Wilderness Survival - West of Canada

[Justme]

Tips for Payne: I was born in BC and camped out many times

1. Most of the places you would want to camp in are in the mountains, it gets freaking cold at night, even in the summer. And if it is raining, you will be extra cold without gear. I was even cold with gear.

2. If you are planning a 4 day trip, that is short. You don't need to hunt, but get a fishing license, also you should be able to find raspberries every where in central BC, southern BC gets very desert like in some places.

3 Bears are there, but cougars too. Don't go alone, even primitive man stayed in groups, it is safer that way. You are risking your life otherwise. Unless your camping on a small island on a lake or river, that would be safer.

4. Enjoy - the mosquito's heh heh heh

[steelnwool]

Arg.. Build a canoe in the wilderness? In one of Ray Mears' shows, he meets up with a Native Canadian man north of Ottawa, and they take a couple of days to build a canoe. And the native man has been doing it for years, and they had all their gear gathered all ready. Please please please do not take these skills so lightly. Natives did not wake up one morning and have these skills. They evolved over tens of thousands of years.

You said you've never fired a gun. Which means you have never hunted. If you have never done something, do not think you can just go out and start doing it to keep your self alive.

I'm not talking out of my a-s cause I'm in the same boat as you. I would love to think I could do such a thing but I have 2 young kids and a wife so I am realist about my mortality.

TAKE BABY STEPS

examples;
- you don't want to take a tent or sleeping bag : Go on a camping trip in the woods near where you live, take EVERYTHING you need except a tent and sleeping bag and make those things a focus for your one or 2 day trip. Then do the same trip 5 or 10 times.
- I have never hunted and would like to learn how to process an animal end to end.. how am I going to accomplish this? I'm going to go hunting with an experienced hunter and pester him with questions all day long. I'm not going to waltz into the woods and run my fat *** after a dear... or even a rabbit.
- Fire : LIght a fire a hundred times without matches.
- Get cold and miserable for fun. Being able to do any of these skills under ideal situations is easy. Go out in your back yard, get all of your clothes wet, don't eat for a day and try to build a fire and a shelter. Then compound that with the mental feelings of being stuck and helpless. Its not a walk in a park.

The idea is romantic, and fantastic and all that stuff but take baby steps over years, do not throw your self into rugged wilderness for a lark.

[payne]

@Justme: Aren't there any spot free from any license-requirement?
And how frequent can we meet predators in there?

@steelnwool: I guess I more had something like a minimally sophisticated raft in mind.
And to all your concerns, I do plan on practising over a few months before going into the wild. This summer, I should get hired as a tree planter, and this would be the perfect time and place to practice all this stuff. I have no worry about me lacking the skills to survive in there.

[BC-Dave]

Pretty much what everyone has said.

I live in the Chilcotin and 2 years ago I was in the same boat as you. I had this mindset where I really wanted to go 'live in the wild' and see how far life would take me, using the least amount of equipment as possible.

Let me tell you something right now -- that plan quickly spoiled. I thought I knew everything dude. I watched all those Ray Mears shows, all Survivorman, researched everything there is to know about the wilderness, etc. but it was nowhere NEAR what you need to know. Basically take what you think you know, quadruple it, and you are still not even half prepared.

Justme has the right idea. It gets cold at night. Around here, there is frost every month of the year, and even some years, snow. I remember when I first got here and it was 33 degrees celcius during the day. Man I was dieing, I was like holy s#$@! Was laying in my tent sweating and I was practically naked that night. Woke up after a few hours and I was shivering to my bone. Looked at the temp and it was -2. This was in August.
Also like he mentioned, be ready for the most mosquitoes you will ever encounter. I remember I counted 89 different bites on just my legs, not including below the ankle, in just 2 nights. Serious. Bug spray is a good idea, but most of it is really stinky and just basically going to increase chances of animals smelling you. Also you mention you would like to see if you could last longer than 4 days, so if you were to bring bug spray, what would you do when you run out? This is why I would rather get used to them naturally, which I did, by the way -- but it wasn't a fun ride lets just say.

