours or minutes without shelter (depending), you may still be alive, but you may not be in any shape to even stand up and walk 20 feet or think straight and avoid the death that is coming after that period of time.

I always say that you aren't in trouble when you're thirsty or hungry or loosing body temperature...instead you are in trouble immediately, that very first minute. You better get busy right quick, and avoid reaching any of those states in the first place. Also this is why I say that there is an "initial hump" - assuming situations where you have no food, water, shelter, fire, etc, and little modern tools/equipment/supplies, you really need to achieve quite a bit as early as possible, and this accumulates a lot of physical exertion...without that water and food, you can be spent before doing what you need to do to be able to continue further.

I'm really kind of amazed when these people are able to give commentary on camera as coherently as they do after exerting themselves some and not having much water or food. But then they edit...in some outtakes of a show you can see them struggling and not even able to stand up without losing their balance or almost blacking out. They should show that kind of stuff more often.

[finallyME]

This dude had the exact order a month ago. We should promote him to super duper clairvoyant reality show figurer outer or give him a cookie or something!

Dang it! I guess that guy does get the cookie. Another guy predicted it on post # 115, but the post you refer to is #106, so the clear winner.

[finallyME]

If I was to take a food item it would be the
1. 5 lbs of beef jerky (protein)

I would have chose pemican, like Sam did. In fact, I would have chosen 5 lbs of tallow if it was a choice.

[TXyakr]

Hey, didn't I see someone splitting a tree with a machete, or am I remembering that wrong? There is no machete on the list. That and the disposable lighter...making me think history got a little mixed up along the way or changed things.

Yes a machete was not officially on the list only a hunting knife but if you were paying attention Alan had a Kukri blade or small machete, that is why I brought up that question of where the line between a hunting knife and machete were crossed. Part of surviving difficult SHTF situations when on hunting or camping trips is being observant. For North Vancouver Island specifically my choice would be #1 Sharp Axe, #2 Large Knife (not big machete), #3 large Buck saw. I can dig with knife also there are instructions on how to make a post hole digger on primitiveways and other websites, Also broken bottle found on beach works to dig with, and some fairly hard woods there make a good shovel, many alternatives to shovel I have lived for many months in wilderness without a shovel. Difference between a GI in the fox holes/trenches and Special Forces at a forward location perhaps.

Also for those who actually have extensive experience using fuel lighters, ferro rods and wood friction methods such as bow drill the advantage of lighters are that they can hold a flame to a moist or poor tinder longer but these are more likely to fail, i.e. fuel drains gasket fails, or is crushed or tiny ferro rod is broken or falls out etc. Even if a ferro rod breaks all an experienced person need is about 1 inch perhaps less. If you have a blade, axe, saw or knife and some reasonably good wood you should have infinite source of drills: hand, bow, pump, saw etc. You ABSOLUTELY should go out to your back porch or local park and practice but at the very least watch that youtube video by Mitch I posted. Hundreds of other videos online but all a waste of time if you don't GET OUT THERE AND TRY IT OUT FOR YOURSELF!!!! Get off your comfy chair!!! Put out your cigarettes!

BTW I have seen indigenous people in the Amazon Jungle split fairly large trees with fairly thin "grass" machetes when they did not happen to have their axe with them. But it is NOT the preferred way to do it and generally requires a baton to get it started then baton does most of the splitting not that machete. Also best if the tree is still green. Axe is definitely best. Skill and experience is far more important than a truck load of equipment when you are in a very remote area, but that would require that you leave your keyboard/electronic device.

[NightSG]

Yes a machete was not officially on the list only a hunting knife but if you were paying attention Alan had a Kukri blade or small machete,

Anybody recognize which one? Either he's really good at sharpening on random rocks or it held a heck of a good edge the whole time judging by a couple of scenes well into the series where he was using it for delicate tasks.

[TXyakr]

I would have chose pemican, like Sam did. In fact, I would have chosen 5 lbs of tallow if it was a choice.

I agree or Biltong or anything with mostly protein and fat not starch and carbohydrates which are easier to find in most wilderness areas in this case Bull Kelp or others in other areas. My concern about fats is that in a humid climate they go rancid very fast, while higher protein can last longer before it goes bad IF you can keep it dry and out of reach of animals. Then you obviously need to ration it on rainy days when not possible or waste of time to forage for food.

That one had me thinking - I've no experience or knowledge here. Was thinking of the jerky, biltong, and pemmican...but started considering the salt content of all of those coupled with how they are dehydrated themselves already. I imagined them sucking all the water right out of me while believing that I was keeping a calm tummy in the first few days hustling and burning energy to get some things established early.

