waiting on the white truck

[kyratshooter]

Yep, I am sitting here waiting for the big white Fed-X truck.

This one requires a signature, and the tracking indicator says that the truck is headed for my house sometime today.

So I am stuck sitting here, jumping every time one of the neighbors passes the house in their big one ton pickups that sound amazingly like a delivery truck.

This shipment is the ultimate score, more precious than gold, scarce as hen's teeth, not seen in at least two years and only acquired after searching around the world at great sacrifice of time and effort....

!! Shotgun powder !!

[hunter63]

Woot....Good score....
How about .22's?

[Rockgod1619]

My guess was going to be .22's as well! But hey, good score indeed!

[kyratshooter]

?? .22 ???

Don't know and don't care any more. Not shooting any of the "stash" and have replaced them at the range with the .357 and .223.

That is one reason I made this order. This 8 pound keg represents 15,000 - 16,000 rounds of either caliber, or 3,000+ 12 gauge shells.

It is a good cushion added to the regular stock and extends the ammo supply to sometime in July of 2375 a.d. if I fire one round a day to put meat on the table. Or one year of skeet/trap/pistol competition, whichever happens first.

The truck just departed the driveway and I am a happy camper.

[1stimestar]

Yay. I have to wonder, what kind of packaging do they use for that?

[Zack]

Yep, I am sitting here waiting for the big white Fed-X truck.

This one requires a signature, and the tracking indicator says that the truck is headed for my house sometime today.

So I am stuck sitting here, jumping every time one of the neighbors passes the house in their big one ton pickups that sound amazingly like a delivery truck.

This shipment is the ultimate score, more precious than gold, scarce as hen's teeth, not seen in at least two years and only acquired after searching around the world at great sacrifice of time and effort....

!! Shotgun powder !!

Where'd you get it? Or is that classified?

[kyratshooter]

Yay. I have to wonder, what kind of packaging do they use for that?

Big brown box with "small arms powder" written on the side in little bitty letters. There is a "hazmat" fee or $28 for the delivery. The carrier can not move more than a certain amount in any one vehicle so it cranks up the shipping expense greatly. When I buy I try to get enough to make paying the extra shipping worth while.

Last time I ordered me and another guy split the hazmat fee, which allowed each of us around 17 pounds of powder and several thousand primers each.

I got a lead on this order from an ammo production firm with an overstock of their proprietary powder. It is not one of the powders one will find in the Lyman, Speer or Hornady manuals, but they have data for their own loadings and there is now info all over the internet for this powder.

It looks as if its best use will be in 9mm/38/45 pistol loads and shotgun shells. That will free up many of my other powders for specialty use.

http://www.expansion-industries.com/...DER-p/etr7.htm

I am not sure if they have any of it left but you can place an order and try.

[Phaedrus]

Nice! I've been thinking of getting a Dillion since powder and primers are back in good supply. I actually have a crapload of powder already and a decent stock of primers but with availability good again I want to step up to a progressive loader for 9mm.

[kyratshooter]

Making one score on a shipment of powder does not mean availability is "good again".

Some rifle powder is back, but shotgun and pistol powder is still scarce.

I can still find nothing from the standard brands like Alliant, Accurate, Hodgen, IMR or Winchester from any of the suppliers I normally use or from any of the major sporting goods outlets.

I had a good supply myself but, in these days of scarcity, burning up what I had when it can not be replaced made me cringe. In that situation I want to load a couple hundred rounds of each caliber and sit on the bulk and only load what is demanded by the situation.

That has kept my "ammo supply" at a high potential count, but that potential is in empty brass, lead, primers and powder which can be loaded into rounds of any caliber needed, not 1000 rounds of this and 5000 rounds of that stockpiled for a specific gun.

The "stockpiling" of finished rounds has been restricted to calibers that are too cheap to reload.

Even my shotgun reloading has been restricted to slugs and buckshot, which is artificially expensive over the counter. I can by small shot field loads in 12ga or 20ga at Wallmart cheaper than I can reload.

I started with progressive loaders back when they first hit the market, then backed off to a Lee turret press.

There are parts of the reloading operation I still want to do by hand for QC sake. Priming is the main one. I like to insure the primers in my 9mm and 45 loads are flush with the case. I also like to feel the pressure of the resizing and crimping operations and the Lee press lets me do that while still cutting down on the number of times I handle the case I am refilling. The real time waster in single stage reloading is how many times you put the case onto and off of the shell-holder.

I also got irritated at becoming a slave to the machine. I did not feel like I was reloading, I was simply keeping a big blue machine fed, adjusted and happy.

But that is just me and my peculiar preferences.