As far as bears and cougars, yeah... they are here. As are wolves, moose, etc.
I know someone said to bring bear spray but trust me, please don't depend on it. Everybody who lives out here will laugh in your face when you tell them your bringing bear spray as a weapon. And I don't mean that as an offence, but seriously, every rancher out here has stories of hitting a grizz in the face from 30 ft, and the thing just kept running like it had no brakes. Now black bears I can understand, I've run into a black bear with two cubs as I was walking through some bush. Came out about 20 feet away. Both cubs climbed a tree and the momma just ran away. Nearly s$*@ myself and it was only like a 200lb black bear. An 800lb grizz sow is not something you want to be taking on with a can of bear spray lol.
Cougars - be careful of these nasty buggers. I lost a dog a couple months ago to one. Basically they stalk you like cats do. I've heard stories of ranchers rounding up their cattle, only to notice a cougar stalking right behind them.

Oh heres a story about a cougar. I live with my parents in a cabin, but I have a little truck camper sitting on the ground like 100 feet away from the cabin. One night the clouds were covering so it was complete darkness, and I had this dinky little flashlight which had like 5% battery power left, and I was walking to my camper. As I was walking I thought I heard something off in the bush but couldn't see anything. Anyways I went back to the cabin because I was sleeping in there for the night but I forgot something at the camper. Grabbed a better flashlight and went and grabbed it. On my walk back I shined my flashlight where I thought I heard something and I seen two glaring eyes looking at me about 10 ft up a tree -- about 15 feet away.

Anyways yeah.. most of the time they will bug off, but if they do attack you, you better have some kind of weapon, lol.

I see that you have posted you will be coming between June and Sept? Well thats a big difference bro. Here in June, you will see mostly deer and other various animals. In September, when the salmon is coming up the rivers... well... man I got no words to even say how stupid that would be to do. You can spot more than 5 grizzlies in a quarter of a mile in some places. Also thats rutting season and the last thing you would ever want to do is run into a bull moose, whether you have a rifle or not. I seen a truck after the last rutting season that was attacked by a moose, it was a dodge ram 3500 and the front door was smashed in like a cannon ball hit it.

Now back to the wilderness talk.

As far was food goes, fish should be number one. Fish, to me, is the easiest source of survival out here, because its so readily available in almost all lakes, assuming that you have a way to catch them. You could hunt for a week and get nothing, or go fishing and have food in 20 minutes. If you have a pellet gun, you can hunt small game. Squirrels and chipmunks aren't exactly the biggest source of meat but they will help. In late summer you will find grouse everywhere here.

As for saying you might stay out for a long period of time, let me ask you some questions.

Will you have money in case things go wrong? What happens if your clothing gets ruined, what will you wear? What if you knife breaks, or gets dull? Do you know how to give yourself first aid? What if critical equipment you have gets ruined? Etc. Etc.

You say you don't want a sleeping bag, tent, etc. I say, no thanks dude. Do you think you will just wander across an axe and saw and blade sharpener etc. out here? lol.
Don't get me wrong though dude, when I came out here I had the exact same mindset. I wanted to prove that I could survive like they did 'in the old days' with as few tools as possible in the most primitive way. I failed, miserably.

My viewpoint has changed on that idea. I say you should bring EVERYTHING you need and even don't need, so that you can survive with absolute ease. Then as things settle, you start getting more knowledge and getting used to it, you can discard things in order to be more primitive. A good idea would be to store the stuff somewhere, not throw away. You could possibly need them someday.

This winter the temp here got down to -50F with windchill. On average it was around -20C or so. I was sleeping in a camper with 3 layers of clothing on and sleeping inside a sleeping bag with 2 blankets of wool. I shivered my *** off dude. Trust me, bring as much clothing as possible, then when, or if, you get used to the weather, you can just not use the materials.

As far as a good location to not find people, out here is good. My nearest neighbors are from an Inidan reserve like an hour away almost. Town is 2 hours away from here.


You say you want to use crafted weapons and trap in order to catch food. Start practicing now is all I can say to that. I could have all the knowledge in the world about making deadfalls and pitfalls etc. and still not catch a single piece of game out here without knowing where to do it. Crafting bows is not easy here, it's mostly all lodgepole pine and spruce out here, and there is virtually nothing as far as natural cordage that would be efficient.

If you are serious about coming out into BC and you came out near me, I would gladly come out with you, though I might not be able to during certain parts of the summer.
I am no expert by any means, but I live here and I've learned a thing or two while being here. Oh and trust me -- being with someone will help you from going crazy. Sadly, I hold conversations with myself daily.

[payne]

Loved reading that post, Dave.

