Outdoor Guide career path... Alderleaf vs Anake

**miketr** · 11-27-2010, 05:51 PM

I am researching schools to attain the skill set needed to become an outdoor guide and survivalist. I'd like to be able to lead expeditions and teach the arts of survival. I am hoping to find a primary program and supplement it with other various certifications like Wilderness First Responder (WFR), jungle survival, avalanche training, mountaineering, and others I'm sure as time goes.

I've been looking for comprehensive programs. The 2 that I have found are Alderleaf Wilderness College and the Anake Wilderness School. Both offer 1 year programs that I think would serve my purpose. There are several differences, and Anake offers a second year program. With that said, Alderleaf seems to be the more popular and supported of the 2, but Anake has advantages as well.

I'd love to hear anything anybody has to offer about the 2 schools. Also, if anyone knows of other comparable schools, please advise me. Thanks a lot!

**Rick** · 11-27-2010, 05:53 PM

We'd love to see an Introduction if you don't mind. Are you in the U.S.? Which part? Are you willing to travel to the right school or are you locked into something locally, where ever that might be? An Introduction might answer some of those questions.

http://www.wilderness-survival.net/f...ead.php?t=7813

**miketr** · 11-27-2010, 06:11 PM

Hello Rick & All,

I currently live in NJ. I've spent most of my life living here, but prefer rural areas. I recently moved home from Colorado where I spent a year in Breckenridge and another in Vail. It was great there, but the summers were the most enjoyable part for me with the rock climbing, hiking, and camping. Anyway, I've decided that my business degree isn't going to provide the lifestyle or career I've come to desire so I'm looking to pursue one I know will.

While I have great experience hiking and camping, I want to become an expert on the field. The Alderleaf and Anake schools require a relocation, which I am prepared and excited for, yet I see no other comparable options outside of their WA area.

Anyway, thanks for any and all help!

**Sourdough** · 11-27-2010, 06:57 PM

For $50,000.00 per year we could get you into the Dogman School or the Sourdough School of survival.

**crashdive123** · 11-27-2010, 07:25 PM

I don't know that there is a course, or course of instruction, that when completed will give you the credentials that you may seek. Working as an apprentice in quite a few fields may offer the best training. There's always the military, but joining is no guarantee of getting exactly thay type of training.

**DOGMAN** · 11-28-2010, 01:21 AM

Originally Posted by Sourdough

For $50,000.00 per year we could get you into the Dogman School or the Sourdough School of survival.

I'd gladly take your $50,000...I mean, I'd gladly teach you the "wilderness guide" skills needed to get started in this exciting career path- if you like to shovel dog poop and snow. I need a good intern.

seriously though...I am not familiar with either school- I looked at their websites though and they both look good. One question though...your in New Jersey...why not go to Tom Brown's Tracker School. He is a biggie in the wilderness survival school arena...might be cheaper than relocating.

**miketr** · 11-28-2010, 03:25 PM

I have actually checked out Tom Brown's school... I'd love to go there as well, but my concern is that the real appeal would be in an internship or caretaker program. These would actually be preferable, but there's no guarantee it will be an opportunity for any particular individual. Like I said though, I'm still in the researching stage, collecting data.

The Tom Brown Tracker school program would be a dream come true for me if I'd be able to get an intern position. Anyway, I have to run out, I'll be back.

**Sourdough** · 11-28-2010, 04:20 PM

Hunting &/or Fishing lodges in Alaska are always looking for workers. Hunting Guides hire packers & assistant hunting guides, as well as camp help.

**miketr** · 11-29-2010, 12:19 PM

Has anyone been involved with the Tom Brown program? I'd love to talk to someone about it. Like I said the internship would be amazing for me, but as confident I am in my abilities and my studious nature, I was wondering about the internship program and what being accepted to it may entail. If anyone has any ideas on the matter, let me know. Thanks!

**SARKY** · 11-29-2010, 12:41 PM

I've taken a Tom Brown course in tracking. It was very helpful when we were called out for SAR in Maine. Where in Jersey are you from?
Check out NOLS, National Outdoor Leadership School
www.nols.edu

**Sourdough** · 11-29-2010, 12:42 PM

OK, You talk about a "career path".......? Do you expect to find employment with these skills......? And if so at what pay scale.....? Is this to be a life hobby or a method to supporting a family.....?

I am NOT one for crushing the wilderness dreams of anyone; However I wonder if you look on this as an adventure or as a vocation.

It may not appear that I am trying to help, but I am trying to help.

**miketr** · 12-07-2010, 12:17 PM

There is something more to life, and the intrinsic compensation associate with the tracker/scout lifestyle is what I'm seeking. I've always had a strong connection with the outdoors and am happiest and most content while immersed in nature.

Ultimately, I hope to either establish my own business or form a partnership with an existing outfitter or organization like the tracker school or something. I would love to promote the value of our natural setting and help increase the public's appreciation for nature. I know from experience that our land can provide what we need individually and want to incorporate the fact into my life and help others to do the same.

The monetary earnings of an outdoor position may not rival those I've had in the past, but what I can assure anyone is that it will be more rewarding on many levels than anything I can do with my business degree or experience I have thus far.

Whether I'd be leading hunts, educating others, guiding vacationers or researchers I know what I seek. I value things outside what has become the norm for Gen X and Yers; I know my goals are not the common element among the masses, but its important to me. Also, as a society, we owe it to ourselves never to loose sight of the skills people like Tom Brown teach. Our Native American predecessors had a good thing going, I often wonder how things would have played out if the white man had never interfered. While I will never force anything upon anyone or my love ones, this is what I seek for myself and what those who truly know me understand will make me happy.

