Mosin-Nagant

[Rick]

It tool some lookin' but I found the rifle and the can of ammo. That was a good hiding spot. Thanks.

[natertot]

Hey Kyrat, I'm not sure where you are getting your ammo for those prices. I keep finding the surplus stuff for about 25-28 cents per round while the last time I bought commercial I paid about 44 cents a round for 400 rounds. Yeah, a little bit more, but I like the fact I don't have to worry about corrosion from the primer. I have only had one surplus round fail me, otherwise pretty reliable. grouping were always kind erratic for me too, although I could consistantly hit a human silhouette target at 100 yds.

[kyratshooter]

Hey Kyrat, I'm not sure where you are getting your ammo for those prices. I keep finding the surplus stuff for about 25-28 cents per round while the last time I bought commercial I paid about 44 cents a round for 400 rounds. Yeah, a little bit more, but I like the fact I don't have to worry about corrosion from the primer. I have only had one surplus round fail me, otherwise pretty reliable. grouping were always kind erratic for me too, although I could consistantly hit a human silhouette target at 100 yds.

Finding the cheap surplus is no problem;

http://www.aimsurplus.com/product.as...Can&groupid=40

http://www.sportsmansguide.com/net/c....aspx?a=865012

Sportsman's Guide also has free shipping on orders over $50 most of the time and if you are a club member the prices are even cheaper. Club price and free shipping hits 18.6 cents per shot.

I want to know where you are getting commercial ammo for $9 a box. All that I have seen at that price was Berdin primed, steel cased and nonreloadable, retreaded military surplus. Military mfg. steel cases loaded with noncorrosive primers and sp slugs of questionable origin, all put together by the same Russian plant that does the FMJ at three times the price.

The Privi-Partizan is the cheapist reloadable case ammo I have located and it is $14per box of 20.

All the corrosive primer means is that you clean the rifle that night and you should do that anyway. It is the corosive nature of the primers that keeps them shooting long after comercial noncorrosive is out of date. Much of the world, even some of NATO, still demands the corrosive primers for long storage life.

"Pre-Soviet block fall apart" ammo should be very consistant. Any plant manager that had bad ammo traced back to his facility might have himself stood against the factory wall and shot. Over here you just lose your contract. The Soviets did have demand specs on their ammo, just like we do. Accuracy standards were a match to the NATO specs.

[natertot]

Finding the cheap surplus is no problem;

http://www.aimsurplus.com/product.as...Can&groupid=40

http://www.sportsmansguide.com/net/c....aspx?a=865012

Sportsman's Guide also has free shipping on orders over $50 most of the time and if you are a club member the prices are even cheaper. Club price and free shipping hits 18.6 cents per shot.

I want to know where you are getting commercial ammo for $9 a box. All that I have seen at that price was Berdin primed, steel cased and nonreloadable, retreaded military surplus. Military mfg. steel cases loaded with noncorrosive primers and sp slugs of questionable origin, all put together by the same Russian plant that does the FMJ at three times the price.

The Privi-Partizan is the cheapist reloadable case ammo I have located and it is $14per box of 20.

All the corrosive primer means is that you clean the rifle that night and you should do that anyway. It is the corosive nature of the primers that keeps them shooting long after comercial noncorrosive is out of date. Much of the world, even some of NATO, still demands the corrosive primers for long storage life.

"Pre-Soviet block fall apart" ammo should be very consistant. Any plant manager that had bad ammo traced back to his facility might have himself stood against the factory wall and shot. Over here you just lose your contract. The Soviets did have demand specs on their ammo, just like we do. Accuracy standards were a match to the NATO specs.

Good stuff kyrat. I get my commercial from Aim. It is the brown bear for 7.95 a box when you by 25+ boxes. This comes out to be about forty cents a round not including tax. I know it isn't reloadable, but at that price I'm okay with it. I only load shotshell right now anyway. I always clean my firearms once a week, but not always the same day I shoot. I try to, but things don't always work out as planned.

Also, how do you clean inside the bolt on yours? This was always my biggest issue. I didn't want the stuff to corrode the inside of the bolt, leaving me to get new ones on a regular basis. Thanks for the sportman's guide link as well. I think I'm gonna have to check there more often!

[Rick]

Try this for the bolt disassembly. The spring is pretty strong on them so I use a block of wood to push the bolt down against the block of wood.

http://www.gunpics.net/russian/m9130/mnboltdis.html

Here's another:

http://62x54r.net/MosinID/MosinDisassembly.htm

If you don't have a firing pin gauge then don't take it apart. You need the gauge to make certain the spacing is correct.

[hunter63]

The bolts i have seen are punched on the back.... lined up with the screw head groove.
That is brought up in the second site Rick posted.

Also check your brass to see how the indentation looks after firing a few rounds...just in case you end up with a frankenstein bolt.

I truly think you could run over these bolts with you truck, and leave them outside all winter, slide it back in and fire the weapon.
The fact they haven't blown up in some one face for at least 60 years or so is a comforting thought.

[hunter63]

Good stuff kyrat. I get my commercial from Aim. It is the brown bear for 7.95 a box when you by 25+ boxes. This comes out to be about forty cents a round not including tax. I know it isn't reloadable, but at that price I'm okay with it. I only load shotshell right now anyway. I always clean my firearms once a week, but not always the same day I shoot. I try to, but things don't always work out as planned.

Also, how do you clean inside the bolt on yours? This was always my biggest issue. I didn't want the stuff to corrode the inside of the bolt, leaving me to get new ones on a regular basis. Thanks for the sportman's guide link as well. I think I'm gonna have to check there more often!