I guess you haven't read my Introduction post, but anyways.
The only thing I really am fearing at the moment are predators: the rest doesn't look like any threat. I mean, as someone stated, 4 days isn't that much. I just wanted a "fair" introduction to wild survival. Not getting any food for 4 days is more than doable.
Cold is no threat neither. As stated into my Introduction, I've attempted Washington's summit during winter. Make some basic researches about the weather there and you should get quite a good picture (funny little anecdote: I nearly stupidly lost my gloves because of the amount of snow that falls there by removing them for less than 2 minutes and leaving them on the ground).
As for mosquitoes, 3 months of tree planting should get me used to them quite perfectly. :P
And being alone; I really and seriously just do not care at all.

I will have money in case things go wrong: I should do this little adventure near the end of my summer (though I still have to cross Canada with my bike after that :P). I currently am leaving to West for about 6 months with something like 2000$, but take in count I most likely will earn money.
Part of a little survival kit contains a kind of aluminum blanket, I guess that's what I'll wear if my clothes get ruined. However, I do plan on bringing an extra T-shirt as it looks like extra-tissue can always become handy in some situations (so I do plan on ruining that T-shirt).
About the knife, I'm not quite sure about the possibilities of survival without one, but I'm quite sure we do not rely 100% on knives: they do not represent the only mean of cutting something.
First aid could be a bit of a concern, but I do plan on improving my skills over it.

I'm not going there thinking I'll succeed, I'm going there because I just have to try it out.
I currently am completely unorganized and look like a total noob, but I'm not taking this whole thing as not-seriously as you all seems to think. As I've already stated, I just do not have the time to get too much over this at the moment because of school.

And ya, Dave, why not meet? I haven't subscribed to any university in order to really do not have any "time-stress", so I guess we have all the chances on the world to meet up: just give me dates and I'll try to fit them with my "schedule". Doing this with someone else isn't excluded at all, and I actually for sure do like the idea of still putting myself to the test while having a mentor teaching/watching me.

[BC-Dave]

Yeah sorry I didn't read the intro post. And yeah I didn't mean to ramble about long time survival or anything it just seemed to me like you were wanting to stay for more than 4 days.

And I didn't mean to make it sound like you aren't organized or anything. 4 days is really nothing out here, if anything you will be wanting to stay way longer!

As far as meeting up, I might have to house sit for a good portion of summer. Although this isn't 100% so I can't really say. Only time will tell. But if I can do it, I definitely would. And don't think of me as like a mentor/teacher or anything lol. If I was to come with you I would definitely be going all out like yourself. Though I would probably bring a bow or rifle :P We could go drop a buck, smoke it on the spot and really live the life

Also to give you a idea of what it looks like out here, type in Chilko Lake and Taseko Lakes on google images. Better yet, if you have Google Earth, type it in on there. There is some reallllly good pictures on there uploaded by somebody. Plus it gives you an idea of what the surrounding area is like.

[Justme]

There are license free area's everywhere, but unfortunately the law calls it poaching. If you poach, don't get caught, but I would probably just pay the $50 bucks or what ever it is for a fishing license just to be safe. If you do go alone, then at the very least, go to one of the many campsites that are free and that you have to hike to get to. It will not be busy and you will probably have one or two other people camping close by. Might be safer, and it still affords you a great deal of privacy. I hope you know what your doing, otherwise prepare for misery. Hope you don't get eaten, maybe check on getting a firearm.

[Rick]

Welcome Justme. How about stopping by our Introduction section and tell us a bit about yourself? It's a license free area and doesn't even require a firearm.....yet.

[payne]

Happy to hear that, Dave.
As I've mentioned in the OP, I plan on doing more than 4 days if ever I am doing well in the wild. Continuing as I hate it (or simply suck at it) would be plain stupid. 4 days just looked like quite a good minimum that'd set my mind up about how it really is to survive in the wilderness.

How hard/long is it to legally get a firearm?

[Justme]

You know Payne, a gun can be pretty expensive, like $500 to $1000 for a cheap one, but if you are going rustic you could get a $25 bow and arrow set from Walmart. You won't even need a license. Now if you see a Grizzly Bear and decide to fire a arrow at it, make sure you are wearing war paint, and shout AI AI AI AI AI.

Rick - Thank you for the offer, and maybe I will introduce myself sometime, but I am kind of private, so for now I won't. Besides mysterious is fun.

