Ilbe not line
Sent from up in an oak tree
Ilbe not line
Sent from up in an oak tree
What size are you? I'm 5'11" these days and the Molle fits me okay.
I have to agree with everyone. ALICE packs were designed to hold up for troops in foreign regions. Regions that can't be properly tested of long periods of time so the military designed a pack basically indestructible . I've done 30k ruck marches through the hills of Fort Knox and the wetlands of MS and LA. With a wet weather bag you can't go wrong. And if you know how to pack gear right you can hold a lot. 100lbs in a large pack. But yes the straps can be uncomfortable. Upgrading them will help tons. I have some of the newest MOLLE packs and they are great but do seem to break easier and are often more expensive. Any military surplus has both. For a beginner on a budget but wanting the right gear to hold up I'd recommend anyone an old OD green ALICE pack.
I know....I have one. It is basically a fancy book bag without a frame. Get an assault pack, either the ILBE or the MOLLE II. You can get those for about the price of a used medium ALICE.Originally Posted by natertot
The question that Traditionalist needs to ask is does he need a frame. The frame gives you the ability to carry more weight. It doesn't take much weight before a book bag gets really uncomfortable.
I've taken a vow of poverty. To annoy me, send money.
http://www.youtube.com/user/FinallyMe78?feature=mhee
I am 5'11" and an ALICE frame is way too short. Of course, torso size is not related to height. The MOLLE frame is the perfect length for me. The ILBE fits like a dream.
I definitely am not an ALICE fan, but that doesn't mean that you shouldn't get one. After all, the only way for you to join the group is to get one and see for yourself. There isn't an ALICE hater out there that didn't acquire that hatred from wearing the ALICE pack for many miles. Get one and join the club!
I've taken a vow of poverty. To annoy me, send money.
http://www.youtube.com/user/FinallyMe78?feature=mhee
In post 18, the only negatives you had about ALICE were the frames. Eliminate the frames, and they are good durable packs on the cheap. I don't know where you get that MOLLE or ILBE is the same price as a medium ALICE. according to your links, the MOLLE straps are $19 plus shipping. Local surplus sales medium ALICE with straps (no frame) for less than $27 out the door.
You don't like ALICE, and that's okay. I'm not saying they are the perfect be all end all packs either. I must ask you though to not let your personal preferences cloud what is factual about ALICE. The OP is 16yo, short on cash, and is looking for a place to start. A rugged pack with straps that can be had under $30 seems like as good a place as any for a starting point. If he doesn't like it, he can always turn it into a trunk bag or secondary bag or whatever uses he can come up with. Anyone can get their monies worth out of one no matter how they use it.
”There's nothing glorious in dying. Anyone can do it.” ~Johnny Rotten
The frame is short for a reason. It's to make room for the pistol belt. It's not designed to sit on the hips like a "normal" pack does. However, you can lower the whole rig so it does. Hence the "kidney" pad. The Molle got around that by using the load bearing vest. It also sticks out in back a lot more than most other packs. It definitely has a few drawbacks for hiking. I haven't used the ILBE but I do like the way it's set up. The Molle is just a nice piece of equipment. I think I paid $50 each for mine. I can put way way more than I can carry in my Molle. I can only put way more than I can carry in my Alice.
First lets compare apples to apples, and then we can start arguing about it.I was comparing the ALICE with no frame to a MOLLE or ILBE assault pack. That is different than the ILBE and MOLLE main pack. Here are some examples:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/USMC-Assault...item2c738598ac
http://www.ebay.com/itm/USMC-Field-A...item27eb892a95
http://tonystactical.com/index.php?m...roducts_id=100
All just glorified book bags.
Shoot....get one of these http://www.walmart.com/ip/Fieldline-...-Camo/26376284
or one of these http://www.walmart.com/ip/New-Centur...Black/15001664
I've taken a vow of poverty. To annoy me, send money.
http://www.youtube.com/user/FinallyMe78?feature=mhee
Aaargh. The Molle assault pack has worse shoulder straps than the Alice and they are the pits. The Assault pack is the pits squared. I think the pack was so named because it assaults the wearer. And they are sewn in. You can't change them.
Rick,
How did your experiment to add the "straight" pieces of foam padding to the Molle assault pack's shoulder straps turn out?
Last edited by sjj; 09-12-2014 at 04:43 PM.
