Nuclear reactor melt down and bugging OUT.

[crashdive123]

Our young men and women in the service wanted to get in and be heros, and were very frustrated. It took awhile for them to realize the hazzards.

A bit curious what you mean by this. I missed the stories that the military men and women of the area want to go in and be heroes.

[Rick]

I'm glad Hillary finally made the import ban, how much food got in before she finally did? What's the date she banned them?

I would suggest you research the issue and then you'll know. If someone feels as strongly about a subject as you appear to about this I'm a little hard pressed to understand why they would not spend the time researching it. As much coverage as this event had by non-biased media it's pretty easy to look up. While you're at it, you should look up the Operation Tomodachi Registry.

[Crabapple Plum]

A bit curious what you mean by this. I missed the stories that the military men and women of the area want to go in and be heroes.

Personal conversations with members of the Pacific Fleet. When I want information I go to the source.

[Rick]

The news reports from Fukishima were repeatedly skewed towards a best-case scenario. The Japanese government also "revised" safe exposure levels in the days following the event making large adjustments to what they claimed were still safe levels of exposure. While the full extent of the disaster may never be known, it seems clear that the early reports all understated the real severity of the situation. Seems like the Soviets reacted in a similar fashion with the Chernobyl event. Based on their history, I don't expect much more of our own government officials.

For a moment, put yourself in charge of a nation. You not only have a disaster to contend with but the ongoing economy and security of your nation. If you announce the worst case scenario what happens? In this case, an entire fishing industry shuts down. Even those in Okinawa Prefecture 1100 miles away. The same with produce and dairy. Even where it is not affected. That means all of those folks are now out of work. Throw in the rice farms and cattle production. You already know that electricity is out to most of the auto support industries so they are shut down, too. How does that impact the economy? You also have to consider the intangibles like goodwill and how it affects global commerce with your country. Suddenly "Made in Japan" is something to be avoided.

These are not straight forward issues with black and white answers. Government leaders, like business leaders, have to consider the overall impact and weigh the consequences of every report they put forward. And sometimes they just don't know so they have to revise reports when better data is available.

Realize, too, that everyone has the ability to play Monday Morning Quaterback and second guess or find fault with any decision made. If you run the country then you have to make the decisions in real time with whatever data is available. Sometimes you guess wrong.

[Rick]

SD - To answer your question, we have a good dozen nuclear reactors upwind from us. Almost all are in Illinois. If your scenario played out I would sit tight. There are not only federal government but plenty of state, municipal and private organizations that will be performing testing; many at private labs and universities. You should be able to get a reasonable estimation on the size of the release, if any, direction of travel and possible downwind contamination. If necessary, I would travel a southern route at a 90° angle from the spread by vehicle.

[1stimestar]

I had to go find this story that I read years ago for the first time. Every once in a while, I go look it up again.
http://www.kiddofspeed.com/chapter1.htmL

[Sourdough]

For a moment, put yourself in charge of a nation. You not only have a disaster to contend with but the ongoing economy and security of your nation. If you announce the worst case scenario what happens? In this case, an entire fishing industry shuts down. Even those in Okinawa Prefecture 1100 miles away. The same with produce and dairy. Even where it is not affected. That means all of those folks are now out of work. Throw in the rice farms and cattle production. You already know that electricity is out to most of the auto support industries so they are shut down, too. How does that impact the economy? You also have to consider the intangibles like goodwill and how it affects global commerce with your country. Suddenly "Made in Japan" is something to be avoided.

These are not straight forward issues with black and white answers. Government leaders, like business leaders, have to consider the overall impact and weigh the consequences of every report they put forward. And sometimes they just don't know so they have to revise reports when better data is available.

Realize, too, that everyone has the ability to play Monday Morning Quaterback and second guess or find fault with any decision made. If you run the country then you have to make the decisions in real time with whatever data is available. Sometimes you guess wrong.

Well, I respectfully disagree with this. The safety and wellbeing of the humans that one is charged with protecting SHOULD come first. To me you are inferring the the wellbeing of business, industry, capitalism comes first.

[Wildthang]

I just hope that if we ever have a large nuclear disaster here in the states, they don't put Rick in charge

[Cast-Iron]

Well, I respectfully disagree with this. The safety and wellbeing of the humans that one is charged with protecting SHOULD come first. To me you are inferring the the wellbeing of business, industry, capitalism comes first.

I couldn't agree more.

Governments should gather the pertinent data and experts to develop an intelligent response which places the safety of all effected above any economic concerns. Disasters breed chaos. The larger the event, the greater the chaos. You run the risk of compounding the probelm if you fail to deal with it in honestly and openly. If you don't know, communicate what you're actively doing to assess the situation, then offer the best advice you can with what you do know. Maintaining credibility insures the best means of organizing an efficient response to the crisis.

