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Thread: What Medicines are a must?

  1. #21

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    Quote Originally Posted by hunter63 View Post
    ...well, all I can say is a bottle of aspirin in the console FAK, was really ripe/strong/nasty/....and some of my Benadryl kinda melted down(DW bee sting emergency stuff)....Tape was also kinda funky with sticky stuff sticking out.
    Tossed them.......
    for longevity they need to be kept in a dark cool area. high temps freezing temps humidity all play parts in breaking down antibiotics ( or any meds) prematurely. some even need to be refrigerated Those I do not plan i stocking
    I Wonder Who was the first person to look at a cow and say, "I think I'll squeeze these dangly things here, and drink what ever comes out?"


  2. #22
    Senior Member hunter63's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by welderguy View Post
    for longevity they need to be kept in a dark cool area. high temps freezing temps humidity all play parts in breaking down antibiotics ( or any meds) prematurely. some even need to be refrigerated Those I do not plan i stocking

    But if you don't have it when you need it...it don't do you no good.....Oh well.....I just keep checking and replacing.
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    Quote Originally Posted by welderguy View Post
    They are all antibiotics!
    I have a list as I mentioned in my reply to hunter, that lays out the details of each antibiotic dosage how many per day etc etc , did you also know that some bacteria's such as MRSA require multiple antibiotics to get rid of it. So no I'm not playing doctor, Thanks for your concern tho Ill take that into advisement
    All the ones I recognized I knew were antibiotics and didn't want to assume the rest.
    It is good you have that info and yes, I did know that about MRSA. I know many folk who think, "I have antibiotics, I'm good" but they don't know anything else. Not saying you were one of those. Just wanted to put out the info for all who read so they don't wind up screwing things up worse.
    ”There's nothing glorious in dying. Anyone can do it.” ~Johnny Rotten

  4. #24
    Senior Member hunter63's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by natertot View Post
    All the ones I recognized I knew were antibiotics and didn't want to assume the rest.
    It is good you have that info and yes, I did know that about MRSA. I know many folk who think, "I have antibiotics, I'm good" but they don't know anything else. Not saying you were one of those. Just wanted to put out the info for all who read so they don't wind up screwing things up worse.
    That's why I asked as well....DW is allergic to a lot of the 'sillens" so I don't fool with them.
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    The Shelf Life Extension Program (SLEP) was established to reduce costs and make certain medications were available if needed. Here is a white paper from the FDA that lists 122 medications tested and the results. Please note, some DID fail. You'll need to scroll down to see all of the drugs. It's a technical paper but if you are interested in stockpiling drugs then worth your time to read through it.

    http://www.ofcaems.org/ds-Stability_Profiles.pdf

    The actual DOD/FDA shelf life extension database requires a login and password. You must have a .gov or .mil email address. I'm posting it here for what it's worth. I know some of you are military or government so you might be able to gain access. You may receive a notice the sites security certificate can not be trusted but you can click through that. If you aren't interested or don't have one of the email extensions listed then the site won't provide you any information.

    https://www.shelflife.hq.dla.mil/fda_slep.aspx

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by welderguy View Post
    I have a friend that is a veterinarian, he showed me the chemical compound and the manufacturing info , they are exactly the same and from the same companies we use, I have used both Cipro and tetracycline with great results and no side effects.
    I agree with welder here. I did some checking with both our vet and family Dr. ( both are family friends) I keep fishmox on hand as it has the same ingredients as "human" antibiotics it's just 90% cheaper and 100% easier to get.
    If by what I have learned over the years, allow me to help one person to start to prepare. If all the mistakes I have made, let me give one person the wisdom that allows them to save their life or the life of a loved one in an emergency. Then I will truly know that all the work I have done will have been worth every minute.

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by welderguy View Post
    The Company That the Vet gets his drugs from is the one I use, but the funny thing is that company also sells on ebay !!
    And Hunter your correct going to the pharmacy is cheaper , but I can only get my Dr to write so many prescriptions every few months!!

    so far in my home pharmacy I have
    CIPRO
    CLINDAMYCIN
    CEPHALEXIN
    PENICILLIN
    AMOXICILLIN
    LEVOFLOXACIN
    METRONIDAZOLE
    CLARITHROMYCIN
    DOXYCYCLINE

    there a Mix of Pet meds and regular scripts. There are more I would like to add but money wont allow for it at present time .
    Quote Originally Posted by welderguy View Post
    I read a report done on stored antibiotics, I cant remember where be on this forum!! that they did several tests on dated meds and found them to be intact up to 5 years past expiration ( by intact I mean no break down or toxicity). Yes there are some that do break down and some that are toxic I will search my files and see if I have that list of drugs tested.