If you don't get a chance to clean right away, at least spray some WD-40 down the bore till cleaning time, keep stuff soft and keeps moisture out.

I know, most everyone says WD-40 is bad for this, but I'm still shooting after 40+ years on some oldies, with no problems.

[natertot]

Thanks for the tips guys. Once I can get my bolt apart and master that portion, I may just have to go back to surplus ammo!

[Rick]

Here's a pic of the depth gauge.

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If the pin is too short it won't fire the primer. If it's too long it will punch through it. Once you do it a time or three it's pretty easy.

[2dumb2kwit]

Here's a pic of the depth gauge.

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If the pin is too short it won't fire the primer. If it's too long it will punch through it. Once you do it a time or three it's pretty easy.

I thought that was a beer opener.

[hunter63]

Sadly, I sure a lot of rifles get sold with out all the "stuff".....

[Rick]

I think it's correctly termed a Vodka opener. It is Russian after all.

[hunter63]

Kinda pricey but SG has kits, for the nagants.....
http://www.sportsmansguide.com/net/c....aspx?a=762749

[Rick]

Yeah, for that price you could buy another gun and be happy with two!

[hunter63]

Yeah, for that price you could buy another gun and be happy with two!

Yeah, well that was a while back,....but yeah my thoughts exactly!

[scottmphoto]

I've got a 1934 MN 91/30. I forget all the particulars. I paid $172 for it about 5 years ago. I know that is a lot for one, but it looked brand new. I got it from a collector and it had been well taken care of. I love shooting it. I still want an M44 though. It'd be easier to carry out on the place cause it's shorter and lighter and my place has a lot of thick brush.

[hunter63]

M44 have the bayonet, M38 don't but are about the same size, mach shorter than the 91/30's.
Cool rifle.

I love shooting the short rifles at dusk, BIG fire ball, and smoke and fire....what's not to like?

[vahtryn]

I gotta go through and take apart my rifles, one of them being an m38. I like it better than the m44 because it doesn't have the extra weight of the bayonet. I wouldn't mind putting a composite stock on it just to lighten her up but that's something on the very back burner right now.

When I got my first Mosin I had to clean the ever living hell out of the poor girl. Took the bolt apart and even in there it was coated in that grease. The m38 is definitely a cannon of a carbine. The surplus ammo I generally use there's always a fire ball firing out of the barrel, it's awesome.

Gonna take that on a deer hunt this year since it's the best equipped rifle i have for that.

[Rick]

You don't have to leave the bayo on it. I've boxed up all the accessories I got w/mine and labled which rifle they went to. I kept out 1 firing pin gauge for cleaning and resetting the pin. Cleaning them was nasty. Like you, I didn't think I'd ever git er done.

[Thaddius Bickerton]

I love the cheap surplus 7.62 x 54R stuff.

I also have a couple hundred boxer primed cases that I reload my hunting rounds into.

M/N is the cheapest fix for wanting a "new" gun going at the moment.

I love getting a 91 / 30 and tweaking it into the best shooter I can, and then hunting with it. But just shooting tin cans out in the back yard (big back yard for me lol) is a blast.

I agree that the trick it to not drop a ton of money into a low cost weapon.

I have found that simply a full disassemble / cleaning goes a long way towards getting them shooting much better.

Without stoning the sear or anything, just making sure the trigger parts are clean and not rubbing any wood will help a lot with the trigger pull.

ETA: If you use surplus ammo with corrosive primers, I find that running a few squirts of Windex through the bore to get the salts out then cleaning as usual prevents any problems. (The ammonia in the Windex neutralizes the corrosive salts I have been told, anyway it works for me.) But be sure to clean after firing surplus ammo.

Make sure that no lacquer from some surplus ammo is built up in the chamber to avoid sticky bolt syndrome.

Most M/N's I have fired can be made to shoot 2 - 3 inchs with surplus ammo assuming the crown is ok. Notice that many of them have been counter sunk if the crown was messed up. If not there are home recrownings, but this is not something for the untrained to attempt as a proper crown is key to any barrels accuracy. Of all the things one might do to a M/N if you lack skill / tools a gunsmith recrown is the only one I would consider if I could get it done affordably.

(fortunately for me my son is a metal wizard and I can get him to weld bolts bent or help me crown barrels etc.)

For most just inspect the crown and buy one that is not dinged up and you are good to go.

Free floating the barrel is easy, just pull the stock and put lipstick on the barrel and make sure the stock is clean and dry then assemble it. then take it apart and sand off any lipstick marked spots. Go slow and take minimal amounts off rinse and repeat until no lipstick comes off on the stock. At that point a dollar bill ought to slide up and down the barrel. This prevents stock pressure from effecting barrel harmonics and thus accuracy.

The safety stinks so I had son weld a "U" shaped piece of metal to mine so I can stick my finger in it and pull it back and turn.

Also on my favorite one while I kept it all stock I did have him tap the rear receiver and help me put on a peep sight. My old eyes much prefer this over the stock notch, and I don't have to figure out arshins (russian unit of measure that the older 91/30's sites are graduated in.) Also the stock battle sight zero is 300 yards more or less on the stock sights and the thing shoots high at 100 yards.

To get cosmoline out of the stock I wrap it in old cloth and put it in the car on a hot day and it sweats it out till it is nice and clean. Just wipe off, rinse and repeat till it is all out. Also be sure you get all of it out of all the nooks and crannies of the metal.

These old guns are great, simple, and surprisingly accurate.

And for real excitement watch someone fire the m44 or m39 carbines around dusk. The fireball is enough to incinerate anything that was attacking you. :-)