If you don't have a way to find and purify fresh water in this situation (N-VI) or in most remote areas you will die within 3 hours (daytime desert) or 3 days for sure. So the salt content of your food is not as negative a consideration for someone exerting energy in an outdoor lifestyle as its for someone with high blood pressure working in a white collar climate controlled office. Basically you need more salt living outdoors. If possible should be boiling water as often as possible, drink warm tea or just warm water often, keep a record of it minimum of 1/2 gallon per day drink with every meal or digestion does not work properly. When camping in hottest parts of Texas from July to August I drink up to 2 gallons of water per day, if I see any yellow in urine I drink more even if water is hotter than my body temp. I have been outdoors with white collar office workers (folks who exercise in AC gyms only) and they nearly lost it (vomited/fainted) due to lack of salts in their diet after only about 6 hours of exertion in the outdoors, basically they were not "conditioned" both physically and nutritionally.

[TXyakr]

I still think it was a silly premise. Some challenge. The producers were really fortunate nobody died or got seriously injured. I don't care what "waivers" might have been signed, they still could have been sued and lost if there were any fatalities. I also say that it wasn't survival since to be rescued all's they had to do was make a phone call! I did learn some things on there...mostly what "not" to do...

I am not an expert on it but I have had a long discussion (or listen to lecture on "waivers") with a Lawyer friend on a long road trip to camping location. And I also talked to a TV producer about it. Basically even a very carefully written waiver does not protect the TV network from gross negligence, but the contestant does take on some risk. Most is the risk of transportation getting there like the two helicopters that collided in Argentina killing the French contestants from the "Dropped" show last March if you recall that tragedy. I think 10 people died including celebrities.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...lling-ten.html

In the case of this "Alone" show they were only a few hours way from rescue by land or sea, or by air if weather allowed for that. Risk of injury by wildlife was fairly unlikely as long as they did not hang food or eat in their sleep shelters like fools. Alan video recorded himself eating by the water in and an open area, and built a separate kitchen shelter. Experienced people do this in black bear and puma country, also wise in raccoon country. I have had those come up and beg for food. Once gave one garlic, it ran away, lol.

BTW I make sure all the adults READ!!! and sign waivers when they go on day trips or weekend trips with my friends and me. Kids must have their parents or legal guardians sign them. But I understand some of the weakness of these waivers (especially after long "talk" with lawyer 10 hours in car together, not on THAT topic the entire trip!). and that if anyone of us instructors does any thing negligent the waiver is useless in a court of law.

[TXyakr]

Anybody recognize which one? Either he's really good at sharpening on random rocks or it held a heck of a good edge the whole time judging by a couple of scenes well into the series where he was using it for delicate tasks.

I could not find the exact blade he used but perhaps he will do a youtube video of items sometime. Key in this marine/saltwater environment is a 1080-1095 high carbon blade with all but bevel coated to protect. Then use any fairly fine grain stone to sharpen daily or even multiple times per day. You do not need to buy some special "Arkansas Stone". Many other stones will work depending on what blade is used for, for example mostly wood/bushcraft best not to get super sharp, leather strop not a good idea. What do you think Crashdrive? Except if you just really need a shave or something like that.

Watch his casting video if you have not already, get an idea of how he knows to use what he finds in the wild and his attitude toward this "challenge" versus a true "survival" situation.



Edit: fairly good Kukri but probably not the one Alan used OKC Kukri Knife under $100 shop around.
https://ontarioknife.com/fixed-blade...i-knife-detail

[Erratus Animus]

Alans blade is the condor kukri. a few of the other forums and tube channels have confirmed that anyway from what I have read.

I believe the beans and legumes were a good choice but since the limit is 5lbs I would have cut back on them and added peanut butter. Calorie dense, name one animal that doesn't like it so it could be bait for traps, if natural peanut butter the oil has other uses as well. That is if they would allow it because the producers would not allow certain things even if on the list.

I agree that a good 3lbs felling axe or at least a forest ax would top my list followed by a mora styled blade as far as cutting tools. Being in Louisiana I did not always have that view but after getting out of my comfort zone and using an ax I find myself leaving the machete at home much more often and if it were for a longterm trip I will be taking the ax.

Sam has nothing to be ashamed of and I am happy for him and his new family. I called him the dark horse early on and as spot on with that. Congrats to Alan as well. Looking forward to seeing what changes they make to the show.