    And rotating drugs isn't as easy as food stocks, I can eat food stocks I don't get sick a lot so that does raise an issue of rotating ???
    I store PENICILLIN, AMOXICILLIN and CIPROFLAXIN.
    I get them from an online fish meds store.
    They are identical to human antibiotics down to the markings on the pills.
    I read a report as well on the longetivity of antibiotics after their exp. date. If kept in a dark, cool place, they last years past their exp. date but can lose some of it's potency.
    There was one antibiotic that can become toxic after the exp. date. I can't remember which one.
    Maybe Tetracycline or Erythromycin.

  8. #28
    Senior Member BENESSE's Avatar
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    Here's the thing about antibiotics. Unless you are sure your ailment is bacterial and not viral, it's not smart to "mis- take" them. You can create more trouble than it's worth, and in a SHTF circumstances it's not a gamble you want to take.
    Make extensive notes on how to diagnose various conditions that warrant taking the drugs you are hoarding and make sure you use prevention as the first line of defense.

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    I take a different approach about antibiotics. I don't store them at all. I happen to believe in cleanliness and early intervention. Wounds would cleaned up and covered where necessary asap. Cold, flu, cough, treat the symptoms as early as poss with OTC meds and a small libation generally does the trick. I think there is too much reliance put on antibiotics in all it's forms and resistance is so easy to induced.
    I do use antibiotic cream when the need calls for it, but it's not in my stores.
    Recession; A period when you go without something your Grandparents never heard of.

  10. #30

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    If you guys want to simplify your med stock pile. All antibiotics are derived from 1 of these 4. cyline, sulfur (sulfamide), penicillin, steroid. Pharmaceutical companies slightly change the formula only so a new drug can be patented then sold for big bucks.

    Penicillan- ampicillian- amoxicillian- rivacillen- ext, all the same. effective on gram pos

    Cycline, tetracycline- doxicillian- oxytetracycline- ext, same. effective on Gram neg and slightly gram Positive

    Sulfamide- bactrum BS, - all for Uriniary track and kidney very effective gram pos and neg but stays in the ui track

    Steroids- all strengthen and harden protein turger cells disrupting mitosis. different steroids effect different areas of the body.

    So I Carry a-- tetracycline PW, sulfimide Bolbus, diphenhydramine Imiv (antihistamine),
    I Dream of a Time when Chickens could Cross Roads and not be Questioned about thier Motives

  11. #31
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    Now, if there were only four bacteria in the world we had to worry about that would work swell. Here's a list for you.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_antibiotics

  12. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by ace_maveric View Post
    If you guys want to simplify your med stock pile. All antibiotics are derived from 1 of these 4. cyline, sulfur (sulfamide), penicillin, steroid. Pharmaceutical companies slightly change the formula only so a new drug can be patented then sold for big bucks.

    Penicillan- ampicillian- amoxicillian- rivacillen- ext, all the same. effective on gram pos

    Cycline, tetracycline- doxicillian- oxytetracycline- ext, same. effective on Gram neg and slightly gram Positive

    Sulfamide- bactrum BS, - all for Uriniary track and kidney very effective gram pos and neg but stays in the ui track

    Steroids- all strengthen and harden protein turger cells disrupting mitosis. different steroids effect different areas of the body.

    So I Carry a-- tetracycline PW, sulfimide Bolbus, diphenhydramine Imiv (antihistamine),
    So what the heck did you just say....Gram neg?......I'm impressed, But.....
    I am a blue pill, white pill, big pill, little pill.....kinda guy......
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  13. #33

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    Thanks Rick for the link It truly provides a lot of info for what I was trying to say in a very easy and comprehensive way and show that all of those drug that it lists are derived from just the first 3 classes. Explaining which bactrims are gram pos and which gram neg.
    And hunter I would love to explain the difference between gramic bactiria and the peptidoglycan of bacteria. So if you are truly interested let me know.