[Rick]

Mystery has no place in survival scenarios. No one should accept your word until we know you're qualified to give advice. We've had posers on here before.

[Justme]

I prefer people not to take my word, but to make their own choices. Still I will look into the intro section if you insist. Anything you want to know ?

[Justin Case]

Its all about earning credibility... First step is a good intro,,

[Rick]

Here's a template you can use if you wish.

http://www.wilderness-survival.net/f...r-Introduction

I understand that some folks just don't like to reveal information about themselves especially on the internet. I really don't have a problem with that. But, as JC said, it does help us to know who is offering up information and whether they should be taken at face value or not. You can also talk in generalities rather than specifics if you choose (I'm between 20 and 30 as an example). Welcome, no matter what you decide.

[payne]

As it looks right now, it seems like if I encounter a grizzly, I can't do much, even with a gun, so I guess it's kind of useless to buy a gun I might use once in my whole life for something like more than one thousand bucks (which represents half my current budget).
If I encounter one, well, so be it. Death is a liberation from this society. :P

[Justin Case]

Hi Payne,,, here is something to consider http://www.henryrepeating.com/rifle-survival-ar7.cfm

[Justme]

Bear spray and a sharp spear that you can make with a knife is better than nothing at all. Just have somebody go with you, and make sure you are able to run faster than them.

[payne]

Bear spray and a sharp spear that you can make with a knife is better than nothing at all. Just have somebody go with you, and make sure you are able to run faster than them.

I laughed out loud there. XD

@Justin: Nice gun. However, it looks like it isn't very strong: they are talking about catching small games with it. :/

[typ3]

As it looks right now, it seems like if I encounter a grizzly, I can't do much, even with a gun, so I guess it's kind of useless to buy a gun I might use once in my whole life for something like more than one thousand bucks (which represents half my current budget).
If I encounter one, well, so be it. Death is a liberation from this society. :P

Payne,

Based on what you've posted so far, I really don't think you're in the right mindset to be going out into the BC wilderness. Here are a few reasons why:

-Your irresponsibility doesn't just put your life at risk, it can endanger others. Volunteer SAR groups, police, and paramedics like myself, all put our own safety at risk when we attempt backcountry rescues. As much as rescuers try to mitigate the risks to themselves, there are risks. For example, having someone hanging from a rope dangling off a helicopter as in a HETS rescue will always be risky. Unfortunately it seems that you're blithely ignoring proper research and preparations, things which may end up with you needing a risky wilderness rescue which puts the lives of others in danger.

-You say the only thing you currently fear is predators. As someone who lives in an area of BC with plenty of Grizzlies, there are things which are FAR more dangerous to someone in the backcountry than ol' Grizz. Chief among those is inexperience and ignorance, especially with regards to the environment you're in.

BC Dave makes some really good points. The weather in BC mountains can go from hot to sub-zero in a matter of hours, and bring with it torrential rains, wind, and snow. Last year I was on a alpine hike in August where the weather went from around 25 C to 0 C in a matter of a couple hours. The conditions turned from sunny to overcast to driving rain then freezing rain then snow very quickly. We were very well prepared, but we decided to head home because of the volatility of the conditions: by the time we got to the trailhead there was maybe 10 cms of snow on the ground. And this was in August in Southern BC--the North is far more intense.

-Getting a gun for predator protection isn't really necessary. Although I do sometimes carry a 12 gauge or rifle for predator protection, most in the backcountry rely on pepper spray, bear bangers, and common sense. For someone without experience around bears, carrying a firearm is, IMHO, a bad idea. The consequences of shooting a bear in "self defense" can be pretty intense, and inexperience might lead you to either use the gun when you shouldn't, or hesitate far too late. Can you tell the difference between a bluff charge and an imminent attack?

Payne, may I suggest you find a buddy, a tent, and a backpack and do some straightforward backpacking along established routes. Straightforward hiking, without a "survivalist" bent, can be very rewarding and educational. It's also the best way to build up the maturity necessary for more extreme outtings.

[BENESSE]

A lot of good advice given here.
IMO, at 19, payne is old enough to go out for 4 days (according to him) and find out for himself the lay of the land. He'll never learn more than actually doing it, the way he wants to do it. If he finds out the hard way, so be it. That'll be more meaningful than anything anyone says.