**Rick** · 12-07-2010, 12:33 PM

You worded your goals very well and listed many good options for attaining them. Your research will will help you discover which options will be best for you. If you can, further define, for yourself, what it is that most interests you outdoors and focus on that narrower goal. And don't forget that your business degree is a valuable asset for running any type of business. You also have the option of using your business degree as a minor and shifting your focus to a major in an outdoor education degree, biology or something similar.

Good luck!

**Sourdough** · 12-07-2010, 03:04 PM

Originally Posted by miketr

There is something more to life, and the intrinsic compensation associate with the tracker/scout lifestyle is what I'm seeking. I've always had a strong connection with the outdoors and am happiest and most content while immersed in nature.

Ultimately, I hope to either establish my own business or form a partnership with an existing outfitter or organization like the tracker school or something. I would love to promote the value of our natural setting and help increase the public's appreciation for nature. I know from experience that our land can provide what we need individually and want to incorporate the fact into my life and help others to do the same.

The monetary earnings of an outdoor position may not rival those I've had in the past, but what I can assure anyone is that it will be more rewarding on many levels than anything I can do with my business degree or experience I have thus far.

Whether I'd be leading hunts, educating others, guiding vacationers or researchers I know what I seek. I value things outside what has become the norm for Gen X and Yers; I know my goals are not the common element among the masses, but its important to me. Also, as a society, we owe it to ourselves never to loose sight of the skills people like Tom Brown teach. Our Native American predecessors had a good thing going, I often wonder how things would have played out if the white man had never interfered. While I will never force anything upon anyone or my love ones, this is what I seek for myself and what those who truly know me understand will make me happy.

Well said. My favorite line in the movie: "The Shawshank Redemption" is "Get on with living or get on with dying". I hope all your dreams are manifested.

**kyratshooter** · 12-07-2010, 04:15 PM

As a member of the higher education set I am going to make a sugestion.

All of the mentioned schools and courses are self accrediting and self regulating. They answer to no one and their cirtificates and diplomas are good only to those that wish to accept them. I think very little of several mentioned and will not get into that. As I said, the diplomas and cirtificates are worthless. Anyone that wishes to ignore them in hiring or promotion is free to do so.

I would get in touch with Ron Hood. Not that Ron is a wonder person, or that I worship his footprints as some others do their mystic heros.

Ron is a real confirmed x-Green Barret (wartime VN service) and a Professor (as in PHD) with the California State University system and teaches survival skills at the college level. YES, you can get a degree in outdoor skills in California. The courses are taught by certified and educated instructors with real degrees and real experience.

http://www.survival.com/

The availability of a real degree that can be used as barter in an employment negiotiation or as a marketing point as a private teacher has some real merit.

It does to me anyway. Espically when you major competition, "those that are worshiped", are draft dodging mystic charlatans.

A degree from an accredited university will put you on the rolls for National Park Service/BKM/National Forest Service positions too. Joes' Starve To Death and Rat Tracking School will not mean much to the folks writing a regular paycheck, even a small one.

**hunter63** · 12-07-2010, 04:31 PM

KS, good points as usual.
I wasn't even gonna comment, as I have absolutely no first hand knowledge of any of these schools.

But IMHO, as the subject matter is more of a life and death situation rather than, say, Literature,...... degrees and certificates, would not be what I was looking for in an instructor.

Life experience, military training, OTJ training, length of time in the field, would mean more to me, than a one year class/course.

I commend you Mtr, for following your dream, you have to start somewhere right?

I do think internship, apprentice with the best guy you can find, and just time in the field will be necessary.
Find something you like to do....and you will never work a day in your life.
Good luck, man.

**kyratshooter** · 12-07-2010, 04:53 PM

Originally Posted by hunter63

KS, good points as usual.
I wasn't even gonna comment, as I have absolutely no first hand knowledge of any of these schools.

But IMHO, as the subject matter is more of a life and death situation rather than, say, Literature,...... degrees and certificates, would not be what I was looking for in an instructor.

Life experience, military training, OTJ training, length of time in the field, would mean more to me, than a one year class/course.

I commend you Mtr, for following your dream, you have to start somewhere right?

I do think internship, apprentice with the best guy you can find, and just time in the field will be necessary.
Find something you like to do....and you will never work a day in your life.
Good luck, man.

I agree with every point you make Hunter.

But why take a course from a good teacher and get no official credit for it when you can take a course from the same teacher through an accreditied institution and have University of .... recognition.

Plus you will want CPR/FA and SAR certifications at the very least if you want to cover liabilities to the public.

The degree is good, having a teacher is also good, but the certified education and a skilled mentor is better.

I do commend a young man for following his dream. I abandoned my dream of the same thing in an attempt to offer stability to may family. I got the degree in the safe field when I could have had it in my dream field. The dream would have paid just as much and I would probably be a less cantankerous don't give a $&!# individual today.

I just offer an option that most do not realize is available.

"Hey kid, what you studying in school?"
"Well Aunt Gert, I am working on a degree in marketing with a second major in Progressive Bug Eating"

**klkak** · 12-07-2010, 05:17 PM

I've been going to school learning Wilderness skills for 40 odd years and I still don't have a degree or certification.

Reminds me of a quote:

"Where did you go to school Gunny"?

"Heart break ridge"!

"Funny, I've never heard of that school"!