Ammo hoarders

[Geek]

In New Jersey we recently had a bill introduced to outlaw "cop killer" ammo. It left the determination of what was "cop killer" ammo up to the State Attorney General, who is very anti-gun. Expectation among gun owners in the state (both of them) was that this would effectively give one individual the ability to ban any ammo over time. There was enough of a hue and cry that this idea got shelved, but the idea that the ammo you want might become unavailable is not completely ridiculous, at least in New Jersey. I've also heard rumors that in some places there have been attempts to limit the number of rounds you can purchase to 500 rounds per month.

I think the debate about how much personal inventory is enough is going to be the topic of a thread from time to time as opinions differ. To the extent that someone changes their mind as a result of that debate, the debate is constructive.

Your reason for stocking can be concern about SHTF scenarios, expectations for higher cost in the future, worries about future regulations, or something else entirely. Stocking up ammo is no more ridiculous than stocking up food. How much is enough is a personal decision, whether you are discussing ammo or food or anything else.

[SARKY]

If I can afford to purchase it and it is legal to own, why should anyone tell me how much is too much

[crashdive123]

In New Jersey we recently had a bill introduced to outlaw "cop killer" ammo. It left the determination of what was "cop killer" ammo up to the State Attorney General, who is very anti-gun. Expectation among gun owners in the state (both of them) was that this would effectively give one individual the ability to ban any ammo over time. There was enough of a hue and cry that this idea got shelved, but the idea that the ammo you want might become unavailable is not completely ridiculous, at least in New Jersey. I've also heard rumors that in some places there have been attempts to limit the number of rounds you can purchase to 500 rounds per month.

I think the debate about how much personal inventory is enough is going to be the topic of a thread from time to time as opinions differ. To the extent that someone changes their mind as a result of that debate, the debate is constructive.

Your reason for stocking can be concern about SHTF scenarios, expectations for higher cost in the future, worries about future regulations, or something else entirely. Stocking up ammo is no more ridiculous than stocking up food. How much is enough is a personal decision, whether you are discussing ammo or food or anything else.

Have to agree with you on this. Good post.

[canid]

I have to agree with this. Ammo is money. It's utility. It's just plain not likely to depreciate under reasonable circumstances. With that said, I try to keep a small bit on hand. I do this in small amounts, and for reasons of utility, but larger amounts (safely and lawfully stored) are not unreasonable either, as a hard comodity hedge. In what 24 month period have either ammunition, or it's constituent metals fallen in value? the scrap value of those constituent metals is now as high as the retail price I've paid for half of the ammo I've ever bought.

[2dumb2kwit]

I think the debate about how much personal inventory is enough is going to be the topic of a thread from time to time as opinions differ. To the extent that someone changes their mind as a result of that debate, the debate is constructive.

Your reason for stocking can be concern about SHTF scenarios, expectations for higher cost in the future, worries about future regulations, or something else entirely. Stocking up ammo is no more ridiculous than stocking up food. How much is enough is a personal decision, whether you are discussing ammo or food or anything else.

I agree with you, Geek. Heck, all it would take is an extended power outage and you won't be able to buy ammo. Think about it. When is the last time you bought anything that didn't get scanned and/or rung-up on an electronic device?

You know the old saying. "Better to have it and not need it, than need it and not have it".

[Old Professor]

When I was a little tyke, at the end of WWII, my father and uncles frequently commented on ammo shortages during the war. They were of the opinion that a smart person who was a hunter or shooter should stock up on ammo for their firearms; the ammount depending of the type of firearm and how much they expected to hunt/shoot with that gun. Emphasis was on hunting purposes rather than target shooting. Of course back then there were not too many semi auto hunting guns, so a little ammo lasted a long time. With semi auto's like the Black Rifles and even my much loved Ruger 10/22's they can really burn through ammo. Back in the 60's I read a book on survival firearms that reccomended for the 22LR, 5 thousand as a reasonable ammount to keep on hand. I did keep close to that ammount. Today, I would be inclined to double that ammount. I used to buy my shotgun shells by the case and always had several cases for each gauge (a thousands to fifteen hundred hunting loads. I wont even go into how many trap loads I went through! As a hand loader, I always tried to have hundreds of loaded rounds and enough components to load each case three or four times. Now as I get older and more infirm, I have given my SIL most of my guns and ammo, keeping only a few handguns with adequate supplies of ammo for practice and CCW. I have enough hunting loads for my favorite bolt hunting rifle to last the rest of my hunting life. I had a conversation with a friend who lives in the northern suburbs of Detroit last night and he was going out today to buy two Black Rifles and two 9mm semi autos and a LARGE ammount of ammo. This because of the rising crime rate around him. He plans to relocate to the UP of Michigan, (near me) within the year. He (we) believe that an economic collapse looms on the horizon, regardles of who wins the November election.

[Geek]

I hate to break it to you, but the economy collapsed four years ago nationally, and probably long before that in Detroit.