[crashdive123]

Personal conversations with members of the Pacific Fleet. When I want information I go to the source.

I sure do wish that during my over 20 years serving in both the Pacific Fleet and the Atlantic Fleet somebody would have asked my opinion of something so that they knew what the real scoop was half a world away. Sigh....their loss I guess.

I'll add that with the thousands upon thousands of Sailors, Soldiers, Airmen and Marines that I encountered over my career - not one of them desired to put themselves in harms way in order to be a hero. To do their job? Yes. To be a hero? Not hardly.

[crashdive123]

Well, I respectfully disagree with this. The safety and wellbeing of the humans that one is charged with protecting SHOULD come first. To me you are inferring the the wellbeing of business, industry, capitalism comes first.

I couldn't agree more.

Governments should gather the pertinent data and experts to develop an intelligent response which places the safety of all effected above any economic concerns. Disasters breed chaos. The larger the event, the greater the chaos. You run the risk of compounding the probelm if you fail to deal with it in honestly and openly. If you don't know, communicate what you're actively doing to assess the situation, then offer the best advice you can with what you do know. Maintaining credibility insures the best means of organizing an efficient response to the crisis.

I read the post a little differently. I do not believe Rick was saying or implying that industry should be placed above the safety of the people at all, but rather as a leader (call it government) they have the duty to act in a responsible manner. Did they do that? I suppose that will be the subject of debates for many years to come, just as the government response to Katrina has been. What I got from the post was that if leaders created fear and panic, it not only would not have served those in the affected area, but also those that were not. Protecting the people is of the utmost importance, but causing them harm due to irresponsible actions serves no one.

[Crabapple Plum]

Um, "Heroes" is my word, it's their role in life. They're very humble people.

Well, I respectfully disagree with this. The safety and wellbeing of the humans that one is charged with protecting SHOULD come first. To me you are inferring the the wellbeing of business, industry, capitalism comes first.

Which is why I go directly to the original sources, data collectors, scientists and Boots on the Ground people and ignore the Vulture Vomit.

[kyratshooter]

My own philosophy in this reguard is that officials fear public panic more than they fear public extinction. They can always cover their tails by claiming they feared they would create panic, which is actually saying they feared they would lose control of the public. Every action they take is about being in control.

They would rather have control of dead people than lose control of live ones.

[Crabapple Plum]

I believe that to be the absolute truth. I try to teach others to plan ahead and don't wait until they see it on CNN.

[Rick]

Thank you, Crash. At least someone read my post. The whole essence is that irresponsible reporting does the very thing you don't want done. I don't know if they handled it correctly or not and I'm not about to try and second guess them. But by doing what you are advocating you would have put people out of work 1000 miles away. They would not have been able to provide an income, buy food or pay their bills. Multiply that across the country and you have now placed everyone in the country in jeopardy all because someone in Alaska or Idaho or PNW or Belize wants the worst case scenario published. I doubt very seriously whether the Prime Minister of Japan gives two hoots in he!! what I thought of his handling of the situation. He did what he thought was best and doesn't have to answer to me. And since no one on this site knows the truth one way or the other this is all just an exercise in hypothetical thinking.

By the way, WE are public officials. Do you think there is some special breeding program to raise them? They come from us. If you don't like what they are doing then run for office or elect someone else. EVERY government official is condemned on this forum by people who have no desire to fill the role and only complain. If you are not the solution then you are the problem.

[Crabapple Plum]

Well Rick, I have a pretty good idea what the survivors of Japan were hit with and what they're still being exposed to. I don't have TV. Are there any news stories being run in this country on the health effects of the people in the Zone? The kids and pregnant women were drinking bad milk for several weeks.

[Rick]

And how would you know that?

[BENESSE]

If you wore your foil hat like you're supposed to, you'd know too.

[Crabapple Plum]

Um, "Heroes" is my word, it's their role in life. They're very humble people.



Which is why I go directly to the original sources, data collectors, scientists and Boots on the Ground people and ignore the Vulture Vomit.

Curious, are you folks intentionally hostile to me or just obtuse?

[Rick]

Let me get this straight, because I disagree with you I must somehow be slow or dimwitted? So far all you've done is make bold accusations with not one iota of support. You KNOW all these things and all I did was ask how you knew and I'm obtuse. Fine. I now know how you operate so I'll let it go. Obviously, a discussion is not within your realm. Now, tell me, who is intentionally hostile again?