Wasn't trying to argue. Didn't realize you were talking about the "assault packs" and it came across that your personal preference for one means that there is zero worth for the other. You don't like ALICE, and that is fine. I don't think they are perfect, either. But they are not worthless (except to you, per your personal opinion, which is fine) and worth having a couple.First lets compare apples to apples, and then we can start arguing about it.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/USMC-Assault...item2c738598ac
http://www.ebay.com/itm/USMC-Field-A...item27eb892a95
http://tonystactical.com/index.php?m...roducts_id=100
All just glorified book bags.
Shoot....get one of these http://www.walmart.com/ip/Fieldline-...-Camo/26376284
or one of these http://www.walmart.com/ip/New-Centur...Black/15001664
As far as glorified book bags...... well, I don't know what you want differently. Zippers on the bottom instead of the top? Straps to wear them a different way? One difference between them and book bags that I own is that my book bags all have those cool little loops that hold pens and such. BTW, I do have the first bag that you listed for Wal-Mart. Picked it up on clearance last year for $8. Figured for the price, why not? Nice bag for what it is...... really.
”There's nothing glorious in dying. Anyone can do it.” ~Johnny Rotten
At the time there were not many "add a pad" products to choose from. The one I purchased wasn't quite wide enough so the velcro didn't close. I rigged it using another piece of velcro but I never did like the set up. Today, you can find strap on shoulder pads everywhere. I haven't messed with it beyond that. I found the assault pack really didn't serve my needs and was pretty uncomfortable on my shoulders. It has been relegated to my "if everything else fails" pile. I have so many packs now I'm starting to feel like Sourdough.
Are alice packs worth it?
Depends on what "it" is. Like many here I am prior military, I spent a lot of time under an ALICE pack, and I basically hated humping that bit*h. Yet as soon as I got out, an large Alice pack was sought out and added to my gear. Why? Price and capability.
The Alice pack has a lot of basic good points. its tough, been everywhere, and seldom fails. Personally I never saw a true failure of an alice pack in 4 yrs in the Marine infantry. I did see the odd shoulder strap need replacement, and a frame break, but the bag its self held up. Its well made in this respect.
It is far from a comfortable pack, and when compared to civie hiking packs it even looks worse comfort wise. The Alice was a "one size fits all" that alone should warn you that almost every civilian hiking pack has the potential to be far better fit to an individual, vs the one size for everyone. But, with a little work you can add padding and really make an Alice "not bad" feeling. The old practice was using 100mph tape and the packing foams found in ammo and other suplies (I used to always grab a few pads and make insoles for my boots) The smart guys really padded out their packs and it made a big difference...today it makes more sense to just use upgraded straps and belt from later Molle packs or the like.
It may make more sense as well to just get a more modern pack...I was out before the Alice pack was retired so I don't have experience with the later systems.
So, if money it tight you can get an alice, mod it on the cheap with tape and some padding and have a good functioning pack. But you could also get a later design surplus pack and avoid some of the downfalls to the ALice system (but likely have some other downfall).
Bottom line, the Alice pack is still a good pack, and can be found cheap. You may find something better for your needs and not spend too much more, but the Alice works.
Grabbed a medium Alice without a frame and hip belt today in amazing shape for $5. It had the shoulder straps and extra shoulder straps in it. Where can I get a frame and belt cheap?
Sent from up in an oak tree
Congrats! Sportsmans Guide is pretty inexpensive on theirs. there is always ebay and other online milsurp places.
”There's nothing glorious in dying. Anyone can do it.” ~Johnny Rotten
Whoever used the bag took great care of it. The flap where the instructions have a little cracking but are very clear with the instructions. When I went through the bag I realized it had a pair of shoulder straps inside. Now I have 2 pairs. The shoulder straps that were inside are definitely un issued. There's no fading or scratch on the metal hardware. I still have to get a frame but I feel it was worth the $5
Sent from up in an oak tree
Just google alica pack frame. You'll get tons of hits. The link I gave you earlier will show you how to attach the shoulder straps to the frame.
Thanks rick. Will do after school today. I could see the shoulder straps being uncomfortable but for my use my bag won't weigh more that 35lbs. I plan on using it in upstate to do some hiking and a few overnight to three day trips. I understand there's better bags for that but I don't doubt the Alice pack. I'll be ordering molle ii straps for it also.
Sent from up in an oak tree
Bad straps will make a 35 pound bag feel like a ton of stones suspended by two saw blades within a couple of hours.
If you didn't bring jerky what did I just eat?
You're just mad 'cause some guy with three stripes told you to carry it. They gave you overseas pay and all that combat pay. That was like, what, an extra $95 a month? What the heck more do you want?
"They gave me all that money. So much my pockets was sore.
More dough than I can use.
Re-enlistment blues."
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