[Old Professor]

True but you ain't seen nothing yet! I am thinking "Great Depression", food riots, roving mobs and such. I was Living in the suburbs of Detroit during the 67' riots and saw the break down of society and the rioters traveling out to the suburbs to engage in criminal behavior. Thats why I have guns and ammo to protect myself and mine!

[Geek]

In many ways a normal day in Detroit is now worse than in the 60s riots, but we are now suffering from the "boiled frog" syndrome. In the 60s what happened was abrupt and unusual. Today you don't go out at night in Detroit on any night and the violence is not unusual. The same is true in Chicago, Camden, NJ, and lots of other places. Those places collapsed gradually. Unemployment is at Depression era levels. The roving mobs are called "gangs".

My point is simply that we are already experiencing "economic collapse" at a local level, but we seldom recognize it as such because it is spreading gradually, not abruptly. If you fear economic collapse nationally, then you should look for it block by block. It won't happen everywhere all at once.

[Wildthang]

Well dont get me wrong guys, I stock ammo too and in fairly large quantities, but not to the extreme of filling storage units, and those are the people I was talking about when I posted this thread. I absolutely agree that everybody should have a few thousand rounds of their most used calibers, and also some on hand to barter if necessary, nothin wrong with that!
I just think that some people go the point of being outrageous, whick makes it harder for the average guy to get ammo!

[LowKey]

What about all the current proposed legislation (due to the movie theater shooter) that would do away with internet sales and purchases of over 500 rounds in a month. I know of guys that blow through that in a week just shooting clays in 5-stand. That's only 20 matches. Some of the competition guys do that and more in a weekend.

Or the attempt to ban lead ammunition through the EPA (though they were successful in banning all lead fishing weights under an ounce.)

And wouldn't microstamping give a whole new meaning to "policing your brass."

They legislate the amount of ammo (by count) and powder (by pound) you can store here in MA. Over that amount requires a permit from the fire department and still has limits.

[Geek]

While a storage unit full of ammo is more than I can afford, I believe you express one of the legitimate fears that prompt people to buy ammo while it is available. If food rationing was implemented, you'd be glad you had set aside some beforehand.

Oh yeah, I forgot, they're trying to tell you what you can eat or drink in New York now. :-) Maybe I should stock up on soft drinks and baby formula!

I apologize if that borders on political. My point is just that someone who stocks up on what they think will be hard to get, or just more expensive, in the future, is either a good planner or a "hoarder" depending on whether you think what they are doing is reasonable. Setting aside a storage locker full of product X may be a waste, or it may turn out to have been extremely prudent. There is no way of telling ahead of time.

A storage unit full of ammo is not something I am contemplating, but I am not going to call someone who fills one a "hoarder". For all I know, somewhere down the road he may look like a genious.

[hunter63]

Like any investment, you buy when it's a good deal, hoping to cash in when the value goes up, value meaning monetary, hunting supplies, or self protection.

I hope the storage unit guy(s0 realizes that putting all your eggs in one basket, so to speak is bad council (IMHO)....for practical, possibly legal, logistical reasons.

Deploy your assets, whatever they may be.

[Wildthang]

Like any investment, you buy when it's a good deal, hoping to cash in when the value goes up, value meaning monetary, hunting supplies, or self protection.

I hope the storage unit guy(s0 realizes that putting all your eggs in one basket, so to speak is bad council (IMHO)....for practical, possibly legal, logistical reasons.

Deploy your assets, whatever they may be.

Well said Hunter, and that is exactly what I am doing. I think if the police ever got wind of a storage unit full of ammo during a SHTF event, they guy that owned it would probably lose his stash!

[boo]

Having four or five bricks of .22 is all that is needed.

[crashdive123]

Having four or five bricks of .22 is all that is needed.

Maybe for you, but some of my weapons don't shoot .22 all that well.

[hunter63]

Maybe for you, but some of my weapons don't shoot .22 all that well.

yeah, know what you mean....fall right thru that big hole ........

[natertot]

yeah, know what you mean....fall right thru that big hole ........

.....and right to the bottom of that lake where the canoe tipped over!

[hunter63]

Bingo.........another argument for "Don't put all you eggs in one basket, deploy your assets."

[wholsomback]

Gee I wonder if anyone realizes that this is more corporate greed at work than anything else.

1.Create a shortage by not producing as much ammo as the year before.

2.Hold back ammo from suppliers.

3.Then put out false press about the polititions wanting all your guns and ammo creating a run on guns and ammo.

4.This puts a shortage on the marketplace and a look what the government has done to us.

5.Then raise the price and meter the stuff out.

6.Creating desire for more product that they don't produce.

7.Which they charge more money for so everyone tries to hoard more which creates an artificial shortage which increases corporate profits.

8.Don't think the players like Wal-mart and others don't want the price to go up so they increase profit margins.Standard answer from corporate is we ordered it but the manufacturer is out at the moment.

9.Well when you get ahold of the manufacturer you can buy all you want so who is scre$#%^ who.

10.CORPORATE GREED is the game and they are playing us all.No politics need be involved.I can get what I want you just have to go to the scource.