[Rockgod1619]

KYRat, what would be your advice for someone who wants to get into reloading? I've never done any reloading before, but would like to start.

[hunter63]

I personally like a single stage press.....and treat re-loading as a precise process......with OC checks along the line.
Had enough of factory piece work in my past.......now its a pass time.

Though about turrets and multistage presses...both do require set up, so does a single stage, but not as much as a multistage....just haven't acted on it yet....and may never move on.

I use a pair of single stage presses and add a third if I am gas checking and sizing.

Works for me.
Heck, I even liked the Lee Loader "bop a mole" loader's.....That I started with.

I suggest a Lee Starter Set........all you need is dies, powder and bullets.
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/121...ProductFinding

[Rockgod1619]

I've been looking at the Lee's all day, haha! Would probably go with the single stage to start with. Might have to start there. Just want to start with loading .223 and move forward from there. Thanks, Hunter!

[Zack]

Big brown box with "small arms powder" written on the side in little bitty letters. There is a "hazmat" fee or $28 for the delivery. The carrier can not move more than a certain amount in any one vehicle so it cranks up the shipping expense greatly. When I buy I try to get enough to make paying the extra shipping worth while.

Last time I ordered me and another guy split the hazmat fee, which allowed each of us around 17 pounds of powder and several thousand primers each.

I got a lead on this order from an ammo production firm with an overstock of their proprietary powder. It is not one of the powders one will find in the Lyman, Speer or Hornady manuals, but they have data for their own loadings and there is now info all over the internet for this powder.

It looks as if its best use will be in 9mm/38/45 pistol loads and shotgun shells. That will free up many of my other powders for specialty use.

http://www.expansion-industries.com/...DER-p/etr7.htm

I am not sure if they have any of it left but you can place an order and try.

The only shotgun load they have in the chart is for 12 gauge. Darn. I can buy target loads (cheap ones, but they work) at WalMart for about the same price as loading them. 20 and 28 gauge is a different story though... I'm glad you got some. Thanks for sharing, maybe it'll be of use to somebody else.

[kyratshooter]

KYRat, what would be your advice for someone who wants to get into reloading? I've never done any reloading before, but would like to start.

I have to agree with Hunter on starting up with a single stage press. You have to learn to walk before you can run. I loaded on a single stage for 20 years before I bought a Dillon, sold it and moved to the Lee Turret Press.

I like the turret press because I can set up the disk for each caliber and change out disks with the preset dies in place. To change calibers I simply change the shell holder and the snap out die holder. Since I have been reloading the same bullet to the same depth with the same crimp, in three different calibers, for 40 years I never have to adjust the dies once they are set when I use the turret press.

I also suggest you PM Natertot for assistance. He is a Lee Dealer.

Zack, I can buy 20 gauge shells at Walmart for the same price as 12ga shells. You can probably buy 28ga over the internet at reduced prices too.

I only reload the buckshot and slugs and I stick to the 12 and 20, which makes life simple. Oddly enough, I shoot more trap and skeet with the 12 and rely on it for home defense, but I hunt more with my 20s.

Like I said, just me and my peculiarities of old age.

[Zack]

I have to agree with Hunter on starting up with a single stage press. You have to learn to walk before you can run. I loaded on a single stage for 20 years before I bought a Dillon, sold it and moved to the Lee Turret Press.

I like the turret press because I can set up the disk for each caliber and change out disks with the preset dies in place. To change calibers I simply change the shell holder and the snap out die holder. Since I have been reloading the same bullet to the same depth with the same crimp, in three different calibers, for 40 years I never have to adjust the dies once they are set when I use the turret press.

I also suggest you PM Natertot for assistance. He is a Lee Dealer.

Zack, I can buy 20 gauge shells at Walmart for the same price as 12ga shells. You can probably buy 28ga over the internet at reduced prices too.

I only reload the buckshot and slugs and I stick to the 12 and 20, which makes life simple. Oddly enough, I shoot more trap and skeet with the 12 and rely on it for home defense, but I hunt more with my 20s.

Like I said, just me and my peculiarities of old age.

That's true about the 20 gauge shells. The Federal's and lower-end Winchester's hang up in the gun though. So I've got to reload Remington STS and Winchester AA hulls. $$$ is right. Good thing I shoot with non-reloaders who throw those things away. I'll shoot just about anything for skeet shooting, but I've been using 12 gauge lately because of the cheap shells at WalMart. I hunt with 12 gauge too. But if I had to choose 12, 20, 28, or .410 gauges, I think I'd say 28 gauge is my favorite. But the powder situation has me kind of puzzled...

[Rockgod1619]

Appreciate the input KYRat!! I'll most likely start with the single stage and go from there.