    Oh and i guess I did leave out the Aminoglycoside's. how ever most people know that alcohol kill bacteria. And there is the arsnic group like Arsphenamine if you really want to used those. Thanks Rick for pointing those out.
    Last edited by ace_maveric; 11-19-2014 at 07:06 PM.
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    Senior Member hunter63's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ace_maveric View Post
    Thanks Rick for the link It truly provides a lot of info for what I was trying to say in a very easy and comprehensive way and show that all of those drug that it lists are derived from just the first 3 classes. Explaining which bactrims are gram pos and which gram neg.
    And hunter I would love to explain the difference between gramic bactiria and the peptidoglycan of bacteria. So if you are truly interested let me know.
    Not really, all I need to know is was related to me back in the old days as a night shift supervisor responsible for FA .....
    Navy nurse....
    "I you can see it, put a bandied on it.....if you can't see it give them an aspirin"

    I gonna guess I'm not the only one with less than advanced or I should say,.... any medical training....so that kinda make all the information useless to me.
    I need the dumb guy version.
    Last edited by hunter63; 11-19-2014 at 06:38 PM. Reason: splin'
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    Quote Originally Posted by cubsfanrva View Post
    I was wondering what other medicines are vital to a survival pack?
    **************************************
    Your newbie survivalist enthusiast
    Best to talk to your PCP or a nurse at Doctor's office about brand names etc. Many years ago my Doctor of over 25 years said to avoid triple antibiotic ointment and use polysporin or just an antiseptic. I sometimes just use iodine but about 2% of people are allergic to that according to one Dr I know.

    1. Topical antibiotic ointment (Bacitracin zinc or Polysporin,
    many people react severely to Neosporin, neomycin requiring #5 below or an urgent care medical facility)
    2. Topical antiseptic (1 fl oz bottle of Iodine Tricture 2% is my preference over those pads that dry out)
    Iodine 2% 5 -10 drops in quart of water will generally purify it, so has an alternate use,
    but not for pregnant women.)
    3. Anti-diarrhea (IMODIUM A-D or generic equivalent will get you out of minor Beaver Fever problems most of the time)
    4. "NSAID" for pain and anti inflammation (some prescriptions are just higher dosages of OTC meds)
    5. Antihistamines topical and oral (can make you sleepy)
    6. Bandages of many kinds, a few butterfly to close large lacerations, liquid bandaid last resort as are sutures they can seal in infection, as much air as possible but minimize secondary infections. Quick access Tourniquet, I once had to rip off the bottom of a friend's shirt, it worked but was very dirty.
    7. Tweezers from electronic supply that are strong and highly functional
    8. Scissors that actually work, cut away apparel, tape etc.
    9. Those pink pills for upset stomach, nausea etc.: bismuth subsalicylate
    10. 1st Aid Burn Cream with Aloe and Lidocaine HCL 0.5% Solarcaine is a common brand easily found but some prefer other brands that have Benzalkonium Chloride 0.13% a mild Antiseptic, If possible get all burns in cold water or ice as quickly as possible.
    11. That stuff for Poison Ivy/oak or just wash well with soap and water
    12. Topical analgesic (Benzocaine 6% w/v) for Stings or bug bits or just use alcohol and #5 Antihistamines.
    13. 3-6 ml Syringe to irrigate or flush dirt out of cut or wound. (bulb syringe has sterile problems)
    14. CPR mask, "3D" type with one way valve in hard case is best if space is not an issue, i.e. kit for home use or car camping. But thin latex or nitrile will work. Practice once every 2 yr min in recertification class on adult and infant manikins.

    A friend of mine (former EMT) will often take an AED and full back board in his 17 foot canoe or raft. This seems excessive to me but one older friend almost died of a heart attack and his Dr said to not paddle more that 10 miles/day for a year. Also many people fall while climbing on cliffs beside rivers out west, i.e. More injuries than on the river. So I don't mind helping him load and unload.