[natertot]

Kyrat, I do not know why you are having problems finding shotgun powder. Shotgun powder in my neck of the woods has been in pretty regular supply. The issue has been finding powder for pistols and rifles. The other issue up here has been trying to find a consistent source of primers although that is getting better.I also agree with what you and Hunter said about starting to reload. A single stage is a great place to start with, but the nice thing about the turret press is that you can single stage reload on those and then when you are ready change it up to let it auto index.

[Zack]

Kyrat, I do not know why you are having problems finding shotgun powder. Shotgun powder in my neck of the woods has been in pretty regular supply. The issue has been finding powder for pistols and rifles. The other issue up here has been trying to find a consistent source of primers although that is getting better.I also agree with what you and Hunter said about starting to reload. A single stage is a great place to start with, but the nice thing about the turret press is that you can single stage reload on those and then when you are ready change it up to let it auto index.

That's really weird about the powder, we don't have shotgun powder, but rifle powder is available by the ton (probably...).

[TXyakr]

It is mostly just a supply and demand issue and some over reaction since the tragic shooting in Connecticut years ago when the price of powder suddenly went up almost 3 times along with demand. Not exactly rational behavior.

Here is the explanation from Hodgdon one of the powder manufacturers:
http://www.hodgdon.com/PDF/Web%20Pag...ng%20Surge.pdf

In my "neck of the woods" a regular supply can be purchased from several local independently owned gun shop owners for a good price and after developing a good relationship with them they will text message me when some is in, so I don't need to keep dangerous amounts in my house which some folks (local fire department) consider to be a hazard. But that is just me. I'm just a common sense, rational kind-a-guy. HYOH (Hike Your Own Hike).

I have absolutely no basis of evidence and SHOULD NOT SPECULATE!!! but sorta wonder if it has been difficult by regulations for these powder manufacturers to expand their production capacities or if they believe that the demand will drop off eventually and it would not be a wise business decision to do so. Thus they can just raise the price until demand drops off and their bottom line will be just fine will very little risk to their long term financial viability. I just do not know so I WILL NOT SPECULATE… oops I just did. ha ha ha

[kyratshooter]

Nate, most shotgun powders double as pistol powder.

There are a few powders that are pistol specific but almost all the medium-fast powders are developed, or pressed into use, to function as both pistol and shotgun propellants. Unique, all the "Dot powders", Winchester AA, SHC, Clays, Universal, Titewad, Titegroup, Accurate 2,5,7 and a host of others can be cross referenced between the shotgun charge bar charts and the pistol reloading manuals.

What powders have been abundant, or have you just seen a pound here and there for the past 2 years? In North KY there has not bee a pound of pistol or shotgun powder on a shelf, and very little rifle powder, since a week after the Northridge shooting.

Primers are not a problem if you buy on line. I stopped depending on the LGS system of component buying when I moved up here to north KY. No one kept a good supply of components so I never depended on them for my needs. Surprisingly enough, I found that the big hunting and outdoor stores like Bass Pro, Cabellas and Field and Stream kept nothing either!

The thing about buying on line is, again, the hazmat fee. One has to buy in bulk to make the purchase worthwhile. Almost all the online suppliers have primers available once again. You just have to buy 5,000-10,000 before the shipping fees divide into portions small enough to make the purchase sensible.

It is a big jump from buying primers a 100 pack at a time and single 1 pound cans of powder, to buying 10,000 assorted size primers and 25 pounds of powder so you can get all you can on one hazmat fee.

Now that some of the rifle powders are back on the shelves I have noticed that the retailers have jacked up the price too. It is way higher than the online prices, sometimes up to $10 per one pound can.

My biggest adaptation has probably been making the change from the powders I used for decades to "what I can get". For 30 years I never kept anything but Unique for both pistol and shotgun, 3031 and 4350 for rifles in all caliber ranges. I had charges matched to bullet weights and preferred loads established after years of testing. I saw one of my test runs go from a 4" group @ 100 yards to under an inch with only a 1/10th grain change in powder weight on my last series of rifle tests. I used 1/3 pound of powder to find the right combination and that is a lot of powder in these days of scarcity. Just picking a number that looks good out of the book has never worked for me.

The entire test process of working up loads must be performed for each load to get the proper performance from each caliber. I shoot a lot of fixed sight pistols and changing powder and charge weight changes POI, sometimes by a great deal. I can't just load up a new batch and head for the shooting match.

Well I could, but I would not hit anything.

Fact is, I had stopped almost all my competition shooting except for trap (I can buy the 12ga shells at Walmart) over the past 2 years just because I did not want to use up all my powder.