    I had a fellow camper swell up severely due to a reaction to neomycin, he needed to be evacuated quickly. The fool over exaggerated how much outdoor experience he had and messed up the trip for everyone else with his lack of preparedness. IMO everyone should learn what they are allergic to and have a minimal First aid kit on their person virtually at all times. (not while swimming or bathing obviously). I am not impressed with how much mystical smoke you blow and communing with the spirits you do or how much you pray to gods or whatever just use common sense and its all cool with me.
    Last edited by TXyakr; 11-20-2014 at 01:19 PM. Reason: spelling, add more items

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    Default Prescription meds last resort

    Unlicensed Medical professionals or non-professionals can get into serious legal trouble for giving out prescription medication so I would never admit to having ever done that!

    For a few rare very remote wilderness adventures in N.A. I have taken various items such as Amoxicillin, very strong pain and anti-inflamaitories, EpiPen (epinephrine), Suture Kit, Nitroglycerin, anti-biotic eye drops, and a few other things but I generally do not tell anyone else on the trip and usually there is a M.D. or Wilderness EMT on most trips of 1-2 weeks in extreme wilderness areas, so I just assist and try to stay out of their way.

    As a kid my mother took plenty of antibiotics and stuck me with tetanus shots a few times herself, put that was overseas. Here in the USA if it is possible to use a GPS signaling device, or mobile phone to call for helicopter or surface evacuation of the injured or sick person, then you are required by most state laws to do that first.‎

  17. #37

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    Quote Originally Posted by SHTFMIKE View Post
    I store PENICILLIN, AMOXICILLIN and CIPROFLAXIN.
    I get them from an online fish meds store.
    They are identical to human antibiotics down to the markings on the pills.
    I read a report as well on the longetivity of antibiotics after their exp. date. If kept in a dark, cool place, they last years past their exp. date but can lose some of it's potency.
    There was one antibiotic that can become toxic after the exp. date. I can't remember which one.
    Maybe Tetracycline or Erythromycin.
    The Cyclines (Tetracycline, Oxytetracycline, Doxycycline, Chlortetracycline Clomocycline, Demeclocycline, Lymecycline, Meclocycline, Metacycline, Minocycline, Penimepicycline, Rolitetracycline, Glycylcyclines, Tigecyclineand- generic names only)- will decay turning into cyanide. Liquid forms turn very dark and thick, as for the pills- Although there is actually no simple spot test for cyanide, there is a simple spot test for free chlorine -- namely, that potassium iodide starch paper will turn dark blue to purple in the presence of free chlorine. Which is usually associated with the breakdown decay.
    Last edited by ace_maveric; 11-19-2014 at 09:20 PM.
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  18. #38
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    I guess if you want to twist my point into something that supports yours that's okay. Your premise negates the fact that bacteria, like viruses, mutate over time and new strains are found so a single gram negative antibiotic will not have an affect on all gram negative bacteria. Pharmaceutical companies manufacture newer antibiotics in response to mutations. Yes, they are in the business to make money. If they didn't they wouldn't be in business. Do they overcharge? Off course they do. They charge what the market will pay just like grocery stores and car dealers. That's how free enterprise works. But assuming that four classes of antibiotics will serve all your needs is not correct. If it would we would not be having a problem with MRSA, HA-MRSA, CA-MRSA, Tuberculosis or the host of other antibiotic resistant strains. In addition, many bacteria require combinations of drugs to be effective.

    You guys can buy all the fish meds you want. Self medicating with the wrong antibiotic is part of the reason we are where we on on the antibiotic time line. I would be really PO'd if I picked up some strain of bacteria that turned out to be resistant because some folks chose to diagnose and medicate themselves rather than going to a doctor to find out what the real problem is and which medicine is appropriate for it.

    I fully expect someone to post on how to remove your own appendix in the field. It's just an incision and a snip, right?

    I have to leave now. I need to find a larger soap box.

  19. #39
    Senior Member hunter63's Avatar
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    Rick, Rick, Rick....It's the blue one.....take the blue one........
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  20. #40
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    I recently watched The Necessary Death of Charlie Countryman and there's a scene where this 20 something is in obvious pain.

    Friend 1 to Friend 2: "Look at him, mate. He's in pain. Tell him how many Viagra you took."
    3rd Friend in painful grimace thinks for a minute. "Five...six...maybe...seven."

    There's also a pretty funny movie called Hard Times in which a truck load of Viagra gets dumped in the town's well.

    Yeah, take the blue one.

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